Lovefraud recently heard from a woman who was concerned for her daughter. Here is her e-mail:
Currently, our daughter is married to a sociopath. He has taken us (her parents) for thousands and thousands of dollars, then turned her against us. These people victimize people and are somehow able to make themselves look like the victim. They have 2 small children.
He has completely isolated her from her family, including her sister. He completely hates me and has made me the enemy, for I started seeing through him. Do you have any idea how I can possibly reach her to make her see the pattern? This man has felonies on his record for scheming to defraud; he has cheated people all his adult life. I have found out many other disturbing things about his past that she is not aware of. I want to inform her of these things, however many people feel she won’t believe it. Like your sociopath, this one said he was in the Gulf War; he never was. Instead he went AWOL from the service. He said he had a masters degree in accounting, but he has no college degree of any sort. He’s had over 20 jobs and moved over 30 times. He is 12 years older than our daughter, has a terrible temper. We worry about her and the babies all the time.
What’s a mother to do? On the one hand, she sees knows that her daughter’s husband is toxic. On the other hand, her daughter is a grown woman making her own decisions.
Sociopathic manipulation
The woman’s daughter is being manipulated by a professional. Sociopaths gradually draw in their victims with flattery and half-truths. Then they hold on to their victims with empty promises or threats. Eventually the victims, confused by the alternating charm and rage, are emotionally off balance and doubting their own perceptions.
It happened to me. It happens to everyone snared by a sociopath.
The problem for me was that I didn’t know about sociopaths. I had no idea that it was possible for a man who consistently claimed that he loved me, to lie, cheat on me, and take my money. I had no idea such evil existed.
Friends and family
Sociopaths put a lot of energy into maintaining the charade for their victims. They don’t put the same energy into manipulating people on the periphery. Consequently, the friends and family of the victim can often see the deception when the victim doesn’t.
I think friends and family should speak up, in whatever way will get through, while maintaining a relationship with the victim. I also think friends and family should not enable the sociopath by continuing to give money or whatever else he is demanding. The sooner the supply ends, the sooner the sociopath will leave.
I suggested that the woman do her best to maintain contact with her daughter, even though the sociopath has isolated her. At some point, he will abandon her. When he does, I recommended that the woman not be judgmental toward her daughter.
I know the devastation of being victimized by a sociopath. Once I realized the truth, what I needed was not criticism, but the support of people who cared about me.
Unfortunately, sometimes even with hard EVIDENCE that someone is a criminal, a cheater, etc. the “victim” will not believe the evidence, and instead will take the “word” of the psychopath over the cold hard facts.
If it IS just a case of family or friends having “gut feelins” about the psycho path, but there being no criminal record or whatever to be “hard evidence” then it is very difficult to successfully “warn” a victim or potential victim.
I personally have been warned about various people that I did business with that were I believe psychopaths—and I DID NOT llisten to these warnings. In each case I went back to the person who warned me and thanked them after I saw the light for myself.
I have also warned others about a psychopath who HAD A CRIMINAL RECORD and the person(s) would not even LOOK at the evidence. I have been accused of being delusional, bitter and angry! I am sure I sounded like all of those things, but I was not delusional—and I had a right to be VERY angry! But I was NOT believed. That is the point!
If you are “the ex-wife, (GF etc) warning the new GF then you will be seen as a SCORNED wo/man and will not be believed because s/he wil have told the new squeeze what an evil witch you are!
There are several articles and discussions here on LF about warning the victim(s) and sometimes it works, but many times I think it is fruitless to even try.
I’m sorry Silver that your family apparently had some evidence that they chose to withhold from you. Sometimes when dealing with a P it is difficult to know what is the right path to take. Especially if they had never dealt with one before. They were also in a learning curve in dealing with this kind of person. (((hugs))))
So, an update on the youngest son’s arrival. For the purposes of convenience, I’m going to call him, “Mike.”
I don’t know if I posted this, but the night before Mike was to leave, his spath brother told him that he’d purchased a laptop computer for him, and that he could pick it up at the spath’s house. Well, Mike arrived at the spath’s house and the laptop was there, but the spath and his new victim-wife were not.
Mike went to the victim-wife’s parents’ house as he believed that the spath and victim-wife were there and he wanted to say, “Goodbye.”
True to form, the spath refused to appear for 1 1/2 hours to bid his brother a farewell. “Spath’s taking it very hard,” was what the victim-inlaws excused this behavior to be. That Mike, the source target and whipping post, was moving on with his life and starting over with his mother was repellant to them, and they made no bones about it by saying, “You really belong here with ______.”
It came time for Mike to leave, and he never DID have a farewell from his spath brother. What a kick in the nuts that had to have been for him.
Mike got here and he’s displayed a WHOLE lot of self-confidence issues, along with play-acting for Social Services when we went to have his food stamps reinstated in his new home. He suddenly went from capable young man to an anxiety-ridden person with “short term memory loss.” I believe that this behavior is directly related to his upbringing so that the spath father would be provided with NUMEROUS medications to “manage” this kid by keeping him doped up and quiet. Mike also seems to be suffering from Stockholm Syndrome and vehemently defends his spath brother as a great guy and “good Christian.” I keep my mouth shut and my facial expressions on “Neutral.” He’ll find out in due time, and I refuse to be the one to blame for his epiphany.
We have a long way to go. I have to set my boundaries very strictly, and I have to NOT absorb Mike’s personal issues. This is going to be a very demanding challenge for me, but I’m feeling confident that we can tease Mike’s exceptional qualities out in a gentle, encouraging manner. His hard work will have to rest on HIS shoulders, however. Again – boundaries, boundaries, BOUNDARIES!
God love you ALL for your support and encouragement! 😀
Dear Buttons,
I will pray for you to have strength and wisdom and for your son too. He probably DOES have stockholm syndrome and he also probably has some learned helplessness and manipulation of the system (foodstamps etc).
I hope you can get into some FAMILY counseling situation with him, where you can meet with the counselor so that it will benefit both you and your son. He may NOT want to “benefit” from it by becoming “independent” he may prefer at least for a long while to be DE-pendent at least to the “state funding.” But it is possible I think to show him that DE-pendency to anyone goes along with the person you are DE-pendent upon (even the State) having control over your life.
Take time for YOURSELF, Rome wasn’t built in a day! (((hugs))))
Thanks so much, OxD. This is going to take time – a good, long time. And, counseling is not optional, at this point, but a mandate.
Only by example is he going to “see” the difference between dependency and independence. It’s going to take him a while to understand the differences, too.
{{{{Hugs back atcha}}}}
Ugh. Picked up my ds today, and had to hear all about his visit with new girlfriend’s parents over the weekend. I think the spath is really pouring it on thick with this girl to get her to marry him and save him from his financial woes and make him look better in court. Was SO GLAD to have found the link to “Don’t Date Him, Girl” and cheateralert.com from here. Just posted to both, and now I will pray to the universe that somehow she finds him there. Anyone have any luck with that? It really hit me when my ds was saying how nice new g.f. is to her how much it feels like my obligation to save them both. Wish someone would have done that for me… but do the new victims see it as good fortune, or do they get wrapped up in the denial? I just wrote what the “red flags” are… I know all his lines, and I have learned his game. I’m hoping that means more than just going on how much he hurt me.
Dear Freemama,
I don’t remember how old your daughters are, or how old the New GF of your X’s is—no doubt she is being “love bombed” by him right now, so chances are that if you had a video of him raping the Virgin Mary it would not matter, she would not believe it.
In the past, I have been warned about someone I was dealing with was a psychopath (not necessarily a lover) but they had already convinced me that they were wonderful and I chose not to listen to people I trusted, that I knew had good judgement, I BELIEVED “my own eyes”—and of course they were blinded by the shining light of the psychopath’s wonderful treatment of me! Yea, right!@.......
Warnings are generally better received if they are delivered to a person BEFORE the “love bomb” where the psychopath mirrors back to the victim how special they are and how they are just “perfect” in the Ps view. Cults do this to ensnare new members and Ps are GOOD at it as well.
This woman will be his next victim unless someway she gets herself out of it. Your daughters won’t see either him or the new GF in a light of “reason” most likely but the way they are presented. If you kids are young, my suggestion is for the time being just let it ride. If you try to “wasn” them about the new GF who ruined their “happy home” they are more likely I think to see you in the light of just a “bitter person” —
The “bitter person” role, the “scorned woman,” the “crazy x wife” are all roles that the psychopath likes to lay on US—and if we say a word against them, that “proves” what they are saying is right! They do it to our friends, our kids, and anyone whom they can get close to.
Fighting it is difficult, and frustrating, and usually unsuccessful, unless like Erin Brock your X gets himself arrested for SELLING DRUGS and vindicates her publicly.; Two of the psychopaths I was reviling got arrested as well, and that was SOME vindication for me, but my egg donor continues to paint me as “mentally ill, the poor dear” when in fact, she is the enabling and abusive one. Fighting it, trying to get people to see that YOU are not the crazy one, only, unfortunately, many times, makes us LOOK CRAZY! And frankly most people could care less one way or the other. So I just let it ride, if they are gossiping about me, they are leaving some other poor soul alone.
He will EVENTUALLY show his true colors to the current victim, so at some point in time, you and she can both sit down together and have a cup of coffee and compare stories. (((hugs))) and God bless.
Oh, I definitely know his painting of me as the “Crazy Ex” – which is why I am no contact! Kind of harder for him to pull off how jealous and controlling I am when I don’t talk to him and essentially just bide my time until court, submitting declarations every time he breaks the restraining order. I was a very passionate person who honestly showed my feelings, but that’s the absolute worst thing you can do with a spath! I don’t say anything bad about the new g.f. to my ds (he’s 5), and I know of course he likes her and of course she’s probably really nice. The only thing I would say if I could is “Don’t get too attached”. After she gets taken, she’ll have no rights to see my son. Everyone loses in this scenario. (Hello Jesse James!) I do know that! At least I can be sure my ds is eating well. His father hated to “waste” money on food! According to my ds, they’re eating over there every day. Ugh. You’d think being jobless and completely unable to care for himself would be a huge tip-off to the poor woman, but I remember how nice he was to ME in the beginning, and how he tends to pick women who are insecure in some way and really feed their ego. Also he went to massage therapy school (supported by me!) not a a profession but as a way to lure hot women. Poor thing. I certainly hope she’ll have the smarts to demand to meet me before marrying the man.
Freemama, your ability to feel pity for the spath’s current target is an indication of just how far you’ve walked your healing path.
The new targets get caught up exactly as we did – we believe in the facade, and then we’re in denial until our worlds collapse and the spath is revealed at long last. They are usually ensnared via pity – no job, no home, crazy ex, etc., etc., and it works for them for a while until the new target either heeds the red flags or finds themselves in dire straights, just as we did.
I’ve always maintained that it is imperative to “meet the ex” when considering any relationship with someone who was previously married. Spath will do anything they can to not allow that to happen, but if it does, Katie-bar-the-door!
Brightest blessings!
I have grown a lot, to be sure. Though no one should have to come out of anything like this at all… but if you’re going to, it might as well be stronger.
He TORTURED me with his secret girlfriends and numerous emotional affairs. Even when caught, he would deny deny deny and make it out like I was just a controlling freak. Meanwhile, I watched his son every second I wasn’t working so he could go party and cheat all of the time. Can’t imagine why that would make someone bitter! I used to HATE those women. I was so jealous that he was giving them all the attention I deserved as mother of his child and caretaker in every aspect of his life. I do realize now that they were just as duped. I even feel compassion for the girl he cheated on me for two years with. She probably expected him to leave me for her, and when he did finally leave, he dumped her, too. She didn’t make enough money, though she was totally willing to appease his voracious sex drive! Yech. I still think it was horrible of her to be a willing accomplice, but letting go of that resentment towards her really brought much-needed healing to me.
Dear Freemama and Buttons,
I agree that letting go of that bitterness especially toward the others who were/are duped by them is an essential part of OUR healing. Even letting go of the bitterness toward them (as long as you don’t start trusting them again! LOL) is also healing for me.
Those that participate in continuing abuse TOWARD us are a different story, and taht abuse (of course, according to the P we deserve it) is usually a CO-abusive person, so sometimes they turn it around on the P themselves. When two Ps get together it is simply amazing what they can do to each other. Fortunately, one of them usually whips the crap out of the other one, and the loser limps off as “I’m such a VICTIM” and (giving REAL VICTIMS a bad name!) but it is nice to see a P get what they have coming, and from another P NO LESS!
Karma Kicks arse!