This week we are continuing to discuss The Psychopathic Mind by J. Reid Meloy, Ph.D. The author is diplomate in forensic psychology, former Chief of the Forensic Mental Health Division for San Diego County and Past President of the American Academy of Forensic Psychology. As I said last week, my initial reaction to the book was rather negative because I believe this author has made some assertions that have become the basis for inaccurate folklore that has spread over the internet (to be discussed in the coming weeks). But Dr. Meloy made up for all that by setting the record straight on a very important issue—the spectrum of psychopathy.
The idea that psychopathy is a spectrum and that “sociopaths/psychopaths” vary in severity means that there is no real point at which “normal” stops and “sociopath/psychopath” starts. Any decision about where to draw this line (after gathering information on a large group of people) is in a sense arbitrary.
The idea that “psychopathic disturbance” (as Dr. Meloy calls it) is a spectrum can be very confusing. Many people feel a sense of relief when they finally figure out that the person who has harmed them is “a sociopath.” By “sociopath” they mean categorically different from everyone else, a different type of human. Now I am saying there is really no category, just an extreme on a continuum.
I want to point out that we talk about the extremes of the continuum of traits as if they are categories all the time. Think about the adjectives tall, genius, beautiful, athletic etc. and you will realize that although these concepts exist in theory, it can be difficult to correctly place individuals into any of these categories on a strictly yes/no basis. The only time it is easy is when you are dealing with the extreme cases.
It is however; very important to understand how the interaction between spectra and categories affects us. For example, if you are used to being with players in the NBA, most everyone outside of the NBA will seem “short” and the perception of “tall” will also be skewed. To the NBA, 6’2″ is short!
This problem of perception while in the midst of an extreme population has created a problem for forensic psychology. When Dr. Hare first developed the psychopathy checklist, it was thought to differentiate criminals who are “psychopaths” from other criminals who are “not psychopaths.” Well, I maintain that this is exactly the same as calling a 6’2″ NBA player “short.”
I am also concerned with how our perception of psychopathy changes when we see it in the community. When we are in the community a person who has “a little” psychopathy stands out as a 6’2″ person would in a crowd. Many pose the question, “Is my _______ a jerk or a psychopath?” When we understand psychopathy as a spectrum we see that such distinctions are not very useful. It is more useful to ask “How much psychopathic disturbance does my ________ have?”
I have looked extensively in the scientific literature for the exact Psychopathy Checklist (PCL-R) scores that might indicate mild, moderate and severe psychopathic disturbance. If you are following what I am saying you will immediately realize that these definitions are important in determining just how many “psychopaths” there are. When I searched the literature several years ago, I reported on this blog that about 10% of the population has significant psychopathy. That 10% figure corresponds to a cut-off score of about 12 on the PCL-R.
In The Psychopathic Mind, p. 318 Dr. Meloy says the following:
Mild psychopathic disturbance 10-19
Moderate psychopathic disturbance 20-29
Severe psychopathic disturbance 30-40
This is more or less what I also determined given my clinical experience and reading of the literature. You might ask why I harp on this so much and why am I harping on it again? The reason I bring this all up is to help those of you who are stuck in a relationship with someone who has “mild psychopathic disturbance.” Steve Becker also talked about the problem of “mild psychopathy” this week When he’s just a bad dude, though he did not call it that.
In what I am about to say I depart from Meloy and give you my own opinion.
The nature of “Mild Psychopathy”
Psychopathic disturbance as Meloy also describes it is a disorder of motives. Since we all have these motives psychopathy is a spectrum. Psychopathy is an imbalance between love and power motives along with degrees of poor impulse control.
A person who is severely affected with psychopathy has no love motives at all. If we could perfectly measure the love motive, we could indeed form a category of those who have NO capacity for love. That category probably also includes some individuals with “moderate disturbance” and all with “severe disturbance.”
Individuals with mild psychopathy have some ability to love. Because they can love a little, what they do is particularly harmful to “loved ones.” They switch back and forth, in and out of “loving” states. When they are in a loving state, they truly have no emotional or other memory of their experiences outside of that state. Similarly when they are in the “power mode” they have no access to the memories of the love mode. It’s as if they have a split personality. Their poor partner is left asking, “Will the real ________ please stand up?”
The dilemma for partners and family members, is that both states are real. Those involved with the “mildly psychopathic” have to make a tough decision. They have to decide whether or not to let go of a person who they have shared real intimacy with. That is much harder than letting go of someone with severe psychopathic disturbance where the entire relationship was a sham.
sistersister- oh yes what a sexy post!!! I’m off down town to drape myself in what I think is beautiful…to hell with everyone…I am coming BACK to me…and I know I’m powerful, beautiful and worth millions of eh ….what ….millions of things…yes things…..dont know what they are yet but I want millions of em!!!
Dear Sistersister!!!
TAWANDA girl friend!!! Thanks for your great and STRONG post. You are right! I want to tell the truth, but I’m still even afraid to tell the truth for fear someone may be offended.
Yea, there is TACT! and I think we should ALL use some TACT (My late husband said “tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell and make them HAPPY to be on their way”) But what I call TACT is that you can tell a “girl her face would stop TIME, or tell her it would STOP A CLOCK.” So I DO think we can tell the truth in a “nice” way, but we still must tell the TRUTH.
Thanks, Sistersister, this is why I stay at LF because I learn new lessons every day and thank you for being today’s TEACHER with a good, strong, truthful lesson. I appreciate you!
Nah. Don’t even try to be nice.
Like I said, save your energy for real human beings.
It doesn’t even matter if spaths know what they do, or know not what they do. Either way, it’s like talking to a wall.
Say whatever you want to a wall. Just don’t get hurt.
Thanks to everyone for their kind appreciation! Another round of Orange Juliuses, on me!
Bulletproof,
Millions of good things, whatever they may be, lots of good things. You escaped spathyville so it’s all good!
Sistersister,
Your call to every woman (and man) to be themselves, to open the door to every possiblity, really lovely. Own up to our part in the mess and get a fire lit under our expanding butts. Yay!!!!!!
Just a note about boundaries, I set them with spath and was clear about not wanting him to touch me. He says “just a hug?” “just a kiss? we’ve known each other for 20 years!” My answer was no, so he comes up behind me and says “touch” while touching my arm then runs away. OMG!!! This freak I can’t get to leave the house and my attorney says to stay until we have an agreement on belongings, etc. I told him that I will do whatever it takes to protect myself and my children. I don’t care who he fools with his carp, he isn’t fooling me any longer.
Just venting, today was another steller day but everyday I feel a little better.
I just love the spunk of the posters on LF, they get it. TOWANDA! I finally get that one too, I loved “Fried Green Tomatoes!”
There is a quote I read in my speech book yesterday and I wanted to share it with you all…
For every woman who is tired of acting weak when she knows she is strong, there is a man who is tired of appearing strong when he feels vulnerable.
For every woman who is tired of being called “an emotional female,” there is a man who is denied the right to weep and to be gentle.
For every woman who is called unfeminine when she competes, there is a man for whom competition is the only way to prove his masculinity.
I thought of my son when I read this and the importance of teaching him that emotions are part of our humanity. Having a spath father, I need to be more attuned to this.
Thanks for letting me share!
Erin,
Jim missed on years of his kid’s life. He hasn’t seen them since they were little, and the kids are now in their mid-teens.
He found a sneaky way to contact them.
His daughters were home alone during summer vacation while their mother works. Jim would call his daughters during the day and instruct the girls to delete his number off the caller id.
He is also chatting online with them at night after their mother goes to bed. He also plays yahoo games online with them until late night.
Jim thought he was being pretty slick. Except for one thing. I’ll bet he never bargained on his daughters questioning their mother. Asking why can’t they talk to their dad, why can’t they see their dad.
I believe this is what happened because their mother told them about the stuff I found in Jim’s computer years ago. The teen porn.
Yes, I called his ex years ago to ask about her experience with him.
I do regret making that call. I shouldn’t have. I don’t know how else to explain it except that I craved validation so bad. I couldn’t get validation from Jim. He said nothing is wrong, the problem is me. That I called his ex to get validation. Isn’t that crazy? But, I felt like he was driving me crazy, that I did something crazy to stop feeling crazy.
yikes…..
I love Orange Juliuses, I sort of came up with a recipe for them.
In a blender put some ice, usually 4-5 cubes, fill with OJ to near the top, add sweetner ( or sugar) and a Teaspoon of malt powder, and a tsp of vanilla. I used to put raw eggs in too, but don’t do that any more. BLEND until ice is “gone” and PRESTO, you have a passable Orange Julius.
I also do a pretty good copy of those cold capichinos that they sell in the little milk bottles at the store. Essentially the same thing, only use milk as a base, with some coffee, vanilla and malt powder, adjust to taste but no ice cubes or blender. Just stir.
regarding this comment above
pathwhisperer says:
What I don’t understand is why hasn’t genetic analysis settled this argument? We could argue until the end of time. The DNA of such psychopaths as Michael Swango, Ira Einhorn and Wayne Williams (or use Hare’s PCL-R to select the sociopathic sample) should be compared against each other and against the norm. Then we would know, as a fact, if it’s an on-off condition or a spectrum. I can’t understand how this hasn’t been done already.
My reply:
It has been settled already. Genetic analysis also points to the disorder being a spectrum and to the environment influencing the expression of certain genes. As much as we would like to divide our species into good and evil, “human” or not, unless you pick a yes/no variable like murderer, you cannot create a category. So there is a category formed by the individuals you mentioned only “psychopathy/sociopathy” does not create the category.
The other reason there is no category is “choice” and “free will”. There are some people with the temperamental traits of psychopathy who by an act of will based on a logical analysis of the costs/benefits choose not to do evil to others. Are these individuals then not more human, especially since the capacity for choice most defines us in comparison to animals?
Dr. Leedom:
You wrote:
“There are some people with the temperamental traits of psychopathy who by an act of will based on a logical analysis of the costs/benefits choose not to do evil to others. Are these individuals then not more human, especially since the capacity for choice most defines us in comparison to animals?”
I’m assuming you mean that there are many people who have low or no conscience that COULD commit terrible violent crimes but do not, because the cost to THEMSELVES would be too great? For instance, he thinks, “I found myself a SWEET deal with a sugar mama and I’m not gonna get caught!” Because, if you’re implying that they can indefinitely change their behavior at will, doesn’t this preclude them from being a sociopath as we know them?
Hopeful6596
So many sociopaths must fall into the category of ‘act of will’ preventing them getting caught….what is scary then is the deep seated unconscious desire to fulfill their potential….an alcoholic also uses act of will to stop drinking but has a human side emerge that feels remorse and ultimately is capable of rehabilitation back into human being….what is there for the “well behaved psychopath” who must sit surpressed even though they really want to express themselves??
Nah, I think it is like a cat, stalking a mouse….she prevents herself springing too soon and thus losing the mouse, but if a dog comes along or is near and she thinks the dog might get her if she focuses on the mouse, she may give up going after the mouse at all BY AN ACT OF WILL. It is simply weighing the odds…I think, not kindness or lack of intent.