According to Merriam Webster online a pet peeve is something that annoys or bothers a person very much. One of my pet peeves is people of all sorts who say that psychopathy is “fascinating” or worse even assert that it is “beneficial”. There is nothing fascinating or beneficial about a disorder that is linked to child rape and murder of innocent victims and countless ruined lives. It also bothers me that professionals who talk about psychopathy in this way are sought after by the press.
Several months ago a lovefraud reader forwarded me an article I had not seen. Nepotistic patterns of violent psychopathy: evidence for adaptation? Linda and I wrote a comment on this paper and that comment has just been published. The comment argues that psychopathy is not an adaptation but is instead a “spandrel.” The word spandrel in evolutionary psychology is analogous to the architectural term. A spandrel, (also spelled spandril or splaundrel), is The roughly triangular wall space between two adjacent arches. This space has no meaning other than it is there because of other important features.
In my opinion psychopathy as no meaning outside of selection for high mating effort (sex drive) and social dominance. Both of these confer advantage when they are found in people who are able to love and care for others. To understand why psychopathy exists we simply need to understand the advantages of sex drive and dominance. We do not have to assume human predators are somehow “superior” beings.
To read our paper visit Is psychopathy a disorder or an adaptation? Please recommend the article on your social network if you agree with the article. If you choose to comment please do so respecting the scientific nature of the discussion.
Just remember spandrel… scoundrel same difference!
Liane I tried to comment, but it would not allow me to do so….here is what I tried to say.
As the daughter of a full blown psychopath (multiple murders and abuse to everyone involved with him) and as the mother of a diagnosed psychopath currently in prison for murder, and with other psychopathic relatives, I can testify that what the authors of this article wrote is true.
quote: “We applaud these authors for raising the issue of the treatment of relatives by psychopathic individuals as it is commonly asserted that offenders do better when they have supportive family ties (Andrews & Bonta, 2003). This assertion has caused mental health and criminal justice professionals to encourage family ties (Rotgers & Maniacci, 2005). There is little data regarding the impact of offenders on the family members who are asked to act as supports; if psychopathy is associated with harm to family members, it may not be ethical to encourage family ties. It is difficult to study the impact of psychopathy on the family because of ethical constraints on research involving prisoners and lack of access to psychopathic individuals in the community (Widom, 1977). A review of Cleckley’s cases (1964), surveys of people who claim relationships with psychopathic individuals (Leedom & Andersen, 2011), and qualitative analyses of memoirs written by the wives and adult sons and daughters of highly psychopathic individuals (Leedom, Bass, & Hartoonian Almas, 2012; Leedom, Geislin, & Hartoonian Almas, 2012) indicate that family members report considerable harm including psychological, emotional, financial and physical abuse and exploitation.”
I think it is completely unethical for the “system” to encourage abused wives/husbands to take back ex convicts into their homes, to encourage parents who have psychopathic children to be “supportive” to these people to their own detriment.
The AVERAGE PCL-R score of ALL convicts is 22 and 25% of all convicts score 30 or more (full blown psychopaths) so encouraging their family members to take them back seems to me to be abuse of the family.
Only about 40% of paroled ex convicts complete their parole term without being convicted of another felony for which they go back to prison. (NOT “technical” violations). So this means that the families who take them back have a 60% chance that the family member will reoffend and break the law….but the worse, in my opinionn, problem is the “under the radar” damage the convicts do to their families.
I have hired an attorney to FIGHT the last parole for my son and I am fighting the next one and will fight every one until the day I die, and my other sons will continue to fight his paroles as long as they are alive.
I have known and been associated with SEVERAL psychopaths in my family and I can testify that every one of them abused every family member—wife, husband, parents, siblings and children. There is no benefit I can see in the psychopath’s family.
The only “benefit” I can see in the genetics being passed on for psychopathy, is that because of the sex drive and the dominance drive, they may leave more offspring than non psychopaths. Also the psychopaths may have survived in tribal societies during periods of shortages of food and other resources because they would not have a conscience to stop them from killing others in order to obtain scarce resources.
I have seen the results when parents don’t “give up hope” that “Johnny will find Jesus” and stop stealing….or otherwise breaking the law. Families use scarce resources to hire attorneys, to pay for counseling, to pay for substance abuse rehab, and pay an emotional toll as well in trying to salvage the life of the family member who is high in psychopathic traits.
This is not to say that SOME criminals don’t come out of prison and lead a “law abiding” life afterward, but usually these “successful” men and women were not violent to start with and had personal resources; intellectually, educationally, financially and socially, on which to depend.
Just because ex-convicts “who have family support” do better after discharge does not prove that the family support is the CAUSE of them doing better. It may be that they have family support BECAUSE they are not psychopaths to start with, just run of the mill criminals, but low on the PCL-R.
I will fight my son’s parole as long as I am able. He is a danger to me and to society at large. I hope the parole board will continue to listen to me.
My spath brother had problems with the law all his life, mostly for using drugs and drinking. As a kid he was also arrested for a string of burglaries. Then, the last time he was arrested for drugs, I wrote a letter to the judge asking for leniency and I begged my parents to allow him to live in their basement. That’s before I knew what spaths were.
He actually has stayed out of legal trouble since he moved back to their house. But that’s only because he’s got his victims in the home. He is a parasite. He got what he wants. They barely speak with him, he hides in the basement, he has cable and internet access, food stamps (that he sells) so he can buy lotto tickets and beer. I think he occasionally gets temp jobs.
Being out of legal trouble doesn’t mean he is “better”, it just means his evil is now occurring off the legal radar.
Skylar, you are right there and that is what the “system” (“criminal justice system,” boy, is THAT an oxymoron!!!) wants, they want the “nere’do’wells” of our society to be taken care of by parents, spouses, siblings, churches, etc. so that THE system doesn’t have to deal with them.
By the terms of the criminal justice system’s accounting, your brother is a big success. So what will happen to him when your folks die?
Man oh man! Thanks Liane, for researching, and fighting the good fight! We have to have The Science part of this process, to further verify what all of us already have experienced, and know.
They are sick. Period. Disordered. They will not, ultimately, even if they don’t perpetuate as much violence on their family’s (which is in question), contribute statistically to the overall survival of the human species. Which is what I understand adaptation to be, right?
I came away from reading this with the feeling that the real issue is just being approached, but also kind of side-stepped.
Unless I misunderstand, the perpetuation of the species IS the final scientific arbiter for ‘adaptation’? But abundant procreation, and protection of one’s family is a pretty superficial indication of nepotism….. and adaptation!
Are they inferring that the more psychopathic adapters we have the more likely the human race will survive, because psychopaths create and protect more individuals?
There has to be some way to illuminate that contrary to contributing to species survival individual ‘adapters’ tear down our general society and families in such a way as to counter act any positive influence their proclivity for procreation might infer.
I don’t see how ‘individual’ procreation, as in one psychopath being able to make LOTS of babies because they are dominant, can be identified as an adaptive response. What about all the peripheral costs of the adaptation they claim? The lost lives via murder, suicide. The loss in societal/business production due to emotional and psychological abuse and neglect? Genocide, mass financial loss, and war? These are all abuses of individuals and greater societies that are not adaptive!!!!
I think the net ‘loss’ to humans is palpable.
I don’t know how to measure the obvious, and not so obvious, destruction these individuals have on the world. But I know this cannot be a positive adaptation of human beings.
Liane and Linda, what a superb response!
I don’t believe that psychopathy or sociopathy is necessary for ANY reason. I’ve read many, many supportive articles and comments that ppathy/spathy is “necessary” aspect of humanity in that these disordered people effectively run businesses, corporations, and other organizations and this simply isn’t true. A successful business or organization becomes successful when strong ethics are practiced and expected of employees or other board members.
I believe that the reference to maintaining “family ties” is OUTSTANDING! “Family ties” do not, cannot, and never will alter ppath/spath choices and behaviors. “Family ties” only serve to ENABLE ppath/spath behaviors through blind support and denial.
Wonderful, wonderful article and thank you SO much for posting this! I sure wish you were speaking at my divorce action! LOLOL!!!
Brightest blessings
EDIT ADD: And, to drive the point home of the article, how does Jerry Sandspathsky’s exploitation and molestation of children benefit anyone? Many could argue that he’s simply an anomoly. From the percentages of people that I’ve known throughout my lifetime, it is NOT uncommon that vulnerable children are harmed by these predators. GO, Liane & Linda! GO!!!!!!
Off topic: this is sort of like “Mental Mythbusters.” Awesome.
A point I believe we can take away from the concept of the development of a psychopath and the value of family is that when raised in a physically harsh circumstance, the psychopath is more likely to conduct physical violence against others.
Whereas when raised in a more sustaining culture, the psychopath’s level of anti-social behavior is more likely to remain within the range of non-physical acts such as cheating, infidelity, white-collar crime, etc.
The problem for parents of psychopaths is that they can never emotionally disconnect from the feelings they have for their child, regardless of how massive the pain that the child produced for them.
At least when someone is love-bombed by a pshychopath, they have the ultimate ability to create emotional and physical distance. When the psychopath is your own child, even though one can distance themselves physically, the emotional distance is ever present.
I was emotionally raped and defrauded by a psychopath. I gave birth to a child who is very much like his father. The only saving grace that I can take heart in is that I must of done something right….. he’s not maniacally physically violent and could have become so. He’s just a manipulator, a bully, a thief and a cad.
To stem the future development of psychopaths, I believe society must become more aware of the signs in early childhood. I recognized my son had little to no empathy all along, but didn’t know what could be done about it. I wish I could go back and take steps to instill more humanity by doing things like exposing him to more charitable interactions with people and having him verbalize what he beleives others are feeling….. giving him training on how to react when he sees that aspect in people, or focusing him more on kindness with rewards for those actions.
I suspected maturation would instill empathy in my son. I didn’t recognize that phychopathy, among other things, is a delay in the maturation of empathy.
Fraudsurvivor, I believe that the emotional connection is amended with a sociopath child, over time and after sufficient recovery. My eldest son is clearly spath, and it’s been about 4 years since I began the arduous task of processing my relationship with him into a complete severence of emotional connection.
Do I still love that beautiful infant that I gave birth to? You bet I do. But, I do not “love” the adult that he has become. I wish no ill, but I won’t entertain spath games, either – not even from my own offspring.
I am not required or obligated to “like” the truth. Most often, truth is not pretty or warm-and-fuzzy. The truth is that my eldest son is a sociopath. No amount of love, understanding, encouragement, or support will change that fact. I don’t like that fact, one iota, but it is indisputable and undeniable. So, I either accept that fact and let go of the hopes and dreams that all parents place upon their children, or I maintain those false hopes and suffer exploitation. I’m not willing to allow myself to be exploited, anymore, by anyone.
Brightest blessings
My spath told me once that he had made a decision “never to be mean”. I thought, “How nice for a man to be that way”. HAH!
In reality what he meant was, “I find that I can exploit people more easily, the nicer I appear to them”. His “niceness” makes him all the more dangerous, in my opinion.
Off topic, I read on another page of LoveFraud (I can’t remember which one and can’t find it again), that it was questionable to mention someone’s name as a spath if they had never been charged with a crime. In fact, my ex-spath was charged, convicted, spent time in jail for, and is now out on 10 years probation making restitution. In addition, in my state, a person’s criminal record is available online for public record. Does that mean I can mention his name either here on LoveFraud or on any other sites? I realize this is a legal question, but I am interested. He is a very “nice” dangerous man.
Fraudsurvivor
You said: “The problem for parents of psychopaths is that they can never emotionally disconnect from the feelings they have for their child, regardless of how massive the pain that the child produced for them.”
and you also said:
“I gave birth to a child who is very much like his father. The only saving grace that I can take heart in is that I must of done something right”.. he’s not maniacally physically violent and could have become so. He’s just a manipulator, a bully, a thief and a cad.”
And you said “I suspected maturation would instill empathy in my son. I didn’t recognize that phychopathy, among other things, is a delay in the maturation of empathy.
I would like to discuss some of these statements.
Number one….I think parents CAN disconnect from the emotional feelings concerning their offspring who are psychopaths. I have done so by “splitting” if you will my feelings for the child I gave birth do and loved, VERSUS the adult he became…the murderer he became.
Number two: you probably DID so something right, and/or your DNA diluted the DNA of the sperm donor. But there are LEVELS of psychopathy.
Number three. Yep, you are right. Lack of empathy is not always just a delay in maturation. But the lack of empathy is what we have to deal with in dealing with these offspring. Truthy, and others here, are in the same boat with you and me with psychopathic offspring…some worse than others. All causing us as parents pain.