As many of us have painfully learned, before sociopaths dump one victim, they usually have already targeted another. In the following letter, a Lovefraud reader asked what she should do about the new victim:
I am finally away from the sociopath, although he still continues to contact me from time to time demanding money. He has a new target—as always, a financially secure woman, vulnerable and he has “given her a shoulder to cry on.” Her father just died, her mother has cancer and she stands to inherit some valuable land and she is already “hooked” thinking that he is “so caring” and “has been there for her and she for him.” He has told her I left him took all his money, etc.—the same story I got 10 years ago.
I’d like to be selfish in this, and just let him wander on to the new target, which means he will leave me entirely alone, but I feel so bad knowing he is going to ruin the life of a naive, vulnerable woman. My predecessor told me she “thanked God every day that I came along,” and part of me wants to do the same and let him “move on,” but I feel somewhere I should warn this woman. Had my predecessor told me everything she eventually told me, things would have been a lot different. I lost everything, including my social standing, my reputation, my integrity and self respect, not to mention my company and all my assets through his wild spending and lying about “business deals” and his abilities.
My question is this: Should I contact the other woman and tell her what I know? Or can I just “mind my own business” and let nature take its course. I wish someone had told me what I was facing.
Try to warn
This is a question I’ve heard many times. Should you warn the next victim?
In my opinion, if you can do it safely, I think you should try.
If you believe the predator fits the description of a sociopath, it may help to describe him or her that way. When people realize there is a personality disorder called sociopathy, and the disorder has distinct symptoms, it may make the warning more effective.
For example, if you said, “the guy (or woman) will cheat on you and take your money,” the next target, having already been told by the predator that you’re a disgruntled lover, may assume that you’re just bitter.
But if you said, “I believe the guy (or woman) is a sociopath, and to learn more about the disorder you should read Lovefraud.com,” maybe the person will go to the Internet, look up the behaviors and then recognize the symptoms.
Will the new victim listen?
The key question, of course, is will the new target heed your warning? We all know how good sociopaths are at flattery, soliciting pity and manipulation. The sociopath has already told the new target about all the terrible things you did to him or her. The sociopath may have the new target partially or totally brainwashed. Your words may or may not get through.
Still, you know what will happen to the new target. You know the pain and devastation the predator will inflict. You know what you’ve been through, and you don’t want to wish it on anyone.
In my view, you should try to prevent another casualty. But what do you think?
Should you try? Do you think the new victim will listen? Did someone try to warn you? Did you listen?
Please post your views on the Lovefraud Blog.
Chaos,
It is so horrible to feel that someone has taken so many years of your life. I know because my P-husband stole 18 years of mine. That is certainly how it feels. Some people say, well, look at the good times you shared, it wasn’t all a waste. But then I say, no, every memory was corrupted, every good time was a lie. It is so hard to find a way to make lemonade out of these lemons.
But don’t blame yourself for not having known. Like you say,he was able to deceive everyone and how could you have known you ought to have hired a detective? I mean, who would think to do that in a relationship, especially one that appears so perfect in so many ways. These people say the right things; we don’t lie, so we assume others don’t either. They take advantage of our good, trusting, trustworthy nature, and exploit it, just as they exploit every good thing of every person they ever run into, for their own personal benefit, always at the expense of someone else.
My P, I recently learned, not only had a 5 year affair with K, a woman he was planning on up and leaving me for, but also a 10 year–give or take a year or two–affair with a woman who used to work at the same hospital he and I–up until 6 years ago–used to work at–someone I’ve met and sort-of known, someone who went to work at the hospital he now works at because he went to work there. (He dumped her within the past few months; and as revenge she went for and got a job he desperately wanted, a job he wanted so he could get out of the ER before all the women there who he has f*&%#d start talking–which they might just do if and when they discover he is all of a sudden engaged to one of their much younger co-workers so soon after making some of them feel so “special.”)
It is a crazy, long story of how I found all that out. My P reveals the truth inadvertently, and now that I am onto him, it’s as if there is a red light flashing whenever he lies. If it doesn’t flash at the time, it flashes in the middle of the night when I wake up and start thinking.
And so now I realize he has–because he has dumped the three of us: me, K, and the woman I just found out about–stolen a grand total of 33 years from our lives. I do not feel sorry for these other 2 women; as far as I’m concerned they deserved whatever it is they are suffering; they knew he was married and one of them knew me; they’ve both been in my house and in my bed; however they have been victimized too. I’m sure he lied to them all these years, manipulated them, telling them horrible things about me, telling them he was miserable, telling them that someday he would be with them, each never knowing about the other–or all the other women for that matter–each thinking they would someday be with him, grow old with him, maybe die in his arms.
And it is beyond despicable that anyone could do such a thing. And it hurts knowing we loved these people so dearly, these creatures who did not deserve us, and that now we go forward, wary, wondering who we can trust. We don’t want to hire a detective every time we meet someone new. And yet, even being intelligent, which obviously you are, is no guarantee against being duped by one of these master-deceivers.
I am sorry for the pain you are going through. I know how rough it is; everyone here knows how rough it is.
I also hired a detective to get the “rap shee” and list of major felonies on my son’s Trojan-Horse P friend that he sent to infiltrate our family—it is the best $225 I ever spent! 15 pages of major crimes including child molestation (3 separate events) kids 8 or 9, 11, and 14—and when he was “outed” he said, “Oh, that is all a mistake, I am trying to get it cleared up, she was 17 and she was a slut and she lied to me about her age. My DIL who was having an affair wit him by then still believes his lies, even with proof, my mother wouldn’t even look at my evidence, but I KNEW, that was when I fled.
I would never ever marry anyone or even seriously date anyone that I had not known their entire “life story” and all their friends and family, without a complete back ground check by a professional.
Due to a lot of regulations you can’t get some information, even a professional can’t legally get it, like financial information, but I would make sure that I saw his official IRS filings at least, spoke with any X-wives, )I know, some x-wives will LIE, expecially if they are Ps themselves,) but I would get someone’s word about this man, and more than only HIS word.
And, I would never co-mingle finances with ANY man again. No need to at my age (61) I’m not going to marry a dead beat who can’t pay for his own basic needs, and if he survives me, he;’s not getting my stuff—and I don’t want his stuff.
I understand how young couples could co-mingle finances, but you know I am getting to the point now that with a 50% divorce rate and so on, I would not advise my even younger adult children to co-mingle finances 100%—a woman ought to be able to walk out, or a man either for that matter, without being so poor they can’t call a cab—with or without a kid on each hip.
There was a day when the man was supposed to support and take care of the woman and women didn’t have many rights but those days seem to be past now.
Even if one partner is much better off financially than the other and wants to live to their “level” of ability to pay, great, but the other person should still have separate funds that the spouse couldn’t touch. At least a “reserve emergency fund” for “whatever. ”
In my divorce, my x was mentally ill, with a P father, who “grabbed” 90% of our assets and I was a stay at home mom. I was left with almost literally the clothing on my back. I made it, but it would have been much easier if our funds had not been co-mingled, and this was also in the days when women didn’t have separate credit from the working husband. Made it very difficult. I lived in desperate poverty until I finished college and went to work.
I even had to get a court order to get my kid’s dog back. Even then it was the same breed but not the “Right” pup, and it was so starved it made me cry…(his P father had the dog) I convinced the kids it was the same dog and never told them any different…but I had to feed the dog hamburger to keep it alive when I couldn’t afford to eat it myself or feed it to my kids, but I couldn’t let it die, as my kids had lost EVERYTHING else including their dad and grandparents. They slept with that dog at night until it recovered and it was a comfort to them.
threee years or so after my husband left he called me, in the middle of the night crying and apologizing for what he had done to us, and it was like he didn’t hear a word I said back to him, and the call almost sounded like an “oral suicide note” and it went on for maybe 5-10 minutes (it seemed like an eternity) but I have never heard such grief in a person’s voice in my life.
I did love him, and I know he loved me, but his P father had controlled the household so long in such P fashion that my x and his sister too, were so disabled by their inability to function without their father’s approval that their lives were hell. At the time it was all going on I had no idea what was going on…and though I was hurt, I told my kids that you can’t quit loving him because he is mentally ill, any more than you could if he had a cancer—now, with my knowledge of psychiatry I can see that he was a seriously disturbed man. I also found out some things that I didn’t know before I married him. He had been engaged four or five times prior to marrying me (his parents were out of the country when we met) and a few days before the wedding he said “They won’t break this one up” It didn’t make any sense to me, but after I fond out about the prior engagements, all of which they had broken up even at the last minute by putting horrible pressure on my XH, and I realized how trapped this man was in his P-FOG.
I haven’t seen or heard anything from him in years, and I don’t know if he is alive or dead, doing well or not. He sent child support checks til the kids reached 18, then all communication stopped. He never even sent them a Christmas card after the first year. I had offered to give him back all his child support if he would see them once a month but he wouldn’t take the offer. Prior to the break up, he was one of THE best and most loving fathers I have ever known.
Ps don’t just destroy their partners, they destroy EVERYTHING they come in contact with. I hadn’t really thought about my X-s father much. Even though that man knew that he was dying with liver cancer, he wanted to destroy his son’s home before he died because he couldn’t brow beat me any other way.
I sat down a while back and made a list of every person that I have had contact with in my life that I would VOUCH was a P, and the list is quite long–I forgot him though, so need to add that one to the list. BF,X-FIL, bx-osses, p-father, Uncle, neighbors, etc. The list is unfortunately so long it makes me sound like I think EVERYONE is a P. LOL Yea, I am “paranoid” but you know, it doesn’t mean no one is out to get me.” LOL
I still pray for my XH, he is not a bad man, though he hurt us very much in the divorce and his father kicked us when we were down, but though he (XH) had choices, I don’t think he saw those choices or was able to rebel against the P-father. It’s a shame.
Ox Drover-
Thank you for your kind comments. I always find your posts healing and educational. I try not to blame myself but I need to understand why I was so attracted to P/N. I think my first boyfriend was an N. It appears that my upbringing with my N father made me a sort of P/N magnet.
I wanted to share my story here at this site, because my ex-P was a “successful” P. He has no criminal history, maybe some speeding or parking tickets. He can hold a decent job for many years and pay the bills regularly. He is a Christian and goes to church every Sunday. On the surface, he is a perfect gentleman with good social skills. He is intelligent, kind, and VERY polite. No one thinks he was leading a double life.
If I meet someone I would like to date, I will definitely run a background check on him with his permission. If he does not allow me to do so, I will no longer see him. I will also try meeting his family, friends and co-workers before I get into a serious relationship with him. Finding a life partner is a very serious matter.
Gillian-
Thank you for your warm comments on my post. I am sorry to hear that your P-husband took away 18 years from your precious life. I can relate to your experience. Yes, I had good times with him. But, as you say, those moments were lies. They intentionally create “good” times in order to manipulate us. They are nice to us because they have a hidden agenda. I try to wipe out those good moments in my memory, and try to remember bad things he did to me. Breakup we are experiencing is not a normal one, because we did not have a “relationship.”
One thing we can do now is to learn from our experiences (yes, we know it is very hard), and hope for the future. We are still alive. If I ended up having a miserable life, that would mean my ex-P won! I will not allow that happen. We are very good people and we deserve much better in our lives! Recently, I read this book, “Excuse me, your soul mate is waiting” by Marla Martenson. This book describes some simple steps to “stop being victims and take control of your lives.” It lifted my spirit.
I regret trying to warn the girl. Again he has two girlfriends.
She didn’t believe me and I’m sure it’s going to be even worst now, because he in going to counter balance what I said with sweet words for her.
It was not my responsibility to do so and I did it because I was angry, jealous, furious, indignated. We shouldn’t do anything driven by such feelings.
Now I have a bigger problem: he’s threatening to sue me for defamation for the things I wrote in my blog about sociopathy. I never mentioned his name, but I did compare his behavior and he surely has recognized his actions in my words.
I would suggest you to never warn the next victim, as it can make her situation worst, making her trust unconditionally in him and you know that believing in a person like this can bring diseases, humiliation, a lot of pain.
I regret writing to her not only for bring threatened, but because it is humiliating that now he knows he is still part of my life and I wasn’t able to build a new life without him.
Many things here prevent me from doing it and that’s why I need to leave this country as soon as possible.
FREE, I think that “intelligence” is counter produ tive to spotting Ns and Ps—I think that people with less intelligence are more likely to be able to spot and avoid them than people with more intelligence. I think there may be several reasons for this, possibly the fact that if we are smart, we think that makes us able to defend ourselves better than someone who might not be so smart—I’ve seen lots of folks without enough IQ to think their way out of a paper bag that can spot a P a mile away and not believe a word he says—THEY LISTEN TO THEMSELVES and their guts. So sometimes “smart” just makes us better bait. LOL
BEsides, I think there are “different” kinds of “smart”—and an IQ test only measures ONE kind.
OxDrover:
Above vmpatricia says, “he’s threatening to sue me for defamation for the things I wrote in my blog about sociopathy. I never mentioned his name, but I did compare his behavior and he surely has recognized his actions in my words”. Now, I do not believe he can sue her, and is just threatening, particularly since she has not mentioned his name.
However, I have very specifically put my S’s name places…and have read that truth is an absolute defense for libel and slander. Everything I have posted is verifiable, either with documentation or testimonies. However, sometimes I am also concerned about libel, slander, defamation of character, or if posting someone can be seen as harassment. Do you have any experience and/or advice on this topic?
Free:
There are some incredibly bright people on this site, and I’m sure you are one of them. I know we all look back at our lives with the S’s and say “oh how stupid of me!”. But with the intellect and fact-finding, plus kindness and basic goodness of the people here, we will prevail and find happiness and peace.
Peggy,
You are right. Publishing the TRUTH is an absolute defense of liable suits. He is JUST POSTURING, and he may actually believe that you can “sue” for something like that. If he tries, the attorney will tell him that he is blowing smoke. Even if he does file, believe me it will back fire on him.
My DIL and the Trojan Horse P are also trying to get possession to the truck that TH-P bought with money he borrowed with no intention of paying back, AND she tore up the loan note. We are able to PROVE FRAUD, not just an unpaid debt—so Mom should be able to get not only TITLE to the truck, but if she doesn’t for some quirk in the law, she is accruing “storage fees” that will soon render the point moot. Soo one way or another she will either get the truckk tosell or the “fees” (which of course they cannot pay) and since the storage fees fall under the “mechanic’s lien” statute, they will NEVER GET THE TRUCK BACK. It has been parked in one of mom’s garages since August 07 when they were arrested.
The DIL tried by saying (even telling Mom’s attorney and my son’s divorce attorney (same man) that the truck was paid for (i.e. no lien on the title itself) when SHE KNEW SHE WAS LYING…Whem Mom filed the small claims case, the TH-P from prison shot back that the truck was paid for and now my mean old mom wanted both the truck AND the money he had paid her—DUH! They never never give up trying to CON. Even in the face of evidence, not to say moral reasoning. LIE LIE LIE
MY main reason for not wanting them to get it (besides the injustice of it) is to keep them AFOOT, the less resources either of them has, the better. I know this will pi$$ them off at me, but so what, they are already blaming me for them going to jail and their perfect plot failing! LOL So I have nothing to lose and will fight FIRE WITH FIRE. I think that my DIL has been convinced that she doesn’t want to spar with me any more (she’s like to but doesn’t have the courage any more) and the TH-P would cheerfully like to kill me I am sure, but again, without resources and on parole when he gets out (if my contact of the parole board doesn’t stop him from geting parole) he will be severely limited without friends OR transportation or money.
I have not only regrown a brain and a back bone, but I am determined to see it through—protect myself in the process. I am no longer going to delude myself I can “treat them fair” and they will “go away”—Just like an unbroken horse, Ii want as MANY ROPES ON IT AS I CAN TIE ON. Lack of transportation is one of those ropes—if they are worrying about the ropes, they won’t be kicking at ME.
Ah, let the windbag threaten. I’m sure if I started totally blasting my P in writing on my blog he’d get all blustery and do the same thing — but I might actually enjoy watching him posture and whine to the point I’d worry about being an N or P myself! 😛
Idle threats. Obviously newspapers are threatened by libel laws all the time…and they’re seldom carried forth. They can’t be won. Quite simple. Lawyers know this and don’t waste their time.
If this person did these things to you, that is all the defense you need, whether you sky-write it, blog it or create a coffee-table picture book…you’re telling the truth.
Of course, you’re also giving him SUPPLY. Negative is as good as positive to those creeps. And if he’s a true Narc or Psych he might fly into cataclysmic rage over his perceived injury. But if writing makes you feel better — DO IT ANYWAY.
I was fortunate that the ARREST RECORDS of my Ps speak for themselves (except for my P-father) and he postured so arrogantly and contradicted himself in print so many times he destroyed his own credibility so I didn’t have to worry about him. LOL
About the only one that can get away with appearing “pure” is my P-by-proxy mother who only shows her fangs to ME. But enough of the neighbors and family friends have seen what she has done prior to the arrests that I was pretty well vindicated in the community.
Trying to “warn” her and not being able to get her to listen (I DO think there is some senility going on there now from a report I got yesterday from someone helping her with her taxes–she was a CPA and didn’t know what the most basic tax forms were.)
Sooner or later I may have to step in via the courts if she starts totally mismanaging her estate, or have my cousin, her power of attorney, do so. At least if she gets to where she can’t balance her check book or starts to do anything that might impact our family trust, I do have the authority to go that route and assert my trustee ship.
Some Ns and Ps may actually turn violent though if “provoked” by poking publicly at their “image” if that is very important to them—some it is and some it isn’t, so whether or not I would actutally try to “get even” by exposing them publicly, I would have to take under advisement about how important it was to me and how much I might provoke in the way of revenge on their parts. Some times it isn’t worth the hassle or the risk involved—just depends I would think.