We tend to speak of sociopaths versus non-sociopaths in pretty much either-or terms, despite recognizing that we fall along a spectrum of behaviors and attitudes that range from extremely unself-centered (even to self-sabotaging levels, reflecting poor self-esteem and weak self-protective defenses); to levels we would describe as dangerously exploitive (moving into the range of full-blown sociopathic personality, characterized by a troubling indifference to, and disregard of, others as separate human beings whose dignity deserves to be respected).
At bottom, as I have elsewhere written and stressed, the sociopath is a remorseless, chronic boundary violator; his regard for others’ dignity is minimal and shallow, if not missing. The function of his violating behaviors is to acquire something he wants with little, certainly no deep, regard for the damage he inflicts on others in his taking of it.
The sociopath knows that his behavior is “wrong” according to law and conventional standards of decency and, unless intellectually impaired, he knows “why” it is wrong from the same code of laws and standards.
He may be able to say, for instance, “It was wrong, or I know why it’s considered wrong, to have robbed that individual,” but he will rob him anyway, because he wanted the money and credit cards, and what he “wants” supersedes all codes of respect toward others.
Thus the damage he inflicts on others in taking what he wants is, at most, a secondary, non-ethical based consideration.
Just as importantly, if not more importantly, the sociopath’s understanding (intellectually) of the suffering he’s caused will leave him, unlike the non-sociopathic person, peculiarly (and tellingly) untroubled.
The sociopath, I can’t stress enough, is concerned with his gain, not others’ pain.
Now let me return to the point of this article. There are individuals with whom I work, not infrequently, whom I’d describe as, in some sense, “fall between the crack” personalities. These individuals have sociopathic tendencies. They are almost always chronically abusive one way or another.
Although they may not precisely meet every criterion of the textbook sociopath, still they exhibit, often (and historically) enough, the kinds of sociopathic abuses (and rationalizations of their abuses) that make them sociopathic enough to be avoided as assiduously as the full-blown sociopath.
Interestingly, these individuals can pose worse dangers than pure, unequivocal sociopaths for the very reason that it’s possible to find features of their personality that do not conform exactly to the textbook sociopath’s, leaving one dangerously more optimistic that her partner may be capable of the change and personal growth worth the wait, and suffering.
However, much more often than not, these individuals will lack this capability just as much as the clearcut sociopath lacks it. Yet their partners can find this especially hard to accept—that is, the virtual certainty that their sociopathically-inclined partner is as unlikely to make the kinds of critical reforms as the clearcut sociopath—because, in some respects, these “partial” sociopaths evidence certain capacities of sensitivity that encourage a seductive (but ultimately misguided) basis of hope?
Of whom am I speaking? I am speaking, for instance, of the individual willing to come to therapy. But you are much more likely to see this individual in a couples therapy situation than individual therapy (voluntarily). This is because in couples therapy he can more easily, craftily disavow his responsibility for the abuse he perpetrates than in individual therapy.
When you seek individual therapy, voluntarily, you are basically conceding that you are coming with some of your own issues to address that can’t so easily, entirely be pawned off on your partner. Certainly it’s possible for an individual to present himself in individual therapy, even voluntarily, on a purely manipulative basis, but this individual usually won’t stay in the therapy for more than several sessions and, moreover, he will quickly reveal signs of his flaky, dubious investment in the process.
So it’s quite rare to find a significantly sociopathically-impaired individual seeking individual therapy, sincerely, on his own. But I repeat: it’s quite common to meet these individuals in couples therapy, where they may also enjoy, on some level, the tension of the dynamic in the room—the challenge, in a sense, to compete for the vindication of their image and comparative innocence; to persuade the therapist of their partners’ craziness, or histrionics.
In short, the couples therapy environment can satisfy the sociopath’s tendency to gamesmanship, competition and manipulation. He can verbally flaunt his quickness, glibness, logic, gaslighting tendencies and, if he has them, his impressive analytic and persuasive powers; he can rise to the challenge of convincing the therapist who the really “whacked” party in the relationship is?
But let us not lose the thread of the article. We are speaking here not necessarily of the full-blown sociopath but the “partial” sociopath. And this, again, can complicate and, in some respects, worsen matters!
For the reason that, because he may not be a full-blown sociopath, he may be involved in the therapy with a “sort of—”perhaps a “partly genuine” wish—to salvage the relationship, and not necessarily for entirely selfish, manipulative reasons.
And so this can be especially confusing to his partner, if not the therapist. Who is this man? If he is showing up regularly for couples sessions, seems on some levels to love his partner, is capable of producing, seemingly, some sincere insights and some accountability for his destructive behaviors (at least in the sessions), doesn’t this suggest a candidate for some real, substantive change, if not transformation?
But the answer most often is, NO. To repeat, the individual of whom I speak is almost always, in the final analysis, no more capable of changing than the textbook sociopath, only his more human side creates the teasing prospect that he can, indeed, produce this change, when he won’t, and can’t.
Why? Why can’t he? Why won’t he?
Because he has too much of the sociopath in him. What is too much? This is hard to quantify. At what point along the spectrum is he too far gone to make meaningful, worthwhile, reliable changes, even though he may retain some genuinely humane qualities?
For the answer to this question, tune in to my next article.
(This article is copyrighted (c) 2011 by Steve Becker, LCSW. My use of male gender pronouns is for convenience’s sake and not to suggest that females aren’t capable of the behaviors and attitudes discussed.)
sky – i remember you talking about this. and you reminded me of something – people used to tell me things, because i felt safe to them, was compassionate, and didn’t take their telling me personally – i was detached (in a good way). that was old one step, the one who went off into retreat for a year. but i also had better boundaries. i was shiny, but my radiance was more solid – fewer holes.
this thing with this woman was about holes. invasiveness.
i suspect someone hugs my gram everyday – and she has good boundaries. she isn’t scared of people – irritated by them at times, but not scared.
i wonder what it is that you give off? i have no way of knowing via lf – maybe you are just adorable.
it sounds ‘shiny.’ – a light from within. trying to figure this out. you are very much in your intellect, but others are attracted to your light in person…feel safe to tell you things – that suggests that you posess a type of emotional maturity to me (that’s my only point of reference), not the arrested emotional development you talk about. hmmmmm. do you lack a sense of self or were just just not allowed to enact its boundaries when you were young so you gave up and are just wide open energetically? your ‘self’ is there, just holey? 😉
i gotta go to bed. peace out all – and i will check in tomorrow morn to catch your response, sky. xo
OneJoy, even invasive people can’t hurt you if you don’t care about their opinion of you.
It’s only after being lovebombed, that most of us begin to care what the lovebomber thinks of us. Do you know what I mean? When spaths want you to invest emotionally in them, the first thing they do is lovebomb, because accepting a complement as truth, is the first step towards valuing them and their opinions of you. After that, they dis you and you feel bad because their good opinion was taken away.
It sounds as if you feel like you care about her opinion of you? You did exchange recipes and agree to lunch. But now you don’t want to do anything that could change this, so you are setting boundaries? I could be wrong, like I said, this is a subject that’s very interesting to me because it befuddles me.
I’m trying to think of something someone could ask me where I would respond “that’s private”. There aren’t too many things, except financial questions (but then money is the only thing my parents taught me to protect).
I know that people see me as being very meek and mild mannered, just really nice and harmless. When the spath had set up the neighbors to destroy me, he must’ve told them that I was such a people pleaser that I could be talked into anything. I was secretary of the neighborhood association and the president, Joe, was one of my spath’s trojans. Joe told me we should just do what our association attorney said even if it was wrong and we knew it was wrong. This guy was a bully and a blowhard. Suddenly I went from mild-mannered skylar to the evil bitch from hell. I told him THAT IS NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN, DO YOU GET IT JOE!?. He resigned.
Lacking boundaries might be the same as not caring what others think about you. I lacked boundaries and I attacked Joe because I really didn’t care what he thought of me. I did think he might try to kill me since we were alone in his car. But I didn’t really care, I HAD to tell him the truth. Joe had tried to lovebomb me before, but I found him repulsive so it didn’t work.
I think that lacking boundaries comes out in different ways depending on the situation. It’s not a simple concept at all.
skylar:
I suspect that people are picking up on your caring, compassionate nature and you are obvioulsy a listener. It happens to me also. People will talk and talk to me. Probably mostly because they sense I am a good, compassionate person, but more likely because I am quiet so I let them talk and they sense that. X spath did that to me…talked and talked and I listened. He told me more than once that he liked me because he could talk to me and that was important in a relationship. Just one more lie I guess…sigh.
Greetings, friends,
I haven’t been on here in forever. I clicked on the site a few weeks ago, and immediately my computer came down with a nasty virus. Me and the computer were out of commission for a while. It was the most productive week of my year. It’s amazing what you can get done when you break your internet addiction…….well at least for me. I don’t think the virus came from this site, but just a warning to be careful about the links you click on. Even the best anti-virus software cannot protect you from some of the nasty viruses going around.
I am having a lot of stress in my life at the moment, much of it dealing with my neighborhood and how it is turning into a ghetto. This is particularly evident during pool season. I had to call the cops on a pool party at 3am, so here I am up. Ugh. The neighbor boy has been sitting out on his patio every day without his shirt sunning himself and ignoring me. I’d love to say that I could care less, but it does bother me to have that trigger there (for those who know the story). It probably wouldn’t bother me so much if I were happier and more fulfilled in my own life. But I’m letting a lot of little stresses get to me. I found a beautiful 2 bedroom/2 bathroom loft apartment in a very nice neighborhood not far from here. For the same as what I pay here, I could get twice the square footage and (finally) have a dedicated massage room. I am on the wait list for one, and when it comes through, I will (finally) walk away from this nightmare of a condo. Meantime, I have a company I’m talking to that SWEARS they can get me a principal reduction on my mortgage loan. I hear this is really hard to do on the type of loan I have – FHA. It will cost me $3000 out of my pocket to do it, and the initial part – $600- is a risk. I’m weighing all the options carefully. I have an emergency/moving fund, and it would take a lot for me to spend a big chunk of it. A reasonable mortgage and low monthly payment would allow me to rent this place out. Either way, I need to get out of here. It has turned into the ghetto. I think the best thing is to walk and not look back. It doesn’t take too much negativity in my life before I become depressed. I don’t really want to be a landlord.
The apartments are in a beautiful self-contained community where my Spanish school is. You can walk to the shops and everything, and it’s even closer to my job. They reserve 1/3 of the units as “tax break” units for lower income people like me. So it’s really a very expensive apartment that I will get a price break on. They also work with their tenants to make it affordable when the rates go up. They do criminal background and credit checks on ALL tenants. With the 14 foot ceilings, there are no noise problems. There is a junior olympic sized pool and a hot tub that is open year-round. A gym and a computer room/community lounge in the lobby. They’re all remodeled in modern style, which I like. But the best part is having a separate massage room and guest bathroom. This would be a great change for me. I’m considering it very carefully because once I move, I will likely never be a homeowner again. I’m almost relieved about that, to be honest. This condo has been nothing but an anchor around my neck. 2 or 3 years ago the furnace broke. It was $3400 out of my pocket to replace it! It would be so great not to have to deal with repairs.
On the plus side, I have a new female friend who is in the teacher training program for a Buddhist community that I have some affinity with. She has been so much fun to hang out with and a real voice of reason for me with all my ups and downs. She is a little older than me, and we can converse on a deep level. But she’s also a lot of fun, which is what I miss from my current group of friends. I tend to be a bit of a loner, so will see if the friendship “sticks”. We seem to have a lot in common, including both driving red convertibles, even if mine is a 14 y.o. honda del sol. It’s a challenge not to spend money, though, when we’re together, because we’re always around gift stores or places where beautiful clothes are being sold. The other day we drove up to the mountains for an ice cream and they were selling clothing in the ice cream store! Clothes are my weakness.
On the topic of “invasive people”, I have found a good response when someone asks a question that is private, but I don’t want to offend them or be rude. I just say, “Maybe I’ll tell you some time.” It works great if I’m on a date with someone I hardly know and they start asking a lot of personal questions. But anyway, I haven’t been out on any dates lately. The dating sites have started to feel negative for me, so I just stopped doing them. Anyway, I have not had problems so much with people asking inappropriate questions as people wanting to give me unsolicited advice. This drives me nuts. I have a friend who wants to set me up with this guy friend. She is CONVINCED the HE is what I need. I just consider the source. She met a man long ago who gives her a lot of security, and so much of her life is about financial security. Realizing where she’s coming from has helped me not feel angry toward her, and not take her comments too personally.
I have a lot of little stressful things going on now, along with the big stressful thing about possible moving and walking away from my mortgage. It is all weighing me down. I just hope I can get enough sleep and stay sane.
So glad to see everyone doing so well here!
Love,
Star
The spath i met him and his ex wife and her mom’s are all nuts. Misery loves company i guess. Spaths are people who are literally born with no soul and empathy. I cannot even begin to imagine being so unfeeling. Waking up feeling like an cold ice cube.
Thank you to everyone who responded to my post. My therapist says the same exact thing to me all the time. She wants me to stop living the fantasy lie that he has this wonderful life. I’m working on it.
Believe it or not, it has been 14 years since my relationship with this person. He was super intelligent, handsome, and popular. He had chased me for 4 years until I finally gave in and fell hard for him. And then, in an instant, a complete 180 happened. He claimed he was confused and that he didn’t want to hurt me. That didn’t stop him from spreading the “I love You’s” and using me for sex and then telling all of his friends the most intimate details of our sex life.
I wasn’t allowed to call him my boyfriend because he just got out of a relationship and needed time. Mind you, this is the same person who obsessed and cried over me for 4 years prior. Cheated on his girlfriend with and told his friends that I was the girl he loved. He even wrote in one of his love letters that Beethoven’s 9th was indeed an ode to me. PUKE!! I thought he left his girlfriend to finally be with me, the girl he loved.
He charmed the pants off me in the beginning with his love letters and declarations of profound connectedness. Then the D & D started. It was a shock when it first took place. He was not at all the sweet boy who had a crush on me. It began when I declared my love for him for the first time. I think he was really pissed that I had given him an ultimatum that he had to break up with his girlfriend or leave me alone. He couldn’t have his cake and eat it too anymore.
The whole relationship he accused me of being clingy and controlling. I thought I was in-love. When two people are in-love, don’t they want to spend as much time as possible with one another. I was only able to see him once or twice a week. He would slander me behind my back to all his friends but still tell me he loved me.
His friends started to treat me badly, even right in front of him. He would do nothing to defend me. I was shamed into believing it was all my fault. He would scream at me and tell me that no one liked me and that I was a controlling bitch. I was so confused because I thought that I was just showing love to him. I just wanted that sweet boy back.
I’m not saying that I was innocent in all of this. I did do some stupid things, but I always truly wanted to have a good relationship with him. There are some nasty details that I have left out. Let’s just say, he was really cruel and emotionally abusive. I know I didn’t deserve any of that.
As it turns out, I finally had enough and broke up with him. I crumbled a few times and wanted to re-connect with him, but he was extremely cold and callous to me . Didn’t want to resolve anything.
Did I mention that all of this happened in only a year and a half time span. From the time he broke up with his girlfriend to the time I broke up with him.
I had suspicions that he was going to go after his friend’s sister next. I kept asking him if that was the case and he denied it. You see, he had also seen her in the past behind his previous girlfriends back. (he cheated on his girlfriend with many woman…at least six that I know of) I always knew there was a chance she was a contender. Well, guess who he married and had children with.
This goes back to my original question. I’m convinced he would never hurt his wife because she is his good friend’s sister. His friends mean everything to him. (Or should I say, his image means everything to him) He would never do anything to mess that up.
Just wish I caould have that final piece of the puzzle.
Thank you for hearing my story,
Sister
Sisterhood: ((((big hugs, dear)))) I read your post and OMG you poor girl…sounds like you have been through the mill like I have.
The only ‘final piece of that puzzle’ that you are going to end up with will be one that you devise for yourself. You are going to get no resolution from your x in that area so you are going to have to make one for yourself which is exactly what I have done.
Did you speak your mind when you broke it off? Did you tell him straight up on no uncertain terms, that you know he is a player and a scammer? The same way I did. Oh yes, I let him have his final visit just so I could let him have it and tell him exactly what I thought of him and then I informed him that if he did not stay away from me or does not stop bothering me, that I would press charges on him and serve him and his disgusting new victim, restraining orders and I meant every single word of it. Especially after HE betrayed our friendship and then on top of that tried to kill me, with glee and intent. I meant every last word I said and there will be no more words from me, irregardless of his stalking. He can just sit wherever he is and consider the things he has done to others. And, if he isn’t; oh well, I can do nothing about his SOUL. We all seem to eventually reap the evil we sow in this life.
Sister: you are going to have to MAKE that final piece/peace. 🙂
Find out how you truly feel; be honest; weigh out all the good and the bad in your relationship and be honest.
When you are honest with yourself, you will find your missing piece and more peace than you could ever imagine. 🙂
I had to make MY final piece and resolution and I am sticking by it without question. NC is NC. Completely and totally. No cheating. THEY ARE NOT GOING TO CHANGE. EVER. If you allow them to, they will devour you and your soul. They are not even worth our thoughts anymore.
I say prayers for you Sister….
Think of yourself and stand your ground.
YOU are as entitled to live this life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
update: no threats since yesterday afternoon.
which is a good point to share – if you are being stalked by x sp, do keep good logs: dates, times, etc. – I have started a little journal on my desktop with all the information as it plays out. Then when it comes time for court proceedings and legalities, it will be so easy to remember and print out for the prosecutor.
I know some of us are not to this point yet, but for those of you a little shaky, still, in the big BOMB DROP, pay attention and be good to yourself. DO WHATEVER YOU HAVE TO DO TO PROTECT YOURSELF, INSIDE AND OUT. THESE ARE ‘ILL’ PEOPLE and not in control of themselves. You know that as well as I do or we wouldn’t be here; right? 🙂 We have to take care of ourselves and not worry about them. They are lost. We can’t save them: we need to save ourselves.
*HUGS MY SISTER*
DUPED
attagirl: you said:
The spath i met him and his ex wife and her mom’s are all nuts. Misery loves company i guess. Spaths are people who are literally born with no soul and empathy. I cannot even begin to imagine being so unfeeling. Waking up feeling like an cold ice cube.
Good point, I have learned it seems to run in families that are dysfunctional. There was hardly any parental control in x. Lots of dark, black, family secrets in his past. None of that is my concern. We should all come to the table prepared to have an honorable relationship or not go to the table at all.
sp’s alienate themselves from society because they see us as a commodity instead of a human being. they don’t feel like we do, Sister. Conscious has no meaning to them unless it is in the context of SAVING THEMSELVES and ONLY THEN. I know it’s difficult to believe that evil such as this truly does exist, but it does and for no rhyme nor reason, we give of ourselves so completely only to be loved to death.
I am not impressed by the threats to ‘back off’…
it only inspires me and empowers me more.
The shoe is finally on the other foot.
Who is laughing now?
DUPED
A person’s family background is tremendously important. While not all those who come from broken homes, alcoholic parents or have been subject to abuse are sociopaths or even toxic, many are. I think this is especially true for boys. Girls seem to be more resilient.
My x-spath came from a broken home and hated his father until the day the man passed. I do not know the details, but I my x-spath was even proud he did not attend his father’s funeral even though his sister did.