By Ox Drover
One of the themes that seems to run throughout the stories of many of, if not most of, the people who have had experiences with psychopaths is that we have either had repeated episodes of being abused by the same psychopath, even after we saw their dishonesty, or had episodes of being sucked into the webs of multiple psychopaths. Or, we have both of these—multiple episodes with multiple psychopaths.
Most of the people I have known who were formerly victims of psychopaths are not stupid. In fact, some of the smartest, most accomplished people I know are former victims, and have been repeatedly victimized by one psychopath after finding out that this person was dishonest and abusive. Somehow, they kept on going back to the relationship, even after multiple attempts to disengage from the abuser. Why? Why does a person who is smart, accomplished, and otherwise successful in life and business keep repeating the same behavior that allows them to be hurt?
There is an often-used quote, “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.” It seems by this definition that the victims of psychopaths are “insane,” because we keep on trying to have a relationship with someone who is repeatedly abusive. There must be some reason that otherwise smart and successful people keep repeating the behavior that is unsuccessful in its outcome. There must be some common thread among victims and former victims that makes us susceptible to frequently returning to an unsuccessful and painful relationship.
Here’s a little story that may contain what may be a grain of truth that might point us toward the answer to the question of. “Why?”
The Chief and the Snake
Once upon a time there was a very wise and kind Indian chief. One day as the chief was walking through the forest, he came upon a rattlesnake in the path. He stopped and started to go around the snake, not wanting to hurt it, but not wanting to be bitten either.
As the chief started to pass around the snake, the snake spoke to him (not an unusual thing in those days) and said, “Chief, please have mercy on me, my wife and family are on the other side of yonder river, and I can’t swim, and I can’t get to them. Won’t you please pick me up and carry me across the river?”
The chief looked at the snake and laughed a bit and said, “Why, if I tried to pick you up you would bite me and I would die. I am sad that you have a problem but I must not be bitten, or I would die and my own children would starve because there would be no strong man with a bow to hunt brother deer to provide meat to my little ones. Though my heart feels sad for you, no, I must refuse to pick you up.”
The snake then spoke to the chief saying, “But such a brave man as you should not be afraid of such a small snake as I, and I promise from the bottom of my heart that I would never harm you if you were to help me across yon river. I am so afraid that if I am not able to get across, my wife and children will perish. Please help me in my hour of need.”
The chief looked at the snake and his heart was sad because he knew what it was like to have one’s children without food. His heart took pity on the snake, and he agreed to take the snake across the river, if the snake would agree not to bite him.
The chief reached out to pick up the snake and held him high over his head as he waded the swift and cold waters of the river. About half way across the river when the chief was doing his best to protect the snake from the cold waters, the snake reached down and bit him on the neck, sinking his poison fangs deep into the chief’s blood stream.
The chief was surprised and said to the snake, “Brother Snake, why did you bite me, now I will die and you will drown as well. You promised on your honor not to bite me if I would have mercy on you and help you, now we shall both die and our children starve. You promised me.”
The snake replied, “Ah yes, I promised, but you knew what I was when you picked me up,” as they both sank under the swirling cold water of the river.
What we have in common with the chief
What caused the chief to reach out and pick up a snake that he knew was poisonous, that he knew had the power to harm him, and that if he was wrong in making this decision to pick up the snake, and the snake did bite him, that his own children would suffer because of his decision?
Empathy is what the chief had, empathy for the children of the snake. Because the chief loved his own children, he assumed that the snake must also love its children. Just as the chief would do what was best for his children, he empathized that the snake would also do what was best. Since the chief knew that he would never do anything deliberately to cause consequences for his children, he did not see that the snake would deliberately do something that would cause problems for his own offspring.
Thinking that others have the same motivations that we have can get us into the same problems that the chief got into. The chief wanted to help the snake. He felt pity for the snake. He knew that he would not want someone to refuse to help him if it meant that he would die and his children would go hungry, so it never dawned on him that the snake would be willing to make a decision to do a deed that would insure that the snake-children would go hungry.
The chief’s empathy and his thinking that others had the same empathy, the same motivation for their behavior, and no reason to hurt another, even at the cost of hurting themselves or their near and dear, caused him to want to believe the snake’s promise not to bite.
The snake, however, was right. The chief knew what he was when he picked him up. When we allow ourselves to believe the promises of people who have proven that they are dishonest, we open ourselves to be repeatedly injured or even killed. When someone shows you what they are, believe your eyes. Believe what you see, not what you hear.
No Contact
“No contact” is the commonly accepted “treatment” for any abusive relationship. This means that only contact that is required by law (such as meeting that person in a courtroom due to a law uit) or the minimum amount of contact required by law to co-parent with such a person, is the only interaction between you and your former abuser. No contact allows the injuries to cease, and keeps you safe from new and repeated injuries from the abuser.
“No contact” also includes not stalking the person’s Facebook page or other social media. It means blocking or deleting any text messages, phone calls, e-mails or any other form of communication, including having others tell you what the former abuser is “up to.” Refusing to engage in tale carrying, gossip, or drama involved with the former abuser is also essential. If you must speak about the relationship, do it ONLY with a trusted friend or family member who sees that the relationship was/is abusive, and with assurances that the person will keep your information in absolute confidence. This process can be likened to “not renting them space in your head,” which includes wondering if they have a new relationship, and if they are making this new person happy o,r if they will change for this new person, or wondering if you were wrong about what they are.
You know what they are now, so don’t pick them up. NO CONTACT WORKS.
Star,
That’s an interesting turn of events insofar as neighbor boy.
Taking a little responsibility maybe, from the therapists perspective?
I’m not being a smartass, honest, but it gives me a different perspective too.
Off to play with my granddaughter today!
HUGS
LL,
When I looked at it from her perspective, I could see that he did show a lot of signs that he liked me. He would not have called me so much or asked me to be his gym partner if he didn’t like me. He would not have gotten up at 7am to take me to my MD appt the day my car died. He is usually up till 2am every night. I, on the other hand, talked about other guys a lot (to make him jealous) and played really hard to get. I think it just backfired.
She thinks we both gave out mixed signals because we were both insecure and afraid of getting hurt (probably me more than him). I think she is right on the money. So once I build my confidence a little (maybe after my CR trip and a few hypnosis sessions) I’m going to have a talk with the neighbor – the talk I should have had with him before. I will let him know I liked him and ask him why he stopped calling. I will be honest and upfront with him and not play any games. I will tell him that since we slept together, I do feel a connection with him and it is more than friendship – not that I consider him my boyfriend – but just that there is a connection and I “like” him. Then I will ask how he feels/felt about me. I will tell him that at very least I would like us to be able to be friendly and neighborly like we used to be, without all the avoidance drama. I have a feeling he will really appreciate my candor. The few times I expressed my honest feelings to him in the past, it actually brought him closer. Same with the guy in Costa Rica.
If he is dating someone else or otherwise rejects me, I will face it head on, and finally be able to let go of him and move on. I didn’t realize I had so much feeling for him. But the therapist thinks he had some feelings for me too, at least at one time. He and I are such very different people. I don’t see us ever lasting as a couple or having much in common. But we never even tried. The therapist rephrased that in his mind – since is used to women chasing him – that since I didn’t chase him, I didn’t like him. Strange way to look at it but it’s his reality.
But I have to take responsibility for my share in this disaster. I liked him and never told him. I never asked him where I stood. Some men are emotionally clueless and need to be led along like puppy dogs. Especially musicians. They seem unusually wierd. It’s hard to imagine a guy that good looking and magnetic being insecure, but I hear it happens a lot with musicians. Especially since he is now middle-aged.
I don’t remember where I read it but I recently read that for introverts, telling someone how you feel is the greatest peak experience you can have. I have a strong introverted side, and the musician guy is a total introvert, even though he seems to always need to be entertained. I think we were both terrified of getting close and everything that means, especially living next door. But for me I have the added fear of being rejected for my age, my lower socioeconomic status, and also just because. I have terrible fears of rejection. I have had this as far back as I can remember. I used to hide from boys I liked but secretly coveted them from a safe distance. I need to get over this. With most of the guys I’ve dated, they were clearly very interested in me, so the risks were much less. I got involved with some of them by default, just because they were there and paying a lot of attention to me. There was no challenge for me and therefore no risk.
The neighbor is someone I felt really excited about. He seemed to have the whole package – he was intelligent, sexy, creative, successful, unusual, and educated, and really fun to be around. Plus he loves cats and has two of his own. But I figured he was out of my league because of his looks and status in life and also being a rock star. In his own way, he may have thought I was out of his league because I’m just different than the girls he usually dates. I saw one of his previous girlfriends, and she wasn’t anywhere near as attractive or as classy as me.
I went through something similar in college where I obsessed over a guy for 4 years! 4 years! We had a (somewhat) physical relationship in my freshman year. Then we moved apart and would just run into each other occasionally. I couldn’t forget about him and became obsessed. After 4 years (!) of it, I decided to just go over to his house and tell him how I felt. I was so scared I was shaking. I started to turn around and go home at one point. I told him I still had feelings for him and asked him if he had feelings for me. He said yes he did but he would have to “think about it.” At the time, I didn’t know how to express myself, so I just told him that what I wanted was to go to bed with him (we had never gone all the way). Even though he didn’t give me the answer I wanted, I was ELATED afterward. I had taken one of the biggest risks of my life. It didn’t matter what the outcome was. (We never did get together). I was finally able to let him go. Shortly afterward I went to Europe for a year. When I came back, I got my first real boyfriend. I will never forget the high I was on that evening that I had taken my power back and gone for what I wanted.
This guy and the rock star have a lot in common. They are very confident and sexy and I was intimidated by both of them. I keep giving my power to these types when I feel I am not worthy of them. I think once my self-esteem is up to par, I will probably realize I have no interest in their games anyway. But if I don’t take the risk, I will never know.
All of this talk about how I’m not ready for a relationship yada yada is all well and good. But the real “meat” of the situation is that I need to start taking more risks in relationships. Every time I’ve taken a risk, I’ve felt alive, even if it ended badly.
Star,
Wow. That’s very introspective and somewhat insightful about yourself, as well as neighbor boy.
I guess the real test as to whether all of this is what you may think or believe, or what the perspective was from the therapist is to talk to the man about what happened, honestly like you shared here. I think you’ll know, Star, at that point, what’s going on, what went on.
My whole life has been about men. I guess I can’t offer much other than just learning and observing from your insights, because for the first time in my life, I’m not with a man, nor do I even care to have one. I just got the most relational bitch slap I ever could have had. I’m pretty untrusting and not ready to take any risks. Maybe someday, but that desire to find the man of my dreams is all but over. If it happens, great, if not, great.
I admire that you continue to try Star. That takes a lot of guts.
Something that I do not have.
LL
Star,
that fear of rejection and the feeling of being alive, when you open yourself to risk in relationships tells me that you have invested your self-worth in what others – especially men – think about you.
Psychopaths look for this kind of thinking when they start to love bomb us. The complements are meant to assist us in investing our self-worth with them, because we think there is a payoff : increased self-worth.
Self-worth is an interesting choice of words because we all know that Bernie Madoff lured his victims with the promise of increased “self-worth” of the monetary kind. Cons all work exactly the same.
But when you’ve invested you’re self-worth with Bernie or anybody else, that’s when you gave them power over your self-worth. Now your opinion of yourself is based on what they tell you. Now they have the power to devalue you. (just like our government devalued the currency once they got us to accept it in place of the gold standard in 1933. And they continue to manipulate it to this day.) And you know psychpaths will one day tell you, “Nobody will ever love you” (as mine did).
Accepting compliments gracefully is okay, but I don’t ever accept compliments as fact. If someone says I’m gorgeous, that’s just their opinion. It reflects on them, not on me. Same thing if they say I’m ugly – that’s their opinion.
All of us are programmed to want to be valued by others. I’m not placing myself above that – that would be hypocritical because I spend a loooong time doing my hair and makeup each day! But at the same time, I work hard at acknowledging how much of this really matters and why I’m doing it, and what I expect to gain. We’re not getting any younger.
You will meet men with charisma for the rest of your life, Star. You are giving them your power when you even PONDER the question, “am I worthy of them?” That’s the wrong question, the right one is, “are they worthy of me?”
What does it take for someone to be worthy of me? Charisma?
Here is where you’ve been had by the charismatic leaders who have switched currencies on you. They have given you an cheap currency, inflated by their egos and manipulated to impress you.
Maybe Jesus said it best when he was asked if they should pay taxes to Cesar. Who’s picture is on the currency? Cesar’s. Then give to Cesar what belongs to Cesar and give to God what belongs to God. Find your gold standard, Star, stop trading in a currency that others can manipulate. You start down the slippery slope when you first accept their currency in the form of compliments and love bombing.
Sky,
That was an incredibly powerful post.
LL
Dear LL,
You are wrong! You have more guts than anyone! Look at all the “stuff” you’ve gone through and continue to go through, and you NEVER give up!
I like reading your posts because they are so honest and raw. I learn from you LL.
Ana,
Thank you, that’s very kind of you. I’m humbled.
LL
Reading above posts is enlightening. Love bombing, and flattery, and admiration, and compliments did get me off center precisely because my sense of self is shaky and it felt good to have it “confirmed” by someone else. Dangerous.
DW,
I don’t think there is anything wrong with compliments or even admiration for someone. I think the problem is that with the psychopath, it’s delivered very disingenuously and in rapid fire succession. Just doesn’t “feel” accurate.
I personally like to give others compliments and show admiration if it’s there. I like to uplift others. Underscore things that are genuinely good about others. But I wouldn’t do it if I didn’t feel that way, and moreover, if it weren’t true, nor with someone I knew I didn’t much care for.
I think caring about others and letting them know what you feel is good about them, is a positive thing. Not just for them, but I feel good too. Kindness. I like it.
LL