LoveFraud reader buzzibee raises some important issues in a recent comment.
How does a tested and proven psychopath usually respond to being told “You have a mental disorder. You are characteristically a psychopath”?
Are [they] so arrogant to dispute a medical diagnosis that they have a mental disorder? Do they display any desire to learn more about the disorder and at any point admit to it?
In order to be diagnosed as a psychopath, a person needs a score of 30 out of a possible 40 on the Psychotherapy Checklist-Revised test (PCL-R). This is a very time-consuming test which only trained personnel can administer, so by and large only prisoners and research subjects are likely to have it.
Psychopaths don’t see themselves as having a problem and so wouldn’t present themselves for testing anyway. Unless they thought they might benefit from the diagnosis in some way. So that’s point number one: psychopaths are unlikely to receive the diagnosis unless they are incarcerated, and probably not even then.
Point number two is that those who do get the diagnosis respond like psychopaths; in other words they use it as yet another tool to manipulate others. Here’s a quote from a December, 13 ‘Nature’ article on research scanning the brains of psychopaths in order to better understand empathy:
All the subjects seem to find the experiment to be nonsense. “It was stupid, boring,” says inmate Willem Boerema (not his real name), who claims to have taken part only because he likes Meffert [the young female researcher]. Then, contradicting himself, he adds that “if they say the study can help people then it’s good”.
Boerema, smart, articulate and multilingual, has a PCL-R rating of 35 and a big problem with the term ‘psychopath’. He views it as a fashionable label abused by the judicial system to keep people like himself from being released. “The courts look at your PCL-R rating and add two years to your sentence, then another two years, and then another.”
When he entered the prison five years ago, Boerema says, ‘borderline personality’ was the fashionable term, and his designated pigeon-hole. “The psychopathy label is more damaging though it prompts everyone to see you as a potential serial killer, which I could never be.” (Note, in reporting this article it was agreed that inmates’ crimes would be neither asked about nor reported on.) But Boerema also wears the score as a badge of honour: “I think my high psychopath score is a talent, not a sickness I can make good strong decisions, and it’s good to have some distance with people.”
I’m reminded of Freud’s comments on the following “piece of sophistry”:
A. borrowed a copper kettle from B. and after he had returned it was sued by B. because the kettle now had a big hole in it which made it unusable. His defence was: “First, I never borrowed a kettle from B. at all; secondly, the kettle had a hole in it already when I got it from him; and thirdly, I gave him back the kettle undamaged”….We might…say: “A. has put an ‘and’ where only “either-or” is possible.”
‘Boerema’s litany is classic. It’s ‘nonsense’, ‘stupid’, ‘boring’. I’m going along because I like the doctor, I want to help people. It’s ‘fashionable’, ‘damaging’, labeling, used as an excuse to keep him in prison. It’s a badge of honour, a talent. It’s not a sickness… In short, there is no such thing as psychopathy, but to the extent that it’s true, it’s a good thing.
Just two other uses to which the diagnosis might be put are: as a threat, and to elicit pity.
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There’s never anything wrong with the psychopath. This is perhaps the main reason why therapy doesn’t work with them – they have no motivation to change. But that’s a topic for another day!
Beverly: Oh you are so right it gives me chills. I used the word punished so many times when telling how I felt – like a little girl almost being guided back in line with how he needed me to act. The turbulance came almost like clockwork, as soon as things calmed and were going well – he would do something to raise flags or look very suspicious to me or downright get caught at a lie. Same as you, I do have a stubborn streak, and I am only pushed so far at being manipulated so I would stand my ground and he would begin the patient, sweet, so determined for me to know how he believed in us. As you said I also could never really tell fact from fiction and as we lived about 45 minutes apart – I felt many a time after we’d said goodnight – he would be out on the town or have someone over. He got alot of enjoyment out of our relationship I do believe, but I also was not so naive to believe that he didnt need more. I agree with you, most the time I hated to let myself think how much worse it really was behind my back than the things I knew. Then his good ways, would make me question myself for even wondering. It makes you nuts inside and I”m just newly out of it this time, but I feel very different this time inside, as for making the breakup stick. Reading this site has reinforced it for me and given me so much more strength. The difference with him is he’d let me get to a point where I always did the dropping of him… then he’d work his weave of drawing me back in… and now it makes me ill to have given him the satisfaction so many times and gone back to him. Live and Learn I guess.
Lesley: Of course they come back. You have to just resolve not to respond. For me, the knowledge he would come back eventually was part of my early healing. As far as it’s a ‘power game’ for those of us who aren’t sociopaths (we have our dignity too!) But as time goes on you realise you don’t want to hear from them. I never answer my door or my phone unless I know exactly who it is. It’s not worth it! (A few ‘caller withheld’ calls and doorbell rings have occurred recently – usually a sign I’m going to hear from him). I split up with him in July, but before that we’d gone a whole month and, another time, eight weeks, before I took him back. Never again!
Splashy trips no. (We went on a week’s holiday to the US together but we totally paid our own way – and one night he went missing altogether for hours as I slept – that makes me giggle now!!) Two of my colleagues he messed around said he was a tight-arse. I’m quite generous so in time he knew he’d have to be with gifts and so on or seem a real tight wad. (Mind you – first Valentine’s Day just two months after he’d begged me to stay in his life, he did NOTHING until I made my horror apparent! Red flag or what?) Tell you what I did hate: Paying for meals etc then him saying another time ‘I’ll pay for this one – I’ll treat you’ as if it was a kindness rather than just being fair!
Hygiene: Mine was clean, but he had the most APPALLING dress sense. Pure, bad early 1990s. I’ve heard that some sociopaths self-harm – I think his wardrobe was his way of going about it.
Secret Monster: What made you decide to marry your wife as opposed to the others? If you got a group of sociopaths together, do you imagine you’d ‘bond’ at all, eg, ‘Oh I feel like that too, I thought I was the only one!’ (a bit like we have in this forum) or would that require empathy? Do you have any need to feel that others have gone through the same experience? Could a pressure group of sociopaths take over the world? (I know that some consider they already have…)
To findingmyselfagain. Yes, at first I didnt understand the dynamics of what he was doing. As when you accept the idiosyncrasies of any new person you date, you dont know how the new partner is going to react.
And of course, if their reaction is cool, unfuffled, closeted and non angry – it makes you feel like you are the criminal of the piece. At first it defies logic, we ‘know’ the behaviour doesnt feel right, we re-run the incident over and over, questionning what we did, what they said etc. We may even try to adapt ourselves to our new partner (bend myself out of shape) to fit their behaviour, talk ourselves out of our own intuition. But it was only when I understood what he was actually doing (which was after we finished), that the mystery of alot of it fell into place. I was shocked and horrified that he had played along with a falseness, saying he despised betrayal in partnerships – when all along he had different women on the sidelines. A con man and sadist. He used stock sayings like ‘you have to accept me for who I am’, clever that. The thing was I thought I ‘knew’ who he was, but I found out who he really was after it was over. He even has his family fooled, getting them to do his dirty work – but they wouldnt listen to me – I was the crazy one of course.
Yes when I put it all together, the way we ended, I realised that he had waited till we were going through a really good bonded patch and then POW he hit me with a couple of nasty tricks. Giving me a phone with all of his womens phone numbers on it. I couldnt believe it at first – why would he do that? Because (a) I wasnt compliant enough, (b) he had found other prey (c) he wanted to punish me for past reactions on my part (d) he wanted the satisfaction of seeing me squirm (e) he wanted to talk his way out of the situation. I have taught body language, and I watched him through a microscope and he didnt mess up, showing what practised liars they are. We had so many breakups, but he would reappear telling a few weeks later but NEVER apologising for anything – because he only wanted me back to satisfy his little sadistic streak.
He arranged another out of the blue suprise for me. Unbeknown to me, he set up a scenario for me to ‘meet’ one of his women in a public place. At first I couldnt believe what I was seeing, I said nothing at the time, thinking I was going paranoid or mad. He had hit me with the ‘now you see it-now you dont’ trick. But then I decided, true or not, I just didnt want to deal with his behaviour any more – it was exhausting, whilst he invested very little in the relationship and used a smokescreen of carefuly crafted words to give the illusion that I was the special one – I did rumble that though and asked him to stop putting me on a pedestal and stop rushing me.
My ex was crafty. He hid behind his mobile phone most of the time and we only saw each other weekends and as we didnt live together it was hard for me to know what he was up to. At the end I did check on him quite alot. Even when I asked him to meet me during the week he was always tired from work. Twice he even moved into my place and moved out days later – probably because I would keep my beedy eye on him and he didnt want that.
If we are basically mainstream good people, how could we have known the game – this is not how we operate, most of us are not practised in manipulation and humiliation – we are in a different club – but it has only been during the last year that I have realised that ‘other’ types of people exist.
I can’t imagine mine (isn’t it funny how we all refer to the sociopaths as ‘ours’, as in they belong to us…strange…anyway) ever coming back or trying to make contact- for any reason. I’m sure he knows that I know what he is. The last look I gave him was of pure contempt and rejection (he attempted to smile and acknowledge and I did not accept). What possible reason could he have to try to reconnect with me? I’ve deleted my email address, and changed my phone number- first time I’ve ever done that for anyone.
Beverly: Sorry, but LOL – I keep thinking we’ve been going out with the same bloke. ‘Only saw each other at weekends’, lack of embarrassment, and ‘you have to accept me for what I am.’ ‘Mine’ (!) said, whenever I listed how unreasonable he was being, said in a really hurt way ‘You make me feel ashamed of who I am’ and then lost contact for a while to make me stew. Then came back as if nothing had happened having done more of what I said I couldn’t tolerate!
Dodged_A_Bullet: I think the danger he exposed you to and your discovery of it has probably made him realise he pushed you too far to ever come back. You must have had the shock of your life when you found out. (How did you find out?)Otherwise, they come back when other supplies run out.
I got mine binned from work and it looks as if he might sneak back in another department. 🙁 He’s so notorious at work but has no shame.
EnnLondon, That thought had crossed my mind too, as I probably live less than an hours travel time from you. Does your ex have any distinguising features – like a tattoo, pierced ears, scars or anything like that? If you say yes to all three, we may have something in common?
🙂 His ears aren’t pierced. I think sociopaths are probably attracted to weirdish tattoos and scars! In any case we were both ‘weekend girls’. Unless you got him Saturday afternoons of course. Come to think of it, I only got him Friday nights! What a mug!
Some days it seems quite easy to imagine that we’re all seeing one bloke – easier than to accept that there are so many people exhibiting the same ridiculous traits and saying the same old words!
Hold on, do you think we’ve all been going out with Secret Monster?!
To EnnLondon – Just reading back on your narrative. It all sounds the same except for my ex was afraid of flying and has never been in a plane as far as I know – you went to the US together – so I dont think its the same bloke – but they sure sound similar.
To EnnLondon – His tattoo is very distinctive and would definately be ‘one’ of his identifying features!!
EnnLondon – Seriously though, I think I may have said before, that these sub personalities seem to come up with the same kinds of lines and behaviours. Is it different people but one energy?