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Pruning the dead wood from the trees of our lives

By Joyce Alexander, RNP (Retired)

I live in the woods, and what passes for a “yard” (I can’t possibly call it a “lawn” with so little grass!) is pretty much in deep shade most of the summer due to the tall trees. Because of the deeply wooded environment, I’ve had to make a choice to have either trees or grass, but not both. I chose the trees.

Many of the trees are different varieties of oak, some of which tend to shed the lower limbs as they grow taller and the lower limbs receive less sunlight. This self pruning of the trees benefits them by taking the limited resources of nutrients from the ground and moisture from the rains, and using it to grow taller and wider at the top where it receives the most sunlight, rather than maintaining those lower limbs that are not as productive because they don’t get as much light.

In keeping other trees in the yard that don’t “self prune” healthy, I do this pruning for them with a saw. I trim the lower limbs off so that the resources of the tree will go into making it grow taller and straighter. I also trim off any limbs that are broken in storms, so that the amputation will be smooth and not collect rain water or rot and kill the tree.

There is a lesson to be learned, I think, in the analogies of pruning the dead wood of our relationships, so that the healthy parts of our lives can grow taller and straighter. The unhealthy relationships, both major ones and minor ones, use more resources than they contribute to the overall health of our lives, and will deplete the resources available to us to live good lives. They suck the resources we have and give little or nothing in return. The resources we do have are wasted in trying to maintain these sick “limbs.”

Sometimes unhealthy relationships will fall out of our lives of their own accord, just like the self pruning Jack oak trees drop limbs, without any effort on our parts to remove them. Some unhealthy relationships just seem to depart, and drop out of our lives.

Other unhealthy or broken relationships sort of hang on in our lives, like a hanging limb that we call a “widow maker,” because even though it is dead and detached from the tree, it hangs there precariously in the top of the tree ready to fall on someone walking underneath it without any warning. These unhealthy and essentially dead relationships become dangers to our lives, as well as to the lives of those around us.

There are many things that can damage a limb, or even an entire tree, making it necessary to remove all or part of the tree. Lightning strikes have actually taken out five trees over the past few years. The entire trees, though they struggled to remain alive, finally succumbed to the injury and the insects and mold which took root and finished them off. We had to remove them. Sometimes losing these trees seems like I’ve lost an old friend, and their shading of my home in the summer time is greatly missed when they are gone. In their places I have planted new trees, which I have fertilized and watered and pruned to help them grow tall and straight. The relationships that are “lightening struck,” through no fault of their own, are still not healthy ones and no matter what I try to do to heal them, there is little chance that they can recover. Their departure though, leaves a space in the sun for new growth to flourish.

Not every tree, and not every relationship, makes it for the duration of our lives. Some shed parts of themselves, and some die of an injury or of their own accord, or change in some way so that it is not possible to continue to have them in our lives. Sometimes trees reach their natural age span and they, like old friends, depart this mortal plane. Sometimes a tree, just by the position in which it grows, will lean too close to the house. It becomes a danger that during a storm it might fall on the house and crush it, so it must be taken out before that potential danger becomes a reality.

Relationships in our lives, just like the living trees in my yard, are constantly changing. The only thing in this world that is a true constant is change. In order to keep our mutual space healthy, the trees and I must work together. During the dry years, I water them, and they shade my home from the beating heat of the summer. During the cold blustery winters, some of the cedars shield my house from the winds that seem to be directly from the North Pole. They also provide berries for the cardinals that winter in my yard, giving a splash of bright red to an otherwise dreary day. Since cedars require a very acid soil, I don’t try to make grass grow under their roots by spreading lime, because if I did, the cedars would sicken and die. I trim them gently in the fall so that their branches will not be overcome with a wet snow or ice and broken off during the winter leaving them injured and sick.

I moved into the clearing here in September of 1994. During that time here, there have been both major and minor changes to both the trees in my “hole in the woods,” and in the relationships in my life as well. I’ve pruned the trees, removed some entirely, some have died, and I’ve planted new ones, and all of them that are here now have grown. I’ve also pruned some of the relationships, removed some entirely, some have died, and I’ve formed new ones, and the ones that are still here have grown and matured and become stronger.

I have fed and watered, nurtured and defended the ones that were healthy and not poisoned them by trying to make their environment into something that they can’t survive. I haven’t tried to make this “hole in the woods” into something it isn’t. I don’t try to make it like a suburban sodded lawn, with manicured grass and topiary trees. If I wanted that, I would move to town.

I accept my relationships and myself for what we are, enjoying healthy relationships with the people who make my life a better thing and trimming out the dead wood and the “widow makers” from both the trees and the dead wood of unhealthy relationships. This makes for a much safer, healthier and more peaceful life in my little “hole in the woods,” where the fauna and flora and people can have a peaceful environment in which to thrive.


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136 Comments on "Pruning the dead wood from the trees of our lives"

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wonderful analogy with the trees Walking in the woods is my delight
I had not seen my relationship in that way before, that it is a dead branch hanging The trouble is it is (or it was) a fine magestic branch so it is hard to lop it off. But it is better to get rid of it before it kills the tree

You can try to splint or repair a injured branch but it will forever be damaged and will never be the same again. So with relationships once the hurt and distrust is there you can try to splint it back together but it is forever wounded Sometimes you can tryto regenerate a damaged relationship but it will never again have the same innocent delight and joy, and the weakness will remain to fail sooner or later. It is not worth wasting your life on the damaged branch (you will only damage yourself in the process) Cut out the deadwood and look for a new love and then take better care of it from the start.

It succinctly summarises the discussion thread in the posts on ‘it was all about him..’

Dear Lovelost,

I agree with you, there isn’t a way to “splint” a limb that is “trust” fractured, and no matter how “seeming majestic” it appeared to have been, without trust it is going to become a “widow maker” in spite of everything you can do.

By pruning out the unhealthy and broken limbs in our relationships we allow room and resources for NEW AND HEALTHY GROWTH in our lives.

Well said Oxy!

I think (for me at least), one of my greatest struggles in my relationship with a sociopath was that I kept trying to “frame” the relationship and the issues based on ordinary people. With normal ordinary people it is possible to work through issues and have a real relationship. What I learned from my experience is that it is impossible to have a real loving reciprocal relationship with a sociopath because there is not even a basic foundation of truth and trust. There is no real affection or love or trust or empathy or remorse, the sociopath cares no more for you than his favorite t-shirt or coffee cup, and they are quite capable of doing you tremendous harm for no particular reason at all. The truth is painful and hard to accept especially when they stand there and say how much they love you, while they are cheating behind your back. Now I have more than one frame for relationships with people because when your dealing with a sociopath it is not a one frame fits all situation!

Oxy ~ Very good article. Everytime I try to trim my tree I get poison ivy. Another 7 years and I can take the chain saw to the whole dang tree. Yea

Thank you Hosanna, and MiLo, Yea I know you are counting the days! LOL Then you can not only cut down the tree, you can dynamite the STUMP!!!! KA BOOM!!!!

It’s amazing how toxic these sociopaths really are… Mine, I think, has an actual “event horizon” where once passed, everything starts to crumble, decay and cease to exist.

Literally, the day after I accepted the paperwork from the spath, I got sick with a stomach flu and (seeing as this is the 10th time I’ve been sick in the last 6 months from cold/flu) I’m having to step down from my position at work (I have a physically demanding job, and work with the public). Coincidence, maybe. Maybe not, though.

I had to cut out the spath, because he was ruining everything. Nothing worked right, everything was falling apart. He was like a big, thick toxic rain cloud that hung over my life. It wasn’t until I got away that I actually felt “normal” again and my finances, my stability, home, family started to repair itself.

Nothing thrives in the environment of a spath. They pollute every relationship, every home, every job, etc.

When I saw the title of this article, I knew it was an Oxy article. 🙂 I love this analogy. Like trees, relationships are organic and always changing. I think trouble comes when we try to keep them static because of fear of change. We hold onto those dead branches that really need to fall off. There are so many reasons why I’ve stayed in relationships that had passed their time. I was insecure and emotionally bonded and also I became financially dependent on many of them. Un unhealthy bond was better for me at the time than no bond at all. So I preferred to splint the dying branches rather than just let them fall off as they naturally would. I thought constant drama in a relationship was normal because this is what I’d grown up with. It was what I was used to. But I eventually did move on. Then, I burned the dead branches in the fireplace, reflecting and learning the great lessons they had to teach me, extracting that last bit of usefulness they had in the fire of transformation. Every one was a necessary part of the path for me.

Thanks for a great article, Oxy. One of these days, I will try my hand at writing an article for LF.

Purewater, I think the STRESS that these sick relationships have causes our body to become sick because the stress hormones adversely effect our immune system and keeps it from being able to adequately fight off bacterial invaders.

Star, yea, that’s me, the queen of the analogies! I wish I’d thought about gathering the branches and burning them as part of the article, that’s a great one! Thanks for the suggestion. We do gather them and burn them, but not in a fireplace. I found that the smoke of the wood fire, especially from oak, gives me bronchitis (so at my living history events I have to avoid direct smoke from the camp fires, so I do a lot of dancing around the fires) LOL

Oxy, if you lived near the beach, you could have a big bonfire and roast marshmallows on it!

We have had a few weeks of big wind storms. It was interesting and I was curious about my response to it. I’ve been in this area for 23 years……and I love the environment. I live in the mountains, on a lake, we have decent winters (compared to other places in the country) and our summers are simply gorgeous! We experience the 4 seasons and each one offers something unique in itself.
So……last week with 130 MPH winds…..and the lake being so high due to the snowmelt we’ve received the past few years…..things changed.
The high winds caused damage to the lakefront properties…..it was the perfect storm. High water level with North east winds…….
The docks took a beating! Ripped apart, tore lights off and metal along with the planks. The dead trees on the shoreline also took a beating.

So…..what washed up on the beach was beautiful driftwood. Beach like driftwood. Planks that were unidentifiable as planks…..splintered and rounded from floating and hitting rocks….stumps that were carefully groomed by nature, branches that are sanded down by mother nature.
The jr’s and I went along and picked up the wood around our place, to do our part. I had planned on trashing it……We didn’t want it to wash back on the lake, because this causes a hazard in the summer boating season……..OUCH!
I had a client who had a stack of it on her porch, drying out. She made mention of what wonderful firewood it makes.
Hmmmmmm……never occured to me to burn it.

The point is…….when something is dead in our lives….something which could possibly be a hazard in future days……still has some worth, but from a different perspective. There is value in it if we see it clearly.
This hazardous drift wood will keep us warm this winter. We can look at it as it burns in our fireplace (dried first)….and remeber the fun times on the beach collecting it….the fun nights we spent looking out at the lake watching the waves pound and the wood wash up….and allow the fun times roasting marshmallows on it as we are warmed up this holiday season.

Thanks to the wind storms and my willingness to hear my client………we will make good from what seemed like bad.
On so many levels.
This…..is life!

Oh, and Oxy….send your dead limbs over yonder…..I’ll burn em for ya! XXOO

Beautiful imagery, EB.
Thanks for those thoughts.

Beautiful post EB! This is life!

EB – Nice post, but don’t burn that drift wood.. Keep the beautiful pieces for yourself, hang them on the wall, put them in your flower beds, or take them to farmer’s market and sell them, people love interesting, beautiful weathered driftwood. Seriously darlin.. I have done it, people make extra money selling natures treasures – wish you could see my Gazebo I am working on, the post are weathered out and sunbleached telephone poles, framed in time worn sunbleached driftboards, the side’s are weaved with interesting pieces of driftwood with grapevine wrapped in and out…

Oh Hens……in my old house I had tons of driftwood in the yard, cool tumbled roots. I made a handrail for my stairwell out of a cool branch that was sitting in a stream for years. All I did was rub it down with some bees’wax and shabang, smooth as silk…..it was the coolest thing. I did bring that with me to this place….but I haven’t put it up yet.
I just have no room. No wall space…..and the association is hounding me about my ‘garden’.
I do have a cool redwood burl out there….that I dragged off the beach years ago in Mendocino. It was huge and waterlogged…..but I was determined to have it! I gorilla glued a piece of slate on it and it was Jr’s nightstand for years. I found some seaweed and wrapped the burl in it and dragged it forever to my car. Don’t know HOW I got it in my car……sheer will! 🙂

I made Jr a bed out of Mt. driftwood…..was the coolest thing ever. I did a valance over the window out of the little pieces glued to a board. I sold that when I moved. No room here for such a big-hearty bed. I did move the valance here and have it in my office.

If I had a garage…..I’d keep some of the wood……and sell it or make something cool out of it. But I don’t have anyplace to store it for now.
One of the peices was a cool branch that was rounded….it woulda made a really cool shower curtan rod. Jr looked at me when I made the suggestion and said….MOM-STOP!
I laughed.
I am all about the repurposing of things from nature….I love it!

Your gazebo sounds delightful…..I can only imagine.

Oxy,

I always love your illustrations of life’s problems and hard lessons that so many of us at LoveFraud have learned the hard way.

Your illustrations drive it home so nicely.

Glad I stopped by this evening…

Aloha

P.S. I have definately trimmed the dead wood out of my life. :O)

Aloha, darling Praise is always High dollar when it comes from you! Thank you so much! Doesn’t take much to get an idea for an article, all I have to do is look out the window and see the several trees that desperately need taking out (lightening strikes) and a couple of widow makers hanging over where we park—well where we DID park until the widow makers got ready to fall.

I know you’re busy with school and your job but wish you’d do us another article! Or let us read some of the papers you have to write for your classes! ((((hint-hint))))

Oxy,

I wouldn’t torture you with my papers. They are torture to me! I might write an article when I graduate. It will be a good time to look back at all this.

I have been working with a client that I know is on the spectrum somewhere. I can’t quite decide but my time at LF and with the BM helps me see it. We don’t want to give up on kids but at the same time, I was getting annoyed with dancing around the topic at the consultation tables. Ya know what I mean?

She lies even when she knows the person she is lieing to knows the truth for sure. For example, I started a baby blanked project with her a few years ago. She sewed two rows of squares together and it was very hard to get her to do that. So, I finished it recently. I brought it to work because she wanted to see how it turned out. Then she announced, “I MADE THAT!” I would say that is a bit of an overstatement.

She also tells anyone who will listen “Eminem is my Uncle” and “my parents had 12 kids” (4 is the real number).

But the lies are not really the problem. The total lack of empathy for anyone and the total lack real connection to anyone or the desire TO connect with anyone… and the stealing.

On September 11th, the kids wanted to watch stuff about 9/11 because they were little when it happened and they don’t remember. This little girl, after 60 seconds, says, “I’ don’t see what the big deal is. I’m over it.”

Anyway… about that paper. I better get to it. This is the last installment of the semester and as soon as I am done, I am FREE for 6 weeks!!!!

Aloha……… :O)

Dear Aloha,

You know, the thing is the “politically correct” therapist has to subscribe to the “party line” that “these KIDS can be helped and we just have to find a way to do it.” In truth, there are some, my son was one of them, that by the time he hit puberty there was NO saving him from himself, from the lies or the desire to control.

The literal WASTE of time, effort and resources on these kids is to me a big waste.;…and if you were to say that, the “party liners” would say “well how else could you tell WHICH kid among the large number CAN be saved if you don’t try equally hard on them all?”

Also, I will say that judging which kid has empathy and which one doesn’t is a SUBJECTIVE judgment. Then, if it were determined some way objectively that the child was hopeless, WHAT do you do with them?

It is sort of a catch 22 situation AT BEST I think, but I know what you mean about seeing that the girl is personality disordered and knowing within yourself that there isn’t much hope for her to develop empathy, to quit lying etc.

Looking back at some of the children I worked with in inpatient settings, that had such GLEE at doing things to hurt others, or set fires, or any number of other kinds of “bad behavior” I too was so frustrated at working with them, and frankly my empathy centered more on their parents’ plight. Working with inpatient kids (starting a few months after my son Patrick was arrested for murder) actually was THERAPY for me! Because I realized that(A) I wasn’t the only parent with a child like this and (B) there were kids who had done WORSE things than murder. Even with this “therapy” and these realizations though, it took me a long time to finally cut the EMOTIONAL umbilical cord and free myself from being TIED to him emotionally.

I admire you so much, Aloha, for using your experiences with the bad man for helping those that CAN be helped. God bless and enjoy your six weeks of freedom! (((hugs))) AND God bless!

Hi All,

Oxy and Aloha..I don’t know exactly what Aloha is doing (working with at risk youth?) but I have been thinking aLOT lately about my own childhood journey, and bad behavior, and how grateful I am that I wasn’t given up on, as hopeless and unsalvageable. That a few someones stuck with me and assisted me in changing.

I recently have been triggered by a 30yr old woman who cheated on her lovely husband. I did this same thing to my first husband, who I was briefly married to. And watching this woman hurt her husband has brought up my remorse over the horrible treatment of my first husband. I have been remorseful for years about my callous treatment of him. And now I find myself going NC with this woman, and feeling conflicted about being so judgemental, when I was in a very similar and self-centered place myself as a young woman (this was twenty years ago). I am so angry with her. And I feel like a bit of a hypocrit. But I am staying NC because I don’t feel I am the right person to help her, and I am friends with her husband and very supportive of him.

It has also brought up lots of thoughts about how selfish non-disordered people can be if they don’t have the tools to understand themselves, and haven’t developed a defined sense what their values are. How cowardly and confused we can become given the right mix of life experiences, and yet still be capable of real change and redemption.

I was raised by a narcissistic mother, who doesn’t have a nurturing bone in her body. Her family were all alcoholics and drug addicts. I had four different dads before the age of 9. I abused by one of them. My grandfather was a peodophile. I acted out from the time I was in my teens and well into my twenties to get back at her and the rest, and from the sheer confusion of not having any idea who I really was.

This included compulsive lying, total irresponsibility, stealing, detachment from the consequences of my behavior, and being insensitive to others’ needs. Interspersed with dependency on multiple disordered people, promiscuity, manipulativeness. It also included profound feelings of self-loathing, depression, loneliness and shame.

If I use the criteria for being disordered, I would say I was moderately classifiable. I hurt many people. It was difficult for people to ‘get through to me’.

I never enjoyed hurting people. I never went out of my way to scheme or destroy. I derived no pleasure from my fucked-up-ness. But I also felt I had no control over myself. When I looked inside all I saw was a big fat ZERO.

I also stayed in therapy for nearly 20 years. And I was/am SO grateful that my therapist saw something in me that could be worked with, and saved. That with some reparenting, challenge, behavior modification, love, and consistency I could become a more whole person.

I came to understand that I vacillated between mimicking my mother’s narcissism and re-enacting my own ‘trauma’ of being parented by her (and sexually abused) as a way of trying to cope with my lack of life-skills and to try and heal my relationship with her.

However, this was a VERY long journey, and I was intermittently involved with more and more highly disordered persons, until I ‘got it’. It was a journey of defining what was NOT mine. For years I think I acted out my mother’s and grandfather’s projected and disowned ‘badness’. And I was the one who suffered most from it. But I did finally get who and what they are. Got that I am NOT disordered. That I was capable to changing and growing and becoming a person of integrity and caring. Not a door mat, not a selfish woman. Someone with emotional and psychological equilibrium.

So, though I recognize the difficulty in identifying who is salvageable, and who is doomed to the darkness of being permanently disordered, I do hope that therapists will continue to err on the side of ‘possibility’ with young people.

If not for my therapist and a few close friends I could have been thrown on the trash heap. I think I would have killed myself. The sacrificial lamb to my family’s projected narcissism and abuse.

Healing to all,
Slim

((Slim))
that was so inspiring. thank you for sharing that. There is hope, at least for those who want to change.

Dear Slimone,

Thank you for that post, it WAS INSPIRING and does show that there is HOPE FOR SOME, and that it is difficult to tell which ones will be helped and which ones won’t.

Your mentioning though that you didn’t feel JOY in hurting others is I think one of the clues…but HOW ON EARTH CAN WE DETERMINE? I don’t know. And it is I think somewhat like the “death penalty” issues.

I used to BE FOR the death penalty in cases of horrible murder etc but with so MANY PEOPLE BEING FOUND **TRULY** INNOCENT due to DNA, I have changed my mind, because I can’t stand the thought of even ONE innocent person being put to death for a crime they did not commit, and I know our “justice” system is very flawed. To say nothing of the bad cops that FRAME someone.

I also know that kids who are ABUSED sometimes act out but can be redeemed, such as you.

The REMORSE that you feel though, should not be used by you to have pity on those people who continue to DO bad things to people so that you expose yourself to them. Even if they are redeemable, they must WANT to be redeemed before they can change their ways.

I have remorse for things I have done in the past, and remorse for things I DID NOT DO when I should have done so. I have not led a “sinless” life of goodness and never done a bad thing in my life….none of us can say we have! We should all have remorse for those things BUT we cannot continue to beat and berate ourselves for those things, we MUST FORGIVE OURSELVES for not being “perfect.”

I think that was one of the hardest things for me to do was to FORGIVE MYSELF and to TRUST myself to be better in the present and the future.

Thanks again, Slim for that uplifting post. Sometimes I do get cynical about the possibilities for saving some children and/or even adults that are dysfunctional and CAN be taught better ways of living. You are an INSPIRATION for everyone. Thanks! Glad you are here at LoveFraud. We just have to realize though, that the chances of FUNCTIONAL changes in people with a LIFE TIME HISTORY AND PATTERN OF HATEFUL and ABUSIVE behavior is not much better than winning the lotto, though. We can’t save them, and we must NOT let them pull our lives down into the hell on earth that they live in.

Slim

Wow. I appreciate the honesty and sincerity in your approach.
My son, now 19, was in a similar path – diagnosed with “conduct disorder ” – I thought for sure he was going to end up a sociopath – and he stuck it out with therapy, and turned out to be a great, loving human being, unlike his sperm donor.

Hugs to you for such an inspiring post.

Athena

Slim;
Thank you for writing your inspiration down.
It’s clear, you’ve come a long way baby! You wanted it, you sought it, you achieved it.
I wish the same for others who want it.
Thank you again……and big kudo’s to you darlen!!!!

one/joy_step_at_a_time

Slim – ‘ when we know better, we do better’…it takes years. and you have done beautifully.

So guys, I just went into a metaphysical bookstore to buy some incense for my co-workers for part of the Xmas presents. There happened to be a free guest speaker giving a free talk on how to remove the obstacles to living your dream life, so I dropped in. It was a great talk. One of the things he said that stuck in my mind is that you can only create the life you want if you are coming from a happy place. Even if you have nothing in your life to be happy about, you can be happy you are alive!

He also said that you cannot create anything different if you don’t do something different. For instance, if I am at work and home (on the internet) all the time, how can I meet a great guy? You have to take some time to do some things different.
Go somewhere you don’t normally go.

He mentioned travel. He said that travel changes the energy field that you are used to being in and opens up new things. (This is one of the reasons I like to do it). Even going to ethnic restaurants or new parks can expand your life and open you to new experiences.

So much else he talked about that I just kept nodding to because I agreed so wholeheartedly with everything he said. I cannot remember all the details. But just wanted to share some of the main points.

Also, I saw the hot neighbor boy at the gym today. He walked past me on the stairmaster and either didn’t see me or pretended he didn’t see me. He went into the locker room and seemed to stay there forever! I am laughing at myself because even though I was DYING on the stairmaster, I had already did the weights, and was ready to leave, I stayed and did an extra half hour of everything just so I could run into him. He never came out!!!!! I did see him coming out of the sauna with his shirt off. I saw it through the glass of the pool area. Either he was avoiding me, or he doesn’t work out anymore – just uses the sauna. And I must say, he was looking a little pudgy around the midsection (whereas I’ve lost 8 pounds and look pretty slim). This is so silly – I need to just talk to him and get it over with. But at least he motivated me to burn an extra 100 calories at the gym. ha ha ha I’m such a dork!

Glad you are going to the gym and working out Star! Burn off negative energy and make yourself look great as well!

My vote is to just get to the NIRVANA OF INDIFFERENCE WITH THE GUY, rather than worry about what the sees, looks like or thinks! NC NC NC forever! He may not be a psychopath, but he was just wanting a booty call back then and then stopped talking when he’d decided that was all he wanted, so I think AT THE BEST he is just a superficial guy who wants to sleep with every attractive woman he comes into contact with but doesn’t want a relationship. So what he thinks wouldn’t make much difference. You are so far above him if he came up to your level he’d get a NOSE BLEED! Thumb your nose at him! Hold you head up and let his paunchy arse just get fatter! LOL

Hi One,
Allots been going on but it looks like tonight is “just one of those”where it’s better to not to open up emotionally about that stuff.
I have a question for you about B- and Karma…
I think I’ve blogged about this before but I’de really like to know what the B- version of Karma really is.
I used to believe Karma is the general theory of what comes around goes around….
I spoke to a friend a few months back and I said “If Karma exists why am I going through/have been going through all this shit and he’s doing great. His response to me was “you knew what he was but it was your choice to stay with him.” His response broke my heart.
I did not choose the lies, manipulations, the utter lunacy..and by the time I did know I was in so deep I had lost myself.
What is the def of Karma? Is this mine? I’ve searched my heart and I have been for the most part a good, loving person, often putting myself second.
Can you pls explain this conceot to me? The B- way…

Wait let me clarify…that sounded weak. I am no saint. I have been hurt but have also hurt others…
Where do choices vs. this concept come into play? I’m not sure if I’m expressing this correctly.

Yeah, I am planning to have a talk with him. Not sure what I’m waiting for. I would have talked to him today, but our paths never crossed at the gym, curiously. lol I think the advice to just talk to him is good advice. I honestly “tried” to feel indifferent, but I just don’t feel that way. Why should I pretend to be something I’m not? I need to just face this head-on with a little guts. He’s just a man – he’s not an evil psychopath. The worst thing that could happen is that he could reject me. It’s not like I’ve never been rejected before. We never broke the ice in spite of all we have been through together. And I’ve never been in a position with a man where I had to be the one to do all the ice breaking. New (and scary) experience for me. No reason neighbors should not be able to have a talk!

**sits here cowering in front of my computer** I’m such a coward!!! 🙂

And BTW, I didn’t feel negative before I went to the gym, so I don’t think I was burning off any. I was just there working out – not my favorite place, but on a freezing cold day, a good thing to do! 🙂

Star……….REALLY?

One joy-
It’s getting late and I’m getting tired. If my question made sence I’de appreciate some input when you have a little time.

(((hugs))) to the B-
And to all of regs..
Goodnight

EB, sure, why not? He’s not a spath. It’s just a talk! Please don’t judge me for this – for taking control over my life and facing my fears.

No judgement……..about the Neighbor dude.
It’s Johnny Rocket your writing to …….or was that Betsy Ross, Mary Mae or Jim Bob Nugent today?

The Skitzoid is showing up in Sybil form today on LF…….IF you hadn’t noticed WHO you were conversing with.

Yeah, it’s really not that big of a deal. I just keep waiting till I run into him. And this doesn’t seem to ever happen.

Oh well, I have two lovely other male friends in my life right now – both bilingual so I can work on my Spanish. One is a flamenco guitarist who has traveled a lot. Incredibly sweet guy. And my age. 🙂 I will not put my life on hold till I work this thing out with the hot neighbor boy. It will happen. Eventually. I think we have some sort of past life karma together.

The world is much smaller than we think…..and sometimes living right next door, it takes forever it seems to run into someone……
I believe it’s giving you the time you need to figure out what you are looking for.
In the meantime…….onwards and upwards…….right!?!?!

EB, oddly enough, Sybil’s posts to me have been very helpful and not demeaning or patronizing. Some of the advice offered has IMO been good advice, no matter who it comes from. You may not be aware that it was just 3 or 4 weeks ago, I was attacked and called a spath by a regular LF member whom everyone here worships. So by comparison, wise and respectful advice from a troll is not unwelcome.

Hey Mary K……..CHECK YOUR MAKEUP!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHHHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAH…………………………………

gnite leroy

Star…….If someone smacks you…..THEN offers you a hand up…..does that make them helpful?

REALLY?

HEY SMOKEY………The Bandit is looking for you……….

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHHAHAAHHAHA

So is this the lovebombing part? ha ha ha ha

EB, if you’re talking about the person who attacked me here a month ago, no. I’m very suspicious of her, even though her tone has changed since that day. It’s really no fun being attacked, patronized, and called a spath. It’s very confusing to have someone treat me that way and then be nice to me afterward. But I don’t take it too personally. People are who they are.

EB- I’m coping.. I’m not Michael… Or some form of him.

HEY HEART……..go find the attack>>>>>>>
HHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA

Coping…..I know dear…..

I saw your post earlier…..and maybe tonights not a good night to discuss it without interuptions.

Take a deep breath and do something nice for yourself tonight. Ya know!!!

I hope your okay.
XXOO
EB

Ok… Really you guys think I’m Michael?
I don’t know what to say to that. Accept your wrong.
Really I need to log out.
I’m sorry you think I’m him.

COPING…..Breathe dear…..BREATHE! Where are you getting this?

Star,
I don’t recall who that was…….
But, what I do know is that conversing with a toxic person on LF, thinking your getting decent advise or attention is not healthy…..for you or others.
This guys a freak……he’s lovebombing you, playing along to ‘real you in’……gaslighting and all the games…..and you play right along? REALLY?
He’s using your conversations in an attempt to real others in to his ploy. IT’s CLEAR.
It’s not helpful.

…..no one cares…….

Hey BOB……..did ya get them apples…………….

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
FREAK!

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