It’s disconcerting, no question about it, working with someone who’s antisocial, with real sociopathic qualities (forgetting, again, for the moment, the hell of living with such an individual).
Recently, I’m struck again, in my work with a client I’ll call Howard, by the brew of certain qualities, certain attitudes, certain defenses that strike me as forming a rather sociopathic orientation.
Howard is 19. He understands the suffering he’s causing others in his life: he can “talk the talk,” meaning that he “gets it” on a cognitive level. He can say, for instance, quite accurately, what he’s doing, why it’s wrong, that it’s wrong, even that he feels bad about it.
How badly he really feels is highly debatable. In my view, not nearly as badly as he claims, and certainly not nearly badly enough to make real efforts at change. In our sessions, I confront him regularly with my perception of the discrepancy between his assertions of remorse and regret, and what he’s really willing to do about them?
I see him as someone who can hear my challenges without reacting very defensively. His undefensiveness may seem like a good quality, and maybe it is; but it’s also likely that it stems, to some extent, from his ultimate unconcern with what I feel about, and think, of him. That is, I suspect it stems in part, at least, from his relative indifference to my (or anyone’s) view of him.
When I say he’s undefensive, I mean this specifically with regard to how he fields my confrontations. He is fairly placid in his absorption of them. On another level, though, he’s quite defensive in a classically narcissistic/sociopathic fashion: On one hand, as I’ve noted, he can seem remorseful (quite regretful) for his misbehaviors and abusive attitudes. But if you should probe him at all—not just accept his statements of remorse at face value—he predictably lapses into his truer position: this is a position from which his abusiveness is always, ultimately, rationalized as a response to his perceiving himself as having been victimized, persecuted or otherwise treated unfairly in some fashion.
Now he is canny enough to attempt to disguise this pattern, especially with initial assertions of politically correct sounding accountability. But always, with a little prodding, you will bring him back to his true experience in which self-justification for his abusiveness and an attitude of unaccountability prevail.
Just as noteworthy: no matter how many times you point out to him how rapidly he shifts from taking “seeming” responsibility for his behavior to abruptly abdicating responsibility for the same behavior (again, rationalizing it as a response to others’ persecution), he is rather uninterested in this contradiction and basically unconcerned to reconcile it. He just doesn’t find this contradiction particularly troubling, peculiar, meaningful, or worth his time to look at.
This is a highly sociopathic quality and attitude.
It seems to reflect the “glitch” that allows this personality, in his blithely untroubled, incurious fashion, to verbalize awareness and regret over his abusiveness and exploitiveness on the one hand, while on the other (almost simultaneously) to rationalize it as a valid reaction to his perceived, or contrived, victimization.
When I confront him routinely with this contradiction, he may give lip service to the validity of my observation; but always, his interest to explore it, to own its possible ramifications, is superficial and transient.
Similarly, he will periodically assert his desire to cease his hurtful behaviors; then, in the next minute or so, when presented with evidence that he’s continued the very behaviors he’s claimed to want to cease, he may say something like, “Well, maybe I’m really not that motivated. To be honest, I’m really not.”
The honesty itself could almost be seen as admirable. But the problem lies in his blithe disinterest in the rapid, contradictory nature of his assertions. He isn’t embarrassed by this. Point it out to him and he’s almost bored, like a kid who’ll say, when inconvenienced, “Whatever.”
I regard this pattern as a sociopathic form of indifference to the contradiction between one’s statements, and between one’s statements and ongoing actions. What’s striking isn’t the contradictory content itself, but the missing shame and embarrassment when confronted with the nature of the discrepant communications.
This can leave me shaking my head, privately, in a kind of amazement. But even if I were to shake my head in visible amazement, while Howard might notice it, and might understand why he’s left me shaking my head, you can bet he wouldn’t care to make any more sense of himself to me than he cares to make sense of himself to himself—which is very little.
(This article is copyrighted © 2010 by Steve Becker, LCSW. My use of male gender pronouns is for convenience’s sake, not to suggest that females aren’t capable of the behaviors and attitudes discussed.)
I’ll vote for you if you promise the trains will run on time 🙂
I personally think that the island should be for the spaths and the scammers. Leave them there together with no way off the island until they kill each other off with their scams, their schemes and their destructive cruelties.
The last one standing should then be bronzed and mounted as a reminder to the rest of us that once there were spaths, but that we overcame their evil. (Now there’s a thought that makes me smile on an otherwise grumpy & gloomy day…)
Absolutely, the trains WILL run on time! A mule and 40 acres for everyone, and a chicken in every pot–except for the psychopaths! LOL 🙂
The Bible talks about people with a “reprobate mind” and I think that is what applies to the psychopaths, as their consciences have been seared and they have developed “reprobate minds” without “natural affection.”
I think there is a turning point at which the psychopath reaches a point of “no going back” or “no return” sort of like an alcoholic or drug addict drinks or drugs so long that their brains are damaged to the point that they CANNOT quit drinking unless physically restrained by someone or locked up. They no longer have the ABILITY to stop, to choose to stop if that makes any sense.
I don’t think that my son COULD develop a conscience now or STOP being dangerous. I don’t think he has the ABILITY to fear anything.
You can shock a flat-worm enough times that you can “train” it to go around something, but you cannot “shock” or “punish” some of them enough that you can “train’ them to do a different behavior to avoid another shock. Some psychopaths are trainable To at least AVOID a shock, but some have NO fear, and my P son is one of those that if he thought he could kill me even if he KNEW HE WOULD BE KILLED IN THE PROCESS he would still try to kill me because he would still VIEW THAT AS A “WIN.” It is hard for me to grasp that concept of “win” but it is the only thing that makes sense. He truly believes that he is a “success” in life, that he knows how to run the world, how to live in the world, when all he has ever done as an adult is to live in prison. He does not realize that everyone in the “free world” views him as nothing but another LOW LIFE CONVICT—even “trash” that is free views him as a “low life,” but he can’t see himself as anything but a SUPERIOR being. DUH????
Talk about delusional and with narcissistic grandiosity!!! He has it in spades! He lives in this fantasy world of how grand things are going to be when he gets all the family money (not enough to make him rival Bill gates for sure! LOL) and gets a “Playboy centerfold” girlfriend and a Corvette and gets rich and famous—-and everyone envies him, etc. AIN’T GONNA HAPPEN, at BEST he will get out and live in a half way house, work in a McDonald’s and lose all his teeth without a chance for a set of dentures, and he won’t have a girl friend who has not got a criminal record or has more than 3 teeth of her own. That is BEST case, but in all likelyhood he’ll spend the rest of his life until he gets old and sick in prison, or die in prison and be buried there with a number for a tombstone.
Oxy,
My understanding of the” grandiosity ” is that it grows bigger with more problems…it is like a bigger “cover” for them to hide behind. My ex is so much more obnoxious in all that than he ever was. It is his coping mechanism since he cant be embarrassed or admit it was him.
And yes that is reprobate. They cannot face the truth..too painful. And that leads to death…really it is tremendous pride to the point of delusional sickness. And yes killing the target (cause) of all their problems is win for them. So watch your back.
On a humorous note, He sounds like the perfect manager for the Island of Spathdom.
But no girlfriends allowed there,,well okay IF they are fixed and toothless. LOL
Wow!!! This article gives wonderful insight to what would happen IF a sociopath was treated by a therapist they could not manipulate!! This article matches the previous wash machine analogy from another article on LF. Great info.
Believe me flower, I do watch my back, and as long as he breathes he is a danger to my life and the lives of my other two sons. I’ll keep him in prison as long as I can and then if I have to, deal with him getting out however I have to to be safe.
This article addresses my assessment of a friend who has moments of clarity about her situation and often seems more than happy to apologize for what she did/said.
But then, the other attitude comes around, almost in a cycle: So many people have abused her, how could you say that to her, she thinks this or that attitude or behavior is a crime against humanity, blah blah blah.
No connecting of the dots between the two people: the observer of the spath, and the spath herself.
The only common thread is judgment. She’s always somewhere between apologizing and asking for an apology. I’ve tired of it. It’s exhausting. The Court of the High Drama Priestess is in session! “Off with her head!”
@Kathleen Hawk: Go hang out in some do-gooder organization, fighting injustice, or with a journalist or lawyer with such a “conscience,” and you’ll find people there with an eerie resemblance to this guy you describe. Isn’t it amazing how convenient social justice moments are to people looking for cheap salvation from their own narcissism? Maybe they even sincerely believe they’re directing their badness into a “good cause.” But ultimately, they’re destructive. Watch the dynamic. Watch who floats to the top. Ask quietly about people who had to leave because of criminal charges, violence, or other bizarre circumstances.
Not to be cynical about social justice movements. I’m committed to such things. But watch the rhetoric versus the results. It’s very illuminating.
sistersister – well said. i have experienced the same thing many times over in movements.
Can spot the ‘righteously’ angry lime lighters a mile off now- got to interact with one just last week. I made nice with him, but I will always watch my back around him and avoid working with him ever again.
Dear Sister,
You have a valid point there, and the people who do flock to “social justice” groups or volunteer groups (doo-gooder) tend I think to be ones who are wanting attention (narcissistic) or want control all the while protesting their “good intentions” when they get caught being Ns or Ps. LOL Good take!
As for your “friend”–I’m with you, “off with her head!” Get them out of my life! Just too tiring to deal with them and not worth the trouble!