By Ox Drover
One of the themes that seems to run throughout the stories of many of, if not most of, the people who have had experiences with psychopaths is that we have either had repeated episodes of being abused by the same psychopath, even after we saw their dishonesty, or had episodes of being sucked into the webs of multiple psychopaths. Or, we have both of these—multiple episodes with multiple psychopaths.
Most of the people I have known who were formerly victims of psychopaths are not stupid. In fact, some of the smartest, most accomplished people I know are former victims, and have been repeatedly victimized by one psychopath after finding out that this person was dishonest and abusive. Somehow, they kept on going back to the relationship, even after multiple attempts to disengage from the abuser. Why? Why does a person who is smart, accomplished, and otherwise successful in life and business keep repeating the same behavior that allows them to be hurt?
There is an often-used quote, “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.” It seems by this definition that the victims of psychopaths are “insane,” because we keep on trying to have a relationship with someone who is repeatedly abusive. There must be some reason that otherwise smart and successful people keep repeating the behavior that is unsuccessful in its outcome. There must be some common thread among victims and former victims that makes us susceptible to frequently returning to an unsuccessful and painful relationship.
Here’s a little story that may contain what may be a grain of truth that might point us toward the answer to the question of. “Why?”
The Chief and the Snake
Once upon a time there was a very wise and kind Indian chief. One day as the chief was walking through the forest, he came upon a rattlesnake in the path. He stopped and started to go around the snake, not wanting to hurt it, but not wanting to be bitten either.
As the chief started to pass around the snake, the snake spoke to him (not an unusual thing in those days) and said, “Chief, please have mercy on me, my wife and family are on the other side of yonder river, and I can’t swim, and I can’t get to them. Won’t you please pick me up and carry me across the river?”
The chief looked at the snake and laughed a bit and said, “Why, if I tried to pick you up you would bite me and I would die. I am sad that you have a problem but I must not be bitten, or I would die and my own children would starve because there would be no strong man with a bow to hunt brother deer to provide meat to my little ones. Though my heart feels sad for you, no, I must refuse to pick you up.”
The snake then spoke to the chief saying, “But such a brave man as you should not be afraid of such a small snake as I, and I promise from the bottom of my heart that I would never harm you if you were to help me across yon river. I am so afraid that if I am not able to get across, my wife and children will perish. Please help me in my hour of need.”
The chief looked at the snake and his heart was sad because he knew what it was like to have one’s children without food. His heart took pity on the snake, and he agreed to take the snake across the river, if the snake would agree not to bite him.
The chief reached out to pick up the snake and held him high over his head as he waded the swift and cold waters of the river. About half way across the river when the chief was doing his best to protect the snake from the cold waters, the snake reached down and bit him on the neck, sinking his poison fangs deep into the chief’s blood stream.
The chief was surprised and said to the snake, “Brother Snake, why did you bite me, now I will die and you will drown as well. You promised on your honor not to bite me if I would have mercy on you and help you, now we shall both die and our children starve. You promised me.”
The snake replied, “Ah yes, I promised, but you knew what I was when you picked me up,” as they both sank under the swirling cold water of the river.
What we have in common with the chief
What caused the chief to reach out and pick up a snake that he knew was poisonous, that he knew had the power to harm him, and that if he was wrong in making this decision to pick up the snake, and the snake did bite him, that his own children would suffer because of his decision?
Empathy is what the chief had, empathy for the children of the snake. Because the chief loved his own children, he assumed that the snake must also love its children. Just as the chief would do what was best for his children, he empathized that the snake would also do what was best. Since the chief knew that he would never do anything deliberately to cause consequences for his children, he did not see that the snake would deliberately do something that would cause problems for his own offspring.
Thinking that others have the same motivations that we have can get us into the same problems that the chief got into. The chief wanted to help the snake. He felt pity for the snake. He knew that he would not want someone to refuse to help him if it meant that he would die and his children would go hungry, so it never dawned on him that the snake would be willing to make a decision to do a deed that would insure that the snake-children would go hungry.
The chief’s empathy and his thinking that others had the same empathy, the same motivation for their behavior, and no reason to hurt another, even at the cost of hurting themselves or their near and dear, caused him to want to believe the snake’s promise not to bite.
The snake, however, was right. The chief knew what he was when he picked him up. When we allow ourselves to believe the promises of people who have proven that they are dishonest, we open ourselves to be repeatedly injured or even killed. When someone shows you what they are, believe your eyes. Believe what you see, not what you hear.
No Contact
“No contact” is the commonly accepted “treatment” for any abusive relationship. This means that only contact that is required by law (such as meeting that person in a courtroom due to a law uit) or the minimum amount of contact required by law to co-parent with such a person, is the only interaction between you and your former abuser. No contact allows the injuries to cease, and keeps you safe from new and repeated injuries from the abuser.
“No contact” also includes not stalking the person’s Facebook page or other social media. It means blocking or deleting any text messages, phone calls, e-mails or any other form of communication, including having others tell you what the former abuser is “up to.” Refusing to engage in tale carrying, gossip, or drama involved with the former abuser is also essential. If you must speak about the relationship, do it ONLY with a trusted friend or family member who sees that the relationship was/is abusive, and with assurances that the person will keep your information in absolute confidence. This process can be likened to “not renting them space in your head,” which includes wondering if they have a new relationship, and if they are making this new person happy o,r if they will change for this new person, or wondering if you were wrong about what they are.
You know what they are now, so don’t pick them up. NO CONTACT WORKS.
Hi LL,
Yes exactly. In my mind I was thinking about the I-love-you’s I got from x-bf who didn’t even know me. And i’d say to him but you don’t even know me, and his answer was, “I know all I need to know. I know your character.” Translation–I see your niceness/empathy/great well of supply that I can suck dry.
When I watched the cartoon videos–so freaky, so freaky that a human being can be so twisted, and others be prey to them. Makes me really sad because I embraced them-TWICE.
DW,
I’m so sorry you are sad. It was quick this time, though. You got the lesson really fast. Be proud of yourself. You are improving.
We need to learn about ourselves in order to get past the attraction to the spaths. They exhibit so many infantile characteristics: charm, pity and playfulness. Who wouldn’t be attracted? But maybe we need to start intellectually seeing these “cute” qualities as red flags. When we find ourselves attracted, we need to analyze it.
Sky,
I actually expressed two different processes. The feelings of being unworthy are something I need to address, independent of my relationships. I think this may be what you are referring to as being unhealthy to bring into a relationship. You are so right about that. However, taking healthy risks in relationships is a very empowering thing. Even the most together successful people have fears of failure and rejection. The difference is they feel the fear and do it anyway. The point of my last story is how empowered I felt when I took responsibility for what I wanted and reached out for it. When I got rejected, I was able to move on, instead of staying in a state of obsession. I am proud of myself for doing that.
When I was 41, I went to an audition for a lead singer of a rock band. I had never had a voice lesson or performed in public. I could only strum chords on a guitar to accompany my voice but not much more. I risked rejection bigtime at this audition. When the band came in and backed up my voice on a Cheryl Crow song, it was one of the peak experiences of my life. I was so glad I took the risk. They hired me for their band, and I performed with them for 6 months. During that time, I went to another audition for an even better band. Though I did not get the gig, it was still an amazing experience. I think it is absolutely essential to take some risks in order to feel alive.
Now chasing after unavailable men is a whole different issue. But I really can’t know they are unavailable if I myself am pushing them away – it doesn’t even give them a chance. I think it’s taking the easy way out when you feel rejected by someone to just call them a jerk. It’s harder, but far more rewarding, to just look and see what actually happened without assigning labels.
As far as liking confident and exciting men, I won’t apologize for the type of men I like. I don’t think a man’s being confident, creative, and fun is any kind of a red flag in itself. After all, I’m like that in a lot of ways, too. The sociopath was not very exciting at all – he was like the “boy next door”. The guy in Costa Rica was also just a boring, regular guy. Let’s not type-cast me as chasing after sociopaths just because I dated one for 2-1/2 months in 2008.
Hi Skylar,
Yep, quick. Odd to see that happen, like a mini mirror image of my marriage in a way. stbx H and x-bf totally different individuals, but with same underlying narcissism and exploitive intent, and the insincerity and shallow emotion.
Thank goodness it was only 3 months and I escaped unscathed, really.
Posted a song link in the cartoon post with a question to you re. sending the song to xbf, and answered my own question. It’s like scratching the wound to send him anything. The song expresses things for me.
Aw Star, I didn’t mean to typecast you. You are the least likely to get caught up in a socio web since you aren’t really good supply: You fall for the charm but not the pity ploy or rage.
I’m really good supply and very vulnerable to the pity ploy as well as the charm. But it’s not because I have low self-esteem, it’s because I was progammed to not need anything. It’s almost like having too high-self-esteem. My parents told me that I should take care of everyone else because I could and they couldn’t.
Everyone’s got the programming that they have to decipher and we do it by looking at our own actions and then listening to the way we justify why we do what we do. Remembering my familly history made it that much easier to figure out.
The only reason I even mention psychopaths in your case is because they are everywhere. I know most people are not as liberal with the label as I am, but it boils down to maturity. If someone is immature, they will behave in the ways that the P’s behave. Well, truth is, you can look around and see immature and irresponsible people everywhere. And we don’t have a problem labeling them as such. So I expect them to be selfish and self-centered just like P’s. It would be a nice surprise when they don’t. I’m still waiting.
Sky,
I understand what you are saying. I think some of my neighbor’s behaviors are immature in some ways, but in other ways, he’s just an introverted guy. His relationship history is much more stable than mine has been. I don’t feel at this point that it is my place to give him any kind of a label until I have my own head together. He is a really different type of person from me and he is used to a different type of woman. But I don’t think he is unavailable for a relationship; he just needs a very confident woman who will pursue him somewhat. Ultimately, he may not be the right type of person for me just because we are so different. But the process I was referring to was my own process of being intrigued and interested in someone, and instead of just being straightforward, I play games and push them away. I expect them to pursue me because this is how I think men should behave. Some men are not like this. With him, I would have to pursue a little, and it is terrifying to me. I’m not used to doing this. However, I know a few musicians who got together with their future wives because the women took the lead and pursued them – one from across the country! I don’t have that kind of confidence – it’s what I’m working on. Life is for the living, and I think when we identify what we want, we may as well go for it.
The relationship (or lack thereof) with him is a moot point with me anyway. I’m not ready to put myself out there with him. I have a lot of work to do on myself. I am still in pain and not quite happy with myself. Only time will tell if it will ever feel appropriate to reconnect with neighbor boy. Maybe when I feel better, I will have no more interest. Or when I meet someone else or go to Costa Rica, I will forget about him like I did before. At very least, I hope to be able to say hello to him without feeling triggered, and I think I can do this finally, because I have a different understanding of what happened.
Sky,
You say you are still vulnerable to a sociopath because you fall for the pity play and the charm. But now that you recognize the pattern, (pathological lying and pity play the two most prominent characteristics), don’t you think you can change it? I completely understand when you have been many years with a spath that you would be suspicious of men who are charming or fun. It goes without saying that you would be mistrustful and make a man really earn your trust. Who could blame you? But IMO there is nothing wrong with a man being charming or complimenting a woman. It’s called chivalry. Men SHOULD learn how to pay a compliment to a woman. If a man takes you out to dinner and tells you you look beautiful, he has not asked for anything from you. He has not asked for your money or for you to move in with him. Now if he told you he wanted to marry you on the first date, that is a red flag. But there are many needy guys who are like this who are NOT NECESSARILY SOCIOPATHS. A lot of men out of divorces are looking for relationships on the rebound. I have dated MANY types of men. The one thing that stands out the most with the sociopath is the pathological lying and bizarre inconsistent behaviors. None of the other guys did this stuff.
I’ve dated a lot of very charming men over the years. None (except for the one sociopath in 2008) were sociopaths. But it’s funny charm should come into it because my neighbor is neither charming nor smooth with women. I had to teach him that he SHOULD tell a women she looks nice when she gets dressed up for a date.
Star,
I do agree with you to some extent because you’re talking about men who are charming and fun. Hopefully, as we get to know someone we ARE?
I think it’s a combination of factors involved that say spath city. I can tell a guy who is manipulating and love bombing me, versus one who is being himself as charming. Totally different. I also wouldn’t jump from a nice dinner out, to a man’s bed the same night, let alone the next several months. one thing I’ve learned: Don’t need a man. If I don’t need one and one is interested, it’s not going to kill him to wait and let us get to know each other. That IS the risk as far as I’m concerned. Chances are even Mr. “charming” might not stick around if I’m not jumping into bed with him with in the first few weeks or months even. That’s fine by me! After all I’ve been through, I guess I can’t say I’d be afraid to try again SOMEDAY, BUT, I’ll not forget what happened before. I’m not strong enough to risk getting my heart broken for a great night or two…uh or three or four, of sex.
I know myself well enough that I attach too easily when sex is involved. I’ll pass.
I know there are people out there who can do the whole FWB stuff and have a wild brief time of a relationship, walk away and feel nothing about it…but that is concerning to me too….
Dunno. Just some thoughts. This is a great discussion. Has me thinking about where I stand with myself now and the possibility that all these years i thought a man was what would make me happy.
Holy shit. That just may not be true at all for me now.
Wow. Progress.
LL
Star, I know what you meant, when you said, “now that you know the pattern, don’t you think you can change it?” You mean change MY behavior. But there could be a double entrendre in that question. Maybe, because of my God/Christ/Martyr complex, I think I can change THEM!
sick sick puke.
It’s always interesting what comes out of my fingers as I type. I don’t even know what I’m thinking until I type it. In this case, I meant to tell you that I’ve been trying to change me, but the programming is stuck from age 3 at least. I even went to hypnosis for it.
When I read your sentence, it occurred to me that I try to change them instead of me. And you know, you can’t change a spath. Again it’s my God complex taking over again. It makes me want to “fix” things. Makes me think I can. It’s pure narcissism poured into me by my programmers.
I want to change ME, but I’ve been programmed to try to help them instead. These emotional limps are going to take a while to reverse.
As far as the sex goes. It isn’t really an attachment point for me since I dated pedophiles as a teenager and they didn’t attach to me. The same with the charm and complements, I’ve heard it all. Nope, it’s the pity that really gets me. Give me a crybaby any day of the week so I can go rescue it.
It’s been almost 2 years since the spath broke up with me and I threw out the bedspread that I had when we were together-TODAY! It went in the dumpster. I hadn’t had it on the bed since about a year after we broke up and his cats had made holes in it. I used it as a sofa blanket. I covered up with it if I was laying on the couch watching TV.
I have a huge crush on someone now who is totally normal and not spath and I just threw it out. I hope that this relationship actually develops. It’s only friends right now.