LoveFraud reader buzzibee raises some important issues in a recent comment.
How does a tested and proven psychopath usually respond to being told “You have a mental disorder. You are characteristically a psychopath”?
Are [they] so arrogant to dispute a medical diagnosis that they have a mental disorder? Do they display any desire to learn more about the disorder and at any point admit to it?
In order to be diagnosed as a psychopath, a person needs a score of 30 out of a possible 40 on the Psychotherapy Checklist-Revised test (PCL-R). This is a very time-consuming test which only trained personnel can administer, so by and large only prisoners and research subjects are likely to have it.
Psychopaths don’t see themselves as having a problem and so wouldn’t present themselves for testing anyway. Unless they thought they might benefit from the diagnosis in some way. So that’s point number one: psychopaths are unlikely to receive the diagnosis unless they are incarcerated, and probably not even then.
Point number two is that those who do get the diagnosis respond like psychopaths; in other words they use it as yet another tool to manipulate others. Here’s a quote from a December, 13 ‘Nature’ article on research scanning the brains of psychopaths in order to better understand empathy:
All the subjects seem to find the experiment to be nonsense. “It was stupid, boring,” says inmate Willem Boerema (not his real name), who claims to have taken part only because he likes Meffert [the young female researcher]. Then, contradicting himself, he adds that “if they say the study can help people then it’s good”.
Boerema, smart, articulate and multilingual, has a PCL-R rating of 35 and a big problem with the term ‘psychopath’. He views it as a fashionable label abused by the judicial system to keep people like himself from being released. “The courts look at your PCL-R rating and add two years to your sentence, then another two years, and then another.”
When he entered the prison five years ago, Boerema says, ‘borderline personality’ was the fashionable term, and his designated pigeon-hole. “The psychopathy label is more damaging though it prompts everyone to see you as a potential serial killer, which I could never be.” (Note, in reporting this article it was agreed that inmates’ crimes would be neither asked about nor reported on.) But Boerema also wears the score as a badge of honour: “I think my high psychopath score is a talent, not a sickness I can make good strong decisions, and it’s good to have some distance with people.”
I’m reminded of Freud’s comments on the following “piece of sophistry”:
A. borrowed a copper kettle from B. and after he had returned it was sued by B. because the kettle now had a big hole in it which made it unusable. His defence was: “First, I never borrowed a kettle from B. at all; secondly, the kettle had a hole in it already when I got it from him; and thirdly, I gave him back the kettle undamaged”….We might…say: “A. has put an ‘and’ where only “either-or” is possible.”
‘Boerema’s litany is classic. It’s ‘nonsense’, ‘stupid’, ‘boring’. I’m going along because I like the doctor, I want to help people. It’s ‘fashionable’, ‘damaging’, labeling, used as an excuse to keep him in prison. It’s a badge of honour, a talent. It’s not a sickness… In short, there is no such thing as psychopathy, but to the extent that it’s true, it’s a good thing.
Just two other uses to which the diagnosis might be put are: as a threat, and to elicit pity.
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There’s never anything wrong with the psychopath. This is perhaps the main reason why therapy doesn’t work with them – they have no motivation to change. But that’s a topic for another day!
Silvermoon, I never cease to be amazed that these studies are conducted via convicted criminals. What about the everyday spaths? The ones that are moving among society without a shred of remorse or conscience?
“The Sociopath Next Door” made a good stab at discussing these Things that move so easily (sometimes, elegantly) along their webs of deciet, but I venture a guess that 1-out-of-every-22-people being spathic is WAY below the true number.
So, it brings me to this consideration: the only way to protect ourselves from being baited, lured, and snagged is by erecting boundaries. Unfortunately, “boundaries” isn’t discussed between parents and children, teachers and students, and friends among friends. It’s something that we stumble upon only after we’ve been victimized.
Hi.
He is in a Federal Facillity and I believe they are doing this work now.
I wonder how I would get access to it for the purpose of obtaining protection orders and filing etc,etc.
Am curious to learn because the article says it is not likely he would get a P diagnosis from that process?
Silvermoon,
Federal criminal records are PUBLIC RECORDS and are available to the public.
A man named J.P was convicted of child porno and was sentenced to 3 years in federal prison. He was released in 1 1/2 years on “supervised release” it is NO LONGER CALLED PAROLE, but essentially that is what it is.
JP was a member of my living history group and we work with KIDS, after he got out of prison he rejoined the group AND got a job at a local museum working with, you guessed it, KIDS. It so happened that I (of only a few) knew he had gone to prison and for what.
I went to the board of directors ofr our group and the MAlES on the board did not want to toss him, so I had to mount a campaign against him. I* DID get him fired from his job. and I DID contact his supervion officer (Parole offricer) and RAISED HELL.
I* got an official copy of his “JUDGMENT IN A CRIMINAL CASE” which I got from the FEDERAL COURT HOUSE in the jurisdiction in which he was sentenced for his crimes.
The FORM NUMBER of this document is “A0245B (Rev. 3/01 Judgment in a criminal case”
What it tells is:
What he was convicted of or plead guilty to (the crime date), the Nature of the offense, his ss#, DOB, federal inmate number, his residence address, name of the judge then thje other pages tell what CONDITIONS his “supervised release” have in addition to the USUSAL conditions. and any FINE he was supposed to pay. WITH THIS INFORMATION I was able to find and speak to his probation officer.
Since I KNEW the jurisdiction in which he was sentenced and so on (that was all besides his name) I was able to EASILY get this information for 25 cents per page.
You might have to file a FREEDOM OF INFORMATION request, but IT IS PUBLIC INFORMATION so you should be able to get this form(s) though it might take more time. IF HE IS INCARCERATED AT THIS TIME, you might be able to find where he is via FIA as well. Good luck.
As far as his “diagnosis” there is a FAT CHANCE (NOT!) that you could get this as it is a “medical” (psychological) diagnosis protected by the privacy act. However, you should be able to get copies of the PUBLIC RECORDS OF HIS CRIMES in the federal jurisdiction.
I got through a PI the list of state crimes that my trojan horse psychopath had committed and been convicted for, but if I wanted OFFICIAL COPIES (the only kind of real use legally) I would have had to obtain them from the records of each COUNTY. This was doable, but would have been a pain in the butt, so I didn’t bother since I wasn’t going to need CERTIFIED copies anyway.
I hope this helps. I have used my PUBLIC RECORDS to follow JP from job to job and have sent each of his new employers copies of this. IT IS NOT ILLEGAL TO DO SO, AS ALL I AM DOING IS SENDING COPIES OF PUBLIC INFORMATION.
It amazes me that groups who use volunteer and paid workers with kids do NOT do a criminal back ground check on these people. However they do kick them out if they get that information. BTW JP’s wife is a schooll teacher so I also send copies to the superintendents of the schools where she works.
I am a BIATCH and proud of it! TOWANDA!!!!!
OxD…..Good for you! 😉 Me, too…..
ox,
pacer doesn’t show these records and i know states, not counties. how do i find the records? can i get them if they are sealed?
Silvermoon, I’m curious about this, as well. The former spath friend had 32 counts of “theft by deception” and did a 3 year stretch in the stir. What I wanted to find out is what, precisely, she did – credit card fraud, or stealing checks, etc. There are many people in this area that she “knows” and she aligns herself with those who have money, specifically, or those that she thinks might HAVE money.
Just curious about this. And, what the heck IS theft by deception, anyway???? Don’t ALL spaths do that? Steal SOMEthing via deceit?
part of me doesn’t want to know, but because history predicts, I want to know who I was dealing with……
I don’t know what all the language means. After this, I hope I never have to refer to this vocabulary again!
Silver,
I don’t know what “pacer” means. Please excuse my carppy memory but are you in the US?
If so, What State?
A “county” is a division of a “state” different states have different counties, some up to 150 each. Each state has a state capitol, ,and each COUNTY has a “county seat.”
So I live in say, ,California (state) in Los Angeles city and Los Angeles County. And Los Angeles is the County seat of Los Angeles County.
The cities have records repositories, the counties have records repositories, and the states have record repositories, and the FEDERAL Government has records repositories.
A person can violate a city law, a county law, a state law or a Federal law. The PROSECUTOR of either cityk, county or state or the Federal prosecutor is the one that takes the person to the COURT for that division of government.
If you X is in FEderal prison, then he has been charged with a federal crime and the records of his crime, his convinction and so on will lbe at a FEDERAL COURT HOUSE in That DISTRICT of the federal courts. (they are scattered across the country)
You might try googling “US federal court districts” and see what you get, but that is as much information as I can get for you. Otherwise I would suggest that you contact a private investigator to do a bit of leg work for you. If they can do it from their office it shouldn’t cost an arm and a leg. Sometimes because of their knowledge they can get it 15 minutes what it would take me or you 15 months to find.
Good point OX.
I am working with one, but he is taking a very long time to get back to me. I know in general some things he found, but don’t have the specifics- yet.
The pacer is the system that is supposed to pull up all levels of court records, but it only pulls up one from this state- the federal issue that put him where he is.
What I don’t get about that is that part of what it was all about is possession of firearms by a felon and that there were open charges from another state which were dropped as part of the deal. But, that doesn’t account for the manslaughter case which I don’t understand is not showing up.
Suspicion, if I do find out, I won’t be happy. But, If I don’t find out, I might be at more than a casual risk so it seems worth pursuing a little further.
And with as many counties as in the three states, well, needle in a haystack?
Maybe its just easier and faster to supeona somebody who has access to the information when I go to the annulment hearing and ask for a protection order for me and my son. The current attorney doesn’t want to pursue it, but, given the history I can find, I’m not sure we don’t.
And why would I want to take the risk?
Is an address change of 3,000 miles enough?
In reading this page, I found myself initially intrigued by Secret Monster who attempted to enlighten us with some much desired effect (at least on my part) of “insight”. I thought maybe he would be able to put into words what my S could, or would, not. Turns out, I only got so far before I felt anger start to surface, which then led to indignation and a feeling of disgust. Maybe he righted himself, I didn’t read too far. It sounded too much like the blog of Sociopath World, where they seem to delight in our misery.
It just brought it all back full circle for me-it really is all just a game.