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Two summer books about sociopaths

Two books about sociopaths could be on your reading list this summer. One of them, already out, is by the “Queen of the Best Sellers,” Danielle Steel. In her 108th book, Matters of the Heart, the main character, an accomplished female photographer named Hope Dunne, meets a man who seems to be too good to be true. He is. The guy is a sociopath.

Read an excerpt of Matters of the Heart here.

The author was interviewed last week on Good Morning America. Although I’ve never read any of Danielle Steel’s books, I did like the fact that when she described sociopathic behavior in the interview, she got it right.

“Sociopaths are interesting because one of the things they do is something called mirroring,” she said. “They suss out what it is that is your dream in life and what you really want and need, and then they become that.” Amen, sister!

If anyone is a Danielle Steel fan, perhaps you can pick up the book and let Lovefraud readers know how she did in portraying the personality disorder.

Matters of the Heart on Amazon.com.

Mary Jo Buttafuoco

Perhaps you remember the “Long Island Lolita” story. Back in 1992, 17-year-old Amy Fisher rang Mary Jo Buttafuoco’s doorbell and shot her in the face. It turned out that Joey Buttafuoco, Mary Jo’s husband, was having an affair with the high school student. The case turned into a long-running media circus.

Many years after the incident, Mary Jo realized what the problem was. This August, Mary Jo is telling her story for the first time, and she comes out and says that her ex-husband is a sociopath. The book is called, Getting It Through My Thick Skull—Why I stayed, what I learned, and what millions of people involved with sociopaths need to know. When released, it will be available in the Lovefraud Store.

Talking about sociopaths

The publication of these two books gives me hope that awareness may be growing about the problem of sociopaths. Finally, it seems that the gatekeepers of popular culture are starting to get the idea that sociopaths are not all deranged serial killers. People seem to be becoming less afraid of uttering the word “sociopath” in public.

This is good. More discussion of the personality disorder should lead to more understanding. I hope it continues, so that when the uninitiated—those people lucky enough to have avoided close encounters with a sociopath—start seeing the red flags of predatory behavior, they’ll remember what they read, recognize the warning signs and escape before too much damage is done.


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69 Comments on "Two summer books about sociopaths"

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This is my first posting, I may be a bit different than the other individuals in that I am actually a family member of an individual who ‘remains’ married to a known conman and sociopath. Needless to say my login name reflects what I and my husband have been doing for the past several years – examining and investigating everything and anything to do with this topic.

I agree that talking about Sociopaths is a must and I do feel that the publications available are limited. Not only for those who have not yet experienced one, so that they see the RED FLAGS, but for those who are in the midst of it or THE EXTENDED FAMILIES, who just do not know how to handle the situation.

Since we were one of the first to uncover this individuals deceptions, we have been kicked out by our family member and her immediate families lives. Even after authorities and others have come forward to uncover his lies and scams. Although, I can understand some of the embarrasement or ‘pride’ or just anger that they feel toward us because we exposed the one person who they thought was ‘perfect’ in everyway.

The family member has also stopped all communication with any friends or other extended family. No cell phone, no email as far as we know at least! So we are greatly concerned about her well being.

I guess what I am trying to say is, how it is that the S still seems to still have control over this family. And the above explains alot, it took Mary Jo since 1992 to come to grips with the evil that her husband spewed!

I just hope it does not take that long for our family member!
Thanks so much for this site it has helped us tremendously! And if anyone has any advise to us, we basically have tried to move on but still wish we could break through to this family.

Here is an interesting article about the “gangsta” gene.
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=7884397&page=1

Welcome Inquirente. Sounds like you have done everything you can. Someone else may have some good advice. I’ve had to leave my family alone now. They themselves are toxic, enough to make me stay away without fanfare.

Well, toxic is a good term for it! Unfortunately the parents of this woman knew that her fiance may be a con and knew of his deceptions and lies prior to their wedding date. They were also bamboozled by him and thought he was a truely successful business man. Even with the information they had that incriminated him, they did nothing to hold off or stop the wedding from happening. This S is truly evil and a keen manipulator. But I I have a hard time understanding any parent encouraging this union with the information that they had.

Just bought the book Children of the Self Absorbed second edition, by Nina W. Brown, ED.D, LPC – I will let you know how it is because I think it will explain some of how and why my niece ended up where she is with this S. Her mother for sure has characteristics of true Narcism.

Dear Inquirente,

Welcome to LF and this is a great place to learn about Ps. I suggest that you go back through the archived articles and read them (just the articles themselves at first) as well as keep on blogging here. It does help and knowledge=power, and the more you know about these people the better you can deal with the situation, even though it doesn’t effect you directly, but I hear your concern and caring about your duped family member. Again, welcome.

I just finished reading two books, one was a book I picked up about a balsa raft sea voyage, called “Voyabe of the Manteno” by John Haslett, who was an expeditioner in the vein of Thor Hydall who had a psychpath on his first crew. He described this man’s personality and his behavior in a wonderful description, but never knew what he had on board. The man would change the course of the raft at night and ended up getting them marooned on a deserted beach, he also released the dingy one night….this man was a monster. Haslett described him in much the same language we did.

“His eyes were dead”, “I felt the presence of evil,” “I didn’t dare turn my back on him.” Etc. yet he did not “get” what he had on board as none of ths man’s evil behavior, his risky behavior that put the entire expedition at risk, even the P’s life at risk, that made no sense to Haslett. Very interesting book.

A Stephen King book, called “Rose Madder” has a first chapter that describes from the victim’s stand point the feelings and thoughts of the victim as she is being beaten by her psychopathic husband. It waas riviting though I am not a King fan per se.

There ARE good descriptions out there of Ps by authors who don’t put the WORD Psychopath in them, but none-the-less, they can describe them.

I also just finished reading about a psychopath named Gary Tison, who was an escape artist violent con man, murderer, who escaped prison in Arizona in 1978. the author calls Tison a psychopath and details his life from childhood, his wife’s life and how he manipulated his children (who were not Ps) into helping him escape. How Tison’s wife, Dorthy and others participated in this man’s life at his whim, and how six people lost their lives because this man conned the warden and others into allowing his escape.

Tison’s son donny, was killed in a road block, two were captuered and at the writing of the book were still on death row, Tison himself deserted his dying son and crawled off into the desert where he died of dehydration and exposure. His wife and several others also served time for conspiracy with him for the escape, and the state of Arizona settled for about a million $ for allowing him to escape though they had plenty of warning from multiple sources that he intended to escape, with the families of the people he killed, including a baby about age 2, a young married couple on their honeymoon, and a teenaged girl and her aunt and uncle who had stopped to help the convicts.

The number of lives this particular psychopath ruined or ended is uncountable. One way or another, even the most “benign” psychopaths, in MHO, wreck everything and everyone they touch.

Thanx, OxDrover
Your comments and the books. I will stay posted and I totally agree knowledge=power! At least my husband and I can feel that we did all we could and we can assist other family in learning all they can.

Donna,
Thank you for this article! I am a (now) firm believer of knowledge=power. Thanks Oxy! It is encouraging to me that more people are realizing the world does contain these evil ones, & that more people are seeking to educate themselves about red flags, s’s, the how to protect themselves. Like Oxy said, they don’t have to be another Ted Bundy to be utterly evil.

I like to recommend this book written by Patricia Evans “THE VERBALLY ABUSIVE RELATIONSHIP and How to recognize It and How to respond

This book help me more then I can say! Love it..

http://www.verbalabuse.com/Books.shtml

“Sociopaths are interesting because one of the things they do is something called mirroring,” she said. “They suss out what it is that is your dream in life and what you really want and need, and then they become that.”

Wow, this is so true in my case. He swooped in on me with all his charm and became my “knight in shining armour”. Of course, at the time, it all seemed so awesome, but looking back it was too good to be true. He helped me with things I used to do alone- and do alone now- but things that seemed so gallant at the time- driving me to work on a snowy day; taking me to work when my car was in the shop; replacing a brake light. I do not have anyone in my life that ever helped with things like that.

Of course, it was all fake, and when he got bored with me he just discarded me and moved on to his next victim.

I cried today because my car was in the shop and I had to deal with it without him. But I did- and everything went smoothly. One week and one day of renewed NC.

Dear Blindsided- Im so sorry that you cried today. Sometimes it is surprising how certain issues trigger sadness. BUt be proud of yourself that you did get it handled and probally with no drama. Try to remember that you ARE better off now than ever. He was never good for you. He was never even real. Be glad the illusion has been outted.
take care xoxo.

Inquirente- Good to have you here. How awesome that you and your husband care enough to help this girl. Stay strong in your convictions, learn here, and share your information. How all of us here wish someone could have “seen” what we were unable to, and brought it us. Post as often as you wish.

Donna,
Thanks for the post. I used to read alot of Danielle Steel but haven’t read anything of hers in years. Will try to pick up a copy of this book though.

I imagine she does “get it”–maybe on several levels (she is said to have fabricated some of her past, even from childhood, which is allegedly untrue stories she made up) plus she has been married and divorced FIVE times, with two of her husbands being convicted criminals at the time she met and married them. Her 2nd husband was convicted of robbery and sexual assualt–(one of Danielle’s friends said Danielle was drawn to cons and criminals and one of her husbands said she loved the “thrill” of the criminal). She and her lawyers helped get husband number two out of some legal trouble while they were married, and then Husband number two went on to commit some additional rapes and assaults after they divorced.

Third husband was a heroin addict and also had a criminal record and she met him by chance while visiting in prison, then hired him to help her move. Even husband number 5 was convicted of manslaughter due to some sort of yachting accident.

Danielle has alleged “ignorance” of some of the spouses criminal activities prior to her marriage to them, but some of her friends and people in the legal field, plus the husbands themselves say that is hogwash, that she knew about their criminal histories at the time she married them. One husband even has tons of letters she wrote him (often writing him two or three times per day) that seem to back up his claims from what I have read. But my point is, she seems to like to “play victim” and portray herself as the completely innocent one. Kinda reminds me of some of the “victims” who had unconcious or subconscious “issues” that come into play in their choices (in other words they are not entirely “victims” of chance so to speak but are acting out buried desires, who are portrayed in Meloy’s Violent Attachments. But who knows–I’m not saying that is the case with Danielle, just that her situations and choices brings Meloy’s discussion to mind.

Danielle does some good charity type work in the field of mental health, as one of her children (son) suffered from bipolar disorder and drug abuse and died due to suicide/drug overdose in 1997. Danielle wrote a book about his life and death, “His Bright Light” and she has the Nick Traina Foundations which helps fund organizations to treat mental illness. So she has done many good things to help in the field of mental illness.

Well, I got off on a tangent there, but I wanted to add that I am glad to see that Danielle Steel was able to put into words that were plain and simple for the layperson (who has not read up on sociopathy) to understand. High profile people like her getting the word out in basic plain english of how the sociopath operates, and demonstrating WHY the victims so easily falls for it as most any average and normal person would, is a definite step in the right direction, IMO.

Jen & Donna
I agree, did not know all of that either. Maybe that is why she was such a ‘fantasy creator’ she was good at setting up her own facade.
Thanks Sabrina for your comments. I use the site so often to gain ‘insight’ and my husband as well. When we came into this situation I found this site and was floored at reading about so many victims, and the similar facades. And it validated all that we were finding out about our nieces fiance. Some of the stories were so identical I thought maybe our nieces fiance was their abuser as well.

Inquirente- Just curious, has your neice read any of these stories here? Is she aware of her reality that she may be married to a S? I didnt see where you had posted this info- I may have missed it. My feeling on this is a sense of urgency to present her with this evidence- even if she is ambivalent about it. It will present “red flags” for her at some point whether she admits to it or not. At the very least, she may take precautions otherwise not heeded.

Got a copy at the library today. Here’s part of what she writes in the preface:

“A sociopath is a person who will destroy you, without a heart, without a conscience, without even a second glance. At first they are too perfect and too good to be true. Then, they remove your heart, and whatever else they want, with a scalpel. The operation they perform is brilliant, often but not always flawless. And when they’ve gotten whatever they came for in the first place, they leave you traumatized, stunned, and bleeding by the roadside, and silently move on, to do it again to someone else.” –fair use quote

Sounds like she’s a member of the club.

Inquirente- Im sorry, I re read where your neice has disassociated herself with you due to trying to expose him of his lies. I guess you have given her some education on the sociopath. There is NO ONE in the family (besides you and your husband) who smells a rat here?? I am very concerned about the situation as I am sure many of us here are as well. Please post often, and feel free to ask for any brainstorming as so many veterans here have immense resources and ideas to help. xoxo

Tood- Perfect summary. This was from Danielle Steele?

Sabrina,

Yes, the author writes those words in the preface.

Oh Tood, thanks Im sorry, my brain slow on comprehension today!lol

Sabraina,

What’s a brain? I think I use’ta have one, but I can’t remember where I put it!

As a diagnosed sociopath, I mirror empathy when I don’t feel it. I’ll say soothing things and rub your back, but I don’t feel anything. But though this is manipulative, I don’t do it to take advantage, I do it because not doing it is awkward!

Sabrina,
Thanks, I will post as much as I can and because we have been reading for 2 years the posting and stories help tremendously. Right now all others (friends/family) know of his scams and no one has been in touch with her that we know of. They live in a different state from most of us. It is hard to judge what type of life she is living with him. They are living in isolation. We did inform her early on when we had contact with her about this site. Her response at the time was pretty indignant. Anyway, thanks all for any advice!

I applaud all of you who have come out of isolation and are working through this most horrendous nightmare.

I should correct my second line…my niece has not been in touch with any of us (freinds/family) we have reached out to her in many ways.

Inquirente

I wish I’d had you two around me! Sounds like your neice is a long way down the line with this slug. The isolation stage is really underscores the impending ‘death’ of her ability to pull herself out of this one. She will, no doubt, at this stage, be introverted. From my experience, this is the stage you start to believe you can’t live without them because they have successfully cut you off from everyone else. This is when they can really ‘rip into you’ no more witnesses to comment – see? I don’t comment like this to cause you more pain or anguish –

When I started to come out of the fog, it took an awful long time for me to reach out to other people for support. Mainly because I felt like such a prize ‘idiot’ but more because I thought ‘who would want to know me?’. But little by little, I realise how lucky I am. I am re-building, re-establishing many of my relationships and am, at times, overwhelmed by the kindness and understanding of those people who are ‘still there for me’ – maybe if you can somehow indicate this to your neice, it will give her the strength to dig herself out of the hole.

All love and strength to you both.

Inquirente,

My son C was pulled away from me and the rest of the family by his X-wife for almost 8 years….I knew from when I met her she was deceptive and cautioned him to “wait a while” before he married her, she used this to rush him into marriage and he fell for it. It only took 6 months before he was unhappy with the deal he had made but he felt strongly that marriage was until DEATH do us part, so even when he caught her having an affair, he said “we’ll go to counseling” and work it out…she immediately planned and put the plan into action to kill him….fortunately her plan failed, but it SHOCKED my son so much he was ab;e tp FREE HIMSELF from her deluisoons and his own sense of denial…her going to jail was a GODSENT event in my son’s life and in his restoration to me.

I had about given up that she would ever turn him loose as she had married my son for a “meal ticket” but her biggest need for a meal lticket (her disabled son in a wheel chair with Muscular dystrophy) had died and so she was free of that ball and chain and looking for more excitement when she started the affair.

My son is healing, though he is still s omewhat hypervigilent, and I can’t say as I blame him, but he is no longer going ballistic when a vehicle drives down our county road, so he has made a great deal of progress in the last couple of eyars.

Keep up hope for your niece and be there to help her get up when and if this thing blows up in her face. It make take years, and it may not ever happen, but I wouldn’t give up hope on it blowing up or her abuser moving on to someone else when he has sucked her as dry as a spider sucks an insect, she will definitely NEED YOU THEN.

She will be wounded and ashamed (the victims take on the shame of the abuser) and will definitely need your understanding. In the meantime, learn all you can about Ps and victims, and help spread the word to those that want t6o listen now. Glad you are here!

ablessingid

I am feel for your disorder.

This site is great for information and possible treatment. I hope you will check it out.

http://counsellingresource.com/

Good luck! James

“I am feel for your disorder.”

sorry should be “I feel for..”

But I do hope you will reach out to those who can help you…

Inquirente- Great wisdom from Escapee. I think she is right on the money with the isolation stage she referred to as being the impeding ‘death’ of her ability to pull herself out…
I keep racking my brain with things to get thru to this girl all the time thinking if it were my neice, what can be done here??
I think maybe send her random private emails (he probally would see them) but send links about “trauma bonds,” stockholm syndrome,” domestic abusers, and traits of a S. (??)

Being the aunt, I think Id feel so much urgency in trying to “rescue” her I might become a bit of a stalker-“accidently” running into her on her lunch hour, shopping trips, etc. Making ANY excuse to call her up…
And Maybe just making yourself a constant reminder to her that you love her and that she can count on you night or day.

To elaborate a bit on the mindset of the abused:
When my x n/p began physically abusing me, the verbal /mental abuse had been there so long in a slow, conditioning type of way that it didnt really register with me how wrong, dangerous, and horrific the physical violence was.

I never told a soul about it. Not even my best friend that Ive shared EVERYTHING with for 19 years! TO THIS DAY- I cant fathom me keeping all this silent!! Its not EVEN my nature. It never dawned on me that I should spill it!
ALthough her and I talk about the most private,mynute details imaginable -normally.
She’s always has been the wise, street smart type who “gets” it instinctively and would have gotten me out sooner. When she did find out (which was not until he was kicked out of the house by me some months later) she said with her voice quivering- Sabrina, YOU HAVE to tell me these things honey- I cant even BEGIN to help if you dont tell me!!
That was the first time I realized how dysfunctional “my” thinking had been, hence a long and difficult journey of healing began.

Take care, and prayers for your loved one…

Oxy- I just saw your post as well- you said.. the victims take on the shame of the abuser – well said. This very well can explain my silence during the abuse I suffered.
Have a great day guys!!!;)

ablessingid: Just wanted to welcome you to this site of healing. Are you currently in any counseling? If we can offer help to you, please ask. James is wonderful in giving links for just about anything that you need! Kudos James

Right back at Your sabrina, So glad to have you here at LF! ((hugs))

Sabrina and James,

In my humble (or NOT so humble, as the case may be LOL) opinion the only “meaningful dialog” with a psychopath is NO CONTACT, no notice, and no attention for them. BY DEFINITION a psychopath has no empathy, they feel entitled, are manipulative, and anyone who has been “professionally diagnosed” as a psychopath has met the PCL-R which Dr. Robert Hare compiled after many many years of research. In order to qualify as a diagnosible psychopath, the person much score 30 on that PCL-R (Psychopath check list-revised) and in order to scroe 30 they have had to DO some pretty horrific things as a LIFE LONG PATTERN since before age 18.

Dr. Hare states that “counseling makes them WORSE” as they learn the “catch phrases” to better fake empathy and to better manipulate their victims. Psychopaths also do NOT WANT “help” as. thank you, they are fine just like they are, in their belief and WE are the ones with problems…nothing is ever their “fault” and they do not take responsibility for their behavior except in a FAKE manner. Dr. Hare states that they cannot feel the emotions of empathy and therefore think about others as “pawns” and objects rather than as real humans with feelings.

I have decided that I will not have “contact” with any self proclaimed psychopath on this site or in any other place, and will not dialog with them or try to “help” them, because by definition they do not want help, regardless of what they may SAY to try to hook sympathy from the bloggers here. I for one have had a SUFFICIENCY OF DEALINGS WITH PSYCHOPATHS.

Oxy

Right on on that score – me either. I wouldn’t get ‘drawn in’ by the self-proclaimed S/P/N. One thing I’ve learned from being here and reading all these posts over the past couple of months is that the whole point is: they don’t HONESTY. It’s likely just another ploy to get attention – isn’t it just what you expect (if you read their comments) that’s there’s never anything inspiring, helpful or encouraging for another ‘poster’ – just blah blah blah, me this, me that, it’s how I am (?) – at least we have them ‘nailed down’ for the half-humans they are (god, do I sound harsh?) – it’s just that it’s too risky for me to think otherwise, in the light of all the stories, chaos and pain I have read about from their unwitting victims.

Love to all in recovery and keep posting for strength.

E.

sorry – typo – ‘they don’t DO honesty’

Escapee, your comments are so on target with what we have been experiencing. So early on he had basically taken the ‘soul’ from our niece…her behavior, attitude and social life changed in an instant. He isolated her from the beginning. From the start in 2007 when we began to point out the ‘red flags’ she and her parents became angry and hurt that we would even think those things about him…She became very introverted and cowtowed to his every whim. He continued his lies and deception throughout the time we were alerting them to his financial scams and lies and to the other victims he had defrauded. We in their eyes, became the problem. I could just feel his excitement when he saw the family dynamics fall apart and the war between us kept him looking like a saint. So much to this story, I can not even begin to tell you…but so many of it is what everyone on this site has said. They are masters of manipulation.

And once the facade was over and everyone knew of all the lies and deceptions he played on our niece and her family were true, our niece basically told us she could never forgive us for how we handled it…never mentioning anything about her husbands fraud, cons or lies. Her parents never worked with us but against us, this in itself always has bothered me….so I fear greatly for her well being and safety. The parents have continued to isolate her as well, we have no contact with them. Nor do they with other family members.

Sabrina, thanks for your thoughts!
We are trying to communicate and we can only be hopeful that at some time she will come out of the fog and we want her to know we will be there, unconditionally and we always have.

We have tried email, but fear that is pretty much overseen by him. It is attached to ‘their business’ and sometimes it works and sometimes it does not. They screen all calls and she does not have a cell phone anymore that we know of.

So we wait and we try to find out as much as we can thru various ways and hope that eventually we will see her come out of the ‘fog’.

Aprreciate everyones comments and keep up the great work!
Inquirente

OxDrover,

Yes, for me the NC mean just that no contact no matter where I am. In fact I quit a job that was ran by two of them. All the other employees (the ones that were left) complained so much about one that really had issues. I would ask them why they didn’t look for another job but most had some serious time invested in their job and the company plus the company itself was a great place to work for. Well, I believe because I had this job soon after my ex s/p spit, I just couldn’t stand being around this guy. Strange enough he never did anything (that I know of?) negative around me but treated those poor ladies like, well you know. I still believe he left me in peace because I was a guy. All of them told me how this supervisor believe man were better then the female employees and this dude was a supervisor. Anyway because I had little time invested in the company and like I stated had some emotional issues myself I thought it best to just find another job and quit.

Yes, OxDrover NC is NC is NC!

Oxy, I think my emphasis to blessingid was to reinterate this is a site for “healing” for victims.
I do know that counseling or treatment is regarded as futile for P’s. My next comment would have been to that blogger that IF he/she is already in some sort of counseling , that is probally where they should discuss their issues unless any of us had access to a site.
I guess my hope would be that at the very least a diagnosed P would defy statistics and become less dangerous to society. Thanks for stating it plainly though. We certainly need to know how to handle these different issues as they arrive here. Thanks Oxy!!! (hugs)

OxDrover

Ditto on that concerning any dialog/debate here if one has a pd. Truly I not qualified to help or direct any s/p here at LF or anywhere really. I do hope they get the help they need but of course I will leave that up to those who are trained in this field of psychology and thanks for pointing that out to me.

I was up late last night when it posted. I was shaking bad and did not know what to do. Have to say that for someone who claimed to not wish harm or be manipulative, it was a pretty nasty thing to come and pick on those who are already victimized. Thank you for your thoughts. I am glad the conversation picked up because it felt like PD was winning with us not responding any. (FYI I felt like it, but thought NC was what was an unspoken code).

Katya

Well done! Even though it was traumatic for you – you found the strength.

That’s what this site has done for me – given me strength – and that has come from the sharing and the honesty of all of you here at LF.

Thanks to all and keep posting for strength.

Self proclaimed “psychopaths” come here from time to time. I think some of them are just people who get a jolt out of stirring up trouble but are more like kids making prank phone calls, but others, I think really are Ps and are INTENTIONALLY trying to get debate, argument and chaos stirred between posters.

There have been several posters here that I think WERE/ARE Ps but did not proclaim themselves as such, but none=the-less tried to stir up trouble and argument and nasty “debate.” That is NOT what this site is about. This site is about support, caring and empathy, and sometimes even challening a poster’s position of self blame and self-bashing. the “cyber cast-iron skillet” has sort of become a tradition that I started of “boinking” someone on the head for being self bashing! It is not intended as a real put down, but sort of a joking way to say “Hey, quit bashing yourself!” As far as I know, no one has ever been offended, and other posters have even “borrowed” my “skillet” when I wasn’t around. LOL

When we LOVINGLY confront another poster’s self bashing, or repeating the same dysfunctional behavior we ARE being supportive. Like when someone breaks NC over and over and then hurts because of it, we do opoint that out. But it isn’t about statistics being 90 or 98%, it is about empathy and caring. It isn’t about being “superior” to another poster, as WE ARE ALL IN THE SAME BOAT, we have been WOUNDED.

We are here to help each o ther on our journey on the ROAD TO HEALING not to “get one up” on someone else or be smarter than someone else. Psychopaths, diagnosed or not, are NOT able to grasp this concept, and they DO LIKE CHAOS so spread it wide and thick.

NOT responding to them at all, is usually teh best way and if they do not get ATTENTION then they will quietly go away or Donna will delete them if they get ROWDY, but responding to them only encourages them. I have responded to a few and have made a decision that I will never again respond to one on this blog. I hope that becomes a TRADITION TOO! BOINK!!! to all psychopaths—leave LF!

Oxy

It seemed I have unwittingly been borrowing your ‘skillet’ and ‘boinking’ Confused with it (didn’t know the full story of the skillet) – hope this hasn’t come across as superior in any way.

It’s strange but I have only read one or two posts from a self confessed S/P a few days ago and had no desire to engage. He/she said that they weren’t manipulative or prone to conning people (words to that effect) but just didn’t feel ’empathy’ – they would go through the motions of it but not feel it.

Maybe I’m becoming a bit of an S myself! I just don’t understand how this can be and have no particular desire to – I thought – how sad – but it just flitted across my mind. I didn’t feel any need to let the thought remain there.

However, don’t intend to ‘skillet’ my self for it!

Good luck with the goats and the humidity!

Oxy….potted plants…

“NOT responding to them at all, is usually teh best way and if they do not get ATTENTION then they will quietly go away or Donna will delete them if they get ROWDY, but responding to them only encourages them. I have responded to a few and have made a decision that I will never again respond to one on this blog. I hope that becomes a TRADITION TOO! BOINK!!! to all psychopaths—leave LF!”

I’ve been treating some local ones, N’s, mild P’s/S’s that way in person or “virtually” with “ignore” selections now for a while…”potted plants”. Drives them nuts…or not…I don’t much care. Life is more peaceful. LOL

Nice to see you’re still “carrying” (skillet)!

Oxy- Amen sister. Its a relief to know that we are not “expected” to welcome everyone especially those that we
know will cause discord and triggers for all of us trying to heal.
I wasn’t sure of the “expectation” here as we are such a giving site,I was ambivalent about what to say or not to say. Thanks for defining our boundaries here!!!!!

Sabrina,

I am NOT the owner of thhis web site, Donna Andersen is, but as far as I know we are not “required” to welcome anyone or to respond to anyone in particular. We ARE required (and I agree with donna’s policy) to BE polite to anyone we post to…but we are Not REQUIRED to post to anyone in particular or to post at all.

IN MY opinion I don’t think that a GENERAL DISCUSSION of how to “deal with” a self proclaimed psychopath, or anyone acting like a psychopath ,is a problem for Donna. I did not name names or point fingers at anyone in particular, simply a class of inidividuals who come on this web site from time to time. AND I only gave my personal opinion of how I choose to respond (or not respond as the case may be) to these groups of people. I don’t make the rules for LF and I don’t set the boundaries. Donna does.

Being “too socially polite” to people who proclaim themselves “psychopaths” and want to enter into a conversation with us, I think (in my opinion) is futile and counter productive to our healing of our wounds from just such people as these. Everyone on here is FREE as far as I know to debate with them or dialog with them. I don’t make the rules. I just stated what MY opinon is and how I will behave toward them.

Oxy

I think your no-nonsense approach often gives you a kind of ‘authority’ ! People take notice and that’s a good thing because it’s all just good common sense about balancing good choices whilst reserving respect for others. Something all ‘good mamas’ strive for!

If I thought for a moment I might get some enlightment or flattered myself that I could, in any way, contribute something helpful to an N/S/P I might be tempted to respond but, like all of us here, I learned the hard way that ‘to engage with them is to become complicit in their games’… so it’s a ‘no no’ for me too -………. I think I’ve just said the same thing as you re counter-productive just in different words!

Time for bed!

My modem just crashed!!!

Escapee, some people call me an opinionated old biddy and come a wise sage, but you know I think the truth is somewhere in the middle, I have some good advice for a sage, but sometimes I do some DUMB things like an opinionated old biddy! But I am learning to forgive myself for the mistakes I make so it is all evening out as I reach cronehood.

Just want to comment that I have seen some tremendous progress in oyou since you landed here. Sure glad you are here. Hang around and pass on some of your great advice!!!

Matters of the Heart by Danielle Steel
A Brief Review

Steel manages to craft a fairly realistic portrait of the type of relationship we on this site know so well–romantic love with a psychopath. All the familiar markers are there: the initial boundary-shattering, overwhelming push toward intimacy; the isolation of the target/victim; the hypersexuality; the lies; and of course, the inevitable denouement, when the psychopath reveals himself to be a monster of selfishness and entitlement.

Because the bestselling author is writing for a general audience, she hangs her tale on several romance novel conventions. The heroine is a little too self-contained and psychologically strong to be totally realistic. She seems to turn on a dime in the final chapters to become the standard “woman in peril” that these sorts of books require.

And, as is also standard with romance novels, our heroine does not extract herself from the clutches of the villain by her own wits (as many of us here have done). No, she instead relies on advice, wisdom, and help from male authority figures. Without the characters of the heroine’s male agent and lawyer, the reader is forced to believe that she would have just drifted away into complacent victimhood.

So, Steel hits all the right notes in describing the tactics of a psychopath. But she misses the mark in describing how a target escapes. (I’m afraid, to be realistic, someone like the heroine would bounce from bad relationship to bad relationship until she was forced to stop and introspect. But that would place her squarely in a Margaret Atwood novel rather than a Danielle Steel one.)

This would be a book to recommend to someone with no knowledge of these sorts of relationships. It’s a beginner’s view. For what it is, its a fine book. But you won’t get any new insights from it.

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