According to the National Institutes of Mental Health, “anxiety is a normal reaction to stress. It helps one deal with a tense situation in the office, study harder for an exam, keep focused on an important speech. In general, it helps one cope. But when anxiety becomes an excessive, irrational dread of everyday situations, it has become a disabling disorder.” Put another way anxiety is supposed to help us. The parts of the brain that produce feelings of anxiety are similar to the parts of the brain that process pain, another negative emotion. Anxiety and its cousin pain help us by signaling danger and causing us to avoid. Their job is to inhibit behavior. The part of the brain that processes pain and anxiety is called the Behavioral Inhibition System or BIS.
I have observed that anxiety is the single biggest obstacle to recovery from a pathological relationship with a sociopath (psychopath). The aftermath of these relationships leaves a person with terrible anxiety, dread and when anxiety/dread is overwhelming, avoidance sets in. Avoidance coping leads people to withdraw from life and responsibilities and the result is only more anxiety. A vicious cycle sets in where anxiety leads to avoidance, avoidance behaviors get us in trouble, that trouble leads to more anxiety, that anxiety leads to even more avoidance”¦and so on.
Why is a pathological relationship different from all others? Why is the anxiety experienced afterward so profound? I think the roots of the anxiety have to do with 6 things:
1. During the relationship, mind games, undermine a person’s confidence.
2. During the relationship the victim is intentionally isolated from potential sources of support.
3. During the relationship the sociopath/psychopath does things that harm the victim’s relationships with significant people in his/her life.
4. The break-up of any relationship causes anxiety, conflict laden relationships more so.
5. In the aftermath many victims face financial problems.
6. In the aftermath many victims face legal problems.
O.K. , I admit the anxiety is caused by a total destruction of the framework of a person’s life!
I think that our psychological defenses can operate so well that many people underestimate the degree to which anxiety influences their behavior and the level of avoidance coping they engage in. The best indicator of anxiety, in my opinion is this avoidance coping.
Just what is avoidance coping? Avoidance coping means that a person denies or minimizes the seriousness of a situation. He/she uses a self—protective strategy and actively suppresses stressful thoughts. Most importantly, behaviorally speaking avoidance coping means an avoidance of tasks that might in anyway remind us of the stressor and avoidance of doing many of the tasks of life. Since avoidance coping requires so much mental energy, there is not enough left for getting work done. Instead, people tend to get satisfaction through other activities like eating or watching TV.
I got to thinking about avoidance coping this week because I tutor a 15 year old in math and he described his own behavior which is a good example of avoidance coping and its consequences. I hadn’t seen this student for about a year. I worked with him for several years and the last time I saw him he was in 8th grade and was doing very well in that he could solve simple algebra problems. Now in 9th grade, he is failing math so his mother called me. When I tested him, he had regressed. He could not do any of the tasks he could do easily only a year ago.
I asked him what happened. He said, “The things I know I do. When I don’t get something, I don’t want to do it. I get home and feel like I would rather ride my bike, so I do. Then I don’t do my homework.”
The point I want to make to you, is that I worked with him for only an hour and he got a 93 on the next test! Due to this victory, he feels a great deal less like avoiding. So I ask you, are there things you are avoiding that you could actually succeed at if you just stop avoiding? Wouldn’t an A grade at some task that you are avoiding boost your confidence and serve you better than that nagging feeling you are not doing the stuff you are supposed to do.
My student’s mother has some negative words for her son’s motivation. She says he is lazy etc. She just does not understand the degree to which anxiety is producing his dysfunctional behavior. He doesn’t outwardly appear anxious, though inwardly he is. Just that little contact with me reduced his anxiety enough to help him face that which he had been avoiding. Just like my student, even when we don’t appear anxious, our avoidance behaviors often lead to further damage to our already damaged relationships.
If you are avoiding too much, I encourage you to stop avoiding. Confront those tasks that are causing you dread, fear and anxiety. In the end you will feel a lot better. You might get an A grade if you try and not trying always leads to failure-an F. Next week more on anxiety and coping.
A really bizarre example of the games played on me is: my older daughter was married to a P and lived in Florida. He was going to force her to pull a large trailer clear to TX and she had never done that before. She was crying on the phone to me, so my X, younger daughter and I took off for Florida to help her. We wound up moving her entire household goods in a large Uhaul back to TX for her. On the way, I got seriously ill [had major health issues] and was exhausted about 11PM one night right outside New Orleans. We were having trouble finding a motel since some sort of convention was in town. I almost passed out on the side of the freeway and she went into a screaming rage and told my X to get my ass up and make me pull myself up by my f’ing boot straps. [My blood count was seriously low]. I was barely conscious. I had to sit there on the freeway side with my little girl with my older daughter and my X screaming and cursing at me. Finally, after my younger daughter got me some of my iron tablets and I drank some water I was able to drive my car [we were all convoying] a few more miles till we finally found a hotel. All this because I did not want her to pull that trailer by herself. That’s the thanks I got.
Dear TB,
They both sound HIGHLY TOXIC, so it doesn’t matter what is going on as far as “are they psychopathic or not”—the one with the GD is, from what I gather about what you have said about how she behaves, at least as toxic as the one who had the affair with your husband…as far as I am concerned, there is no TRUSTING someone who says, like my egg donor did, “if I did anything to you that hurt you I’m sorry” but REFUSES to own up to WHAT they did, like the lies they told etc…that is NO sign of remorse, just an excuse. “I’m sorry” generic is not the same as a REAL BRAND NAME APOLOGY. They are NOT equal! LOL
I realized after I finally cut the cord with son C who is not a psychopath, but is dysfunctional, that he had betrayed me many times and everytime the P son or anyone else got up a posse to ride out to hunt down “mom” he joined the posse until I managed to defend myself and then the was “oh, so sorry, Mom, you’re such a prophet.” Well, you know what, if I’m such a prophet you might want to realize that when I predicted that you would spend yourself into sleeping under a freeway in a torn blanket if you keep on spending everything you make to support your video game habits and dont’ save anything for a rainy day, but I also can tell him that there is NO WAY he will be baled out by me or his brother D. He is on his own. He not only broke faith with me, but with his brother D as well. I’m sure he will show back up sometime with that puppy dog look and a sob story about how his car broke down and he can’t get to work, thus losing his job, and he doesn’t have anything saved to bail himself out and oh, Mom., I’ll pay you back (he always HAS PAID ME BACK) but the loan department is closed, because he is NOT making good judgments about how to spend his money, so there will eventually be consequences that he can’t dig his way out of, and there will not be a shovel at the end of my arms. “Sorry, Charlie…” (remember the tuna commercials?)
Same thing with my “x-friends” that were deciding I needed to bail them out of their poor decisions and if I didn’t give it to them they would just steal it….NOPE! Bye, bye! Don’t let the gate hit you in the ass on your way out, and if you come back again and I’ll hold you at gunpoint til the law arrives to give you a free ride to town. Doesn’t matter how “close” I felt or for how long, or what the blood relationship is or was (or not) it is all about how people treat me and how much I can trust them. I just don’t want people in my life that are not trust worthy. It doesn’t pay to interact with them.
I know it hurts to know that your own daughter is trashy enough to screw your husband (her step father) and the fact that she was a “teenager” doesn’t make any difference as far as I am concerned. !) she knew it was wrong 2) she did it any way 3) she showed no real remorse afterward 4) it was high drama then and afterward 5) she continues to behave in inappropriate ways toward you and her sister.
The daughter with the child, I think is pretty narcissistic as well, and is certainly not behaving in a way that is healthy for anyone, especially for her child.
It sounds to me like you have got a lot in common with Mama Gem as far as your daughters are concerned. I’m glad to see that Gem is making progress with her recovery and starting to see that she has NO control over her daughters or the lack of relationship she has with her grandchildren. It is a shame but it isn’t something that you can fix or control no matter how much you want to or what you do. That’s the hardest part to accept. I kept thinking that FINALLY things were coming together for my son C when he lied to me (and he is such a poor liar!) and I realized it was all just a “rinse and repeat” and would never ever get any better, just calms between storms.
Not worth it. I just don’t want to waste what time I have left on this earth messing around with him and his drama and betrayal. It was him that decided to act like and live like trash.
TB we posted over each other.
Yea, they scream “help me, he/she is being mean to me” and then we (enabling) rush to their aid, only to be berated and abused by them because we dont’ help just the way they want us to. Well, you know, I am done with the RESCUING and ENABLING. NO MORE.
That is why I have made the decision to not allow others to use and abuse me, or to treat me disrespectfully, and I consider lying or verbal abuse just like they had punched me in the nose. It is UN-acceptable. I treat others well, so they will treat me well or get out of my life and stay out.
I’m sorry you are going through all this TB, I know it hurts and we feel like we have “wasted” our lives, but that was our choice to do and do and do for them when they obviously were not appreciative of our efforts, but that is what happens when we try to deal with dysfunctional people. It is not going to work out well. It is like dealing with a drunk or druggie, until THEY want to stop harming themselves, we can’t resuce them only enable them.
Ox: Yeah, we did post over each other> LOL
Posse to hunt down mom! ROFL! You always have a way of making your point with using such great humor- I really enjoy reading and learning from your posts! â¤
I am sorry you have pain with your boys! It’s just as you say, beyond our control. So very, very true!
While my daughter and my X started the affair in her teens, I am certain it continued on most likely close to the day I dumped his sorry butt. That’s what I can’t get over. She’s well into adulthood[nearly 40 years old!], so certainly old enough to know/act better. She is still playing the singles scene and lobbing off male egos to stick on her charm bracelet. My friend [male-but only a friend-may be gay, I do not ask], and I saw her at Christmas and she later told me that he ‘whispered’ to her [behind my back, she said, of course, while I went to the bathroom] that he would pay off her student loan if he won the lottery. If he said that, he was just joking, but she made it sound like he was already hitting on her and she was the focal point of his interest. Which, hey, I do not care either way. But, if I did care for this person or any person, she would play every sexual card and head game she possibly could to break up the relationship. Just her way. She tried to break up her brother’s marriage and her sister’s. She has even behaved inappropriately toward her own brother and made us all squirm with embarrassment. If she finds out he has male friends over his house, she will find a way to drive clear to the suburbs to ‘just visit’. Games, games, games……drama, drama, drama.
I agree my younger daughter is N. Damn genetics!
You said we feel we wasted our lives and yes, it’s exactly how I feel. If I had known how this would turn out, I would have not fought for my two older kids, suffered w/o child support and worked and went to school to provide for them. I would have made my X take them, since they are his spitting image. GROAN! But, they were my precious little kids and I loved them. What a waste……but, I’ll keep praying. Absalom oh, my Absaloms……..
Ox,
I just finished reading Martha Stouts book.
The genetic component of the book was amazing. If those theories are in fact so in that there is a biological component to this condition, it is likely that my daughter may well be N. I think, from what I can clearly see with bio dad and my grandmother, both were extreme Spathy cases. I do see emotions in my daughter. Genuine ones and have, but her traits outweigh any sense when she’s not getting her way. She is abusive and hostile. I have witnessed her in states of deep depression and sadness. Hard to say. I’m okay with having implemented my boundaries with her. GIven the healing process I’m currently undergoing I can little afford to take on her “N’y” self right now or her many issues.
Changing my perspective on that is critical to my healing. It is probably the best thing I can do to also help my grandchildren, for as you know, eventually these people give themselves enough rope to hang themselves with. My daughter has almost lost her children once to the state. Intervention is necessary, but it will have to be because she has made a critical error in judgement, which is sure to befall her.
LL
Dear LL,
There is definitely a genetic component to psychopathy but it is not 100% genetic,, but what percipitates the genes to become “turned on” is still up for grabs.
Your daughter has choices, but you cannot make her make good ones. You can call CPS and tell them that there is DV going on in the home without giving your name. She may imagine it is you calling or not, but at least you can do that much. You may end up taking the kids if they do take them away from her if you are able. Or she may be able to hold things together enough that she can keep her kids in the home. It still may not be good parenting, but you’ve done what you can.
Healing yourself right now needs to be your first order of business though. We’ve all made poor decisions or we wouldn’t be here on LF, but we can start to learn to make better ones, that’s also why we are here at LF.
Glad that you are reading and educating yourself. Don’t forget that LF archives have hundreds of great articles and read them ALL. I suggest just the articles fo rnow, save the comments for later, but read the ones in the author’s list or the subject list which go back to the beginning, the by month list is only for one year. Lots of great articles from when lovefraud first started! Keep on educating yourself, knowledge=power.
Dear TB, the way I handle it, for what it is worth, is the “babies” I loved are gone—and the MEN are not people I like. I remember those babies just like my aunt who had one child that died at age 3-4 remembered her baby, she loved that child until the day she died. I love those babies of mine as well, but they are “dead and gone”—sometimes I feel like their pictures should be on milk cartons!~
The MEN are strangers that I don’t particularly like—they may have the DNA of my babies but they are NOT those babies I love and remember, that I took such delight in.
Your babies are just like mine, GONE, and those women that are there are NOT your friends—you fought for those babies and did the best you could, but TIME took those babies from you. They take the babies of every mother/father and replace them with MEN and WOMEN and if those men and women are not the kind of people we wish that we had for friends, we do NOT have to allow them to abuse us…any more than if you kid died in a car wreck and you donated his organs and they were taken on by some psychopath, you would’t let that person abuse you just because he had your daughter’s heart would you? Or her kidneys? Well, I think it is the same thing.
I actually had a “memorial service” for P-son and buried that little boy and cut myself loose from the EVIL MAN in the cell. I’ve sort of done the same thing with son C, just didn’t have the “service” just cut him loose emotionally. Just decided he is on his own from now on. I’m sorry that he chose to lie to me, but it was HIS CHOICE, just as Absalom decided to rebel against King David, to deceive him, my son decided to deceive me, to lie to me. It was ONE time too many, it wasn’t the ONLY time he had done that, for sure. He was part and parcel of the “plot” to run me out of my home, off my farm that I had sweated and slaved over, he knew the Trojan Horse Psychopath had assumed control of my cell phone account and was jacking with it, that he was doing vandalism at my house and I asked him why he didn’t tell me, and he said “well, I told him he shouldn’t do it.” WTF???? HE KNEW SOMEONE WAS MESSING WITH ME, TRYING TO RUN ME OUT OF MY HOUSE and he didn’t warn me? Some son he was, right? Laugh But at the same time the TH-P was screwing son C’s wife, and they were plotting to steal from my egg donor and to kill C once they realized I was on to them and they couldn’t kill me because they couldn’t find me! Laugh
I was watching a TV show with my friend tonight and a mother/daughter team of con women were turning on each other, each trying to get the other one locked up for murder, and I got to thinking about how Ps will “gang up” to work together against a common victim or “enemy” but in the end they turn on each other like rabid dogs. Son C has been a victim his entire life I think, but then he also becomes a dupe and a “psychopath by proxy” by assisting the psychopath with persecuting another victim. When he isn’t in that role, he will victimize himself by his own unwise choices. I can’t save him from that. I’m just grateful to God he doesn’t have any children and he has decided not to ever have any because of our family DNA and I support that decision 100% but if he does ever have any children, I don’t even want to lay eyes on them or get attached because I don’t ever want them to be used to hold me hostage. I know it is difficult when you love those kids and know them, but the Ps will keep you from having a relationship with the kids so you might as well cut your losses rather than continue to bleed emotional blood with continued contact. It’s hard, I know it is, but if you love kids, go volunteer somewhere and put your love and caring to good use with kids you can be good to. I did foster kids and I don’t regret it at all, but there are other ways you can volunteer without taking kids into your home. Or go to a nursing home and visit and volunteer or a dog rescue, there are plenty of places to give your compassion to people and animals that will warmly repay it. Hang in there TB. (((Hugs))))
Ox,
The Sociopath Next Door has been an extremely eye opening read and one of the best purchases I’ve made. I’ve read many articles here, but this book puts it into a context that is very well written and goes to the heart of sociopathy as well as with examples set forth in the book, as well as sociopathic behavior. There are things there that I’ve not yet seen in the articles. Yet. They all describe my ExPOS so accurately,there is no denying what he is.
Now what I’m feeling after having read that is profound sadness and grief. I’m understanding my participation better, but understanding the “nature of the beast” if you will, has been no less than truly shocking as well as educational. I cried big tears after reading this book, not just for the many losses and pains I’ve caused, the things missed, but the biggest sadness for me is that this man truly is very very very sick and there is no changing that.
One of the things that was in the book that was discussed at length and resonated so well with me, was the indepth perspective of sociopathic boredom. Even the gifts of the sociopath are those to which he/she will sabotage. Will never realize to a full potential as a result of the boredom that goes with the condition. My exPOS was a very good musician,but only in mechanics. ANYTHING he was interested in, was short lived. Projects, musical ambition, new interests he lost interest in. ALL of it. I heard him play is saxophone many times. He had a gift in playing that he could well have made into a true talent. I loved watching him play. He played in a band for awhile, and then that was gone too. Part of the sorrow I feel now, is not in feeling sorry FOR him and how he hurts others, but that he has this tragic condtion at all. Such a waste of a life and such damage wreaked upon others as well.
For me, right now, that is the saddest thing of all. The loss of a self that could have been, but never was and will never be.
It is a terrible tragedy. For everyone.
LL
Ox: when I read your first paragraph, I was overwhelmed! This is exactly what I’ve been saying to myself for a long while now. I threw out a lot of childhood memorabilia of my kids a few years ago. I’ve been hanging on to a small box my younger daughter had made with a bear on it. Thinking I will dump that too. I put away all the photo albums and memories because, as you said, they are dead now. Gone. When my GD visited me and made my life pure hell, I could see, even though she looks exactly like my daughter at that age, she is NOT my daughter and she does act like my daughter NOW. I put away all the grandmother items, all the things I had fixed for her room as she never even bothered with them. Just time to put that portion of my life away.
I do understand having that memorial service for your son as a way of having closure.
Your post is full of maturity and wisdom and I greatly thank you for taking the time and effort to reach out to me with love, compassion and understanding! I am sorry we both, as well as others here, have a broken heart, for nothing grieves as hard as a mother’s heart. â¤
I did animal rescue for years, but am tired now. I really just want to rest. My animals and love for them helped me make it thru the really abusive times in my life. You are so correct in receiving love from them and others in need that do appreciate love.
You know, I was reading my Bible earlier and something dawned on me that has brought me great comfort. I’ve been treating my life as if most of it is gone and granted, most of it here is gone. But, life is eternal and the real living is ahead of me! This really thrilled my heart and helped me. I believe we make a lot of choices down here on choosing good or evil. I am really glad I made the choice to stand by my kids and raise them, for I could not face myself and God, had I not. And for that, I am most grateful! What they do with that choice now, is up to them.
Thanks again Ox and much love and hugs to you! â¤â¤â¤
Dear Ox Drover,
This reminded me of you. The entire parole board has been forced to “retire” means they keep their pensions, but not their jobs.
They gave parole to a man who was serving three life sentences. He got out and robbed a store and in the process shot a police officer and killed him.
The people here in MA are PISSED about this whole incident. The Guvna forced them all to retire, he shoulda IMHO FIRED them all.
Ana