It is likely you are reading this because a sociopath said “I love you” and you believed him/her. You also probably thought that when the sociopath said “I love you” he/she used these words as you do, to express a sense of intimacy, passion and commitment. However, what a sociopath says and what a sociopath does are so different it can be crazy making.
In the aftermath of a relationship with a sociopath, former romantic partners are left to wonder, “Just what was going on in that person’s mind?” “What was he/she thinking?” Many people have written in asking, “Did he/she really love me?” and “Do you think he/she loves that other person now?” It is the second question many find most disturbing.
In 1943, Dr. Abraham Maslow in his classic paper, A theory of human motivation, declared that psychopaths lack the capacity and motivation for love. “The so-called ‘psychopathic personality’ is another example of permanent loss of the love needs. These are people who, according to the best data available (9), have been starved for love in the earliest months of their lives and have simply lost forever the desire and the ability to give and to receive affection (as animals lose sucking or pecking reflexes that are not exercised soon enough after birth). ”
Contemporaneously with Maslow, Dr. Hervey Cleckley described psychopaths in The Mask of Sanity and developed a set of criteria for their identification. According to Cleckley (criteria #9), psychopathy is associated with “pathological egocentricity and incapacity for love.” He declared “The psychopath seldom shows anything that, if the chief facts were known, would pass even in the eyes of lay observers as object love.”
Cleckley also maintained that an “absolute” incapacity for love is even found in those with an “incomplete manifestation” of psychopathy, who lack the full disorder. Writing in 1956, Drs.McCord and McCord disagreed with Cleckley and Maslow. They described psychopaths as having “a warped capacity for love” stating, “there are indications that the capacity, however under developed, still exists .”
My guess is that the McCords got fooled just like you and I and a recent paper shows us why.
Dr. Barbara Gawda at Maria Curie-Skldowska University Poland studied the “Love Scripts” of sociopaths. Love scripts are simply ideas about love that a person has. These ideas include how people fall in love, and what people in love are supposed to do.
Dr. Gawda showed a picture of a man and a woman hugging to 60 sociopaths in prison, 40 prisoners without disorder and 100 university students. She asked all participants to write a story about the picture and to imagine themselves as one of the characters.
The sociopaths stories were significantly longer, more detailed, and more self-centered than the other two groups. Contrary to expectations then sociopaths do not lack love schemas. They are perfectly adept and perhaps more adept than most in talking about love. The findings of this study jive completely with my own clinical experience. That is, over the years many people I knew to be sociopaths told me about their love experiences. Their stories were impressive and had me believing that they were capable of love.
If clinicians, scientists, lovers and family members rely on verbal reports, they will never come to understand the lack of capacity to love that characterizes sociopaths. Cleckley reached his conclusions about psychopathy and love only after observing their actions over a number of years. He also said this,
“In a sense, it is absurd to maintain that the psychopath’s incapacity for object love is absolute, that is, to say he is (in)capable of affection for another ”¦ He is plainly capable of casual fondness, of likes and dislikes, and of reactions that, one might say, cause others to matter to him. These affective reactions are, however, always strictly limited in degree. In durability they also vary greatly from what is normal in mankind. The term absolute is, I believe, appropriate if we apply it to any affective attitude strong and meaningful enough to be called love, that is, anything that prevails in sufficient degree and over sufficient periods to exert a major influence on behavior.”
References
A theory of human motivation. Maslow, A. H.; Psychological Review, Vol 50(4), Jul, 1943. pp. 370-396
McCord, W and McCord, J (1956) Psychopathy and Delenquency New York: Grune and Stratton, Inc. page 13
Love scripts of persons with antisocial personality.Gawda B.
Psychological Reports 2008, 103, 371-380.
This study compared the scripts of love among 60 prison inmates diagnosed with Antisocial Personality Disorder and those of 40 inmates without an Antisocial Personality Disorder diagnosis but low antisocial tendencies, and a control group of 100 adult students in extramural or evening secondary schools without Antisocial Personality Disorder traits. The study focused on emotional knowledge about love of the group with Antisocial Personality Disorder, as they present lack of capacity for love. The study was done to examine how they perceive love and how much knowledge they have about love. All described their reactions to a photograph of a couple hugging each other. The content of these scripts, analyzed in terms of description of actors, their actions and emotions, and length of description, was compared among the groups. The scripts of love by antisocial inmates contained more actors’ feelings and strong emotions, as well as more descriptions of actors’ traits, their actions, and presumptions. The inmates with Antisocial Personality Disorder showed more focus on themselves when they described love than the other inmates and the controls.
Maria, one of the hardest things I find getting over is the humiliation of how I behaved. Me. I’ll see your ‘YUK’ and raise you an ‘eeeeeeeeew’!. I am SO embarrassed by the things I did and the things I allowed him to do with me. I will work it out in the end though I guess. I have no feelings for ‘it’ now other than utter revulsion. when I think of ‘it’, I dont have any fluffy romantic feelings or miss ‘it’ I just feel like throwing up. there is a lot of guilt to be worked through about being bonded, and bending over backwards for an abusive monster,he acted like a stupid baby, and there I was dancing about trying to make it happy in ANY way I could, tearing down my own shaky boundaries in order to accommodate it’s depraved needs and hold on to something that turns out to be dangerous and disgusting. I also shudder at the thought of me allowing my children anyway near ‘it’. I shoulda (woulda, coulda) known better.
Tilly, It makes me sad to hear you say that you will never believe anyone who tells you that they love you again:( Although I do understand why you feel that way. It does seem to be the intelligent thing to do. It’s like Oxy’s analogy of the cat jumping on the hot plate. I dont think I EVER believed anyone before I met this ‘thing’. I believe that it is part of the psyche that I built up in order to protect myself from a young age and its part of why I was so easily duped when I felt that I could FINALLY trust and love and BE loved curtosy of the monster from hell skank beast. I want to work on feeling love and being loved, as a GIVEN. Then it wont be such a big hole in my soul, you know, with a sign in the window saying’ vacancy for sociopaths, apply within!’. One of the positives that has come out of this is that I have ‘seen the light’ with regards to those people in my life that DO love and care for me. I have found the trust that I never had before to place the value I didnt have on those relationships without fear or giving anything of myself away. LOVE IS important. Love will save the day… just not in a silly Jane Austin way… or an ‘all consuming pathalogical obsessive way… but in a solid, true, calm, deep and meaningful way. REAL love exists I have learnt just as much as REAL EVIL…but neither LOOKED like I had pictured, I had it all wrong. I refuse to ‘throw the baby out with the bath water’ here even if it takes years of therapy and work on myself to re-programme ! Am I making any sense? lol:)x I hope all is well with you today Tilly.x
First, some background:
The guy at the sushi bar, who enlightened me about malignant narcissism says that he learned that his dad was a N and his mom was N-lite. He is NC with his dad. His brother is also an N, but he still communicates with him.
This man is a successful lawyer, 50 years old and never married. I think I scared him off when i told him about the predatory nature of my ex-P, but at the time, I just wanted to be honest and also was not ready to jump into the sack or anything else – I was still in shock from my discoveries.
He says many of his relationships have turned into stalking mode but he usually doesn’t worry since he knows how to bore them away.
Later, while talking on the phone, I told him that I discovered that N’s are EVERYWHERE. It seems like you can’t get away from them. He said, “yes, I’ve heard there are good people out there, but I’ve never met any of them. I only meet N’s.”
maybe we should find the non-N’s out there and start a club, just for non-N singles. If any N’s infiltrate we reserve the right to kick ’em to the curb and publish their names.
Dear Blue skies,
I could tell you were having trouble describing what you felt, but IT CAME THROUGH ANYWAY!!!! And is so RIGHT ON!!!
The hormonal FLUSH of “new love” is a chemical thing, just a great feeling, like a drug high that lasts (if all goes well) for a few months or years, then if things continue to go well, it settles into a contented, friendship and long-lasting caring love.
Many times statistically at least, “arranged” marriage which some cultures do very well turn into this contented long lasting marriages/relationships even though they don’t start out even knowing each other before marriage.
IN the US about 50% of first marriages end up in dirvoce court I think. and 75% of second marriages (I haven’t checked these statistics lately but they were the last I heard) I can’t even imagine what the percentages of “relationships” and “live togethers” turns out to be over before too long.
People seem to think that just “living together” is easier to get out of than a legal marriage but many people have children together in these arrangements or buy property together so i am not sure they are bettering themselves much. Also the “live togethers” seem t6o me to be “more casual” and happen sooner than traditional marriages used to at least.
Though in some people’s minds marriage is more a religious committment than any thing else, it IS also a legal arrangement. Sharing your bed and your possessions etc with someone I think should be a least a VERY serious decision, with a legal CONTRACT even if you don’t have a desire to legally marry.
If you wanted to sell someone a car you would not let someoen else try it out and drive it for a year or two, or even a month or two wihtout some kind of contract, so why would you let someone share your finances, and life without some kind of contract?
If I ever considered remarrying again, and if either of my sons decided to either marry (son D) or re-marry, son C, there would be a prenuptuial agreement about how things would be handled in the event of death or divorce—contracturally, rather than letting a JUDGE decide this later when potentially the two spouses hated each other.
There are only two things that can happen in any marriage or relationship—one or bvoth of them die, or they seprate/divorce. So since one (at leat) of these things is going to happen, why not prepare legally before it does so that there isn’t any CONNING?
25 years ago when my late husband and I got married, he had kids and I had kids, and we had a prenuptuial agreement on how his, my and our resources would be handled.
When son C got married we all thought she was after a “meal ticket” so we put the family farm (which had all our houses on it) into a trust so in the event of a divorce between C and the WITCH that she could walk away with her SUITECASE, not a chunk of the family farm. As it turned out, the SHERIFF gave her a RIDE TO JAIL as well and she didn’t even get the SUITECASE.
Though my late husband and I had long ago mingled funds, because of the pre-nup I had no problem at all with his estate. Or the step kids. Since I have a good relationship with my step kids it wouldn’t have been a problem anyway, however, I do know a woman who lost her home at an elderly age and was destitute because of her step kids moving in like vultures….and they were legally able to do so, thought it was NOT her husband’s wish, but they had not protected her before they married.
Whether you are living together or married, or have kids or don’t, there needs to be provision made legally in a contract prior to marriage or moving in in my opinion. If the relationship turns out well, fine, if not, you are protected at least finiancially.
My son also made the mistake of “letting her” handle ALL finances and bill paying—much to his sorrow! All commited and cohabiting couples should BOTH know what the finances are, what comes in and what goes out and for what! If someone isn’t willing to do that with you—-you do not need them!!!
Even if they are spending their own money UNwisely, you should be aware of it. Credit cards should also be closely monitored as well. Ps are good at hiding expenditures or lying about them, and many people here have said they were stuck with credit card debt that their X P ran up, or THEIR credit ruined.
Married or not, if your finances are co-mingled, you should have some kind of agreement in writing, some kind of committment, and some kind of auditing and knowledge of how joint finances or seprate finances are handled. If the finances are pooly handled, you can bet there is some problem with the relationship. Many times this is the FIRST indicator that there are other problems going on.
FINANCIAL GOOD SENSE 101—you need to pass that course with an A+
I think that it is interesting to note that a root cause of the disorder is due to lack of emotional & nuturing bonding in the first few weeks/months of life. Sadly, I do know that my ex-bfd P was not wanted by his mother (and to this day he hates her and feels she abandoned him) and he was adopted by a close friend of his father’s. It is tragic. I cannot help but have compassion for him, but I do have my limits.
He is back in my life as ‘a friend’. Apparently his new wife is the silent accepting type, that he claims to be able to leave for days on end, and she simply dosnt even call or bother him. She is very secure with him, and dosn’t question anything he says or dose. It’s what he wanted, so he married her.
I did find out that she recently had a miscarriage, but he did’nt confide in me. It’s very tragic. He’s just far too rough in bed, that is the primary reason she lost the child, of that I am sure.
He has given me $ and some food. It’s been rather strange. I do know that he is trying to see if he can ‘buy me’, and waiting to see if I’ll make any advancements to him. He’s only really interested in sex. Everything is a game to him. I am grateful that he hasnt contacted me in 4days + today, and I am well aware of his manipulations.
Sure I admit that I do desire him,(It would be great to meet someone new) but I would never be that ‘other woman’ and I also know he can never love me, or anyone else (his wife is so clueless) so it’s not ever going to be worth getting all tied up with. I like the simplicity of friendship, but my guard is up, knowing his tendancies and desire for power and control are uppermost in his game with not just me, but everyone.
I do not know what his next move with me will be, but I at least know to keep it light and simple. I also will always have the freedom to say no to him, imagine how shocked he would be if I did!? I can just see his face!
As more time passes, and as I re-read the profile of a sociopath & come to this blog, I feel a distinct and powerful sense that I am in reality, not fantasy, about this man. I mean to say that I know he’s got limitations. Sure, he dose alot of nice things, but I wont get tangled up in any hopeless affaire with him. I also see that he seemed to pick a good victim with his wife, she is utterly accepting of him in every way, and ignores his tantrums, absences and abuse. I am sure he will have affaires, but it will never, ever be with me. I’ll be that challenge that he can never get back. Thank God, I am looking forward to meeting someone who can return my love!
missdiaz, you are just not thinking with, as ErinB says, “your inner psychopath”.
he doesn’t want a friend. He doesn’t want sex. He wants control, attention and drama and he will get it with any person or animal that crosses his path.
Remember MaryJoe got shot in the face by Amy – not by her husband. Your P will drive his wife or one of his other mistresses insane by flaunting your “friendship” as being something more. Before you know it, the drama is back and you risk being shot in the face.
Missdaiz, I also think you are playing a dangerous game. in your post you are talking like you are ‘in control’ of the situation…then making excuses for why he is like he is (red flag)… making yourself party to hurting his current wife by enabling his BS(red flag)… saying that even though you know what he is you still desire him(erm BIG red flag) doesnt sound like a ‘control’ sitch to me or that you are seeing the reality. Its sounds like you are enjoying feeling like you hold his strings… THAT is the fantasy. You are still INVOLVED and IN THE GAME. Stop it.
Sorry to be blunt.:)x I just KNOW that NC is the only WIN situation.xxxx
much love.
This is my first post, and it’s a weird one, but I felt compelled to comment anyway. My ex-n was VERY ugly, but the sex was so fantastic that it was actually the reason why I went back to him – the second time, at least. Due to extensive sexual trauma, before I met him I not only hadn’t ever come from it, but I didn’t even feel anything during it at all. He came into my life after 7 years of having pleasureless sex and took me to having multiple orgasms. The strange thing was, it was VERY hard for him to come and he had the stamina from hell, which I guess isn’t strange for a sex addict when I think about it. Because of my history, I’m one as well, which is why it compelled me to go back to him.
Skylar – my ex NEEDED my emotional bond as well. When that quickly receded after the first time he became violent, that was all he ever talked about – needing me to emotionally trust him again and put complete blind mindless faith in him to do the right thing and take care of me (like he said that he expects of EVERYONE he “allows” into his life – “if they don’t act exactly as I expect them to, I’m not going to be friends with them. What’s wrong with that? EVERYONE has those expectations of the people in their lives.” No, most people let people be as they are and either accept that or not!). I was ripe for the plucking due to an abusive home situation (my mother is somewhere between borderline and plain batshit psychotic) and was desperate for an out. However, previous to him I had a three-year relationship with either an N or S (haven’t really figured out which) and he was, like many have shared about their exes, bisexual as all get-out. He’d do anyone – male, female, old, young, married, single, he didn’t care. I asked him why once and he said exactly that – he just didn’t care. Both of these guys I was involved with are serious alcoholics and come from very bad family situations.
blueskies – I actually lost my mind when I was with my ex. With all the trust I gave him, I completely lost mySELF. I did so many things with him that I’m so ashamed of and repulsed by as well. You’re not alone 🙂 The way I let myself be degraded was just… unconscionable. My mom always told me to never let any man control me but I had to find out the hard way the consequences of not heeding that advice. Even though I’ve always had non-existant self-esteem, I at least had a SEMBLANCE of respect. With my ex-N – a broke 36-year-old with 6 kids by four different women (though only four are alive) who doesn’t even so much as own a bed and FORGET about child support, yet somehow I was letting him make all the decisions while I took care of the responsibilities. He even had a rule that he didn’t introduce me to his “business” associates (he fancies himself in the entertainment business) because they didn’t care about “the man’s girl” but of course, that rule somehow went from applying to just “business associates” to his stripper FRIEND. And every time I called him on an inconsistency, he had some web of words to spin that confused me to the point where I just gave up and conceded. He had beaten me down, kept me sleep deprived and hungry. I reached a level of disrespect for myself that I didn’t know was possible. Even though I had no self-esteem, I always had an independent MIND and he had taken even that from me. I’ve been almost four months NC (with an admitted exception of a week in July when somehow an e-mail got through to me and my curiosity got the better of me) and I am also trying to become un-addicted to him. Even though he caused me to break my almost three year stretch of not self-injuring – not once, but TWICE – I still find myself immensely confused when I think about him. Intellectually, I know what he is – his actions that I documented at the time are plain evil clear as day – but EMOTIONALLY, I want the intellectual stimulation, and PHYSICALLY I absolutely crave the sex.
Sorry about the long post – hello everyone. Long time reader, first time poster.
Missdaiz,
Why would anyone want a “friend” or to even be in contact with such a man as this? For money, and the things he “does for” you?
That is like saying “he is such a nice person, WHEN HE IS NOT ROBBING BANKS, OR BEING MEAN TO PEOPLE.”
Get real, woman, get away from this person and STAY away. he is a married man, and whether or not his wife is a victim or not is between her and him. Get a single man for a friend, not a married psychopath, it can only lead to MORE TROUBLE.
YOU ARE PLAYING WITH FIRE. If you choose to do this, and continue to interact with him, then no one can help you, only you can fix your problems and that can only be jfixed by getting away from him.
MissDiaz:
“I do not know what his next move with me will be, but I at least know how to keep it light and simple.”
“Light & simple” is easy enough…..Good for you.
But, what if HE decides his “next move” is to make it HEAVY and COMPLICATED?????
Disordered men (and women) are nothing to play with. Get away from this person ASAP.
P.S. Only one person can be in control at any given time during a relationship/friendship. So, when push comes to shove (and it usually does, with disordered individuals), which one of you will be the one in CONTROL????
Be very careful.
Rosa’s right… HIS next move. NOT yours. In his mind you are still in a game but this one is ‘let her think she’s in control for now game”. Wake up lady! (with respect xxx) You are in control of Jack sh**t with these people.
and another thing! WHY would you want to ‘see his face when you say no’? have you read about sociopaths? THEY DONT CARE!! As skylar says… tap into your inner sociopath and re-think the situation you are putting yourself in.xx