By Ox Drover
One of the themes that seems to run throughout the stories of many of, if not most of, the people who have had experiences with psychopaths is that we have either had repeated episodes of being abused by the same psychopath, even after we saw their dishonesty, or had episodes of being sucked into the webs of multiple psychopaths. Or, we have both of these—multiple episodes with multiple psychopaths.
Most of the people I have known who were formerly victims of psychopaths are not stupid. In fact, some of the smartest, most accomplished people I know are former victims, and have been repeatedly victimized by one psychopath after finding out that this person was dishonest and abusive. Somehow, they kept on going back to the relationship, even after multiple attempts to disengage from the abuser. Why? Why does a person who is smart, accomplished, and otherwise successful in life and business keep repeating the same behavior that allows them to be hurt?
There is an often-used quote, “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.” It seems by this definition that the victims of psychopaths are “insane,” because we keep on trying to have a relationship with someone who is repeatedly abusive. There must be some reason that otherwise smart and successful people keep repeating the behavior that is unsuccessful in its outcome. There must be some common thread among victims and former victims that makes us susceptible to frequently returning to an unsuccessful and painful relationship.
Here’s a little story that may contain what may be a grain of truth that might point us toward the answer to the question of. “Why?”
The Chief and the Snake
Once upon a time there was a very wise and kind Indian chief. One day as the chief was walking through the forest, he came upon a rattlesnake in the path. He stopped and started to go around the snake, not wanting to hurt it, but not wanting to be bitten either.
As the chief started to pass around the snake, the snake spoke to him (not an unusual thing in those days) and said, “Chief, please have mercy on me, my wife and family are on the other side of yonder river, and I can’t swim, and I can’t get to them. Won’t you please pick me up and carry me across the river?”
The chief looked at the snake and laughed a bit and said, “Why, if I tried to pick you up you would bite me and I would die. I am sad that you have a problem but I must not be bitten, or I would die and my own children would starve because there would be no strong man with a bow to hunt brother deer to provide meat to my little ones. Though my heart feels sad for you, no, I must refuse to pick you up.”
The snake then spoke to the chief saying, “But such a brave man as you should not be afraid of such a small snake as I, and I promise from the bottom of my heart that I would never harm you if you were to help me across yon river. I am so afraid that if I am not able to get across, my wife and children will perish. Please help me in my hour of need.”
The chief looked at the snake and his heart was sad because he knew what it was like to have one’s children without food. His heart took pity on the snake, and he agreed to take the snake across the river, if the snake would agree not to bite him.
The chief reached out to pick up the snake and held him high over his head as he waded the swift and cold waters of the river. About half way across the river when the chief was doing his best to protect the snake from the cold waters, the snake reached down and bit him on the neck, sinking his poison fangs deep into the chief’s blood stream.
The chief was surprised and said to the snake, “Brother Snake, why did you bite me, now I will die and you will drown as well. You promised on your honor not to bite me if I would have mercy on you and help you, now we shall both die and our children starve. You promised me.”
The snake replied, “Ah yes, I promised, but you knew what I was when you picked me up,” as they both sank under the swirling cold water of the river.
What we have in common with the chief
What caused the chief to reach out and pick up a snake that he knew was poisonous, that he knew had the power to harm him, and that if he was wrong in making this decision to pick up the snake, and the snake did bite him, that his own children would suffer because of his decision?
Empathy is what the chief had, empathy for the children of the snake. Because the chief loved his own children, he assumed that the snake must also love its children. Just as the chief would do what was best for his children, he empathized that the snake would also do what was best. Since the chief knew that he would never do anything deliberately to cause consequences for his children, he did not see that the snake would deliberately do something that would cause problems for his own offspring.
Thinking that others have the same motivations that we have can get us into the same problems that the chief got into. The chief wanted to help the snake. He felt pity for the snake. He knew that he would not want someone to refuse to help him if it meant that he would die and his children would go hungry, so it never dawned on him that the snake would be willing to make a decision to do a deed that would insure that the snake-children would go hungry.
The chief’s empathy and his thinking that others had the same empathy, the same motivation for their behavior, and no reason to hurt another, even at the cost of hurting themselves or their near and dear, caused him to want to believe the snake’s promise not to bite.
The snake, however, was right. The chief knew what he was when he picked him up. When we allow ourselves to believe the promises of people who have proven that they are dishonest, we open ourselves to be repeatedly injured or even killed. When someone shows you what they are, believe your eyes. Believe what you see, not what you hear.
No Contact
“No contact” is the commonly accepted “treatment” for any abusive relationship. This means that only contact that is required by law (such as meeting that person in a courtroom due to a law uit) or the minimum amount of contact required by law to co-parent with such a person, is the only interaction between you and your former abuser. No contact allows the injuries to cease, and keeps you safe from new and repeated injuries from the abuser.
“No contact” also includes not stalking the person’s Facebook page or other social media. It means blocking or deleting any text messages, phone calls, e-mails or any other form of communication, including having others tell you what the former abuser is “up to.” Refusing to engage in tale carrying, gossip, or drama involved with the former abuser is also essential. If you must speak about the relationship, do it ONLY with a trusted friend or family member who sees that the relationship was/is abusive, and with assurances that the person will keep your information in absolute confidence. This process can be likened to “not renting them space in your head,” which includes wondering if they have a new relationship, and if they are making this new person happy o,r if they will change for this new person, or wondering if you were wrong about what they are.
You know what they are now, so don’t pick them up. NO CONTACT WORKS.
Out of Denial,
don’t be so quick to think you know all their plans.
My spath conned a good upstanding man out of his helicopter and his life. He did it by becoming his best friend. He did this very very slowly, over a matter of years (just like he did to me). The guy was also a widower who missed his wife terribly and spath showed up to be his best friend. He offered a “Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn” friendship/adventure.
The man felt indebted to spath for everything that spath did for him, especially for being there during the lonely times. He let down his guard. Then a couple of years into the relationshit, came the pity ploy – asking for $$, but it wasn’t really money, it was a helicopter actually, this was their common interest after all….waited a couple more years and spath “accidented” him, so he wouldn’t have to pay him.
Oxy-thanks for the post and the weight loss info. It does make me feel good to exercise. I could really end up doing a lot of damage with weight loss this summer if I can control the stress. Part of that is job related though too. I have my buddy shift tomorrow night for 4 hours at the hospital that is an hour away. I am still waiting for the orientation for the system in town. Once I get their class done, there are potentially 4 hospitals I can pick up in. I also found out that two of the surgery centers in town are hiring too. I will make my way there after the counseling on Monday.
The exercise makes me feel good about myself and I can’t weight myself unless it’s only once a month. I started measuring. I think I will weigh and measure on the first day of each month and have that be it. Otherwise it stresses me out too much-when I see the numbers. I am trying to get into my resistance training routine along with the walking and the tiny bit of running. I need to start doing pushups and situps again everyday and writing down how many I do. I have to be able to do 10 boy push ups and 14 situps in a minute to get back in the police academy. I might as well work on that while I’m losing weight. It’s hard to believe that in 2009 I could do 45 boy pushups and now I can’t even do one. I’m on my knees. Oh well, that’s what happen when you gain 35 lbs from stress. BTW, I can’t say how much of a relief that it was that I am no longer working at that horrible job-thank GOD I got fired. I guess he has a plan-hopefully that includes work soon but better less stressful work than before.
BTW, I’m glad your back is better today and you could take a walk-just don’t overdo it.
skylar are you saying that I might not be as psycho-proof as I think I am? Maybe so. I’d recognize another charmer straight off but if they’re working by stealth and willing to take their time that’s another story. Mine was impatient for things to go his way and pushed hard but maybe he had other plans that were more of a slow burn going on at the same time. His life was a secret to me and I was only privy to the details he wanted me to know and I’m sure that was only a small percentage. He had us all in separate little boxes and I imagined us all having a file with our name and photograph on the front.
Keep going nola… you’ll make it!
I’m not hungry overall. I eat, but just can’t get a lot inside in one go… so it’s tiny meals a couple of times a day. Which is perfect.
And without even actually purposefully dieting, and aside from kine for my knee, not having been able to do m-uch of exercising yet (can start finally thise week)… I lost 8-9 kilos in a month time. Almost all the weight that I gained since last summer and through the winter fretting and worrying and missing him and feeling utterly miserable is gone now. And I was just above overweight BMI border in February. And I had even gained weight after that.
Now I fall right into the middle. Another 6 more kilos to lose to get to my healthy but slim weight.
All that stress just made me gain weight. And with the loss of stress, I lose the weight.
Sounds good to me Nolarn, don’t over do the exercise and the push ups and all that until you slowly work into them. I am easing back into the exercise and wearing the back brace when I go out to work bending over. Actually I’m in pretty good shape for an old broad and you know most of that is just genetics and the fact that I haven’t been sedentary most of my life…research is showing now that even girls who are active in their teens and then get less active still have better muscle and bone in their later years, and exercise even from a wheel chair is beneficial in so many ways.
The being good to ourselves takes time and thought…make some lists of things you want to do for yourself every day…so many minutes of walking, so many calories, and all that.
I have my little routines down…I’m doing things like wearing sun screen regularly now…should have done that 60 years ago, but starting now is better than not…I also have long sleeved white shirts I wear outside, and keep my little fanny pack that I take things with me when I am out…Aussie girl suggested car keys, so when I am outside My car keys are in my fanny pack, and my epi for my bee sting allergy, and my pistole, and my cell phone which is charged, and $50 I keep in it in case of in case…and I am wearing gloves when I work outside now so don’t tear up my hands so badly, and spray myself with OFF before I go out to cut down on the ticks…so I have my “little-old-lady OCD routine” and keep all this on a chair by the front door, along with my hat which I wear outside…so now I add my corset type back brace when I go out to do lifting or tugging etc. or bending…taking care of ME!
I weigh every day but do it to check water retention not fat/ I weigh for weight loss or gain about every two weeks….and I haven’t lost any more weight in about 6 weeks now and it is because of my eating after supper…so got to quit doing that. BAD OXY! BOINK!!!! got to get that next 30 pounds off. I also got me a set of 2.5 pound each leg weights to help burn a few extra calories when I walk…My back pack pack weighs 35 pounds and it’s kinda heavy, so when I put it on, I realize that is the amount of weight I carried 24/7 before I lost the 33 pounds, so it will be easier to get around and I’ll have more energy when I drop another 30 pounds…so gotta get back in gear and do it!
I am eating really healthy foods at least, even if I am eating too many calories. I made a KILLER POT OF CHILI today that is almost fat free, that was only 128 calories per cup and about 150 mg of sodium per cup. Had it for lunch and can’t wait to get some more for supper! I’m enjoying relearing to cook and taste tastes besides salt now.
Doing things for ourselves does take time and thought…but we are worth it. So give yourself the GIFT of that time and effort. EAting healthy, exercise, a long warm candle lit bath, or whatever rings your chimes. Act like you are at a EXCLUSIVE SPA just for you, and do wonderful things….make wonderful dishes of food…just for you. Give yourself a manicure or pedicure or a skin treatment or a hair treatment, and relax on your bed and meditate…doing things for YOU is your top priority now!
Sky,
I learn from you every time you post.
I hadn’t really thought about them stealing my self esteem. I need to noodle on that.
I don’t understand what you said, above ” They know that is how we fool ourselves, by believing that we could only love a person who is as good as we are, when in fact, we have thrown our pearls to swine. I used that quote with my spath ONE time and he repeated it back to me soooo MANY times. He caught the meaning as it applied to me and repeated it over and over as a sociopathic TELL.”
What do you mean?
Thanks
Superkid
Get out the skillet cuz I need to get BOINKED. I broke NC with the lady next door. I saw her when I was outside and she said that she was going to go down the street to have dinner and wanted to know if I would go with her. I went. It was OK though. There was no drama and she was different from the last time I had dinner with her. She was smiling and talking a lot and was friendly. She talked more about her life than she ever had before and she wasn’t closed off-like she felt more comfortable with me. I was studying her a lot too and I was trying to get a good idea about what the eyes were doing. Sometimes she was really making eye contact a lot and sometimes she seemed to avoid eye contact a little. She asked if I had talked to a priest yet and I said that I was seeing the sexual assault counselor instead. She was telling me how I needed to get it taken care of and she said to make sure I keep the appt. She definitely didn’t seem to have empathy though. When most people hear something like that about someone, you get empathy. Usually someone will say I’m sorry that happened to you. Then though we were having a discussion about people in the ICU who are sick. She told me that she is really good with people and their families if someone is dying. I told her a story about when I worked in the ICU about crying with a man who’s father had just passed away. She said sometimes you gotta just cry with them. WEIRD. She is definitely hard to understand. I don’t get her at all but there was no drama, which is good. I thought I would have a better conclusion after studying her, but I don’t. I can’t figure out what her game is.
eb92044
I have to say, EB, that you’re an inspiration. You laugh when you get his text messages? I can’t wait for the day. So, maybe you’re less trusting now, but you are a stronger person for it. I’m SOOO behind you.
Oxy
I have been watching my spath nearly every day from behind the curtain, realizing that my wounds aren’t healing when I do that…..I’m holding myself back from getting stronger.
I completely agree with you that NC is the right thing to do, not only DO NOT ENGAGE but don’t let him rent out space in your head. It’s so important for our own selves.
I’m now reading the book WOMEN WHO LOVE PSYCHOPATHS.
Honestly, I bought it from Amazon when it first came out a few months back and I immediately returned it to Amazon without reading it. The cover turned me off, and then the first few chapters where they go into confusing detail about the DSMV diagnosis, I thought, forget THIS. I read the entire manual last year and still struggle with the relevancy and the concept of the axises.
But this time I plowed through the book WOMEN WHO LOVE PSYCHOPATHS, and I have to say it’s one of the most insightful readings I’ve had so far. Rather than just focusing on the SPATH itself, his book focuses on the interplay between normal women like you and me and the sociopath. What traits do “victims” have in common. Why do the relationships last as long as they do? I’m not a fan of the structure of the book but it’s an illuminating read. I don’t think of myself as a co-dependent any longer.
Superkid
Superkid,
regarding the pearls to swine: There are so many ways to explain this that I’m afraid I’ll go off on a tangent, but I’ll try to stick to the subject.
For me, when I love someone, I feel like I love them because they are so great. I feel like they DESERVE to be loved. Notice I used the word “feel”. That’s because my judgement that they deserve my love was not based on sound logic or reasoning. It was based on my feelings. So, where did these wacko feelings that a conman, drug dealer, scum, DESERVES my love, come from? It came from a con. The spath complimented me and brought me flowers, treated me to nice dinners, asked me to be exclusive with him. I was only 17 when I met him. I had other boyfriends, but none of them laid it on this thick. None of them WANTED and VALUED me like he did (for nefarious purposes).
All of these things, he did in order to “plant a seed” in my heart. A seed of love that was rooted so deep it just HAD TO BE REAL. I never, ever, ever questioned his love for me. Not even through the abuse. And in my twisted mind, if a person loved me as much as he professed to love me, then they DESERVE to be loved. A person who loved me, is obviously, a person who sees my value and worth. So he must have the same qualities as I have, and since I deserve to be loved, then someone who is so much like me also deserves it.
The idea of someone lying for 25 years was beyond my imagination and he knew it.
In the past, I didn’t differentiate what I FELT was real, from what I could clearly see was real, his evil.
I really didn’t know, until very recently, that my heart could betray by being fooled so easily. I didn’t have that insight.
When I told him, “don’t waste your time with people who don’t appreciate you honey, don’t throw your pearls before swine” He must have laughed and laughed inside.
My pearls were my self-esteem and I extended it to him, esteeming him as much as I did myself. Turns out all he wanted was for me not to have any self-esteem, because he can’t have any of his own. He can only ride coat-tails.
Thanks for your comments skylar. I liked the bit about him being reflectionless – spot on.
You are absolutely right, the lies are embarrassing. I got to the point where I was actually doing what he did. I would sit back and ’listen’ to the bullshite he was feeding everyone and think to myself ’that’s not right’ or ’no it wasn’t like that’.
If he had taken your life that would have been his biggest ’pity party’ (so pleased you outed him and that makes you SMART and him DUMB)
outofdenial ”“ you are right. In the long run I think the experience with spath HAS made us all stronger (even if we were weaker at the outset)
This site is brilliant. I have found LF better than any other therapy. It’s a place where we can come if we are high or low, happy or sad.
Ox ”“ I see you have been overdoing it. How’s the back today?
Watch out for Hens ”“ I think he’s on a ’pity party’ to get out of paying duckie dollars maintenanceïŠ
Hens ”“ you know we all love you here ”“ super hugs.(oh shite, I’m love-bombing Hens ”“ think I turned into a spath overnight!!)
eb92044 ”“ It seems to me that the longer we stay NC the stronger we are when they try to contact us, then the easier it is to ignore them.
Thought for today –
“If it is PEACE you want,
seek to change yourself, NOT other people.
It is easier to PROTECT YOURSELF with slippers
than to carpet the whole earth.”