By | June 10, 2012 48 Comments

Psychopaths rape the soul

By Joyce Alexander, RNP (retired)

I was reading an article the other day that talked about “justice” for victims. It said that a rape victim is “made whole” after his or her attack when the perp is put in prison. How can a victim of violent rape be “made whole,” no matter what justice is meted out to their attacker? It can’t be done.

There are some things that can never be “fixed” like they were before the damage, and I believe the “soul rape” by the psychopaths is one of those things. Some of you who have been physically raped may ask, “What do you know about rape?” Well, my bona fides are that my psychopathic sperm donor beat and raped me when I was 19, so I have been both physically raped and soul raped, and I can’t tell that one is any less “painful” or damaging than the other. Humpty Dumpty can’t be put back together again like he was before the rape. I will never again be a “virgin.” That doesn’t mean, though, that I can’t heal.


At the time of my physical rape I had no concept of what a “psychopath” was, but I longed for validation for my pain. Yet I felt shame that it happened to me, and a friend took me to the police in the little town where my sperm donor lived in and the event happened, where I was beaten to hell and back. I talked to the cop about the beating and he suspected what really happened and asked me point blank if he had raped me. I said, “no” because I was ashamed.

I held that shame for a long time. Through other encounters with psychopaths that raped my soul, through the summer of chaos almost 40 years after that summer I was physically beaten and raped. My sperm donor died that summer of chaos and his estate contacted me to tell me I was not going to get any inheritance from his large estate. Surprise! Though I had been NC with him for 40 years, still I was stressed by thinking about that painful summer many years before.

Beginning of healing

In that summer of chaos, 2007, my whole world fell apart and I was sitting in an RV trailer at a friend’s property at a lake in hiding from the stalker my son Patrick had sent to kill me. Reading on the Internet about psychopaths, I came across Lovefraud and my healing began ”¦ from that long ago psychical and emotional rape by an evil man, to the emotional rape my son Patrick had done to me, as well as the final realization that my “mother didn’t love me.”

The healing that I have done in the five years since that summer of 2007 has been sort of like peeling the thin layers of an onion. As I peel each one off I get closer and closer to the core. As I get deeper and deeper inside the onion, I find new layers of dysfunction and wounds that are decades old and work on healing them.

Psychopaths are all about control and what they will do (anything!) to maintain or reestablish control over their chosen victim. The “smear campaign” has been something that has frequently been mentioned by other victims. My sperm donor smeared me to every family member he and I had. Fortunately his cousins, who are now in their 80s and 90s and wonderful and supportive people, didn’t believe a word he said. First, they knew him. Second, they knew me. My half sibs, though, were children when all this happened and I do not have relationships because of his smear campaign. The men we worked with in Africa also knew him, and knew me, and none of them believed a word he said. I was fortunate there and one of those men, 20 years after the rape, became my husband. His belief in me, and support of me, was so important in my healing from the physical and emotional rape of those many years ago.


My egg donor (maternal DNA donor) had always said about my P sperm donor, “He would tell a lie when the truth would fit better.” Yet, when I told her about the rape, she said with a sneer in her voice, “Well, he said you got an abortion and that you’d yell rape.” I’m not sure why exactly it was so important to me that she believed me, but it was. I kept wanting to believe she loved me.

Reaching out for validation is important to us all. Now I am learning to validate myself. Just because someone else doesn’t believe me doesn’t mean my truth is not true. Or that my fact is not fact. I’ve said before, that just because “everyone in the world” except Columbus thought the world was flat, didn’t change the shape of the world. Facts are facts. Truth is truth. My validation of my truth, the facts I know to be true, is enough now. I don’t have to have someone else validate what I know to be true. Sure, it is nice to come here to Lovefraud and be validated, but it isn’t necessary for my healing if I accept my own validation.

The pain that we suffer—physically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually, and financially—is equivalent to the rape of our souls. We can’t ever put ourselves back together like we were before the rape; we will never again be “virgins.” Yet we can heal, we can recover, we can grow and mature and find peace. Even if the perp goes free without any visible consequences, we don’t have to let that ruin the rest of our lives, however short or long they may be.

We can learn and grow, heal and prosper. Living a good life is the best revenge.

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Joyce, every time your writings are posted, I see more and more of how everything ties in with everything else – if you follow me.

Soul-rape. It should be a Legal term with harsh consequences. Having endured gang-rape, spousal rape, and date-rape, soul-rape is probably the most heinous act of all because there is not one remedy to either “make whole” the victim, or to even validate their experiences except by other survivors that “get it.”

Thank you so much for your truth, honesty, and insight, Joyce. You are 100% validated, and your words help to validate others.

Brightest, most loving blessings



I liked this article. Especially the parts about validating ourselves, with or without others believing us. This is where I am currently experiencing difficulty. I have these imaginary arguments in my head with people influenced by the sociopathic smear campaign in which I try to convince them that he is a liar and manipulator. When I catch myself doing this I pause and repeat the following:

“Lack of confidence is what makes you want to change somebody else’s mind. When you know you are okay, you don’t need anyone else’s approval to empower yourself.”

I don’t remember where I got it, but it has helped me from time to time. I really struggle with feelings of anger over the injustice I have experienced not only with my ex Spath, but also in my former workplace and during my military service.

I believe that learning about personality disorders will continue to help me identify those afflicted and enable me to keep my distance as much as possible.

In my transition out of state, I’m currently staying with my N mother. I don’t have any feelings toward my mother anymore, no longing for love or approval. Still, she gets on my nerves. I try to just view her from a “clinically detached” frame of mind, like scientifically observing a personality disorder in action and taking note of the features. At least I’m continuing to learn from this perspective. It allows me to continue to keep that emotional distance so necessary for my well being. My new apartment will be ready in several weeks, and keeping that in mind helps too!


Joyce ~ As always, very helpful, healing article. Living the good life is the best revenge out there!!!!

LPMarie ~ I’m sorry you and sweet chicky have to live with your mom. Only a temporary thing for you thank goodness. Glad to hear your new apartment will be ready soon. Can you take the baby (toddler now) to a kiddie park and enjoy some fun time? The least amount of time spent in a toxic environment the better.

Just gray rock Mom and try to let things just roll off.

Thinking of you – hugs to the cutie

Ox Drover

Marie, learning to validate ourselves when NO ONE believes what we know to be true is so difficult I think….it takes a lot of self confidence to hold on to your beliefs when everyone else in your environment is saying “she’s crazy”—at least that is my perspective. I’ve had to work hard at learning that the TRUTH is not changed by what the majority thinks.

“Democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner. An enlightened democracy is when the sheep is armed” LOL

In writing about validating ourselves and how it doesn’t change truth no matter what anyone else says, I always use the Columbus thing, about just because he was the only one in the world who didn’t think the world was flat, that it didn’t change the shape of the world.

Wanting our mothers to love us I think is a natural and normal thing for a child. When we are adults and still have not experienced nurture and love from that parent, it is difficult I think to cut loose and say “I really don’t care what mama thinks, I don’t need her approval any more.”

Looking at “her” clinically is a good way I think, Marie, to distance yourself emotionally from her. I have done that with a woman who is married to a male friend of mine. He is very sick and I’m not sure how much longer he will be with us, and in order to visit with him, my son and I have to put up with HER. She used to irritate the carp out of me, but now, I have changed the way I look at her and distanced myself clinically and so it is much easier to tolerate being around her. I just let what she says go in one ear and out the other and gray rock her.

With my own egg donor I use a combination of Gray Rock and NC. Since I can’t totally NC her and have to communicate about the farm from time to time, I do that by e mail And the rest is NC. Living with your N-egg donor even for a short time I am sure must be irritating Marie, but I think that Milo’s suggestion of getting out as much as possible is a good idea. Hope the stay with her is SHORT! (((hugs)))



Great to hear from you! I hope you and your grandson are doing well. I’ve been taking my daughter out with my sisters and their (older) children a bunch. My daughter is now 18 months old and on a language growth spurt.

She can sing almost all of “Twinkle, Twinkle Little Star” and amazes me with the things that she says. She can independently produce 2-3 word sentences now and just this morning, she said “Love you” to me for the first time!!! Tear, sniff! So sweet. She’s really growing up.

I do my best to gray rock Mom to the best of my ability. So far, she has been on okay behavior, but can’t help being a N! I don’t let my daughter eat a lot of sugar and unhealthy foods, and that has been one of the struggles here. As well as criticizing my parenting. But I just shrug it off and remember what kind of parent she was and almost laugh out loud at her advice. Almost.

My father is here, too, and he’s pretty self absorbed as well. I give up trying to complete a sentence, he cannot help but interrupt with what he wants to say. I do interfere when my daughter is trying to communicate and he and my mother are oblivious to their behavior. I refuse to let their disorders impact her, if I can help it!



Thank you for your response and your insight. It hurts to have others call me crazy, and at times, I have questioned my own sanity as well. But, in first leaving the Spathy ex and being completely alone with my daughter for a year before relocating, I have learned so much about my strength and ability to take care of not only my precious girl, but finally, and deservingly, myself. And I finally believe that. Being here with my disordered family is showing me not only where my areas to work on lay, but also how far I have come.

One of the greatest miracles that has happened is that my two sisters and I are all FINALLY on the same sheet of music with our mother’s behavior. My younger sister is NC with her. My older sister still desperately wants her love an approval. It’s painful to watch. But we have a pact that we do not share each other’s personal business with Mom, and that if she trys to start any of her triangulation business with one of us, we notify each other immediately. So far, we haven’t seen her N rage, but I think she will grow annoyed with hearing “Mom, I don’t want to be involved. I don’t want to talk about my sister’s life behind her back.” She’s getting that response from both me and the older sister quite frequently!!!

I am lucky to have siblings who were willing to listen and believe me when I told them this is what is going on with our family. I get a lot of stress relief now, because we all talk to each other, and my sisters help me with my daughter now. Of course, they are delighted she is hear and we have all taken her to do many things I couldn’t do before with my former crazy schedule. My daughter is having a great time, and when I have doubts about my decision to relocate, I remind myself that I am allowing her to have a more “normal” life by removing her from Spathy’s reach.


I lost my virginity about the age of 14 when I was raped by our church minister on the kitchen table in the basement of the church.

I went to him for help. I wanted him to speak with my mother and get her to stop hitting me. Why did I go to him? Because he was my confirmation teacher, and in retrospect, I’m 99% sure he picked up on my situation and “groomed” me.

I need to say “about” because my mind blocked out much of the details of the rape. For many years, I couldn’t remember it at all.

I remember small parts of it. It was when I got into Al-Anon adult children, and other people were talking about their rapes (mostly incest,) that things started coming back to me. I started feeling uneasy. I wanted to run.

I finally mentioned to my therapist that I thought something might have happened.

Fortunately for me, but unfortunately for her, she had been incested by her brother. She understood rape, but it was much later, with a sexual abuse therapist, that I finally could put together what happened.

The first therapist and I did some work on it. I mentioned to the other rape victims that I was having problems remembering the details. They became so sad. They told me that I was lucky; they remembered every detail and wish they could forget.

Another woman I met there told me that she had to have a total hysterectomy at 22. Her stepfather began incesting her and her sister when they were about 10 and 12. He slept around on the side. He gave my friend a STD. She got no treatment for it. It was what required the hysterectomy. She became a compulsive shopper, always trying to find something to spruce up her outsides so her insides would feel better. It never happened as far as I knew.

My son dated, for about 6 weeks, a girl in high school who told me that a neighbor had tied her to bed when she was five, tied her twin brother and another sibling to the bedposts at the foot of the bed, and raped her in front of them. She spent her whole childhood in therapy. They tried a new technique on her. Her therapist made her go through the details of the rape again and again. I assume to desensitize her, but it sounds like abuse to me.

Rape is the ultimately invalidation. It does not respect any personal boundaries. It says you, your needs, and your future have no value. I understand it is common during war. It demoralizes the enemy.

The therapist who specializes in sexual abuse told me that she believes that most obese people have been abused in their lives, most likely sexually. She also told me that my rapist was particularly sadistic. Who was I going to turn to for help? My parents?

I did eventually tell them, though, a few years after my son was born. My S mother believed me. I DO remember walking into the house that evening so devastated that even she could see that something horrible had happened. But I couldn’t tell her. I figured I would have been held responsible and been abused by her more. I made a conscious decision at that point to shut down. There were no more avenues of help open to me. At least that is what I believed and given the times, that was most likely true.

She told me that when my brother and his second wife went to him for marriage counseling, this minister wanted to know how she achieved orgasm with her first husband. She was livid afterwards. I knew nothing about it, but when my mother told me, we were confused. We didn’t know what was appropriate or inappopriate for a minister to say during marriage counseling.

My S mother talked with other people in the church and found out that he had been inappropriate with others as well.

There was a curious outfall from telling my parents. My mother used my rape as “the explanation” of what was wrong with me. She embraced it because it got her off the hook even though I told her that I went to him to get him to stop her abusing me.

The fallout for me is that I am terrified of a man touching me for the first time. Sex with a man for the first time is so anxiety provoking that I just skip intimacy altogether. Sometimes, though, when I sense that a man is being genuinely kind and gives me a very light touch on my arm or my upper back, a part of me wells up that wants to sob. The amount of loneliness and longing I feel for some sort of human connection and worthiness as a human are overpowering.

“Made whole” – more BS.

More about the other people wanting to remain in denial and believe this isn’t so bad as one thinks. More denial that the damage isn’t permanent, just like when they tell you that children are resilient and will get over it.

More fantasies about “we have control over our lives,” we can spot the perpetrators, and we live in a safe world.

Statistics say that one out of four girls, and one out of seven boys, will be sexually abused at some point as children. You wouldn’t know that by the silence on the subject.

Soul rape IS what happens. Nobody is “made whole” again. You can’t put Humpty Dumpty back together.

Wonderful concept, Oxy. Thank you so much for writing.

Much love and hugs,


Ox Drover

Marie, isn’t it wonderful when they are learning language? I just love the way they start to put things [email protected] Once my 21 month old was in the back yard with a “truck” and then he threw it into the pool and said “BOAT!” The CONCEPTS of language are amazing. How smart they are!

“Love you”—sniff, sniff, yea, that is awesome!

Good way to handle it with your mother and yea, she will get frustrated with you and your sisters not going for the triangulation carp! That family Drama-rama is her entertainment and she wants it. LOL Keep on refusing to play her games and I hope that you and your sisters can all recover from having her as a mother.

When are you going to be able to move out? I know you are excited! Being away from the psychopath is a great step forward for you and your baby. Does he have any idea where you are? Can you keep him from finding out? Making this sacrifice to be around N mommy short term is a long term good move. I’m glad that you were able to do it Marie! ((((hugs))))

Ox Drover


I was pretty much angry at the article that said a rape victim could be “made whole” by prosecution of the perp.

The rape victim may be VALIDATED by the prosecution of the perp, but “made whole”????? Naw! You can’t put humpty dumpty back together again. You can’t restore virginity in my opinion.

I think if you look at the statistics of the prosecutions (much less the successful prosecutions) versus the actual number of rapes reported, and take into consideration that probably only a SMALL PORTION of rapes are actually reported, I wonder how many victims are validated at all.

Look at the Sandusky thing. How many of those boys were validated? I hope many of them will be validated now, but “made whole?” Nah. The boys raped by the Catholic priests? Nah.

When the boundaries of the body are violated, the boundaries of the soul are raped as well, but it doesn’t take the body being violated in order for the soul to be raped. The betrayals of those who should rightly owe us a debt of nurture not abuse is particularly painful. When a parent betrays us the hurt goes deeper than when even the body is attacked by a stranger. By virtue of nature, the parent owes the child a debt of protection, nurture and love. When that debt is not paid, the child suffers soul rape as well I think.

When we look to our parents for validation concerning our physical rape and do not receive this, the damage is compounded.

Learning to validate ourselves, and learning to no longer “need” the validation that is not forthcoming from parents who are not able or not willing to pay the debts they owe us as their offspring is a big step.

If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth is an excellent book…there are others available on Amazon for just a couple of bucks. I have found that these will help you in your search for a way to validate yourself and to let go of the need for validation from the DNA donors. Some people seem to need that validation more than others and I think I was one of those that desperately needed that validation (which of course I never got)

Not needing approval from the egg donor or validation from her was a big step for me…it set me at liberty like Lincoln freed the slaves.


As I was escaping the hand of murder by suicide, the only expression to capture my experience was that he Raped My Soul..
All the books and LF and everything came after NC started and I was dumbfounded to know that this evil existed everywhere in daily life…the terms and expressions of the victims were all the same…I am so sorry that this is a truth in our world but if not for the strong people that have moved forward to help others via books, websites etc, I would have thought I was completely crazy and would never have been able to start to heal..the darkness of being soul-raped..disintegrated…The gift of your words to aid in identifying the torture, pain and experience are a gift from God. Having a place where you are understood only by having endured the horror…Sometimes the only justice is found here having a place to be truly validated.

Ox Drover

Dear Alivetoday….I am so sorry that you qualify for our “club” here…because the rape of your soul by the soulless seems to be the criteria to “join.” I am glad however that you have survived the murder of your self and your soul!

Unfortunately there are too many of our brothers and sisters who have not found LoveFraud or any other validation and who have lived lives of pain and despair without being able to escape.

There is healing, and in many ways, I think I am a better stronger person than I would have been if I had never had the bad things happen…but I can never go back to being a “virgin.”

You know I think of Jaycee Dugard and Elizabeth Smart, and what they endured and endured for so long, and I realize that a person CAN endure those things….just like women/men here on LF endured 20-30 or more years in an abusive marriage or a life time of abuse by a parent…but it is true that “what doesn’t kill you, makes you stronger” IF YOU WORK HARD AT HEALING!

the sisterhood

Wow, Oxy, this is exactly what I need to read today. Funny how time and time again the articles on LF correlate to what I am spiritually going through at the time.

For some reason, this whole idea of wanting to be validated by the people who know both me and my ex spath is a nagging itch that won’t go away.

But I love what LPMarie13 says to herself, “Lack of confidence is what makes you want to change somebody else’s mind. When you know you are okay, you don’t need anyone else’s approval to empower yourself.”

This is SO SO TRUE! I have noticed that it is my low self-esteem or lack of confidence in my life that is causing these urges to be redeemed by those who could care less about me.

As you say, I am validated because I know the truth no matter who else believes me.

Now I am going to breathe this post in and validate myself.

Thank You!

Oxy, (((hugs))).
You are validated here. We understand soul rape, it’s when our innocence gets slimed.

Thank you for your ongoing inspiration to get the slime off of me. Little by little, I’m getting slime proofed.

Ox Drover


You are not alone in wanting others to validate your truth…that was a very difficult thing for me to grasp is that most people who know me don’t really care…and those that really care DO validate me. DUH.

Freeing myself from even wanting the validation of these people really did SET ME FREE….as long as I wanted, needed, craved, their validation it was like I was a slave to this…I couldn’t escape. That desire for their validation, their approval was like a leash around my throat, a ball and chain around my feet…

Being able to walk away from these people and actually say and MEAN IT…”I don’t need your approval any more because I don’t need YOU any more” is so enabling to myself. I am no longer humiliating myself begging for their validation and approval, begging for the crumbs from their emotional table like a whipped dog.

I’m glad that my article resonated with you when you needed it, but it always does seem that Donna posts an article that does go to what we are working on at the time. Most of the articles I write are about things I have worked on or am working on myself. LOL This is one of those things.



I too think that I am on my way to becoming a better stronger woman who is finally gaining some self-respect and do not feel that I have to entertain the thoughts of everyone. This is a first for me..I was groomed to conform and please.

I wanted to post this too; after 4mths NC, I broke down to accept a call. At the time, I thought I was emotionally detached (I struggle with this) I expressed to the “P” that he “raped my soul”. I was thinking that maybe he would be sensitive to the degree of pain that I suffered. How I wish I never broke NC (just for a couple of days, too many) and I wish I never ever said that to him. His response in what appeared to be a gloating manner or patting himself on the back for a job well done was this: “Raped your Soul, hmmm, I like the sound of that, the way you expressed that, I havent heard that before” … Now I see what joy he was having when I told him…So sick, so disordered….Of course there is a lot I wish I didnt do but really the way things are turning out now that I can finally begin to grow out of my childhood mentality is a great gift in this…Thanks so much for your post!!!


alivetoday: i can relate to your post and yes, Ox is right…they do rape the soul and the very will we have within us. Almost like sucking the air out of a room all at once with their presence. Oh yes, I can understand that ‘groomed to conform and please’…

I have been involved in this stalking relationship for ten years now and have been NC (for the sixth time now and I think the sixth time is the charm; truly) it has been two months this time. And, every syllable was meant. Trust me. However, as always, the light stalking continues….from far away, at least and thank goodness.

Yes, they DO gloat when they know they have hurt us or intruded in our thoughts…that is great pleasure for them.
The same pleasure a child gets when you hand it a gift.

Yes, very sick and very disordered and there is no chance that is ever going to change. All we can do is gather ourselves and move forward with the new awareness that we have that these ‘beings’ exist and do everything in our power to rebuild ourselves. At least we know we can depend on ourselves. We must protect ourselves from them.

Thanks for the great article, Ox…

Peace and blessings to you ~ Dupey



I looked at a dozen places and they were ok or downright carp. Then I found the “perfect” place for my price range. The catch was that it wouldn’t be available until mid-July.

I was staying with an acquaintance prior to N mom, but it became very uncomfortable there and the N mom seemed like the better option. I am excited, but also kinda down and pretty homesick for Hawaii. I lived there all of my adult life and I’m back on the east coast now. Might as well have moved to another planet, that’s how it feels. I’m sure I’m grieving all of the loss and changes, but I am trying to stay positive. I want to avoid a depression and also try to make this transition easier on the baby.

I’ve been up since 3 with insomnia today. I STILL wake up thinking about the trauma of the last few years. I’m glad to be away from him and the drama, though. I think he knows I left, and suspects where I may have gone, but he doesn’t know any of my family.

I talked to a lawyer regarding my court order, and as long as there is an order for child support, I am required to give him both my residential address and a phone number. Since the protective order doesn’t end until August, I haven’t done that. I don’t want to, either. I have to talk to a local lawyer and see what the reprecussions could be. I had permission to leave the state with her and after that visitation would have to be mutually agreed upon, and supervised at my request. There is no requirement to allow him to remain in contact with her via phone or internet. The lawyer said my order gave me a lot of power. When things are more settled, I’ll find out what could really happen if I don’t follow up with Spathy with our info.

The supervised visitation center has called my N mom trying to get a hold of me. I didn’t know what my mom’s deal was when I gave them her number as an emergency contact number, but that’s another story! Anyway, I think he was using them to try to get information about our whearabouts. I cancelled all of the visits for May when we left. They called me back a few days later wanting to schedule for June. I told them I would be off island “for a period of time” and that I would contact them when I returned. Spathy ex can request their notes at anytime. I have requested notes, and they have included his phone number and other comments. Knowing this, I told them very little. They are supposed to be neutral and protect the interests of both parties, but I have experienced otherwise in dealing with them.

A long time friend of his who became a casual acquaintance of mine contacted me during the first week of the relocation. I hadn’t heard from her in well over a year. She didn’t leave a message, and didn’t answer when I called her back. I think he put her up to it, trying to fish for info. I had my number changed the next day.

My realtor waited to list my condo until after we left the island. He and his wife were among the handful of people who believed my daughter and I were truly at risk of lethal violence. Turns out, he taught domestic violence classes in the past. I think they understood what I was talking about, though not a one of us used the term “sociopath.”

Once my condo was on the market, I’m sure he found out that we left. He has a sister who invests in real estate, and I’m sure she saw the listing and told him and the rest of the family.

So, all this to say he doesn’t know where we are that I am aware of, but I’m sure he knows we left. And I’m sure he is spinning his wheels with his N mom trying to figure out how to get information and how to make me pay for “taking her away” from him.

I hope this will get easier emotionally as we become more settled. I have made a lot of progress in the past month, but it’s taking a toll emotionally. Need to stay strong for my lil’ love. I put on a happy face as much as possible. I’m stressed and looking forward to more peaceful times.


I lost two friends due to my anxiety and behaviour (and their lack of understanding and compassion) post spath.

In one of my conversations with one of the lost friends over the last 2 years, I tried to put my experience into terms that she might understand. The word i used was ‘rape.’ I was trying to give her some perspective through a word i knew she would have some emo connection to. it didn’t work.

but, it was the best word to try ‘sum up’ the full devastation i had experienced.

her loss.

i am back in touch with my other lost friend. so he isn’t so lost anymore. not what it used to be, don’t suppose it will ever be – i learned so much about *his* shortcomings through it all.


I highly recommend the book below, Stalking the Soul, because it is about emotional abuse on a soul level.


Dupey, yes – we “lose” people as part of the spath collateral damage. I hate it, but it’s part and parcel of the whole betrayal thing.

G1S, “Stalking The Soul” is a FABULOUS book. It’s odd that the exspath actually read it a couple of years before the marriage ended – for Survivors, it’s a great source of understanding. For sociopaths, it’s a textbook on techniques in crazymaking and gaslighting.


OxD, I am angered by the term, “made whole,” as well. There is no such thing – nobody can ever be “made whole” by money, proper sentencing, or any other means. Once that part of someone’s psyche has been “raped” or murdered, it is damaged or gone, forever. Yeah, there may be emotional healing, but that emotional scar is there until we move from this earthly life to the next – it can be scratched open so easily by triggers.

“Made whole.” Sheeeeeesh, who came up with THAT bullshirt?


Truthspeak: Yes, I have lost every friend and every connection I have ever had, over this ten year experience… except I, just this past weekend, reconnected with a lady I have known 55 years and we started kindergarten together! How many people can say, in this lifetime, that they still have a friend who remembers growing up together? hm? This has come as very much of a ‘highlight’ and ‘boost’ to me right now, reacquainting with my old friend, reminiscing about kindergarten teachers we shared and the ‘greaser boys’ in High School… the same malt shops and road rallies…hehehehe; big fun growing up was and very memorable…

I understand about people not understanding and that is why Love Fraud has been so important to me. There is no other place that ‘understands’ like ‘survivors’ do. I go see my one counselor, once a week, and my other, as needed for medication reviews, etc. He is also a neurologist. But, I am telling you what, having this place to come to and release some of the sorrow and frustration has helped so very much. There is no counselor that will be open 24/7 and although Love Fraud isn’t and has never taken ‘the place for counseling’, it has added the necessary support system that we just haven’t been able to find anywhere else.

Yes, Truthspeak, you are right: we will never be the same. The bad experiences we come through stays with us and it’s up to us to choose whether we allow those bad experiences to overtake our lives and smother us or if we ‘fight back, inside’ and become stronger and rise above it all. No, there is no ‘making whole’ again. Not after what we have experienced. But we will SURVIVE because that is what we do best. Right? We will learn new ways of thinking and feeling about all this. I am starting to overflow my “PTSD FILES” and when that happens, things start getting CHUCKED out of my world. Starting with “IT” and the ‘roadshow’…

We will never be the same but we will be stronger, smarter, wiser and more careful with our hearts and our lives.

So, after having said that, once again, let me thank Donna and all of the wonderful people who have come here, written, posted and helped me find my way through this horrible maze that had overcome my life for the past ten years. Thank you from my heart. I am ever so THRILLED and HAPPY to report that my recovery is on the road now after having been ‘kick started’ by being started on an anti depressant, which I never believed in before. (How horridly naive was I?) I am doing better even though the stalking continues…I am ‘stealthed’ now inside where it counts and matters and I am never going back to that ugliness again as long as I live. MY CHOICE. Each of you has added a garden stone in the path-walkway on my recovery and I am so very grateful. You will all always be a part of me.

G1S: I will read “Stalking the Soul”. I promise.
I have the name posted on my computer screen so I will never forget the name. Thanks for the recommendation.

HAHAHAHA: Trusthspeak, I so understand and relate, you said, regarding the book: “…For sociopaths, it’s a textbook on techniques in crazymaking and gaslighting.” ~ 😛 Shh! Don’t tell them and they won’t know. xxoo

Happy day to you all.



Hello, I have been reading LoveFraud since 2010 when I broke up with my spath. It is really enlightening. When I thought that spath were mainly men from my nationality I just realized that a lot of women have the same personality defects.

A lady befriended me in 2010, we shared our lives together called each other sister. Then this year, she got a really good job and I was still getting short term consulting jobs, she dumped me like last years news. It was the dumping alone that hurt me, she also trashed me behind my back and started speaking disrespectfully to me. It hurt like hell, I kept thinking of all the times she referred to me as her sister and all the things I did for her, the more I went over it the more I realized that she had used me and when I was of no use she found it unnecessary to even maintain a friendship. The pain was so severe, I didnt sleep for days.

I turned to another friend to lament this betrayal. The new friend 2 was depending on me to teach her stuff on the job, I gave her my knowledge and time. Guess what friend 2 took the things I told her in confidence plus a few lies and started a really vicious rumor. I called her and asked her how she could do this, she accused someone else of starting the rumor. I trusted her but last week I had to face the truth that she started the rumor.

Its been a painful experience and I have run to lovefraud to get healing. To share my pain to allow myself to feel this pain in an anonymous forum where there will not be risks of further betrayal.

I feel crazy and hurt and now I understand I really have no boundaries and I am really still the sick woman who was duped by a spath.



You have boundaries. We all have boundaries. The problem is the Ps do not recognize or honor them.

It doesn’t mean that we are sick because we were duped. It means we were trusting, which is how things should be in an ideal world. Unfortunately, we don’t live in an ideal world.

You’ve learned some hard lessons, but that doesn’t make you sick unless you feel sick that such people exist in our world. I know that I do.

I wrote the piece below about friends.

Perhaps there is something in here that might help you?



Joyfulhealing, welcome, and I’m sorry that you’ve had those experiences.

Indeed, “friends” can turn out to be sociopaths, and it is extraordinarily damaging because, trusting to friendship, we make personal disclosures about our pasts, our hopes, our fears, and our dreams. We give a sociopath the information that they’ll later use to manipulate, control, or ruin us.

Having said that, I used to be one of those people who believed that the workplace should be one big, happy family, and that everyone has everyone else’s best interests in mind – with the exception of the corporate ladder-climbers who are “obvious.” Well, that belief was erroneous, and the workplace is a breeding ground for socipoathic behaviors and narcissism.

Today, the workplace is simply that: a place where I go to do a job and earn money for my work. That’s it. I don’t attempt to develop relationships with coworkers, anymore, because it rarely turns out to be healthy. I have to maintain strict personal boundaries, now. I don’t talk about my past. I don’t talk about my fears. I don’t talk about my childhood. I TRY not to talk about my divorce, though it’s always a burning itch for me to spill my guts for validation.

I have discovered that I don’t need anyone else’s approval, unless it strictly pertains to company policy. If someone tells me that I’ve done a good job, yippee. If I am not recognized for my efforts, I no longer care. I wish that the world were an idyllic place where people didn’t target other people for their own entertainment or personal gain, but the saying goes like this: if wishes were fishes, nobody would ever go hungry.

You’re NOT “still the sick woman who was duped by a spath,” Joyfulhealing! You’ve put the pieces together, recognized personal boundary issues, and you’ve made a HUGE leap forward! Right now, the betrayal burns, and that’s a normal reaction. But, as time goes on, you’ll sort this all out and reconstruct your personal boundaries.

So, try to be a little gentler to yourself and a little harder on the boundary construction!

Brightest blessings


Truthspeak, I laughed over this ” I TRY not to talk about my divorce, though it’s always a burning itch for me to spill my guts for validation.” Yep that happens to me a lot.

GIS, wow I read your article a while back and it did hit home as God knows I have had such friends but little did I know I was dealing with one right at that time. Will re-read.

Ladies thanks for your comments, I really needed this validation and No I wasnt going to try getting it from live people who know where I live and where I work and could use info against me :).

Long time ago I didnt want to participate on Lovefraud, was afraid participating would be marinating in the past negativity, now I know with people like this all around us in all spheres I better find me a knowledgeable support group.



Just a quick note to say “howdy” and thank you for the article. It’s kinda hee-larious how we can validate each other for not needing to be validated. So true! We’re the only ones who get it. This community is very special.

Have loads to report, but just got off work and ready to nap. I do want to say that for all of you out ther struggling, there WILL be a day when you wake up better than okay. I never thought I’d get here. Maybe it’s just good-old fashioned stubbornness, but after all these years of hearing about people who come out the other side better than before the spath and *never* thinking it would happen for me, it finally did. It takes a lot of work and a solid commitment to yourself that no matter what horrible things life gives you, nothing will ever be as bad as allowing anyone to hurt you and control your life. I slowly started seeing what I did have instead of wishing for what others had. It wasn’t so much an “aha!” moment. I can see now that the negative thinking which led me to believe I somehow deserved the horrible treatment – from my own mother on down the line to my spath baby-daddy – was just a habit. I kept catching myself doing it and telling myself that while I couldn’t control how I was treated, I could control how I treated myself. Miraculously, wonderful things started happening. I started attracting supportive people into my life without trying. I was finding that although the disasters kept appearing (even increasing!), I was able to get my needs met and not be slayed by my negativity. The more I felt supported, the better I felt. The better I felt, the more I for supported. I have such profound gratitude for all who gently took my hand and pulled me through the dark and thorny woods to this new road. Gratitude is such a powerful thing! It’s brought a smile back to my face. It’s helped me trust that there are good people out there. I don’t think I really got that before the spath. I thought I understood, but it was a shallow understanding still rooted in trauma which told me, “Yeah I’m glad I for such and such, BUT…” I was great at the “buts”. Maybe I would’ve “gotten it” without him, but that’s not important. Things are looking up. I’m getting my life together. I’m sooo happy I don’t have the spath in my environment anymore! I can enjoy parenting with absolute freedom and no more worries about being constant criticized or having to helplessly ensdure watching my son being treated son poorly

Ox Drover

Dear Freemama,


Gratitude is IS an AWESOME thing and makes us appreciate what we have and not feel “less than” because we don’t have what others do.

I look at the houses of others that are bigger and finer than mine sometimes and then I look at mine and I say to myself “Yea, but it’s paid for! There’s no payment each month!” I know folks who have bigger finer vehicles..(almost everyone!) but mine is paid for and it runs….and there is no one who controls my financial strings or my emotional strings. I support myself, and decide how I live. It makes me a FREE Oxy! I am so grateful for what God has given me the opportunity to have! It doesn’t mean I don’t have to work for it or to use my opportunity wisely, but taking care of me, and in your case, the baby-kins, means that I am free from the control of others.

I am so glad you are doing good FreeMama, and you keep on doing that and when the time comes that you decide there is a man who is “good enough” to share your life and the life of your Baby-kins, you will know the RED FLAGS OF LOVE FRAUD and there will never again be a psychopath inch his way into your life or the precious life of that BABY! I hope you have gotten Donna’s new book about RED FLAGS and now with a work book to help you see where you went wrong and allowed a psychopath into your life it is doubly good. Keep checking in too, don’t let us wonder how you are doing! God bless (((Hugs)))

Freemama – Thank you so much for stopping by with your wonderful update. It’s so helpful for those who are still struggling to realize that the past is over and the future can be better.




Loved “marinating in the past negativity.” I’d change that to “marinated by the Ps.”

Then we get skewered and held over the fire. LOL



Why do you lie all the time, even about little things?
Dont you think you are good enough, just the way you are?
Why do you envy other people?
Dont you value YOU?
Why do you hurt people, on purpose, and apparently enjoy it?
Dont you value relationships?
Why dont you enjoy life? Spend time with people you love?
Or maybe you don’t know “love”?
Why hide behind a computer or phone?
Do you fear?
Dont you know right from wrong?
Dont you care?
Dont you have a moral code?
Is this why you read sermons on your Kindle?
You wont find God there.
He can only be found in your heart.
Doesnt it shame you to hurt people?
Does hurting people make you somehow feel better?
Why do you have no friends?
Why dont you trust people?
Dont you realize trust is a two way street?
Why do you stay in a dead marriage?
What do you get out of it?
Money? Or does it function as a beard? A mask?
Is it worth it? Is that the best you can do?
Why do you screw random women?
Does it lift your self esteem to nail women you don’t know
women you don’t care about…
a 60 year old widow, a 20 year old single mom?
Cant you do better than that?
Cant you do better than THIS?


I think this is an excellent article. Actually, it helped validate ME – especially when Joyce talked about the “smear campaign.”

I have been in full blown PTSD mode for the last two weeks because I called the ministry of children’s services to please get involved with my granddaughter’s case – she was molested by a man I brought into her life (not deliberately, of course! but those perverts are a breed that are as sneaky as hell). Anyway, she is living with her maternal grandparents who refused to get her counselling. The ministry is paying them to raiser her and since the grandparents wouldn’t listen to me they might listen to a professional.

My bad. I was cut off from talking or seeing my granddaughter…her stepgrandmother called my ex to tell him I was trying to get my granddaughter taken away from them (and he called me screaming at me)…a new smear emerged just like my lifetime of smear campaigns by my N mother and P sister caused me which made me lose all of my family members…even the children.

Funny how people listen to the word of another but only know me as being generous or funny or loving…and yet they fall into this gossip crap and I’m given the silent treatment. Who knows what Ps or Ns say about the ones with a heart but it has to be bad.

Good news…the ministry of children did go talk to the stepgrandmother and last night I tried one more time to call my granddaughter and I was allowed! She was quieter than usual (is a smear campaign going on about me to her now?) but at least she knows I am trying to reach out to her with love.

I have to be honest and when I was in PTSD mode I was ready to die. To have lost my son in a car accident, to have been raised by people who hated me and never took care of my emotional needs, all flooded my mind and I thought of nothing but ending it all. I had my plan all set up and the unworthiness, self-hatred, was all I could think of and it was easier to die than to live for the last two weeks.

As soon as I spoke to my granddaughter all of those feelings left me as I realized (was able to realize) that she needed me and I must be here to watch her grow. When in PTSD mode there is no rational thinking…I am too unworthy for my granddaughter to care (in my head).

So Ps and Ns and Sexual predators can really do a number on their “supply” to the point of killing by proxy.

I thank God for how things worked out and I just pray I don’t get too many more bullets because this little heart of mine is very weak indeed.

Thanks for listening – and a great article on smear campaigns.

Ox Drover

Dear dear speaking up,

I am so glad that you got to talk to your granddaughter and that hopefully she will get some counseling.

Yep, they SMEAR us to everyone, and way too many times people believe them even though they should know us better than that.

Suicidal ideation is a deep pit, Speaking up, and I really seriously think that you should get some help and therapy if you are in the abyss that deeply.

Depression is a chemical thing in our brain, but we must not try to go it alone when it is so deep that we are thinking about ending it, about suicide. We must VALIDATE ourselves, but sometimes we need help in order to be able to do that.

Please, Speaking up, get some therapy to help you with your depression/PTSD because your grand daughter DOES NEED YOU and you need to be there for her and to be healthy yourself.

When I was in the deepest, darkest part of the PTSD I got help, both with medication (which I am still on 8 years on) and therapy which helped me a great deal. Plus, the work I have done on myself and continue to do. (((hugs))) and my prayers for you and your GD.


Freemama, it’s a great inspiration to read such an upbeat post! Thanks for throwing some good stuff out there!

I guess, changing my system of core beliefs is going to require time and work, and I’m doing it one tiny bit at a time.

Thanks, again, and brightest blessings


SpeakingUp, I understand those pits of despair. I haven’t lost a child to an untimely passing, and I can’t speak to that type of grief. I can only imagine, and it’s probably the hardest thing that a human being can ever face, bar none.

As for counseling therapy, OxD’s spot-on. Had I not found a counselor that “got it,” I cannot predict where I would be, right now. And, even WITH counseling, there have been those moments when waking up just seemed so pointless. I’ve gotten past that part of despair, now, but it can be a very tempting “solution.”

Brightest blessings to you



Yes, I recognize the despair too. I’ve been there. My spath was hurting me so much I just wanted to die. I told him that, and he didn’t do anything to change.

I am glad you are reaching out. I know you have it in you.
That is part of the amazing thing in all of us.
If you had a wooden slivver in your thumb, and you used a tweezer to pull it out, the slivver would be removed, and your thumb would naturally heal. That’s the way we work. You don’t need pixie dust or magical power. It’s the amazing resilience of the human body.

You’re here to get the spath out – like a ugly wooden slivver – it’s the same thing.

You will reject the spath, you will reject the evil, and you WILL heal.



Wow full blown PTSD…that’s a horrible place to be. I’ve had it. What really horrifies me in the false intimacy that the spath built to suck u into their world n then attack u. I spend my time thinking why? And kicking myself for being so stupid.



Don’t kick yourself. Get Donna’s book and you will see how manipulative they are.


Miami, Florida
June, 2012





THIS IS UNBELIEVABLE! Someone ATE this guys face off! Just like a ZOMBIE would do. OMG: this is horrible. They shot and killed the ZOMBIE. I wonder how many of these kinds of crazy people are among us? Hm?

Scarey to think about.
Nothing but pure evil.





It’s unbelievable, hens; just shockingly unbelievable!!!!!
I ‘happened’ upon this story today and it reminded me of the “IT” I was involved with. Gives me shivers to know this kind of stuff goes on. Makes me NEVER want to leave my little spot…

mwah! hens ~ xxoo


They suspect the guy “zombie” was high on bath salts at the time. It’s a hallucinogen that makes users psychotic and aggressive. And it’s legal and can be bought in many stores in the US. Simply scary.

I read that a few days back. Please don’t read it. It won’t make anything better and you will be sick.


It’s too late. I already read it.
Unbelievable! What is this world coming to?~!!!!


I know. Pretty disgusting huh? So sad.
But that video linked on another article about the judge beating his daughter, omg. I was so in shock. I just say there crying. Feeling so helpless.

Ox Drover

Those “bath salts” are banned in some states, and the DEA is looking at banning them in the US That of course doesn’t mean there won’t be a supply but maybe they won’t be sold in every 7-11 where every kid can get them EASILY.


It’s a conspiracy – after all who owns all the 7-11’s?


Yes, Ox, I think they are banned, now, here in California as well.
Amazing; isn’t it? That something like that can find it’s way into an abusive state of being?

I think they ordered it all pulled from the shelves and out of stores here, if my memory serves me correctly. It’s the only intelligent and proper thing to do. True: it doesn’t mean there won’t be a supply but if they can cut it down some is better than not cutting it at all.

A conspiracy? 7-11? They do have great coffee…

Nite every one…
Nice and peaceful and quiet – just the way I like it.
I send you all blessings ~


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