By | August 29, 2011 220 Comments

Letter from a sociopath

From time to time, Lovefraud receives email from people who identify themselves as sociopaths. Here’s one that came in recently:

I have read your website, and i am not impressed. You give the impression that all sociopaths are murderers and haters, incapable of loving, and should be thrown away as a tragedy to the human race. You do not mention the difference between a high-functioning sociopath and a low-functioning sociopath. I happen to be a high-functioning sociopath, and your website is all lies and misguided information, and whats worse, you gain money out of creating a stigma of us, and abusing the victims of certain relationships, which although do happen, aren’t generally what high functioning sociopaths are about. Who’s the one with no conscience? I would say you.

I have no emotion, i use logic to understand what is happening. I mimic emotions of others because i know that it is important to my survival that i display emotion or otherwise people become scared. Is that really so bad? Yes, perhaps i play mind games with people because i grow so bored, but that doesn’t really harm them does it? People get over it. I don’t go out murdering puppies and kittens, and laugh like a comic villain. I may have mistreated some animals, but never with the intent of doing so. I may have hurt some people, but they get over it. I’m the one who has to pay for their hurt, they threaten my survival when they retaliate. I flirt with people a lot, but so do a lot of people, not just sociopaths. I do have some emotion, even if it is limited. I can pretend to have an emotion to convince myself. I act simply to feel.

You ’empaths’ only have emotions so that you are scared of us, when all we are are bored, and confused harmless cheeky rascals. And to point out, adult sociopaths usually stop being sociopaths after the age of 30, so its not ‘incurable’ as soon as they become an adult. You try living in a world that is black and white, where any emotion has to be forced, and you have to copy others expression, and  you’re always so very bored, because i am, so bored. You can’t blame us for needing some excitement, to survive we must have a way out of our boredom. You know nothing about what you say. We have a soul, we just can’t access it as easily as everyone else.

Born with the genes

The person who wrote this letter, I was able to determine, is an attractive young woman. I’ll ignore her mischaracterizations of Lovefraud—we are obviously well aware that sociopaths are not all murderers, because most of us were involved with sociopaths who didn’t kill anyone.  Beyond that, her letter provides a good insight into the reality of sociopaths, with all their rationalizations and excuses.

Even so, I do feel sorry for them.

Sociopathy is highly genetic, and no sociopaths asked to be born they way they are. No sociopaths asked for manipulative parents or uncaring home environments that pushed them further along the path towards disorder. That’s the hand they were dealt, and it’s truly sad.

Even sadder is the fact that they don’t know it’s sad. It’s like someone born blind, who doesn’t comprehend vision. Or someone born deaf, who can’t understand what music may be. They were born with a limited or nonexistent ability to love, and whatever love they did have was probably snuffed out by their own disordered parents. Instead, they have an overactive appetite for power and control.

Like this young woman, sociopaths are aware that they are different. But most of them don’t care. In fact, they take pride in their ability to exercise power, and look down on the rest of us. We are merely marks to be exploited.

Lessen the disorder

This young woman also said that people stop being sociopaths at the age of 30. There is no scientific evidence that sociopathy can be cured. The best we can usually hope for is that sociopaths will decide to comply with the mores of society, if only because it’s in their own self-interest. They do have the power to decide that following the rules is more convenient and causes them less aggravation than violating them.

Can sociopaths actually lessen their disorder? Dr. Liane Leedom is hopeful, although she recognizes that it is extremely difficult. The fact is that many brain characteristics and functions contribute to sociopathy, and the human brain is not static. Beliefs and behaviors can cause chemical and structural changes in the brain. So if sociopaths were really committed to changing their ideas, and engaged in activities that fostered empathy, their brain structures could change. An individual willing to attempt this would probably have a lesser degree of disorder to begin with, so maybe he or she would already have seeds of caring buried within, seeds that could grow into a degree of empathy.

Inaccessible soul

I was struck by the last sentence of the letter:

We have a soul, we just can’t access it as easily as everyone else.

I actually think that the young woman is right about this. The souls of sociopaths are buried under so much negativity—anger, hatred, aggression, coldness, envy and the desire for power—that the souls can’t be felt.

I don’t think those of us who have been damaged by sociopaths should attempt to help them. Our first duty is to ourselves, to our own health and recovery. But I believe that we’re all connected, and maybe in whatever communication we may have with a higher power, we can pray for them. It might take a long time, but maybe it will do some good.

Even if we don’t see any improvement in particular individuals, praying will help ourselves. Bitterness only prolongs our own misery and harms our own health. Perhaps offering prayers, from a safe distance, will make a difference all the way around.

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Ox Drover

Thank you for posting this, Donna. Very interesting indeed!

The CONTRADICTIONS, the RATIONALIZATIONS about how she hurts others “but they get over it” and how her boredom is an excuse for the things she does of course illustrate all the precepts of the teachhings of LoveFraud.

Yes, it is “unfortunate” that some people are born with certain genetic tendencies….a person born with the genetic tendency to crave alcohol or drugs does have the CHOICE to drink/drug or not even though they crave it….my “drug of choice” is nicotine and my brain has a craving for it…I eventually decided, made a CHOICE, to quit nicotine consumption because it was harming myself and I did. There are people who have made the same choices with alcohol and other drugs because they know they hurt not only themselves but others when they consume these substances, so I am of the opinion that psychopaths, like the people who have the genetic tendencies for substance abuse, can make a CHOICE not to hurt others to relieve their own boredom.

I agree that the psychopaths are human, and they have souls. We can pray for them, as you said, FROM A SAFE DISTANCE, and I think those prayers benefit US as much or more so than they do the psychopaths. WE have a CHOICE to remain bitter or to exercise our empathy in a healthy manner. Sometimes it is a continuing battle not to remain bitter, angry or filled with the rage of having been unjustly targeted by someone who seemed to enjoy our suffering, but I think that on-going battle to get the bitterness, anger and rage out of our own hearts and souls is worth it. Sometimes it will rear its ugly head when we think it is gone forever, but I think we must fight it back for our own healing and peace. It is difficult (if not impossible) to feel peace when you are bitter, angry or filled with rage, yet those feelings and emotions are NORMAL in response to being injured by a psychopath.

Thanks for a great article which is very thought provoking!~


I WISH that the spath that I know used LOGIC to maneuver through life, but unfortunately he doesn’t. My impression of him is that he’s not the brightest person, repeating the same “mistakes” over-and-over again. I’ve told him that he’s an abnormal human being, but my words don’t affect him. He thinks he’s fine. All of the problems that he has don’t need to exist in the first place. If he had done what he was supposed to do (eg. pay bills, treat others according to the “Golden Rule,” etc.), gee, he’d being doing okay in the present time. He has his excuses for why he does what he does, preferring to keep his personal problems private. The spath I know truly lacks common sense. It is frustrating to no end having to deal with a person who lacks a brain. It’s not funny at all, but incredibly sad.



Wow. Thanks for posting this.

The emptyness is so real. It’s just written by somebody as flat as a pancake. That’s my spath. So while I’m crying, yearning, being sad, in pain, he’s got this blank expression, because he’s BLANK INSIDE.

Ox Drover

Going back over this letter, I find some of the various sentences very interesting in their demonstrations of various ways of dysfunctionaly relating to others.

1. DENYING RESPONSIBILITY– You can’t blame us for needing some excitement,

2. EXCUSING BAD BEHAVIOR AS “HARMLESS” –“i play mind games with people because i grow so bored, but that doesn’t really harm them does it? People get over it.”

“I may have mistreated some animals, but never with the intent of doing so. ”

3. PROJECTION–Who’s the one with no conscience? I would say you.

4. BLAMING THE VICTIM…I may have hurt some people, but they get over it. I’m the one who has to pay for their hurt,—- they threaten my survival when they retaliate. —

WOW! This letter just gets better and better the more you read it over. Logic? ROTFLMAO, nah, this self described sociopath doesn’t use logic at all, just the same WORD SALAD and self serving babble that most of them do, putting the “blame” for their bad behavior off on the victims they abuse. Pitiful, really, but logical? Nah, not at all.


Yeah, I wish we all could just “get over it.” Some people have no idea whatsoever what their actions do to people.

I have chills all over.


Hate to inform said self proclaimed sociopath but the qualities that make you human, with a soul are not posessed in your being. Empathy, love, etc are never FELT, but forced and play acted. How horrible it must be to BE that, and make not mistake…you are incurable. This is not a disease, but who you are, and no, it doesnt majically dissappear around the age of 30. Contrary to your missives on the “mistakes” made on the writings here, they are well written and truthful. Yet another part of being human that escapes and evades the psychopathic mentality. You will troll thru life for victims to appease your boredom and be continually clueless about humanity in general.


IMO, they could cure themselves if they chose to.

It’s easy, just stop perceiving everything from a mememememememeeeee perspective. You are not the center of the universe and you never will be. Now who has to “get over it” ?

Without that perspective, they can honor and respect everyone as being equal to them and the spathiness would disappear.


She has the audience and the rise out of us that she hoped for. Sick and pathetic are the personality disordered. They bring nothing to society except confusion, hurt and destruction. Just like we choose the level of good we want to bring to others, they choose the level of evil that they want to bring to the world. I think she is hoping that it disappears after the age of 30 so that she has something to look forward to – – a real life. Being a pathetic excuse for a human being is a tough job for a sociopath…or at least the 46 year old sociopath who tried to destroy my life is figuring out now after being discovered before the mask was completely removed.


I agree w/ survivormag –

we’re just giving it the attention it wanted.
whatever – that’s my response.


Ok, here’s a scenario…..

If I push a someone off a cliff and he/she breaks both legs. Is it ok for me to say ’he/she will get over it’?

Well ….. physically there will be some recovery. But old wounds/scars will always be there as a reminder of the event.

Secondly, the emotional trauma of betrayal (being pushed and the actual fall) will take much longer. There will be nightmares, flashbacks and untold mental anguish.

So to say that someone can get ’over it’ is a very shallow and callous view in my opinion.

Candy, don’t try to reason with this person. You’re just setting yourself up to be really frustrated when they don’t get a word of it.


Stomping – Good advice. I think a bit of gardening is the order of the day!


I guess I do have to say a thank you to Donna for sharing this with us –
It’s a perfect example of what we’ve all had to encounter.
boredom…. good thing to know ay?

but I really don’t want to put forth any energy on this.

Moving on to another article to read.

Haha Candy 🙂 Yes, gardening sounds nice.


Nightmares and flashbacks. That’s what I have a lot. Especially the flashbacks. Do they ever go away?


Me, me, me, me, me …or in its letter I, I, I and I ..what a sad individual ..if it even exists …I read this and thought this is just a troll looking for attention, and as boring as it finds the world, so is its letter.

Take care everyone, karma.

Ox Drover

Dear Marcy,

Yea, they will eventually get better or go away, it will take TIME and effort, so keep on reading and learning, KNOWLEDGE IS POWER. ((hugs))) and God bless.


We have a soul, we just can’t access it as easily as everyone else.

*Chortle* *trying to hold it back* *can’t anymore* BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! You mean, you “think” you have a soul. Just like Casey Anthony “really did love Caylee Anthony!” … oh and she won’t let you forget that she’s “really a good person” underneath all of that… ? It’s all just a big misunderstanding… yeah… that’s all.


No. Sociopaths don’t have a soul, but they want you to think they do- so when you’re not looking they can ravage everything you deem precious and turn your world upside down. All while getting a sick sense of satisfaction out of it. You bleed, they laugh- no they grow giddy with excitement. No apologies. But they “have souls”, remember? *Gag*

Others may sympathize, but I recognize it for what it is. I am not going to anthropomorphize yet again, a monster hiding in human’s skin.


Thank you Ox Drover. You make me feel better.


wisergirl, AMEN on all your points! well said.


Yea, they have a soul alright, an inhuman one. I still stick by the belief shared by many that the ‘sociopaths’ are the children of the gods/ or the nephilim.
Yes, my dear I have recovered from what my ‘sociopath” husband did to me but I still carry the scars. Such as playing the game of marriage knowing full well what he was and not disclosing it to me.
I still haven’t told you folks the worse of it or how I tried to kill myself when I found out the truth and how I was saved by a good Samaritan with a real human soul.
The fact that his so called “human relatives” were in on the scam with him and how they tried to hide the truth from me leaves a lot to be answered for.
He was a monster but how they can live with themselves by hiding the truth from me leaves me flabbergasted.
On Halloween I plan on writing an essay telling you all what I know about the ‘nephilim.’
I’ve held back a lot because most rational folks don’t want to believe in the ‘bogey man.’ But on all Hallows Eve the two worlds- the human world/ and the invisible world become one through the thin veil and it’s probably the only time of the year people are interested in hearing a good tale.


Oh please . . Give me a break!
This is the PITY PLOY that Martha Stout talks about, in “The Sociopath Next Door”
I don’t feel sorry for HER. I feel sorry for her VICTIMS.
(Been there . . . Done that!)



I shall look forward to your story…


Holy crap! Half way through this (as I am reading it to my son) I start thinking this sounds exactly like my spath sister in law! She is not the brightest of people, but thinks she knows it all. My son laughed at the 30 yo thing. Umm, don’t we all wish it only lasted until they were 30! Anyway, I do think it could be her, and if it is she is way more destruction and dangerous than appearing in this letter. Bored doesn’t describe it. Ruining people’s lives for power and to feed her N side is more like it! My mom just told me today to watch my butt with her. She said the SIL is seriously out to get me any chance she gets. (I live far away and I am not afraid of her.)
Just seems odd. Too many familars in the wording and attitude of it. It could be a relative of hers, though. Just never know!

Hi Jen. I have to confess I had the same feeling, and my ex spath is a guy even. I think we are just witnessing that no matter how they look, what gender, or what mask they wear, they ultimately have a similar interior and speak similar babble.

Also, I just realized that when I initially read this letter, I got this feeling that I can only ever remember having the first time I saw a dead body. It’s a very distinct emotion. Reading this letter feels exactly like looking at a dead body.

Lastly, is it possible for an spath to also be bipolar, or is that kinda built into being an spath already? Cause my ex spath can be black and white at the exact same time, yet for some reason, he either is completely unaware that he’s a walking contradiction, or he is aware yet thinks no one else can tell. Or are these people ever bipolar too?


I’m crying right now because I know my mom is a spath and I feel so bad for her. It must be horrible for her. I’m so grateful that she didn’t kill me. I’m sure she wanted to. she told me she never wanted kids. She wanted to abort my little sister but the doc talked her out of it. She told me she only had kids because my dad wanted them. But dad didn’t like kids. He told me he doesn’t like children but he has enjoyed us much more as adults.

I’m understanding spaths more and more. I feel so bad for my parents. i realize that it is only by the grace of God that I’m not a spath. I almost was one. my brother and sister are. I did some very spathy things when I was 12.

The boredom that the spath person speaks of isn’t boredom,it’s anxiety and fear. she goes into a hysteroidal cycle and needs drama to create a catharsis.

When Superkid’s exspath said, “someone has to die.” that was part of the hysteroidal cycle that humanity is addicted to. The only thing thing that keeps the human race from sinking into the scapegoat (somebody has to die) cycle, is empathy.

Google Lloyd DeMuse. childhood history.


Sounds like a relative of mine this, also an attractive young woman, in fact an unnervingly pretty and intelligent one, who is most definitely a sociopath. The eyes – that creepy, dead, stare, and the flashes of darkness that cross her eyes as she speaks. Nobody else in the family has those weird eyes, but her. It pains me to say it, because we have a lot in common, even look alike, and could be really good friends if she weren’t so volatile, but I couldn’t deny that coldness, those eyes. If she looked on the outside, like she does on the inside, she’d be whole lot less pretty! Much like the one who wrote the letter, she doesn’t care if she hurts people, even her own family. she has no conscience.Recently was the first time she had seen me in two years, since she spread libellous lies/accusations all over the internet about me. Whilst I was clearly nervous as she walked in the room, even though I am ten years older than her, because of the trouble that had been caused – I almost got a lawyer involved – she was cool as a cucumber and showed no anxiety whatsoever. That was my first clue – it was like nothing had happened. If I had done what she did to an older relative, and it was the first time I had seen them since, I would be quite nervous and contrite seeing them sat there as I walked in. She simply did not understand the level of danger she was in, back then when she almost got a solicitors letter and restraining order from me, and now when she brazenly walked in like nothing had happened, even giving me the odd dirty look at first when I glanced at her a couple of times (sizing up my enemy I guess!) as if to say ‘What the hell is she staring at’
This one, writing here, she has no soul – let’s not kid ourselves. Look at what she has written: “Yes, perhaps i play mind games with people because i grow so bored, but that doesn’t really harm them does it? People get over it. I may have hurt some people, but they get over it. I’m the one who has to pay for their hurt, they threaten my survival when they retaliate…”
People get over it? It doesn’t really harm them? WTF??!! I felt physically SICK when my aforementioned relative launched her hate campaign against me a couple of years ago, because I couldn’t understand how my own flesh and blood could hate me so much when I had been nothing but good to her. I had done nothing to deserve it -she took something innocuous I had said, and twisted it because she was, like this writer, clearly ‘bored’ and felt like playing mind games. She had attmepted a few mind games prior to this big one, which I had rebuffed/not allowed her to get a foothold with because I was onto her by then. She was determined to alleviate her ‘boredom’ though, and almost got herself a criminal record in the process, only she was family and forthis reason I was merciful enough to warn her about what I was going to do beforehand, to give her a chance to stop her behaviour! Which she did….
Look, seriously, in my view, it’s not boredom that motivates them to attempt to destroy minds and hearts – it’s EVIL! Evil exists, simply because love exists. Darkness exists because light exists. We live in a universe of duality. What I saw in her eyes that evening was not a troubled soul, or a tortured human being who could not access their soul. What I saw was pure, unadulterated, evil and it made me feel so sick and traumatised by the reality of who this family member was, that I felt drained for two days after. I had hoped she was merely troubled, and that we could have some semblance of a friendship, but it was not the case, and I would only be puttng myself in danger by denying the truth. There is no soul there – only evil. There is a lump of ice where a heart should be. She is not the type of person you could have a heart to heart with – she might be fine with you at first, but she will use your vulnerabilty and what you have shared with her later on against you in some twisted discrediting campaign when she is ‘bored’ The reality of it truly hurts, I would rather not be typing this right now, but I know me and my relative will never have a nice, normal, human relationship because one of us, frankly, is not human! She’s a predator, a demon in human form; that’s how I see her… xx

Denise Guiney

None the less when you have had a bad experience the majority of your friends and family will tell you to hurry up and “get over it” and what a painful experience that is for you. They do not understand the pain the sociopath caused you and the sociopath does not understand your pain either.


sky – please remember to cry for sky.

i know your grattitude is heartlfelt and i know you are compassionate – but it is disturbing also. i cannot say do not weep for her, do not be grateful; but i look in horror at how low your bar is set.

i doubt that not killing you had little to do with her moral compass, and I don’t know that should get any credit for it. maybe i am reading your post wrong – maybe yo are grateful in a general way, not grateful to her. well, i am grateful you are here, and that you have a chance to remove yourself from spathland….the truth will set you free, but first it will make you hurt like hell.

find your boundaries, find your emo balls and break the trauma bond. your acceptance is a good thing – but always (?) you are lacking in anger, and not in a good way. i just sat back for a moment and thought about how i would feel if i was in a position to say that i was grateful that my father didn’t kill me – INSTANTANEOUS ANGER.

hope i am not ust blah blahing and didn’t miss the point – i am so not good first thing in the morning.

we all care so much for you and about you sky, me included. i want nothing but the best for you – whatever that is.


Thanks for posting the letter. It really gave me chills. They’re just plain evil in my book – the evil that walks among us. Not to make a Star Trek reference, but I will anyway. They’re like the Borg – in that you cannot reason with them. They’ll never see it. They’ll never care about the hurt, anguish, nightmares, and tears.

Once I understand what had happened to me – after he disappeared without a word and would not respond to my messages, emails, etc. I knew that trying to make him understand what he had done was pointless. I’ve started doing Yoga and Tai Chi. It helps with the nightmares and it really does help calm your mind and gives me something else to focus on. He / it has moved on to a new victim – he even married her. I tried to warn her – but alas, I’m sure he had already filled her head with lies about me and I only looked like a vengeful harpy. Through friends of friends they’ve tried to warn her, but as far as I know she’s still married to him. Any advice on how much we should try to derail their next gravy trains? I feel I’ve tried to do what I could. I don’t want to go too far and wind up back on his radar – an evil desperate being with no soul is capable of anything.

Ox Drover

Dear Firewoman,

Welcome to LF…sorry you have a need to be here, but since you do, this is a good place to be.

“Derailing” their next and next and next victim is an endless and futile process….and it just keeps them in your head, renting space that could be filled with happiness and peace, so my suggestion to you at this point is to LET HIM GO INTO THE UNIVERSE, he is not your responsibility and neither are his victims (most of them would not listen anyway as you already found out.)

Our paths start out about them, learning about them, etc. but then once they are out of our lives, we must evict them from our heads and hearts, and then the path becomes about US, NOT THEM. About healing our selves, our wounds and what made us vulnerable to them in the first place. It is as much a spiritual journey as anything (not religious, but SPIRITUAL, the spirit of ourselves) Though in some of us, our spirit and our religious beliefs have also been improved as well. Again, welcome! God bless.

Ox Drover

Stomping in rain puddles,

Research shows many psychopaths are ALSO bi-polar, I think about a third of them at least, many are also ADHD and a higher percentage of them are left handed as well…so your observation about the bi-polar is quite right on. BI-polar and ADHD are both genetic as well as psychopathy, along with some environmental triggers as well. It is also possible that the psychopath has bi-polar, ADHD AND is left handed. I know one that had all of it and he was also a sexual predator of children and ex convict…my psychopathic son is left handed but I know is not ADHD and I don’t really know about the bi-polar as I have not been around him enough since he was over 16 (he’s in prison) to really notice the signs of bi-polar and they don’t usually show up until later in adolescence (at least after puberty) A lot of the “signs” of psychopathy and the mania of bi-polar sort of over lap anyway, the grandiose thinking, the narcissistic attitude, the lack of learning from mistakes, etc.



My in-laws knew quite a bit about the spath (the fact that he lied and was a lawbreaker) before I ever got involved with him, no-one telling me ANYTHING until we were separated (after 14 years of marriage). By then, I’d been through the mill, was a nervous wreck over my experiences via their relative. I think that common decency would cause you to warn another person (especially someone who is dating your family member) about that person, enabling the individual to make an informed decision about whether to proceed with a relationship or drop it then and there. I have a hard time liking his family members (especially the ones who were aware of his past actions) after what I’ve experienced, no matter how sweet and wonderful they come across. When I specifically said to a few of them that I wish that I’d been warned about him because I wouldn’t have married him, they had their excuses – “we thought he would change” and another relative said, “welll, you would have wanted to fix him.” I know I shouldn’t think this way, but I would like for karma to touch them on my behalf.


Spaths do NOT have a soul and are not even human I think. End of story.
I will do whatever I need to survive them, “ethical, moral” or otherwise. There are no ethics involved when you’re dealing with a non-human entity.

Ox Drover


I agree with you, if someone will not WARN you when they know there is a train about to hit you, you can’t trust them no matter how they say they care about you, blah blah blah! I came to that conclusion about my son C….he KNEW what was going on with the rest of my family, that they were trying to dirve me out of my home, bankrupt me, and so on, and HE DID NOT WARN ME…yet, I “forgave” him AND restored him to trust….bad move on my part, —the restoring trust—-I have forgiven him, but that does NOT mean I would ever trust him any further than I could pick him up and throw him. “Sheet on me once, shame on you, sheet on me twice, shame on me!”



It sounds like you really stepped into an important learning and part of your healing.

HUGS go out to you. Truly.


The author of the letter claims to be a sociopath. Well, why don’t WE tell HER to just “get over it” or “deal with it”, (just like she wants her victims to do).


Ox Drover,

I don’t know how you get over their lack of genuine caring (from family members) about your well-being, especially your son. The spath has no concern for my well-being and his family obviously doesn’t truly care either. Jesus was right when He said about his persecutors, “Forgive them Father for they know not what they do.” We can get better over time, but Joanie is right, we have scars. The spaths cause us to see life beneath the surface, I suppose, how humans really are and/or can be.


To stomping_in_rain_puddles,

Answering your question if bipolar disorder just folds in naturally with Spaths”if it comes in a bundle..

I believe it is possible that many spaths have comorbid personality disorders..can possibly be bipolar, have Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) and its subcategory (I think), Disassociative Identity Disorder (what used to be called Multiple Personality Disorder, AND be schizophrenic, all at once. I sensed that my ex (spath) had several of those. And no, spathicity DOES NOT stop at age 30, contrary to what the spath’s letter above describes (maybe wishful thinking on her part) .. Though my spath was dry the whole time he lived with me (I did think, though, just once, that I smelled gin or vodka on his breath..but only once in all those years), I honestly believe all those years of active alcoholism may have created schizoaffective disorder. I think I also remember meeting one person in his extended family, who someone else in his family told me is bipolar. I saw an early family made movie, where my ex, as a toddler, was bullying another kid. As the family members watched it with me, they just if his bullying was funny.

And no, their spathicity DOES NOT STOP after things are “over” with you. Mine, I believe, still stalks me >10 years later (spam emails, prank calls) .. About 9 years ago, I made the mistake of opening one such spam containing an attached MOVING VIDEO OF was a man having sex with a woman who very much resembled me (hair, eyes, but not body type, but facial features were similar to mine..BUT IT WASN’T ME!)..You’re damn straight I think it was him who sent it. By then I was already with my new mate (who I’m still with) .. In fact, THEY DON’T STOP, and I think his stalking behavior has escalated lately. In fact, I intend to fill out a police report TODAY, no matter how long I have to wait at the police station. And I AM going to tell them about the COUNTY PROPERTY he admitted to stealing, when I first began dating him.

Just because we are still on our journey to healing and keep our “no contact” rule, doesn’t mean we must just sit by and let them CONTINUE harassing us.


Ox Drover

Dear Bluejay, you “get over it” the same way we do over any injury, with time and work….and processing the grief. Sure there are some scars, residual marks of healing, but when you break a bone and it heals back, actually that ONE spot is usually stronger than it was before…I think in many ways our spirits and our souls are also stronger than they were before we were injured and healed.

Sure it is painful to “lose” a child, but it is also painful to lose ANY ONE we love, either through death, desertion, or betrayal.

Quantum Solace

“high-functioning sociopath” – muuuuaaaaa haaaaa…

I’m willing to bet that the writer is the is the CEO of Bank of America, Goldman Sachs, Chase or some other Wall Street bankster. Those are the “high-functioning sociopath” they only steal from billions of poor people, whine that their bonuses aren’t high enough and expect thanks and accolades for destroying the economy country and the rest of the world. So ironic! I wonder if he realizes that his letter is a testament to the very thing he’s trying to negate.


You’re probably right, Quantum Solace..that “letter from a sociopath” is probably a MAN..IN DISGUISE as a WOMAN..spaths do that a lot, too. Very often, they ENVY women, so want to BE one..or PRETEND to be one. That is one of the things my ex (spath) did.


DARN IT! I don’t wanna hide!

It’s Panther / Stomping_in_rain_puddles

Yeah, I tried making another identity and I hated it.

I feel like no one in here knows who I am anymore. Ox is all explaining her son to me, and I wanna say, “Ox! It’s me Panther!”

Oh, I’m just not built well for this combat stuff. I went NC which I had no idea would immediately get me stalked. How long before they get bored and wander off?

Ox: I asked about the bipolar thing because I think spathism is not static, based on what I am witnessing and hearing in here. I feel like I am dealing with a shit storm of mental disorders to be honest, and pardon my language, but it was the most appropriate word there. I think he honestly believes his own lies, which would be a pathological liar trait, and also he seems to forget things, maybe by omission, or maybe it’s a degenerative thing. I don’t mean to make excuses. I’m just a bit perplexed. Maybe it just has to do with the spath-existence and maybe being an spath is just like this. I simply am confused how a person can look at you and in the same breath, it seems, say, “I fucking love hate wanna kill you will protect you forever want the best for you am going to destroy you bitch angel.” That’s what I hear when he talks.

ZIMZOOMIT: I went to the police yesterday and as soon as I started telling them why I was there, I started crying. I felt so stupid, but it hit me right at that moment that going to the police was the first moment in which I actually stopped cowering in fear and took a step to validate, protect, and love myself.

Here is the exact way I have felt all this time: I would turn around and walk away if only I weren’t terrified of having my back to him.

I was literally mortified to the point of protecting him when others tried to help me.

Unfortunately, the police didn’t get what I was trying to communicate in the slightest. I told them that he is dangerous, and then they asked me if he had ever hurt me. I told them that he’d put me in the hospital before, and then they asked if I went back after that. As soon as I said, “Yes,” they looked at me like, “Let’s not waste our time helping this idiot. She did it to herself.” Luckily, I have been here on LF, and so I was prepared for such a reaction, because I’ve realized since I go in here that only people who have dealt with an spath actually grasps the dynamics.

Definitely go to the police. Yes, we have the right to fight back. And I don’t mean a fight to win or to show who’s tougher. I mean that if someone breaks into our house and starts ransacking the place and charging at us with a bat, we should shoot them if we’ve got a gun in a drawer somewhere, not just stand there and let them beat us to death just to demonstrate that we’re not violent like them. I am pushing myself to stop fearing these things:

1. People not believing me
2. Making myself visible to possible new predators in the area, since I feel I’m in a vulnerable state and therefore a target to anyone keeping an eye out for a wounded animal
3. Pissing him off and thus escalating things
4. Being mean

My mom raised me on “two wrongs don’t make a right” and “just because someone hits you doesn’t mean you have the right to hit them back” but she forgot to add “but if the bastard is a stalking, abusive, evil son-of-a-gun with no conscience beating the crap out of you, put a freaking bullet in him.”

No, I’m not going to be cruel. But I will defend myself.

By the way zoomzimit, my exspath sent me a moving video of porn just 2 weeks ago in a panic, telling me that he needed me to watch it and confirm for him that it isn’t really me.

It’s absolutely disturbing how similar stories can be sometimes.

She’ll find her “soul”….as soon as they find those WMDs……


All I can say is my ex (spath) must’ve had to view A LOT of porn, before he found (I still suspect it was him) one with a woman in it that ALMOST resembled me (it wasn’t me, ladies!) Oh.., and the guy she was with was MUCH more fit & handsome than he ever was or could be, and the “position” they used was one he would never have fathomed (he was pretty dull in the sack..ha ha)

Wish I would’ve kept that email in my spam folder, though. I could have forwarded that one to the police (to back up my report) probably could be trace-able back to the IP addy.

Yes, they DO stalk/harass you..even years later. No such thing as stopping at age 30! Harumph!




personally i dont think they “grow out of it” .. i do think they perfect their manipulating style and therefore can fool much more easily as they get older.

once a spath.. always a spath.

i’m not about to take my chances.

that’s like going back into a burning building.. just to “make sure” its on fire.


Sociopaths don’t stop being sociopaths at age 30- or ANY age for that matter. SOME spaths merely don’t have the same energy level at age, 45- as they did when they were 25 or 35. I’ve seen that many spaths “slow down” a bit or maybe they just get rather sloppy and lazy regarding keeping track of lies and the individuals who the lies are targeted at.

The two spaths I was involved with were in their 50s and 60s and I can tell you, regarding the 60 yr old- he still had PLENTY of energy to manipulate and play head games- in fact I think it actually energized him.

“Give them enough rope and they eventually hang themselves” is how I dealt with it. Though the “eventually” may be far too long to tolerate.



I am moved by your last post. I don’t want to make judgements about your finding sadness and compassion for your mother. But it did feel deep, and like it came from a place of understanding and personal strength and healing. And, your keen observation about hysteroidal reaction, and need for catharsis really hit home.

Thank you Sky, I have always appreciated how open you are about your personal process/healing, and how amazingly insightful and ‘intelligent’ your understandings about s/p are.



Hello sociopath you enjoy playing mind games well I will tell you, us good hearted people here have a hard time with that. We don’t just get over it, it takes lots of time to heal from someone like you. Another thing I was raped inside and out used by a sociopath he got thousands from me and my children. He played me with all lies for 3.5 years.Promises you all don’t even know what it means you just play your act to get what you want from good people ….. By the way my sociopath was 50 and is 52 now………………. Well I know none of this will matter to you for you don’t have emotions to feel….I sure do and this sociopath has made my life overwhelming a nice way to put it, I know a lot of good people have been hurt here so I will state things appropriately . Sociopaths need to stick to their own kind and leave us alone….

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