A woman contacted Lovefraud seeking advice in dealing with an extremely disturbing situation. This woman, we’ll call her Rosalyn, suspects her sister-in-law of child abuse.
Rosalyn has been caring for the child regularly ever since she was small, and the girl is now starting school. The little girl if fine in Rosalyn’s care, but when it’s time for her go home, when Rosalyn says, “Mommy’s coming to get you,” the child starts crying and carrying on.
Several times Rosalyn has noticed that the child had bruises. “How did your hurt yourself?” she asked. The girl said she didn’t remember. Other incidents also have Rosalyn concerned about her young niece’s wellbeing.
Rosalyn sees behavior in her sister-in-law that makes her think the woman is a sociopath. It’s not a conclusion she came to lightly. “It took me about a year to figure it out,” Rosalyn said. “I’m pretty sure that’s what the problem is.”
The woman is still married to Rosalyn’s brother. But when Rosalyn tried to talk to her brother about her sister-in-law’s behavior, the result, she said, was “shoot the messenger.” Rosalyn’s brother did not want to discuss her concerns.
So, worried about her niece, Rosalyn called Lovefraud. What should she do?
Father in denial
Rosalyn told me more that makes me think that her concerns are legitimate—details that I am not including in this article. It also sounds like her brother is a caring man who is in denial or under his wife’s control.
Many of us have had to stand by helplessly as someone we cared about was being manipulated by a sociopath. And many of us were that person being manipulated, while our friends and families tried to talk sense into us. The hard reality is that, until someone involved with a sociopath is ready to see what is going on and take steps to leave, there is very little others can do. That appears to be the situation with Rosalyn’s brother.
Call the authorities?
Rosalyn asked if she should call the authorities. As heartbreaking as it is, the answer may be no.
Rosalyn is not operating a licensed daycare facility—if she was, she would be legally mandated to report any suspected child abuse. Rosalyn is simply babysitting her niece regularly.
Rosalyn does not have proof that her sister-in-law is harming the child. So if she called the authorities, it would probably backfire. First of all, the sister-in-law works in a profession that most people would find to be incongruous with child abuse. Secondly, her brother does not see, or at least admit to, a problem.
This is a married couple that is living together. If the child doesn’t “remember” how she got hurt, the mother denies any wrongdoing, and the father says there is no problem, it is unlikely that Rosalyn will be believed.
Resist the temptation to disparage
Rosalyn asked if she should “plant seeds” in her brother’s mind that there might be something wrong with his wife. Again, this is very risky. Here’s what Dr. Leedom wrote in a previous blog post, ASK DR. LEEDOM: How can I get my _____ away from the psychopathic con artist?
The sociopath will set up situations that narrow, yet intensify, the range of emotions your loved one feels. Be as much of a source of warmth and encouragement that you can. Try to resist any temptation to disparage the sociopath. The responsibility for recognizing the evil in the sociopath has to come from the person him or herself. If the person complains about his/her life, do not react emotionally, instead be a good listener and point out the feelings you see. If you become angry and say to the effect, “How dare he/she treat you this way!” You will see your loved one defend the sociopath, and make you shoulder the emotions he/she should be having about the situation. Instead, your loved one has to personally own all the negative feelings about the sociopath.
Rosalyn’s brother is still in the fog, that place of confusion created by the sociopath. Suppose Rosalyn had a “heart-to-heart” with her brother, accusing his wife of child abuse. Suppose the brother then confronted his wife. The woman would convincingly deny any wrongdoing, and then convincingly attack Rosalyn, forbidding the child to ever see Rosalyn again.
Maintain contact with the child
This would be the worst thing that could happen. At least, with Rosalyn, the little girl is safe and happy. She gets a respite from whatever may be going on at home. So the most important thing is for Rosalyn to maintain a connection with the child.
It may be best for Rosalyn to take no direct action to contact authorities, warn the brother or confront the sister-in-law. Instead, it may be best for Rosalyn to bite her tongue, keep her eyes open and make sure she can keep babysitting the little girl.
Rosalyn, should, however document everything that happens. She should keep careful records of any behavior the child exhibits that might point to a problem, photograph any unexplained injuries and videotape the child’s acting out.
By doing that, Rosalyn may accumulate evidence for when the child gets old enough to say what is happening to her, or the brother begins to come out of the fog, or the mother screws up—which she will. Then, her documentation may help free the child from an unhappy situation.
Guys, I absolutely HATE these situations where it is “damned if you DO and DAMNED if you don’t”—-
A friend of mine is the grandmother to a granddaughter, “Kim” that she raised from age 1-8, the father who had custody (the mother was “nutsy” and dysfunctional but not CRUEL) lived with my friend and due to the fact he was a fireman and worked 24 on, 24 off, my friend “Sue” was the primary caregiver for “Kim.”
Daddy finally remarried to another “dysfunctional” game playing drama queen and moved him and dtr out. He REFUSED to let “Sue” even see her granddaughter…made her stay with her step mom who DID abuse her….isolated “Kim” from his 10 0ther sibs as well, and totally from his mother.
Sue even started volunteering at the school where “Kim” went so she could eat lunch with her there. It has been 4 years now since the remarriage, and Sue has been able to see her granddaughter ONLY because the dysfunctional mother gets her on regular weekends but lets her go to her grandmother’s house to visit.
In the meantime, step mommie dearest has had another baby and she uses “Kim” as a household “slave” and baby sitter for her younger half brother.
Fortunately, Sue has a great relationship with Kim and sees her frequently now in spite of her daddy and step mommie dearest. I know that Sue’s contact with this child is very important to her, the only “normal” person in her world.
Kim will be 14 soon and in the state where she lives it may be possible for her to go live with her grandmother at that age…maybe not. My friend is 80 but very independent, and a retired nurse, who raised 11 kids of her own….with a P for a husband (fortunately now deceased) but unfortunately, it seems that the 5 male children of my friend (who are ages 40-60) all seem to be very N-ish (at best) and several full blown Ps, Kim’s daddy is one of the Ps. The girls all seem to be normal and caring women, but several have married Ps.
Most of the grandkids all seem to be fully functioning people in spite of all this dysfunction in the family.
I hurt for my friend, Sue, as Kim is very important to her, and I know that they are extremely close. I appreciate Annie’s point of view on this, and from my days as a foster mother, usually for short periods of time, just a few months, I have had contact with some of these kids when they became adults and they told me how much my caring meant to them in their lives of chaos….even years later, these people who were quite young (some as young as 8 at the time I had them) REMEMBERED the kindness I had shown them. Remembered that someone took them on their lap and hugged them and told the they were good boys.
Sometimes there just “ain’t no best answer” to some of these situations with the Ps. These people (the Ps) use their kids like Charmin.
Hugs to you Rosa, that’s a tough spot.
There are two or three things that come to mind immediately. Please note, everything here is from my own personal experience, of course – the experts here have very good advice and my experience may not apply to this situation:
1) the physical abuse, short of death or maiming, can be healed from. It’s the psychological abuse and terrorizing that need your help most because they won’t be recognized. Luckily this is where you can also be most effective by “immunizing” her against what I call “mind f***ing”. A strong message to her “that she is a wonderful beautiful person, that she is absolutely loved by you, and that nothing that she can ever do (code for “nothing anyone else can do to you”) will change how you feel about her, and telling her that you want her to always remember that and come to you if she ever needs anything at all”, will go a very very long way. Of course, you need to put this to her in a way that it doesn’t get too strongly on her mother’s radar. It’s amazing how much physical torture/terrorizing you can endure if you know that somewhere you are loved.
2) An important question in regards to how her mother views her: is she a burden, or supply? If she is a burden you have an opening to be the hero for the “poor over-burdened mother” by relieving some of the load, and thus continue to be a presence in your niece’s life. If she is her mother’s supply – if her mother gets enjoyment and pleasure from mistreating her daughter – the situation is much more dangerous and tricky. In that case that loving message, strongly and unambiguously delivered, will resonate and stay with her, keeping her mentally connected to you, throughout any physical separation and subsequent trauma. Again, this has to be off the mother’s radar as much as possible.
3) You mentioned that her mother had the summer off. Is she in any way in the teaching profession? If so, Oxy’s point is dead on. My mother managed to insinuate herself into my school system, and her radar was always on high alert for “trouble” – meaning anyone who could out her. She was a master chess player in this regard, and had influence planted at least 6 steps ahead of anything my brothers, father or I might have done. Everything was setup so that any comment on our part would bring down the terrorizing from the community.
There is a wonderful business book “The No Asshole Rule” (really, that’s its title, it’s published by Harvard Business Press) that has some wonderful advice about dealing with what they call “A**holes”, which could include psychopaths. One of its suggestions for dealing with dangerous situations in business (e.g. being targeted by multiple abusive persons) is to use the advice the author was given re: falling overboard into the rapids while white-water rafting: you don’t try to do anything other than survive the immediate situation – your one and only goal (and one and only action plan) is to keep yourself alive (away from the rocks and above water in that case) until you get through the bad times to safety (calm water) before you take any action whatsoever. Don’t try to swim to the boat. Don’t try to swim to shore. Just float through until you’re safer. There is a great analogy there about keeping your legs out in front, but better to read that from the author. My take on that for your situation, like someone posted earlier, is that you’re better to sit back and plan until you are in a more favourable situation, and then and only then take action. Taking any action prematurely will only benefit the mother.
I’m having some significant health challenges right now – not up to posting much at the moment, but I’ll be sure to think about this and get back to you as soon as I’m feeling a bit better.
My thoughts are with you. Take courage. Your goodness will prevail in the long run.
OxDrover,
Looks like our posts overlapped. It must make you feel wonderful (I hope it does) to have those people come back to tell you just how much your kindness to them when they were young impacted them and stayed with them.
That’s a wonderful thing you did. You lead by example.
Annie
Annie:
Thanks for the advice. I will use it.
To answer your question #2, she sees the child as BOTH a burden and supply. It just depends on her whim at the moment. If she has other things on her mind, I get to babysit more often. If she is feeling vindictive and controlling, I don’t see my niece. But, remember, my brother is the father, and he is still in the house. I don’t think he would let her cut my niece off from me completely. But you never know.
Question #3: She is a nursing instructor at the technical college.
She actually reminds me of the “Craig’s List” killer they just arrested. You would never suspect how evil she is just by looking at her. But she is definitely leading a double life. And it is scary to watch close up.
Take care of yourself, Annie. I hope you are feeling better very soon.
Blessings.
DEar Rosa,
I had a couple of P teachers in nursing school, in fact, I changed schools between soph and Jr year to get away frm one because thugh I had kissed her arse fr two years, I knew she was UNpredictable and though right that minute she “l0ved me” it was a chance she wuldn’t fr anther tw years.
I had observed her drive other students bonkers and I changed sch00ls t0 get away fr0m her—my 0 key is n0t wrking s0 I am having t0 use the zer0 key. duh!
When these creeps get into a position of power over students they are terrible monsters. Betty, one of our other bloggers wrote about what one did to her masters program…and to her.
I feel for your SIL’s students. I bet a bunch of them could tell you some REAL horror stories.
Oxy:
I KNOW!! I have not even checked into her work credentials. I bet there is a multitude of evidence there, too.
I am afraid to poke around there, because she does seem to have some “friends” in that area.
I don’t want to step into a land mine, if you know what I mean.
I don’t know what you should do-I had a situation with a granddaughter-who was being physically and sexually abused by two male family members, and the mother helped hide it and was also physically and emotionally abusing the child.
When she came to me with and told me the maternal grandfather and her father had abused her (she had dates, times, etc., and was 7 at the time) it didnt surprise me-but the father is a sociopath and the mother probably is too-
I didnt want to turn it in-I went to two counselors and talked to them-they told me I had no choice and chastised me for not doing so.
The next time I saw my granddaughter-she asked me again to turn it in-and I did. My gut was telling me not to.
They immediately got an atty and went after my husband and me. Four years later-I have seen the child one time. And it was supervised.
We took polygraph tests (they never did) but the court didnt make them.
And my granddaughter looks terrible-she told us she had an eating disorder and weighed 42 pounds in the 5th grade.
To put this into perspective, our 3 1/2 year old granddaughter weighs 42 pounds.
You canNOT expect our legal system, judges, attorneys, social workers or anyone to do the right thing by these kids-they dont care. I’ve heard horror stories about child abuse and our legal system. Most of the abusers are sociopaths-
As it stands now-I dont think we’ll ever see her again. Whether she will live through it or not-I dont know.
It is heartbreaking.
But be prepared-you’ll be dealing not only with P’s but with a very corrupt legal system that is not there for kids.
My husbands son, who is one of the perpetrators and also a sociopath-actually called and ASKED US FOR MONEY-during this. We’ve spent over 30,000 dollars trying to help this little girl.
If you want a good book on the subject-and one that I wish I had read before I did anything-read Childhood It should Not Hurt-by Claire Reeves.
I personally would never turn it in again-I would gain as much access to the child as I could – which is what I had been doing.
She told me “Your house is the only place I’m safe”
I feel like a fool.
YOu should see a very very good atty before you do anything-and let the child make her statement to them
Oh yes-I also took our granddaughter to mercy hospital here and let her tell the social worker what happened-they turned it in.
Hope this helps
Magneto
Magneto:
Let me get this straight. You took the child to Mercy Hospital and the child told the social worker what happened.
And they returned the child to the parents??
Annie, what you (and Oxy) say makes a lot of sense to me. As a former abused child, I have a lot of strong opinions about the need to intervene. But in reality, I have no experience, either in my own life or in others, of attempting to intervene in a situation of parental abuse. But I’ve read a lot of horror stories about it backfiring on the whistle-blower and not helping the child at all.
Like you, I give a great deal of credit to my (maternal) grandmother’s influence on my life for whatever sanity and identity I was able to keep together, despite what happened to me. I spent a lot of time with her until we moved to another state when I was 13, when the sexual abuse began, but the emotional and physical abuse had been going on a long time before that.
She communicated not only that she loved me, but that she had a lot of faith in me and believed in my potential as a person. When we were together, I got a feeling that she separated “us” from “them,” those crazy people I lived with. And though I didn’t really believe that there was anything that could get me out of there until I was old enough to walk out, her constant confidence in me and her interest in what I thought and how I was doing meant that one person in the world cared about me.
I think she saved my life, not just in that situation, but in a larger sense.
She never knew about the sexual abuse until many years later. I didn’t want her to know, because I didn’t want to burden her with the knowledge and the problem of what to do about it. Of course, I was a teenager when it started and so my situation was significantly different than children who are incested at an early age. It’s not that I wasn’t messed up, but at least I was partially grown-up and could reason through a few things.
When I think about small children facing abuse — especially knowing the impact of what I faced as a small child, which isn’t nearly as bad as what these children are handling — it just makes me crazy. I want to do something, anything to rescue them.
But the reality is that, no matter how many laws and safeguards are put in place, the police and courts are usually going to tend to believe the parents, especially if they are plausible sociopaths. Children are still generally considered to be undependable witnesses, and it’s an uphill battle to separate them from their parents. And then, unless there is a safe relation for them to live with, they’re going to be thrown into the foster system, which is another potential nightmare.
We need better understanding and concern for children and families built into common consciousness and the legal system. Damaged children are their own tragedies but they often go on to create more damage. There is a short-sightedness in American culture which is truly toxic. It is going to continue to cost us more and more, until children’s welfare starts to take priority as a political issue.
Forgive the soapboxing. This is a really hot button with me.
Kathleen Hawk:
My brother knows that I think his wife is disordered. And I think he is seeing it, too.
But, he still does not know as much as I know.
No one knows what I know because I am the one babysitting this child while everyone is at work. She feels safe at my house, and that is when she “acts out” things that are happening at home. And she also blurts things out about her ‘mommy’.
My biggest fear is that my brother thinks he can “control” the abuse and just keep going in this marraige. We all know what a huge mistake that would be. But, at the same time, it is HIS marraige.
Even to get out of it, he is going to need an exit plan. His wife has created a very complex situation for him.
I continue to document everything like Donna & Dr. Leedom advised me. My brother has no idea how much documentation I have, either.
He’s been very quiet since ‘that day’ when I enlightened him.
I don’t know what he is planning on doing right now. But, I am so glad I did what I did. Just the fact that he is keeping everything to himself and going on as usual so as not to “upset” his wife is a good sign for me.
There was a day when he would have run straight to her and said, “My sister thinks you are crazy.” So, I see this as progress.