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By January 7, 2016 95 Comments Read More →

Sociopath Control: Lessons From Economics 101 And Frogs In Hot Water

FrogLeaping

You don’t have to have studied economics to know that scarcity drives up value. A sip of water for someone parched in the desert is immensely more valuable than the same sip of water at the end of a meal at a white tablecloth restaurant where an attentive waiter refills your glass constantly. Is love any different? A single gesture of kindness or expression of love in a flowing stream of affection goes all but unnoticed. The value of that same gesture in a love-deprived environment, however, is immeasurable.

Using Love to Control

Because human beings value love, sociopaths often use love or the promise of love to control and weaken others emotionally. This happened to me and is chronicled in my book  Husband, Liar, Sociopath: How He Lied, Why I Fell For It & The Painful Lessons Learned (available via Amazon.com).

Taking a chapter out of the “Sociopath’s Playbook,” my now ex-husband, “Paul” (not his real name), began by getting me to love and to trust him. Next, he exploited my trust as he changed my world from love-rich and positive to love-starved and negative. This gave him power over me, because it left him as the primary source of something I valued but now rarely got—affection.

Frogs in Hot Water

Why would any self-respecting, confident woman tolerate such behavior? At a basic level, I am no different from a frog, and sadly, neither are most of us. I have been told on many occasions, typically in business settings, that if a frog is put in hot water, the frog will jump immediately to safety (if it can). The frog’s mental arithmetic is pretty simple:

 Hot Water > Ouch! > Jump! > Live!

However, if that same frog is placed in comfortable water and the heat is turned up ever so slowly, the frog will stay in the pot until it is boiled to death, because the life-threatening change is too gradual for the frog to detect. In the absence of the perception of danger, the frog’s self-preservation instincts do not kick in and tell it to jump to safety. In the frog’s brain, the situation probably looks something like this:

Nice Water > Warm > Warmer > A Bit Warmer >Hot > Really Hot > Boiling > Dead Frog!

The Moral of the Frog Story

The moral of the frog story is that it’s difficult to sense changes in the environment when the change is subtle but continual. However, it does not take long for small changes to accumulate, adding up to meaningful shifts and, ultimately, profound and possibly disastrous alterations in the environment. If a company fails to sense these changes, it cannot take the required actions. Eventually, the business dies.

I am no expert on frogs, but if the frog is anything like me, it’s possible that due to the gradual nature of the change, by the time the frog senses danger, it has been too weakened by the hot water to jump out. Alternatively, the frog may want to jump, but it is being cooked on a gas stove, and the frog is not sure that it can clear the flames as it tries to reach safety. Similarly, the most dangerous time for someone trying to escape an abusive relationship is when that person actually tries to leave.

Hence, the question, “Why didn’t you just leave?” is insultingly ignorant. In either case, maybe the frog wants to get to safety but cannot. It may need help if it is going to survive. Someone must either turn off the stove or reach in and pull the frog out of the pot. If not, the frog knows it is weak and in danger but must resign itself to a terrible fate. This echoes the sense of helplessness many emotionally and/or physically battered men and women feel, and it is among the many reasons why it is so hard for them to leave abusive relationships. I understand it now, because, due to my relationship with Paul, I am one of those women.

But the Frog Habitat Looked So Perfect

To make matters worse, you can probably get the frog to jump willingly and happily into a pot of comfortable water if it is disguised to look exactly like the perfect frog habitat, complete with everything the frog needs for its long-term survival and well-being (food, a mate, shelter, nice temperature, and so on). Should the frog have known better than to pick a habitat that looked so perfect? Is the frog weak and pathetic to have stayed as the environment changed, even if there was no conscious perception of the changes until the frog was too weak to leave? Did the frog really choose to stay in such a toxic environment if it was unaware of the toxicity?

I pose these questions, because if, as someone hears my story or your story, we are dismissed as pathetic or weak, then that person is making the assumption that it could never happen to them (assuming they do not think of themselves as pathetic or weak). But this would be a mistake.

Beware–Sociopaths are Skilled Actors

Sociopaths are accomplished actors, and the real world is their stage. Sociopaths are that good at masking who they are and playing whatever role is required to get what they want, including a long-term marriage to provide a warm, cozy home base and the illusion of normalcy.

TV stories about sociopaths make such compelling drama, because virtually no one suspects ahead of time what these individuals really are. But if experts are right, that between one and four percent of humans are sociopaths, then our only defense against falling into a sociopath’s trap is to understand the prevalence of sociopaths in our everyday lives, to be wary of the subtle signs, and to understand what aspects of our humanity they are using against us.

Identifying names, places, events, characteristics, etc. that I discuss here and in my book have been altered to protect the identity of everyone involved.



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95 Comments on "Sociopath Control: Lessons From Economics 101 And Frogs In Hot Water"

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What a great analogy.

I think or at least I hope that perceptions are better about people staying in an abusive relationship today, than they used to be.

Like you state, it can be difficult to recognize ‘danger’ at first, when we are not expecting nor prepared for it. Then, if it creeps up slowly, we slowly become aware and have been lulled by what we thought it was or what we want.

It’s almost like you have to shake your head and see what is really happening. Not so easy to do.

Cheers for the post.

Great analogy! And don’t forget, the frog has been “singled out” and separated from all his frog friends and family. Perhaps if he wasn’t alone he could get a “leg up” from his buddies and hop right out of that pot. Or if he had listened to his froggy friends he might have been able to hop away before getting caught. Psychopaths hate our friends and family and drive them away for those very reasons. They don’t want us to have any help whatsoever. They don’t want us to be free and happy. It’s watching our suffering that they love, it’s unbelievably sick and sadistic.

Yes, sick and sadistic to us…but all the SP / P knows.

That is even scarier. They can’t behave any other way.

Still NO EXCUSE, and still people that we all must have NO CONTACT with, if possible. We MUST NOT feel pity or sorry for them. That’s when we get into trouble.

There is NO helping them to change and they can’t change. We MUST accept that fact.

We MUST remove ourselves completely from that equation.

I have 2 small daughters with my husband of 5 years and he is completely sick. I have tried to leave him before and took him back for fear of their safety and I am having great difficulty accepting the fact that he will not change. This article is amazing bc it pegs him exactly. At first, fool her then marry her, make her pregnant, but her a car then deprive her of love. He would constantly point out how illegitimate I was at anything from my work ethic to raising the children to my family. He was always better and more important. What I wanted and needed and felt didn’t need to be heard. This happened so subtly and over time. I’m getting out with kids now. I’m no longer his frog.

This fact was the hardest to accept. He blames it on his upbringing, his bipolar, anything / anyone but his fault. Now it’s “my fault” bc I want a divorce so all the legal battles and the death threats and “people laughing at me” are my fault. They are outstanding liars and thieves, unworthy of the love they steal.

Exactly! Reach out to whatever family, friends, church or support groups. That’s why I’m here! It helps so much to remind myself everyday that I’m not alone and I’m not wrong. I’m doing the right thing. They will make you think you are doing the wrong thing, no matter what you do! Perfect example is when I wasn’t working, I was told I was lazy then when I started work, my work ethic was poor and I wasn’t cleaning enough. When I was pregnant and nesting, he told me to get out of his way and stop cleaning so he can play his video games. I was so unhappy. I couldn’t even do what came so instinctually to me. I was truly in a cage. This is so refreshing to see that people actually acknowledge the fact that this guy – this darkness does exist and that you have got to take your heart away from them and leave asap!

Thank you O.N.Ward, perfect description of this situation.

I have been a long time reader,first time posting.

I wanted to take this opportunity to say thank you to you, Donna and Lovefraud posters for all the inspirational and supporting posts on here that have helped me through a lot of dark times.

Thank you all, and blessings to you.

Dragonleight – You are very welcome. I am so glad that Lovefraud has helped you.

Thank you for your response Donna. Blessings

Thanks O.N. Ward. Very nice article. The frog analogy, been there, done that. I was just about to be dipped in butter. Haven’t been in the hot tub lately btw. I agree it is really insulting and part of the victim blaming mentality that we know is perpetuated by the pathological segment. What I have found sadly is that some of the most vocal frog haters are themselves unknowingly being slowly stewed. When you mentioned the concept of scarcity I immediately thought of Dr McDermott and decisionmakingconfidence.com where he describes some of the tactics and techniques that cult leaders and other psychopaths employ, or should I say recipes they use ? Ribbet 🐸

I am just getting very ill mentally and physically by learning so much about sociopaths, borderline personality disorder, narcissism etc. I KNEW that he was a “little off” from the beginning, but because I happen to come from a family with two alcoholic parents and was never taught boundaries, I just fantasized that he was “my soul mate”. Now I find out that I fell in love with myself because he was “mirroring” my personality. It has been almost two years now and I got myself into a situation where I cannot move! We moved in with him, I am also a caretaker of an elderly man that lives with us.
I unmasked the sociopath. I kept throwing the book at him, showing him evidence that he has severe mental issues, asking him about his childhood and parents. He is a pathological liar also. He was giving little tidbits of information at first, then come to find out his father tortured him all throughout his childhood. He had two sisters and one was abused also but not as bad as he was and the other sister was the “golden child” of his narcissistic father. His mother neglected him also. He was never hugged or shown any affection. Never told that he was loved. Everything was his fault and he was always punished, used as a slave by his parents. He put in 20 years in the Army and that was a disaster because he was loving every minute of all the debauchery and immoral sexual activities with both sexes!!! He is basically borderline personality disorder but that is co-morbid. Has dissociative issues, displays multiple personalities depending on what’s going on. About 4 months ago I took away the keys to our 3 vehicles and told him that since he is so dysfunctional and prone to having sex with strangers (something he says he never did while with me..ha ha) that I cannot trust him to go anywhere alone. I can’t move because of the old man and my son and our finances will crash if the old man dies. He is not too healthy. I am trapped here. The sociopath takes almost anything and everything I say the wrong way. He rarely ever apologizes and in his eyes, I am the problem, though when he comes down from raging (after I logically explain to him why he is WRONG) he will say things like “yeah, you’re right, I should have… yada yada) , but what is so unnerving is that I have to point it all out to him. It’s like he has no comprehension of LOGIC. He rages then leaves and hides until the next day or two and comes out of his cave and pretends like nothing ever happened. THEN of course I will bring up the dysfunctional behavior because he has “claimed” that he wants to change and it seems like he always start his sentences with “Well, YOU….this and that…YOU… blah, blah, blah” Like I AM THE PROBLEM!!! Once in a while we have good days…It’s really wearing me down. Been going on for almost 2 years now. I finally had enough and sent him a text message that said “You need to move”, he replied, but I did not read his replies. I shut the phone off. We have gone through this before. He threatens to move or I ask him to move and then he pretends like he wants to work it out. I give in and bring out all the books I have on C-PTSD and whatever else and he pretends like he understands…He has has taken a few of the books and supposedly started to read them, but he never comes to me with any “enlightenment” from things he is reading. Once in a while he does. He is so dysfunctional that he can’t even pay his bills. I do all of that and I am trying to get him to do it also, but he has always had some “woman” with him to control everything. I am not a control freak woman, I thought he was a REAL man, but he is no man, he is a mouse. There are no professionals where we live because we live in the boonies. He mopes around in a daze after we have a “fight” and I am NOT the instigator at all. He just takes things wrong and gets PISSED OFF. I have told him numerous times that his middle name is ANGRY. He got angry. I raised my son (18) opposite of the way I was raised. He was loved, hugged and he had a happy childhood. My son is a good kid, but since living here and witnessing these arguments, it is getting to him also even though he says it is not. I know it is. I am hoping that he moves out tomorrow, but I doubt it. I just can’t take it anymore. In his eyes, I am the Problem. Though at times he acknowledges that he is fucked up. He is such a good actor and manipulator that sometimes I actually believe that he wants to change, but his ACTIONS are not there. I don’t know. I am so mentally fucked up in the head. I don’t know who I am anymore. I was a happy go lucky woman when I met him and then discovered that he is a sexually perverted, immoral, pig and has no shame whatsoever. He used to get into fucking orgies for Gods sake!
I understand because I have done much research that people raised the way he was raised have many psychological issues, but you can’t just label them all 100% anything. They all seem to have a little of this and a little of that. At times he has actually cried when we were reading books about mothers and he finally realized that his mother neglected him when he did not before. I explained to him that she was a bitch, basically. This guy was abused from such a young age (4 is when he remembers the beatings from his father began) that he thought it was all his fault. He actually looked up to his father when I met him. It was like he was under a spell. I had to educate him about narcissistic fathers and had to tell him that he was abused and neglected when all this time he thought it was a normal family. That he was born bad. I had to tell him that he wasn’t, that he was MADE bad and it was all his parents fault.
He was also bullied by the kids at school!! What gets me is I get vibes when I am around him that he is just pretending to be cool, calm and collected when inside he is in a rage. He holds everything in, he takes everything wrong, his self esteem is Non existent but he pretends that he has no problems.
I feel like such a fool for typing all this in here, but I am so disturbed, I just don’t know what to do anymore. I PRAY to God that he DOES move out tomorrow. I actually left him the keys to his vehicle and he took them earlier today. I saw him coming in the front door as I was exiting the bedroom and our eyes locked. He had this poor sad puppy face on and I was afraid of him that I just stepped back in the bedroom and shut the door until he left and went outside again. Last night he’s raging, this morning NO APOLOGIES, I am at my wits end so I texted him to move and just did not want to read his replies….I am like walking on eggshells. I don’t know what to expect-anger, pretending that everything is fine, maybe a rare apology, but I feel like when he does say that he is sorry, that it is not really sincere. I feel like it’s rehearsed…..like he is thinking in his mind “She thinks I should apologize, so I better apologize” but I just don’t feel it is sincere when he says it. Not sure how to explain. It’t like without emotion, no genuine remorse….BUT SOMETIMES he gets me to believe that he is sorry…..that’s only about 10 percent of the time though, other than that I have to sit and explain to him like a fucking baby about how we shouldn’t act this way or talk that way or how being selfish is not nice and being thoughtful is the preferred way to be. I had to teach this pig to wash his hands after using the bathroom. The house was filthy when we moved in because his ex girlfriend was a filthy whore also. I have never met anyone so fucking mentally disturbed in my life. He ogles ANYTHING, male, female, I had to explain to him that staring at people is not MORAL and especially in a lecherous manner… he was sexually abused also as a kid,,,,..OMFG….Sorry for all the curse words. I am losing my mind!!!

Llpp65, I completely understand your dilemma. It is the same situation with my soon to be ex husband of 5 years. He had a Narcissistic, sociopathic father and severe neglect in his family coupled with mental issues that have plagued the family genetically throughout the years. I had to leave with the kids – it was the worst environment. There are times when he would leave me and my toddler (at the time) without notice when I was pregnant for our second child together. He would just jump off the couch, get in the truck and go then come back hours later with a large value meal and eat it in front of us as if we weren’t there at all. He would have many sexual encounters with random women he didn’t know. I finally got a voicemail on his phone from when he was away on his ‘business trip’ from another woman. He would save ex girlfriends numbers under guys names and claim it was work calling. He would leave us on Sundays and say it was a work meeting. Severely neglected the children – I couldn’t work without arranging a sitter bc he can’t be alone with them for more than a few hours without losing his cool or just not watching them to the point they hurt themselves. The last straw was when I returned home from work on a movie set (I’m an actress) and the house was completely wrecked with scissors, knives, kitchen appliances and blades from my grandmothers craft box which was tucked away in a top shelf. My 6 year old and my toddler had gotten into everything and there was a trail of blood from their bedroom to the restroom! My 6 year old managed to cut herself and as she cleaned her wound in the sink, my toddler took the same scissors and cut her hair. The entire top of her head was cut TO THE SCALP. They couldve been seriously hurt. Here’s the kicker: I find out that all the times I checked up the 4 days I was gone, things weren’t fine bc it happened 2 days prior to me returning home. So, he didn’t feel the need to tell me nor did he clean up or fix her hair! This was the last straw! Don’t feel silly for venting at all!!!!! I like to keep it classy and don’t post on my fb or social media out of respect for his family and myself but it helps so much to reach out and share the anxiety. I tried to leave him before and he threatened to kill me if I ever left again so I am very scared day to day. I thought for a second he could possibly see a doctor so I took him back after getting struck by a drunk driver and almost losing my life but we took a few Marraige classes then he refused to go anymore saying It was a waste of money and he was fine that he didn’t need a doctor. Never seen the doctor. Never even called.
It’s not going to end until you move. You gotta be the frog and jump so fucking far away that he can’t hurt you again. This is the single-most difficult thing I’ve ever had to do in my life but I won’t ignore the negative, life-threatening effects this is having and will continue to have on our daughters if I stay. He has since brought 4 strange women around the girls and To top it off, I’ve received threats from his ‘friend’ who is a police officer. I have been lucky enough to finally get the assistance I need with a local domestic abuse organization. They listened and please pray for us that he agrees to get the help he needs and my family can possibly heal. I have always believed you should stand by your man no matter what but I also know that NOTHING IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN MY CHILDREN. The husband I married was not the same man he was pretending to be. I’ve been trying for so long. I’m trying to find the silver lining and thinking of this as free resiliency training and that I’m helping my girls understand I love them more than anything and providing an example that no matter how impossible life may seem, YOU ARE NEVER STUCK!!!! I’m glad this article and blog is active bc it helps me accept the fact that he will not change. I have to be strong – our safety, our livelihood, depends on it. Thanks everyone for sharing.
A few tips: reach out to everyone you possibly can, seek counseling, therapy, talk to a local pastor or nun or join a bible study / choir. Group activities are always a great way to discover how much of life there is to live out there. It will help you to heal faster and lead you to discover how strong you have become and how much time was being wasted on someone who truly cannot love you.
I hope someone reads this and it helps a little.
Love and many blessing to all my sistas that are going through such hell. Keep going and let it burn away. Soon from all those ashes, will rise a beautiful rose.

Heatherdee, thank you so much for replying to my post. I felt the hug. I am very disturbed at what YOU are going through with your kids. My situation seems mild compared to yours and others, but it’s still the same blame game and no remorse with sexual infidelities (that he denys ever cheating on me before I took his keys). Are you able to document what he’s doing? I mean like getting a tape recorder hidden in the house or maybe one of those little nanny cams? These narcissists are SO GOOD at making others think that we’re the problem. What’s funny about my situation is this bisexual freak is 65 yo and has 3 daughters that are disturbed, yet they don’t see it in themselves, they also blame their partners…lol….keep it in the family I guess huh? Anyway, when I met him and he described to me how the home life was for his children when he was married to their narcissistic bisexual sociopathic wife (the love of his lie) I BLASTED HIM …I said “My God, you severely neglected your children and THATS WHY THEY ARE SO FUCKED UP!!
I told him that he needed to pen them letters and beg for forgiveness and explain to them about their grandfather. He actually cried when we went over the final draft after realizing what a POS father he was when after he had custody of the kids for a very short time after the split up with the wife, he would come home from work (Army) and then claim to need to go back to work and leave them all alone all night long while he was out having GAY orgies with the guys and sometimes girls. No BOUNDARIES what so ever. Anyway, I can go on and on and on, but I need to get to bed. The fact that he shows emotion sometimes is what’s puzzling to me. He cried when I exposed how he was a failure of a father and destroyed his kids by marrying a narcissist bitch and loveless mother to his kids. He sent the letters, two of them said “you werent that bad dad” and one took over 3 months to reply (the most disturbed one) and she blasted him to hell but then they all said that they forgave him. Months later we (ME ACTUALLY) figured out that they do not believe him about his narcissistic father and I told him to dig for info. THEY DONT BELIEVE HIM. They say they do, but they don’t because they never asked the grandfather about it and they post all lovey dovey posts to him on Facebook. The family is all in denial….they are ALL fucked up. They dont return his calls, they used to in the beginning, but now it takes weeks for them to return his calls because he has been more open with them about how FUCKED up/dysfunctional he is and how it’s his fathers fault and I don’t think they really want to hear it. I feel like a dolt because I said I was going to bed yet I am still running my trap….lol…I am just so confused….This guy seems to be SPLIT. One day he seems like he wants help, then the next day he is flipping off his rocker….it’s 12:14am here and let’s see if in the morning he will move. I havent spoken to him at all since I texted him “you need to move”. He has come in the house a couple times and I have run into the bedroom to avoid him. He hasnt said anything. Like I said before, he did text me back and I think he even called and left a voicemail after I said MOVE OUT. But I shut off the phone and did not check the messages. I am just so OVER him accusing me or saying things like “if that’s the way YOU want it” always shifting the blame to me….I am pulling my hair out. FUCK!
Goodnight and thanks for replying. I’ll be thinking about everyone on here and hope for the strength in us all.

The fact that he loved a narcisst bitch may be his problem. See, they control every aspect of your lives and in doing so, they brainwash you. So, he may not be a full-blown sociopath but he suffers from severe depression / her ways rubbed off on him. He doesn’t know he’s acting like her bc the behavior was repetitive and normal to him. It sounds like he needs to see a doc and he can be saved. It seems to me, from what I have read that most of his behavior is just leftover mess that he can clean up if he really tried. I wish you the best and so glad you replied. My baby girl has finally went to sleep. Score for this mom!!!! Good night Sista.

I accidentally replied to this in email so I am posting it here where it should be now with an update at the end.

Heather, you made me cry….good tears….his whole life is just a disgusting mess…he went from the narcissist slut wife (married at 18) to the Army at 22 then they split up after like 11 years, He became even more “depressed” smoking hash in Germany and remained a alcoholic and all the debauchery there, but just knowing their deviant sexual lifestyle is what irks me. He continued with this lifestyle even after he got remarried to a woman that he used so he could have someone help him when he had his kids. He has been leading a double life all his life……gay in the closet and straight for the public….He is like a chameleon though, he doesn’t have an identity. He will start acting like whoever he is around. No core identity. That’s why I cant trust him out alone. I know he has had stranger sex in all the places that these homo’s like to go,,,,rest areas on the highways, truck stops….I am going to get ill just thinking about it. I made him get an AIDS test last year and I have stayed out of his bedroom for over 6 months. I am celibate and he is most likely jerking off….lol….
We are both against any type of pills because I actually saved his life from the VA medical center that was killing him from using him as a labrat. He has remitting/relapsing MS…also, but has had no symptoms since I weaned him off pills and put him on vitamins and fish oils etc. my mind is in such a quandary…..Woke this morning and as I was going out, he was coming in. He still had this sad puppy face but he stepped aside and I walked out to the car and took off. I was hoping that he would have left by now, but he has not moved the truck and is just staying in his cave….the old man I take care of almost fainted on me. He wears a urinary bag that I have to take care off and I had to drag his ass to bed. I am so overwhelmed but I am working hard on trying to be positive because my son doesnt need to see me flipping out even though he knows and has seen me upset. I thank you for the replies and I hope all is well on your side of the world. Glad the baby got to bed…hehe….I remember those days, but their smiles and happiness is worth it. The love from a child is like no other. It is what saved my life. I was going downhill fast until I got regnant and my life changed. Having my son turned my life from sadness to joy.
Just saw the freak walk by the window and I am not sure what he is doing. Moving or what? I am so nervous….toodles for now.
UPDATE 1 hour later.
I finally read his text reply to me after I sent him the one that said “you need to move”
His reply was “Will do Warden”
Sp does that sound like someone that is remorseful and concerned that he has me going bonkers?
If I was a warden bitch let me tell you my son would not be the decent moral young man that he is. This guys 3 daughters are all fucked up. and he calls me warden? He has a way with ALWAYS blaming me, making it seem like I am the bitch and I am sick and tired of it. Yes, I care about him, but he just goes into his cave and wakes and acts like we got no problems. He is not showing me any ACTION that he wants to change at all. I am always the one bringing out the books and being excited about it because he can change and get help. BUT HE SURE AS HELL DOESNT ACT LIKE HE WANTS TO CHANGE!!I do not think that I should be the one always bringing up the self help books or what not. If he is sincere he would be talking about them more than me I am FRAZZLED. He is still here but I think he is going to move cause he brought in some grocery store items that we had stored in his travel camper so i guess he is getting it ready to go…He will be happy I know he will because he can go right back to his bisexual orgies. THATS BEEN HIS WHOLE LIFE>
I am very disturbed right now. Forgive me. it is hard for me because like a fool, I CARE about him. How stupid. how can someone care about someone that doesnt care for them? that treats them like they’re the enemy? fuck me!!!!!!!

Love is love. It knows no bounds. He knows exactly what he’s doing and unfortunately it won’t get any better until you make the decision and stick to it. The nurturer in me wants to say there’s still hope but if HE doesn’t want, don’t keep carrying his cross. I don’t really know him or you well enough to say much. I do know my situation and I will say I am scared. Yes, my daughters are my reason I’m no longer his toy, his concubine. My daughters are my reason. Big hugs. Things will get better, you just have to decide what you want and make life better everyday. One step at a time.

“Sociopaths are accomplished actors” is so absolutely true. Only when I had hard evidence that my now “exspath” was having an affair did I witness first hand how well he lied; how dramatic were his words and body language. Wow. So I took action and soon learned what he was: a pathological liar, a sex additct, he vilified me to anyone he spoke to: he was a sociopath.

The one-in-four is scary and most people refuse to see the “bad” in anyone. At work, I identified a co-worker as a sociopath (only to myself) so I micromanaged him. He was good at presenting himself as a wonderful intelligent person. He lied to my supervisors, who in turn blamed me for his cries of being bullied and it was my lack of “training him properly” that resulted in his low performance evaluations. I was told to “cease and desist” and leave the poor boy alone. No one ever asked let alone gave me the opportunity to defend my position. So I changed my strategy .

Essentially I documented EVERYTHING; when it came time for his review again I failed him in various areas. He complained and wrote a memo attacking me professionally. I then presented 2 inches of documentation as my rationale, never saying a word to him or anyone else. My supervisor finally believed me. She stopped undermining my authority and refused to approve his work; she caught him doing “business” on the side during work hours. I continued to micro-manage. He finally resigned to start his own business. Less than two years later……….he is now in jail. 35 counts of insurance fraud and endangering the welfare of minors. Oh, by the way, co workers now believe me. But begrudgingly………amazing.

I love it! Love to hear the stories of the success that comes from properly identifying these people and planning accordingly. The happiest moment is when you can effectively remove the scum from your life without having to watch helplessly from the sidelines. You are never alone and give them enough rope, they will very slowly but very certainly, hang themselves.

Thank you O.N.Ward … great analogy! And the timing of this post was so perfect for me. I’ve been a long time reader, and I have participated in sharing my story on here in the past. Yes, in the past, because present day, I feel like such failure and disappointment to my support group on here and to my family. Why? Because I’m still with my spath husband. I just called my sister yesterday and told her that I feel like I’m going to have a nervous breakdown ” I’m going crazy. What in God’s name is wrong with me? Today, I sign back on to Lovefraud.com because I’m in desperate need of support and encouragement and there’s your post. Your post explained it perfectly! Background: been with my husband for six years (one year dating, five years married). Second marriage for both of us, and the children from both marriages were grown. Yes, the first year was perfect ”“ ahhh, the “lovebombing” stage ” everything moved quick ” a whirlwind romance. I fell hard and fast. He has a great job which he has held since he graduated high school (i.e. stable); close-knit family, beautiful home/land which he owns free-and-clear; we shared the same interests (or so I thought at the time); shared the same values (or so I thought at the time); and shared the same spiritual beliefs (”or so I thought at the time). Once we were married, the spath behaviors started to come to the surface. I remember the first time I confronted him about not doing and saying the nice things that he used to, his response was, “I don’t have to anymore. We’re married now”. I’ve never been exposed to this type of personality before, and I didn’t have a clue what was happening. I started to change, and not in a good way. The strong, confident, positive woman that I was, became this insecure, timid, lifeless person that no one recognized. This relationship was destroying me. I became untrustworthy (he’s a pathological liar) but he convinced me that I misunderstood, misinterpreted, misread, etc. “I was just joking. Guess I can’t joke with you”. I also learned he’s a thief (mostly from his employer and it’s not pens and post-its either). Two years of this before I started researching “pathological liar” and “verbal and mental abuse” and came upon the lovefraud.com website. This site was a Godsend ” yes, even though I’m still with him, it was a Godsend. Reading all the posts was like reading my life with my husband. The same behaviors ” the same stories. The site gave me the strength to do what I knew I needed to do ” and that was to leave him. We have no children together. The house/property is in his name. We have separate bank accounts. My situation is easy to leave as far as the legal aspects go. About two years ago, behind his back, which I still feel guilty about, I bought a house and began moving out of his house into mine. I did this while he was at work because I could not handle the angry confrontation I knew would happen if I told him ahead of time. BUT ” I ended up calling him at work to tell him. The picture of him coming home to me and my things being gone without knowing was destroying me. I just couldn’t do it. First mistake. Second mistake was that I agreed I would stay at the house until he got home from work so we could talk. He cried. Begged me to stay. He’d change. He loved me. He didn’t want to be alone again. He twisted what I thought I knew as truths into “that’s not what I meant”, “I would never do that to you purposely”, etc. Yes, he played me. So I stayed; however, I kept the house I bought and I didn’t move my things back in. To this day, two years later, I still have the house (I’m renovating it on my own ” love doing rehab work), and my things are either at that house or are in storage ” I never moved anything back in. So, how sad is it that for two years, I’ve been living in a house where none of my belongings (other than clothes) are. I’m such a messed person. Ugh. Anyway, in these two years, I’m on verge of leaving and he reels me back in. This goes on every two months or so. To use the frog analogy ” the water gets hot, almost boiling and then it gets nice and warm and comfortable, and then the heat starts turning up again and I try to jump, but can’t because I’m weak, and the water gets nice and warm and comfortable again. I tried on so many occasions these past two years to leave for good, but he honestly knows just what to say and do to make me stay ” to make me feel bad/guilty. I had moved more of my things out, and when he noticed, he said, “I thought things were good between us. You’ve blindsided me with this!” The last incident occurred at the end of September 2015. Another spath blowup. Crazy. I cried hysterically that entire day/night. The next day, he’s all sweet and innocent and I’m left feeling/thinking I’m going crazy. He has me convinced I’m the one who has the problem because I’m too sensitive, too emotional. Since then, he is doing and saying things he has never done or said in the six years we’ve been together. I think it’s lovebombing to the tenth degree, i.e. wanting to have Thanksgiving dinner at the house for my family (never happened or suggested before), wanting to go over to my daughter’s house on Christmas morning to watch the grandkids open their presents (never happened nor suggested before); giving my sister a hug and kiss on the cheek at Christmas (never happened before); took me out to dinner for New Year’s Eve (we’ve never done anything on New Year’s Eve ” ever); has been wearing his wedding ring the past three days (hasn’t worn it in three years); wants to take me on vacation to Bermuda at the end of the month (never happened or suggested before). It’s euphoria and fear at the same time. I’m in desperate need of guidance, direction, support, encouragement ”

Diane111 – it sounds like he is prepping for the “kill.” Trying to distract you while he plots something evil. I suggest you get out ASAP. In fact, you might want to move the remaining clothes to your other house and immediately go visit someone for a month preferably someone whom he doesn’t know. You need time away from him to clear your head and gather your strength.

He will never, ever change. He is taking advantage of your good nature. It’s time to put yourself first.

Good advice.

Diane111, you should be so proud of yourself hon…look what you HAVE accomplished about getting out of this abusive relationship! You have separate bank accounts, you have a home that you have set up to move into…these are HUGE HUGE STEPS!! Pat yourself on the back while you are living in a sociopath tornado you have been able to make steps on getting out.

Sociopath’s craziness literally exhaust their victims intentionally! We were all where you are now…we where all trying to escape their craziness. It’s not easy I could barely get out of bed because I was so exhausted mentally, emotionally & physically by my ex h’s gas lighting abuse, intimidation, craziness he subjected me to. It took a long time for me to escape him even thought I wanted to leave everyday.

I am so proud of you & happy that you have reached out for help here at Lovefraud. This is also a HUGE HUGE STEP that you have taken. Sociopaths isolate their victims & belittle their victims so much that the victims feels worthless and feels that know one will help them out of their relationship because the feel worthless. THIS IS NOT TRUE the sociopath are pathological liars…everything your husband say about is a LIE!! You are strong, you are a good person, you are still resourceful,

WE HEAR YOU DIANE111 !!!!!!!!

I want you to please pick up the phone and call the National Domestic Violence hotline right now…

in the USA 800-799-SAFE

to talk with a free counselor. Ask the counselors for your local abuse center number then call them and set up a free counseling session with one of their counselors. THIS WILL BE THE GREATEST GIFT YOU HAVE EVER DONE FOR YOURSELF. Do not feel embarrassed or ashamed just pick up the phone and you will find a kind hearted person on the other end of the line to help you out of this abusive relationship.

IT’S TIME FOR YOU TO GET OUT OF THIS ABUSIVE RELATIONSHIP!! ASAP!!

Ask the National Domestic Violence hotline counselor to talk to you about an “EXIT PLAN” out of your relationship. Also Google “Exit Plan Domestic abuse”, “Dr Phil Exit Plan” and “Exit Plan domestic abuse you tube”.

Reach out to your most trusted family & friends for help also. YOU ARE NOT ALONE…your husband wants to make you think that you are alone but you are NOT. Tell your friends what is going on in your marriage. Have them keep a journal of what you tell them this can be used in court. Keep a journal at work and write down everything that you husband has done to you mentally & physically, This also can be used in court. Write down dates, time who witnessed the abuse etc. Keep very good record of all the details.

You want to leave that is a good place to be Diane!! That means your mind is opened to leaving!.

YOU ARE NOT CRAZY….KNOW THIS!! Your husband is using gas lighting abuse on you to push you over your emotional edge intentionally so that he has control over you and he is doing this also so that you do not leave him. Google Gas lighting abuse & read up on it and also do a search right here on Lovefraud.

KEEP REACHING OUT FOR HELP DIANE….CALL THE NATIONAL DOMESTIC ABUSE HOTLINE ASAP

USA 800-799-SAFE

outside the USA google Domestic abuse Violence hotline with your countries name.

Take care.

Jan7, Thank you for your comment and the time you spent writing your thoughts to me and for me. I’m in desperate need of help and support and you have helped me tremendously. You completely hit on so many things that I have and am experiencing, even my thoughts and feelings. Ashamed and embarrassed are two of them. I’m 58 years old. I’m a professional in the business world. I should be able to handle this situation but I’m not. Thank you for saying you’re proud of me with what I have done so far. And that it was a positive move … that I’m doing the right thing. I needed to hear that. He is so good at playing me that I second-guess myself. I think, what if I’m wrong? what if he’s not a spath? what if I misjudged him?

And my sister, God love her, is keeping a journal on me. Even re-reading my initial post on here, I’m thinking, “Why the hell haven’t you left!?!” It’s tough to keep your mind focused on leaving when he’s being so kind, attentive, etc. I hate it. This is what makes me crazy in my head. And thank you so much for writing that it took you a long time to escape even though you wanted to leave everyday. That is exactly the place I’m at right now. I’m putting things in place, a lot already is in place, it’s getting the nerve, or whatever, to make the leap.

My gut-instincts, I believe, are right on target. My gut steered me to here. My gut is telling me to leave, if nothing more than for my mental sanity, and not to trust him … not to believe him. My gut is telling me that he’s playing “mind games” with me (the gaslighting you mentioned).

My faith is strong, so I do pray a lot to God, etc. Although I know He doesn’t want marriages to dissolve and wants us to keep our vows, I also know He doesn’t want me to be living like this either.

Thank you again, Jan7 … you’ve been wonderful

Hi Diane111, your welcome. Huge HUGS to you!! We have all been exactly where you are emotionally, mentally & physically. I wanted to leave everyday, I even started packing the house up too but the boxes sat filled in a room because me ex h promised me he would change but he never did and never will.

Your husband too will NEVER CHANGE EVER!

You are a smart business woman who’s job is to “fix problems” everyday at work and to advance your department to meet goals. This is your great mind set. But you have moved this mindset (like all of us did) into your personal life with a sociopath. This mindset does NOT work with a sociopath.

You are in the FIX MODE with your husband.

YOU CAN NOT FIX HIM…

YOU CAN NOT FIX YOUR MARRIAGE WITH A SOCIOPATHS!

This is what you have to wrap your mind around and once you do you will set yourself free from this evil man that is your husband.

I tried and tried and tried to fix my marriage after all we are told that “Marriage is hard work” and “dont give up on your marriage” this is all fine and dandy with a NORMAL person but when you are dealing with a sociopath this mentality does not work you will just end up on the Hamster wheel spinning to no whereville but you know what mentality does works well when dealing with a sociopath?

get your running shoes on and RUN RUN RUN RUN AS FAST AWAY FROM THEM AS POSSIBLE!!!

You are fast walking away from him right now by you having a separate bank account and buying a home for you only….NOW YOU NEED TO PICK UP THE PACE AND START TO RUN RUN RUN AWAY FROM HIM!!!

YOU CAN DO THIS!!

YOU ARE STRONG!!

YOU WILL NOT ONLY SURVIVE WITHOUT OUR HUSBAND BUT YOU WILL THRIVE WITHOUT HIM!!! Look at everything you accomplished before you met your husband!

Just a little back ground for you…I went to a top University in my field, worked in college to pay for college and still got good grades, then I slowly worked my way up to a job with a fortune 100 company. I worked with the top management team including the CEO but at home my life was a mess. I was a mess. I thought I was keeping my life together at work but looking back I was not functioning well at all….

i was not sleeping well because of the abuse i was enduring at home this impacted my thinking in every way…throw in the gas lighting, fear & intimidation etc etc that I lived, and all the craziness that my ex h was doing to belittle me to make be fail at everything in life…to fail as a friend, daughter, sister & co worker. He did not want me to be successful in any of these areas of my life. Why? because then he could not control me.

What do sociopaths want more than anything? to control people and have power over them!!

We went to marriage counseling where I described my husbands traits (without knowing I was describing a SOCIOPATH!! but never did she tell me to run). That did not work out very well because he manipulated the counselor and on the way home from each session he brain washed me by saying “dont trust this counselor” so I didn’t.

Fast forward to exactly where you are know I wanted out I was planing my escape alone never telling s soul that I was being abused never reaching out to individual counseling even though I knew something with my husband (now ex) was seriously wrong and with his family too.

When I finally did escape really crawl out of hell…I was a complete shell of my former self. Sigh…

It was not until I packed up my car and drove 3000 miles away from my ex h without him knowing did I finally call the domestic abuse hotline and find a individual counselor who told me the truth. I wish I would have done this YEARS earlier!!

The hotline gave me local abuse center numbers. I called and set up a meeting with a counselor. I got to the center early and sat in the parking lot in my expensive car and balled my eyes out thinking I am smart, I saw the RED flags from the second a met him, how the heck did I get sucked into his con game & stay so long. I was so embarrassed and ashamed of myself for putting myself in a relationship with a man that was not a good person…I pulled myself together as best as I could and went in to talked with counselor for a few hours I cried most of the time 🙁 but she was so nice & kind she told me her story about her abusive marriage. She encouraged me to go to a Abuse Center Women group meeting.

I was reluctant…embarrassed, ashamed still…but I went…I listen to the stories of the other women but I could not share my own that first time because I was on the verge of sobbing endlessly if I started to tell my story. But I can tell you that going to the meeting that day was the BEST THING I did for myself…even looking back now it is STILL the best thing that I did for myself. It was a HUGE step for me and a step that started me running away from my ex.

At the meeting there were about 40 women each sharing their story…about 80% were exactly like mine = mostly mental & emotional abuse. Some were extreme physical violent with mental & emotional abuse. These stories opened up my mind to what I was enduing and the realization that…YES I WAS IN A ABUSIVE MARRIAGE. Up until that time I was still trying to dissect my marriage on how to improve/fix the marriage…ie what was my part, how could I do things differently etc…STILL TRYING TO FIX THE MARRIAGE…

But after leaving that meeting I knew I could not fix my marriage & I could not fix my h (now ex). He will abuse ever women that he is with!

The only thing left was to impose the NO CONTACT RULE with him and find a cut throat lawyer to deal with the divorce.

It’s not easy emotionally when you finally do cut contact. These sociopaths have created an addiction in us…so breaking the addiction with them cold turkey is not easy…but it is worth it. This is where a good counselor who understands sociopath abuse comes into play…not all counselor have the understanding of what a sociopath truly does to their victims.

IT’S TIME TO GET OUT OF YOUR MARRIAGE.

We are here for you Diane…you are not alone. Please PLEASE call the National Domestic abuse hotline 800-799-SAFE asap TODAY 🙂

Take care,

oops the “Y” key did not get hit properly..Should read “your husband” not “our husband”
.
oops error…YOU WILL NOT ONLY SURVIVE WITHOUT OUR HUSBAND BUT YOU WILL THRIVE WITHOUT HIM!!!

Diane, google “cognative disturbance”…this is what is going on with you right now. Your mind opens up to the fact that you need to escape your marriage but your husband wheels you back in with his words.

You can escape him!!

That is exactly what is happening! And I am giving it my all to get out of from under him!

Thank you so much, Jan, for sharing your story with me! Honestly, my life/story is a mirror of yours. Although I don’t work for a Fortune 100 company, I am a member of leadership and report directly to the CEO too. Like you, I worked hard getting to the top – to be successful. But my personal life, a mess, just like you said. And like you said, the red flags were there prior to getting married but I didn’t listen … pushed them aside … thought, “Nah, your imagining things, Diane” … how stupid was I … and continue to be … UGH! Bawling your eyes out … yep, that’s me too. I did see a counselor most of last year but needed to quit because of the distance and time off of work. Again, I’m from a very small town and it’s about a two hour drive to any major city that has competent, licensed psychologists. My husband did agree to go with me but I didn’t want him there. I feared him doing to the counselor exactly what yours did, and I’d end up being worse off than I already was. The counselor did help me by validating that my husband has sociopathic characteristics but she really didn’t help me with what to do about it … how to escape it … how to protect myself from the manipulation. Even though I like who I am as a person, I know I can also be my worst enemy because of my personality/characteristics. I also know that when I leave, there will have to be – no doubt about it – HAVE TO BE – NO CONTACT! I know myself and I know I will get sucked back in if there’s any contact.

I do plan on contacting either the national domestic abuse hotline or an abuse center for support. Again, I will probably need to travel to attend appointments/meetings, but because you seem to have truly benefited from them,I will do whatever it takes. YOU have given me hope!!

Thanks for the Huge HUGS too .. and HUGS right back to you!

Hi Diane111, your welcome again 🙂 Our stories are very similar. Sociopaths target people that are “doers” people who are independent and get things done. They want someone to do everything for them so they can go off and do their evil manipulate deeds like cheating, manipulating others.

Know that sociopaths target…good, kind hearted, hard working people. THIS IS YOU. no matter what your husband says nasty about you to control you, you are NOT his words. Please know this.

You have accomplished so much prior to meeting your husband and while you are in this abusive relationship. Again you need to be proud of your accomplishments…pat yourself on the back and remember that you can survive without your husband because you are hardworking, resourceful, skilled worker, and kind hearted.

My ex h had my mind so twisted up I could not even find the door out of the marriage let alone even really function on a day to day. I hated being with him. There is no way in hell I would ever go back to him now!! NO WAY! And you will get to this point to. Your h has made you emotionally dependent on him..he broke your spirit down to control you to make you think you are dependent on him…but you are not. I thought this way to when with him.

When I finally had enough I packed my car and drove 3000 miles away without him knowing he was on a business trip. When I was about half way on my drive I literally felt a weight lift of of my shoulders…so crazy the way it felt but it was my body release all the stress I had been under. I could not read his raging ranting emails he sent me because they just stressed me out and I refused to take his calls. He was livid. I did not care. When I had divorce papers served he sent me a email stating “I though we were going to work things out”….I caught him in 3 affairs the day I left him and he had been extremely abusive. This is their mindset this is their brain washing to suck you back in.

This is when I found the counselor & went to the abuse center. My gut was telling me to not talk to him because of the way it made my body & mind feel. Then I read about the no contact rule. So our bodies now what to do.

Since it is difficult for you to go to counseling maybe talking to someone like Donna Anderson here at love fraud (she has a life coach serve just go up to the contact tab at the top of this site) or someone like Steven Hassan from Freedom of Mind Resource Center (they also do phone counseling). If you can’t speak freely at home then ask a friend if you can go in her guest room to speak to one/both of these resources. But I would highly recommend that you do one of these two calls or both. Your mind is open up from your husband brain washing right now this is the time to have someone further open your mind so that you finally escape the hell you are living in.

Steven Hassan is a domestic abuse & cult expert. He has several books and his site is under the Name Freedom of mind resource center. He is a leading expert who has been on CNN, Fox, 60 minutes, Larry King Live etc. I felt like a was being mind controlled by my ex when i asked my counselor the first day if my h was doing this to me she said YES!! this is what abusers do!

I then came home and researched the subject which lead me to Steven Hassan & then read his book…I felt like Steven had been observing my marriage when he wrote his book. It was shocking what these evil people really do to twist up our minds. What i learned from that book was all of these people (sociopaths) use mind control (brain washing) on their victims. Sociopaths are all CULT Leaders! It does not matter if they have one victims (i.e. domestic abuse) or 1 million victims such as someone like Hitler. They all use the same mental control. And you are being mentally controlled by your husband right now. This is the biggest reason why you feel stuck in your marriage & why you are not fleeing him.

The other thing I learned what the mindset I was thinking was also my physical body reacting to the daily stress I was under. My body (like all victims of domestic abuse) was releasing high levels of cortisol and adrenaline this cause our mind to not function as well and this can also make us feel stuck in our current situation. But again you are not stuck. What can you do about this issue? Find a good Endocrinologist Doctor and get tested for hormonal imbalance, vitamin & mineral deficiency, cortisol testing…all of these issues (adrenal fatigue) once corrected will give you your thinking power back. Look at the symptoms list on Drlam. com & Adrenalfatigue. org. To learn more about the physical reaction your body is under.

I have to go now but I will post again later. I am so glad that you reached out again to Lovefraud. keep reaching out for help Diane. You deserve so much better then what you are settling for right now. 🙂

Take care.

Diane, all victims of domestic abuse become stuck in their mindset (I did too) and can’t find a way out of their relationship because the vicim is literally in survival mode. What helps to “unstuck” if you will this mindset is someone asking the victim question. So if you dont mind Im going to ask you questions. But I want you to know that you dont have to answer them if you dont want instead you can simply get a sheet of paper out and write your answer for you to read only. But make sure that you either hide this paper or destroy it so that your husband dose not find it.

Why do you want to leave your husband? (list the mean/abusive things he has done to you whether verbally or physically.

Hi Jan7, (I can’t reply to your two latest posts, so hopefully you get this, and there was only one question on the last post, which I will answer sometime over the weekend). Never even thought about phone counseling! Thanks for the suggestion and letting me know that Donna does it, along with the information on Steve Hassan. Will definitely be getting his book and reaching out to both. I know I need “something” ” something to open my eyes ”“ my mind ”“ to what’s real and what’s not. I’m mentally exhausted going back and forth. The craziness ” “the tornado”. I love how you escaped, by packing up the car and driving away while he was gone. I will be doing the same. There’s no way I will be able to leave with his knowledge. Two things will happen ” he’ll either be extremely angry or he will be distraught. Either will prevent from leaving. I need to be strong mentally/emotionally, and I’m not there yet. And honestly, I don’t think I will be until I’m out from under his control, i.e. the NC. Just need to get there; and with your help, this site and other resources, I know I will ((HUGS))

Hi Diane111, so glad you will look into phone counseling. Steven Hassan might be the best for the first few calls because he specializes in helping people leave cults & domestic abuse relationship = opening the mind up!

Then Donna would be a good person to speak to about the hell you have been enduring & to understand all the sick & twisted mind games your h did to you.

TWO OTHER BOOKS TO BUY:

DONNA ANDERSONS LOVEFRAUD (go to the top of this site and look under Book store tab or amazon)

WOMEN WHO LOVE PSYCHOATHS BY SANDRA BROWN my counselor gave me this book to read when I first left my husband it explains everything!

Yes, I only asked one question in that post…I will ask a question after you answer each question that way you have time to just think about one question.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE BE CAREFUL AROUND YOUR HUSBAND DO NOT TELL HIM WHAT YOU HAVE LEARNED OR WHAT YOU ARE PLANNING ON DOING OR WHO HE IS…this is the most critical time to lie and fake that nothing has changed!! This is what you have to do to stay safe. ALSO CALL THE NATIONAL DOMESTIC ABUSE CENTER TO GET THEIR HELP WITH A EXIT PLAN OUT OF YOUR RELATIONSHIP!!

Like Donna stated in your post to you go to a friends house that your husband does not know or a family members home so that you have a Safe Home when you escape. For me when I drove those 3000 miles away I stopped and a family members home and then went to a secure condo building that he could not get into.

The most dangerous time for a woman in a abusive relationship is when she is leaving or has just left. SO FOLLOW YOUR GUT!!!

YOU ARE DOING GREAT HON. KEEP MAKING STEP OUT SOON YOU WILL BE RUNNING FREE!!! 🙂

Take care.

Hi Jan7,
You said, “My ex h hid things from day one…and when asked he would change the subject or turn it around to blame me for something i.e. cheating etc.” Yep, exactly. He has a way of manipulating the facts to where I was mistaken/misunderstood ” he didn’t lie ” he wasn’t hiding anything. The fingerprint access to the cell phone. His reason why he had to go to that was because he couldn’t remember his passcode. Whatever. Why did he need even the passcode?? My phone has no passcode. Anyone can pick it up and use it ” read texts, see who called, etc. I have nothing to hide.

You said, “The cycle of abuse teaches (or trains us is a better word) to accept their bad behavior…when they switch to the honeymoon stage our mind triggers a positive reinforcement and so we forget about the abuse.” Yep, that is so right on!! Earlier in the relationship I would ask questions about this and about that, and because of the reaction I would get, I stopped asking, etc. He taught me how to behave/act with him. I was “trained”. And I’m smack-dab in the middle of the honeymoon stage!

Thank you SO much for your support and words of encouragement!! Saying you’re proud of me and not judging me. Building my confidence. You don’t know how much I look forward to reading, and need to read, your comments! 

Hi Diane111, your SO welcome. I have been exactly where you are…my mind so twisted up from my ex h manipulation, gas lifting abuse, reward & punishment, intimidation, craziness, pathological lying.

I never opened up to anyone during my marriage….in the beginning of our relationship he told me that he “hated that his ex gf talked to others” about their relationship. So guess what I did = did not talk to others. This is the underhanded stealth manipulation that they do all intentionally to control us. It’s all about power & control for a socioapth. Doesnt matter if it is with the guy waiting on the your table at a restaurant or someone at work i.e. a boss or their spouse at home. They have to have power & control over others.

Everything they do is to control us & our behavior.

** Ask yourself this: What are the reasons you stay with your abusive husband?

for me I made up every excuse in the book = my marriage vows, being raised catholic that factor in, the myths that “marriage is hard work” or “you have to work hard at your marriage” or “don’t give up on your marriage so easily” all of these saying. I even thought that our stray cat that won the lottery one night and broke into our home (haha) would not like to live an another location as she only knew that yard and our house her whole life.

Our minds play lots of tricks on us trying to rationalize all the sociopaths craziness. The love bombing honey money stages is a very dangerous stage for us mentally because it distorts the truth of the relationship the reality of the relationship.

We think that things will finally be normal…but I can tell you that being married to my ex for 12 years THEY ARE NOT NORMAL AND NOTHING THEY DO IS NORMAL. They are mentally crazy. The original term used back in the 1800’s for sociopaths/psychopath was Morally Insane. That is the best term it speaks volumes into who they are and it speaks volumes of who you are trying to have a normal relationship.

Reread Donna’s original post about the “honeymoon/lovebombing stage”. She is correct. When I finally had proof of my ex h affair (he had many) I was done I was leaving but he sucked me back into to the relationships by using his friends. I was so broken down I did not have the strength to deal with yet more people telling me what to do = stay in the marriage.

During this time my ex h started to love bomb me back in…he took me on a trip to Mexico over christmas on Christmas morning he game me expensive earrings something that he never did before but at the same moment he wanted me to sign a contract. He had just woken me up literally gave me the earnings and then wanted me to sign a contract without reading it. Which I refused. He explained that he was borrowing money from a friend to buy a boat for $250,000!!!

It was all to control me financially to keep me in the marriage and for him to get something out of the marriage if I did walk. This is how they think in the honey moon stage it’s all to control your mind & for them to get something out of it.

This is where Donna’s post is spot on…your husband is doing something right now behind your back to manipulate you!! This is what victims of sociopath do not understand at the time but looking back once out they realize they were completely and utterly conned by their spouse sociopath. So please BEWARE because others have been harmed physically this is why I told you in your first post that you should not go to Bermuda with him!! For your safety please follow your gut!! And your gut was screaming not to go because you used the words you had “FEAR” of your husband.

BTW when I escaped & divorced him he got to keep most of our assets including the boat which he devalued substantially in the divorce papers and the boat was paid off. So staying not only cost me my time which I can never get back but it also cost me financially too.

THIS IS FROM THE NATIONAL DOMESTIC VIOLENCE HOTLINE WEBSITE:

Why do Abuse Victims Stay?

“You’re telling me that your husband beat you up. I would never put up with that abuse. Why don’t you just leave him.”

We often put ourselves in the place of the victims and imagine ourselves leaving at the first signs of abuse. But breaking free of abuse is not simply a matter of walking out the door. Leaving is a process.

It can be difficult for many people to understand why a person would stay in an abusive relationship. But there are many reasons. Strong emotional and psychological forces keep the victim tied to the abuser. Sometimes situational realities like a lack of money keep the victim from leaving. The reasons for staying vary from one victim to the next, and they usually involve several factors.

Emotional reasons for staying

belief that the abusive partner will change because of his remorse and promises to stop battering
fear of the abuser who threatens to kill the victim if abuse is reported to anyone
lack of emotional support
guilt over the failure of the relationship
attachment to the partner
fear of making major life changes
feeling responsible for the abuse
feeling helpless, hopeless and trapped
belief that she is the only one who can help the abuser with his problems
Situational reasons for staying

economic dependence on the abuser
fear of physical harm to self or children
fear of emotional damage to the children over the loss of a parent, even if that parent is abusive
fear of losing custody of the children because the abuser threatens to take the children if victim tries to leave
lack of job skills
social isolation and lack of support because abuser is often the victim’s only support system
lack of information regarding domestic violence resources
belief that law enforcement will not take her seriously
lack of alternative housing
cultural or religious constraints

I will post daily for you Diane. I know that coming to Lovefraud is a life line for you. I just want you to know that you are not alone. Keep reaching out to the Domestic Violence hotline 800-799-SAFE as many times as you need and contact your local abuse center. I know you live far from them but maybe you can call a counselor on the phone vs driving to their building. Each time you talk out about your abuser it really does help to open up your mind.

I know that your emotional are all over the place right now. Been there too. It’s overwhelming and exhausting to have your emotions all over the place but keep reading & venting on Lovefraud and you will one day say I am leaving him for good.

Open a fake email account and then a fake Facebook page and look at the sites One moms battle and also Psychopath Free. They both are excellent support sites for you to gather more info and find support. I am not running you off so please do not think that I just want you to gather more info so you can make your decision of when you want to leave your abuser.

On the Facebook One moms battle it deals with court issues divorce and also child custody. Since you and your h do not have children you won’t have to ask question about that (thank goodness) but you can ask questions about divorcing a narcissist & sociopath. Even though you have things separated he may fight tooth and nail for anything and everything, On their you can find lawyers list that understand sociopath abuse.

The other Facebook is Psychopath Free its excellent for daily article reading that they post. And the comments from other victims are really good to read so that you know you are not alone and so many others understand like myself what you are going through daily.

Diane you are doing great you are making great strives to see the truth in your h and for leaving him. YES I am so proud of you it is not easy to escape a sociopath. But you have really done a amazing job to slowly leave him i.e. home to move into, bank account in your name, searching for help etc.

Till tomorrow Diane, take care 🌷🌻🌺

Diane111, sending big hugs! Jan7 is right, you are doing great.

I just wanted you to know that Jan7 was one of the first people to respond when I posted/learned I had been in a “relationship” with a sociopath for 5 years…and yes, I’m in my 50s, a professional and thought I was excellent at reading people.

I am now at 9 months of No Contact thanks to all of Jan7’s advice, education, words of encouragement, etc (Janedoe is my other source of strength).

Please keep reading, posting and asking questions.

Jan7, how are you? Can you believe it has been 9 months NC for me? While I still have a few bad dreams/triggers now and again, I’m doing great…enjoying a peaceful life.

Anyway, I don’t want to take away from Diane111. Just wanted to see how you are and thank you again for all your help.

Hi Amille22, you are reading my mind! I was just thinking about you the other day when I was type to Diane111 and was wondering how you were doing!

Little ESP there 🙂

WOW 9 months No Contact! Fantastic!! You should be so proud it shows your strength & also it shows that you know you deserve so much better!

Triggers do go away so just hang in their & work through them emotionally.

Amille, you always give such great advise to others her at love fraud so I hope you will do the same for Diane111. It think it really helps out someone coming here to hear our stories with our ex’s so they can related it to your relationship and see that YES they are in a abusive relationships. For me the stories people shared with me when I first left my ex & found out he was a sociopath helped tremendously.

Glad you are doing better!! Take care 🙂

Hi Jan7,

I wish I could be on here on a daily basis to get a daily dose of encouragement and strength but my present living arrangements prevents it.

Yesterday was a “down” day for me. Nothing in particular happened, just was mentally overwhelmed with everything and wallowing in self-pity. I am better today, though, thank goodness 😊

My thoughts on the text messages: he was getting satisfaction/kicks from believing that he was getting one over on me – hiding something from me; and believing he still had a connection with his ex. Although she left him, they were high school sweethearts and were together a long time, and do have two children. She never remarried and lives alone. It’s possible she may want him back. That would have brothered me a couple years ago, but not anymore. Actually right now I wish that was the truth. What bothered me about the texting was his hiding it from me … the mind-games so to say.

Hopefully I will be out of here soon. I know the next challenge will be the NC but I can’t wait to take it on!

Hi Diane, its normal to be “overwhelmed” when you are living with a sociopath. Its ok to “wallow in self pity”…but its important also to just remember to breath. Just put your hand on your heart when you become overwhelmed and just feel your breath and heart rate. Take deep breaths from your stomach. Its easy to become so overwhelmed that we forget this simple thing to calm us down.

Hugs to you

Its a good time to also pick up the phone and call the National Domestic violence hotline to talk with a free counselor. Its hard to deal with the nightmare alone so please know you are not alone.

Also during this time shift your mindset to thinking how you want your new life to look like.

example: Are you going to plant flowers in your new homes yard this spring & summer? Then imagine what flowers you are going to plant and where in your yard. Things like that.

And you can also get a piece of paper out and write down all the things you want to do that you have put off for years. If you always want to paint then put this down and go to the library to pick up book on the subject…the sky is the limit what you can do Diane.

in these times its incredible important to think about your EXIT PLAN out this abusive relationship and how each day you are going to make a step to finally get out for good. Dont for get you can also call Donna Anderson here at love fraud to talk with her.

I dont know if you remember me posting about breaks ups and high levels of cortisol hormone being released in our bodies. This high level cortisol causes anxiety…that anxiousness (feeling overwhelmed) you feel and when you are living with a sociopath victims have high levels of cortisol. This too prevents you from thinking clearly and finding the door out of your relationship.

What can you do about this?

Look at the site Drlam. com and Adrenalfatigue. org read/watch their videos/look at their symptoms list

Then find a Endocrinologist doctor (best to find a female doctor if you can) then go and tell that doctor that you are planning on leaving and you are under a tremendous amount of stress. Have the doctor test you for cortisol levels and also vitamin and mineral deficiency. Both of these are extremely common for a abuse victim.

Google “vitamin deficiency and depression then with the word anxiety.

Also google Dr Amen Depression you tube

Your body is reacting to the danger you are in and so you have to listen to your body. Right now your body is in survival mode. Make a list of the symptoms you are feeling so you can give the list to your doctor. On another site the site creator posted at request for those that had health issues during their abusive relationship and over 300 victims posted a lengthily response to the symptoms or illness they had and most all had anxiety and depression.

You are going to have a new wonderful life soon. Keep reaching out to your local abuse center and ask them if you can phone in for counseling since they are located to far for you to travel.

As for his ex wife that is EXCELLENT thinking Diane with regards to you not caring if he would go back to her. I too did the same for me the three mistresses (that I know off) at the end of my married without knowing helped me escape because he was too busy with them.

The no contact rule is not easy. But you take one day at a time. Getting your body balanced from all the stress you have been under not just with this husband but with your ex h (btw I am sorry that you went through so much with him too) with help easy the NO contact rule. Also you might want to ask your local abuse center about a restraining order the day you leave him. This helps to stop him contacting you and it helps you from contacting him.

Hugs to you. Hope you have a better day today!! Take care. 🌷🌷🌷

Diane, DO NOT GO TO BERMUDA WITH HIM!!!

You state “It’s euphoria and fear at the same time”

PLEASE LISTEN TO YOUR GUT INSTINCT…. IT IS TELLING YOU TO BE FEARFUL OF YOUR HUSBAND!!!

Google “Oprah Gavin Debecker You tube” to watch their interview on listening to your gut instinct IT WILL REMIND YOU TO NEVER WEAVER FROM YOUR GUT INSTINCT.

Hi Jan7, I wasn’t able to get on the site over the weekend, but I was able to put together my answer to your question. He’s never been physically abusive to me so what I have been up against is related mostly to behaviors/characteristics and the verbal abuse. What I have listed below is just surface things. I’m making another list, listing actual events/stories in detail.

1. He’s a pathological liar. I don’t trust what he says to me is the truth. I’m always questioning.
2. He steals. He’s a thief. Mainly from his employer but from restaurants too.
3. He doesn’t go to church. He used to when we first getting together but then stopped. Wouldn’t be that much of an issue, but I quit going to because of him. His manipulation.
4. In an instant, he can become angry … and it’s a mean, ugly anger.
5. He’s doesn’t get involved/not interested in my children or my grandchildren’s lives.
6. He doesn’t include me … doesn’t tell me … anything that is going on with his family or with his children. I always overhear people when they talk at family gatherings.
7. Adding to number 5 and number 6 above, although we have been together for six years, married for five, our lives have not merged/blended at all … not one little bit.

I’ll get back to you on the actual traumatic events, at least for me they were traumatic. As I’m sitting here writing this, I’m recalling those times and wondering, “Why didn’t I leave then?!?!” “Why don’t I leave now?!?!” But, no, I’m here thinking, “But he hasn’t been that way lately” and “What if he’s truly trying to be a better person?”

Good gosh … anyway, I will be back in touch with the actual incidents.

Thanks, Jan7!!

Diane111

Hi Diane, no worries..I too could not log on LF this weekend wasn’t working correctly for some reason. I want you to know that there is no time line to answer the question. The reason for asking & for you to answer is simply to open your mind up to the true reality you are living.

Sociopaths play so many mind games that the victim (including my ex on me when I was still married) can not find the door out of their abusive relationship. I literally wanted someone anyone to swoop in and carry me out of my home because I was so mentally, emotional & physical exhausted from my h (now ex) that I could not find the door out of the relationship myself.

I felt like my ex h had put a bird cage over my head and controlled me, my every move but most importantly he controlled my mind my thinking process. Like a bird trapped in a cage. I feel the same is happening with you too. Thinking about the question is a good thing it will bring up the pattern of your husband abuse towards you. This is what you want…it’s painful to rehash old abuse but it is necessary to see the truth in your relationship so that you can see that he will never change and that the abuse has been happening your entire relationship.

The cycle of abuse is “honeymoon stage, tension building stage, abuse stage then back to honeymoon stage”. This is why you think “But he hasn’t been that way lately” and “What if he’s truly trying to be a better person?”. He has trained you exactly like a circus animal is trained to perform. You (& me when married) start to accept this pattern of behavior in our mates…we are waiting for the honeymoon stage to kick in..and in our mind we think awe we have peace again.. this time he will be nice here in out…the peace will last but it never last the cycle of abuse will always happen by your husband just like it was with my ex.

I spent 12 years trying to make my marriage work…hoping that we would have peace…never did I have peace until I left and learned the truth about him = he is a sociopath. Sociopaths never change.

Did you know that lying is ABUSE?

did you know that lying to someones face is emotional & mental abuse (&verbal)

did you know that omission of info in ABUSE?

Most people did not know what abuse is…we are taught to believe that abuse is only physical but did you know that the bulk of domestic abuse is actually mental, verbal, emotional, and financial abuse?

THIS IS FACT!

Did you know that Most victims of abuse are not physically abused by their abuse during their relationship. Physically abuse does not typically happen until the victim is about to leave or has left this is why an EXIT PLAN out of your marriage is essential!

My ex too was so masterful with his lying and omission of info everything was so vague with him secretive…now I know the reason = he was living a double & triple lying life behind my back. he would even lie about what he ate for breakfast to my face even if I cooked him breakfast these are the sick mind games they play. Your husband too!!

Your husband may have many woman on the side…sociopaths are know to have sex addictions and have multiple affairs I thought my ex h had 7 to 12 affairs during our marriage my counselor told me that it was more like 3 to 4 times that amount as this is what sociopaths do…they cheat, lie, steal, abuse.

If you want to know if he is cheating look at his cell phone bill…see patterns of calls over and over this is most likely cheating. Obviously you would have to do a computer “phone reverse look up” to see who he is calling. IF YOU CHOOSE TO SEE WHAT HE IS UP TO BY LOOKING AT HIS PHONE BILL PLEASE BE SAFE DOING IT…IF YOU FIND OUT HE IS CHEATING DO NOT CONFRONT HIM FOR YOUR SAFETY!! Do not blame the other woman she is just sucked into your h manipulate con game…like my ex did to me. Ask your sister for help if you want the truth.

Stealing…this is really really bad!! This is a man who does not care about rules or laws he only cares about his needs & wants. PLEASE be careful especially when you leave these evil guys will turn the table and blame the victim for stealing and I have read so many accounts that the victim ends up in arrested and in jail. So crazy & scary what lengths these evil sociopaths will go to to shift the blame and to destroy their spouse for leaving them. PLEASE keep a journal of all the things he does that is illegal and hide it at your sisters house.

To live with someone that is stealing must be extremely stressful for you Diane. My ex would manipulate things from others by his words…he was always coming home with something he conned off of someone. This was stressful and embarrassing even though I had nothing to do with his manipulation of others.

In the book Freedom of mind by Steven Hassan he states that anyone under some else mind control should go back to their religious roots. Why? because it will awaken your mind to your old self. Ask your family or friends to come by your home to pick you up (for your safety) and return to church. In addition to going to church again you will connect with new people and connect with the outside world again. If you think your h will get upset dont tell him you are going until your family/friends ring the door bell to bring you to church. If he wants to go…then have your friends/famiy join you both but if you can avoid him going that is best because you will be establishing a safe place for after you leave him.

It’s so scary when the fly off the handle with their anger. My ex h would do the same this is part of how they control us…and why we end up walking on egg shells not to set them off. Please be careful now while you are planning your escape it is best to bit your tongue until you leave him. Remember he wants like all sociopaths want is control & power over you.

Start calling his family start sharing some things that he does to you…slowly though…open their mind up to what is really going on. Keep in mind that sociopaths isolate everyone from each other to keep control over everyone. They also do this so they can start a smear campaign (google) against their mate which will roll into sociopath triangulation (google). Be careful how you present the info to his family. But remember your safety is most important and if this is going to set your h off then avoid it at all cost.

It’s very common for marriages to a sociopath not to be “blended/merged” for a number of reasons…1) they dont care about anyone as long as you are giving them what they want…ie for my ex h he wanted me to take care of everything in the house/business while he was out cheating….he also used me to look normal as I was a professional & also responsible citizen/friend etc but most importantly he used me for $$$. 2) he might have had someone on the side all along and this is why he has not blended your marriage. Either way look at this as not normal behavior and another reason to leave him.

I am so sorry that you are enduring this hell from someone who should be only showing you respect and love. Keep opening your mind up…remember Actions speak louder then words.

Keep List his horrible actions like you did above to keep opening your mind up to reality. Focus on his horrible behavior over and over in your mind..dont focus on what he is doing now to be “fake nice”..it’s a con game = honeymoon cycle of abuse.

Thank you for taking the time to write these things down. Not easy to look back but will help you so much. Think about contacting someone like Steven Hassan who is a trained and certified counselor and would be better to guide your mind up.

I won’t ask a new question yet because it’s clear you still want to focus on this question….this is a very important questions so I am glad that you still want to focus on it. Writing everything down will also help you went you decide to start divorce proceedings.

You are going to get through all of this craziness & nightmare. You will shine again Diane111 be kind to yourself now. Keep opening your mind up from your h brain washing and mind control.

Hugs to you tonight 🙂 Take care.

From the National Domestic violence website:

Warning Signs and Red Flags
It’s not always easy to tell at the beginning of a relationship if it will become abusive.

In fact, many abusive partners may seem absolutely perfect in the early stages of a relationship. Possessive and controlling behaviors don’t always appear overnight, but rather emerge and intensify as the relationship grows.

Domestic violence doesn’t look the same in every relationship because every relationship is different. But one thing most abusive relationships have in common is that the abusive partner does many different kinds of things to have more power and control over their partners.

If you’re beginning to feel as if your partner or a loved one’s partner is becoming abusive, there are a few behaviors that you can look out for. Watch out for these red flags and if you’re experiencing one or more of them in your relationship, call or chat online with an advocate to talk about what’s going on.

Telling you that you can never do anything right

Showing jealousy of your friends and time spent away

Keeping you or discouraging you from seeing friends or family members

Embarrassing or shaming you with put-downs

Controlling every penny spent in the household

Taking your money or refusing to give you money for expenses

Looking at you or acting in ways that scare you

Controlling who you see, where you go, or what you do

Preventing you from making your own decisions

Telling you that you are a bad parent or threatening to harm or take away your children

Preventing you from working or attending school

Destroying your property or threatening to hurt or kill your pets

Intimidating you with guns, knives or other weapons

Pressuring you to have sex when you don’t want to or do things sexually you’re not comfortable with

Pressuring you to use drugs or alcohol

Diane111 also google “Domestic abuse power & control wheel”. To see the cycle of abuse first hand. It’s quite shocking to see it first hand & really does help to see the pattern of behavior in your husband.

for your safety Be sure to clear you computer “History” each time you are on a new site.

Hi Jan7,
There hasn’t been too much privacy for me lately to where I can be on LF and respond.
I’m feeling exactly like you did ” wanting someone to swoop in and carry me out of this house because I do not have the mental strength to do it on my own. Extremely exhausting. And that’s a good analogy ” a bird cage! I feel trapped ” not physically, but mentally.
Given what I’ve been reading and your input, I am most definitely in the “honeymoon stage” again. And this time, it’s so much more than before. Like I said in an earlier post, he’s doing and saying things that he’s never done or said before ” ever. If I could erase the past five years’ incidents for my mind, I’d be on cloud-nine right now ” it’s heaven. However, I can’t erase those words/behaviors, nor do I want to ” they are keeping me grounded in reality ” so I am on guard. On the outside, I’m the perfect wife ” going along with the marriage ” being happy, but on the inside, it’s nothing but turmoil. Because of his anger, etc., he’s trained me ”“ I’ve learned ”“ not to react or say anything to upset him, so to him and the outside world, the marriage is wonderful.
Lying being considered abuse never even crossed my mind! But you are so right, it is! As with lying, never considered omission of information as abuse either. These two areas he does ALL the time! And oh my gosh, your ex and mine h are so freaking similar. Yes, lie about stupid things that just don’t matter.
I’m just not sure about the cheating ” I don’t believe he is or has. I could be extremely, totally naïve about this though given my track record LOL. The reason why I don’t think he is or has is that if he’s not working, he’s home ” he doesn’t travel and he doesn’t go out with friends or to bars/drinking, etc. and never goes anywhere by himself. I used to check his cell phone for calls and texts, but he then went to the phone that you access with your fingerprint. I did try then to check his phone bill but he gets it “paperless” and when I signed on to his account, after discovering his password, the website actually displays when the last time you signed in to your account ”“ he knew “someone” was in his account, so he changed his password. I’m terrified to try to hack into it again ” he’ll know for sure it was me then. Back when I could check calls and texts, there were many about things that he never would tell me about, i.e. getting invited to family birthday parties, stuff going on with his kids, etc. There were a lot from his ex-wife also. I never know anything about her ” he never mentions her. Again, a lot of secretive things that shouldn’t be secret in a husband/wife relationship.
The stealing is bad! It’s an addiction/sickness to him ” I don’t think he can help himself. From work, it’s not like he takes a box of paper towels and then uses it and then takes another box to replace it; no, it’s boxes upon boxes of paper towels, garbage bags, batteries; cans upon cans of WD40; bags upon bags of gloves, safety glasses; bottles upon bottles of cleaners. The basement looks like a stock room full of supplies. And honestly, he doesn’t see anything wrong with it. Again, he feels the company owes him. He refers to them as “communist bastards”.
Financially, he hasn’t used me for any of that (again, unless I’m being naïve), so he’s not sucking me dry money-wise. He has his money/bank account and I have mine. Everything is pretty much separate. He pays the house expenses, i.e. taxes, utilities, etc., since the house is his. I pay for the DirecTV and the food/groceries. And the food/groceries include paying the bill whenever we go out to eat. I pay for my own car and car insurance. Oh, when we got married, we got married out of state ” I did foot most of the bill for that trip. Guess that was the start of it hahaha
Gotta go ” will write more later on. Take care ” ((hugs))

Hi Diane111, I am glad that you are consciencly aware that you have to pick your times to come here so that your husband does not find out. This is good thinking on your part. Dont forget to clear you history on your computer each time you are on the internet searching or typing here.

WOW…your ex is a hoarder like my ex h!!! My ex would come home with “crap” all the time…I would tell him that the house was sinking with all the stuff he was coming home with. When he went on a business trip one time I had my cousin come over to help me clear out the basement. It took 95 huge garage bags to clear part of it out. It was so crazy that amount of stuff he either bought, found or conned out of people. Nothing was ever used just stored in the basement. CRAZY. And I was part of it for staying with a man that was like this. It was not until I left that I saw a show on tv about hoarding and I realized that was what my ex was doing. He would always tell me it was because he did not have much growing up but I found out this was a lie too he did the same as a teen. To a sociopath everything is an object even people to them are objects this is why it is so dangerous to leave them.

The other thing that is a RED FLAG is the personal finger protection he has on his phone. I can see if you loose the phone its smart but to block your spouse out of your phone without have their finger print stored is a RED FLAG that he is hiding something.

DONT WORRY about the bills or his phone you can always get them with a lawyer during divorce process if you want.

You state: ” I can’t erase those words/behaviors, nor do I want to ” they are keeping me grounded in reality ” so I am on guard.”

This is good that your thinking is also reality. Dont ignore his behavior meaning SEE it for what it really is abuse, craziness etc. But what ever you do DO NOT call him out on his behavior now that you are in the escape process just come here and vent if need be but you dont want to enrage him and put yourself in danger.

You State: ” On the outside, I’m the perfect wife ” going along with the marriage ” being happy, but on the inside, it’s nothing but turmoil”

This was me too Diane and every victim of abuse..on the outside we look calm but on the inside our anxiety level is/was on full alart for the danger we are living. Our bodies are reacting on HIGH alert but we are not responding to the danger we are stuffing our emotions & feelings down. All of these feelings will come up once you leave it’s overwhelming.

You are in hyper vigilant stage right now…one pins and needle for your husband to get mad,angry…you are walking on egg shells. Look into adrenal fatigue and it’s symptoms. Its’ not all in our minds but it is an actual physical body issue that our bodies are releasing high levels of hormones including cortisol & adrenaline (fight or flight mode) and maybe your blood pressure is high because of all the stress you are under.

Look into getting tested for cortisol levels, hormonal imbalance and high blood pressure these are all issues with victims of abuse and once corrected back to the normal range will help you to think clearly…it’s quite shocking once you have your body balanced how your thinking clears up too and it is easy to find the door out of the relationship. All breakups the body releases high levels of cortisol this = anxiety & depression. With a sociopath the body is constantly releasing high levels of cortisol and adrenaline = constantly anxious and depressed. It as if you are living in a home with a tiger or lion and everyday you are just trying to stay alive and your body is reacting to this daily stress.

You state: “There were a lot from his ex-wife also. I never know anything about her ” he never mentions her. Again, a lot of secretive things that shouldn’t be secret in a husband/wife relationship.”

This is another RED FLAG..if you want you can find out what county he filed divorce papers in and see if his ex wife put in the papers any abuse this will help you in your divorce proceedings. And it will give you more insight into who you are dealing with to open you mindset even more. Sociopaths have a long history of abuse.

You state: stealing from his company”And honestly, he doesn’t see anything wrong with it. Again, he feels the company owes him. He refers to them as “communist bastards”.”

YOU SEE that his behavior is NOT normal!! This is stealing!! This is against the law!!

In marriage we try to have peace…it’s not easy to live with someone who might have different up brings and we adjust to these differences. But your husband an my ex are HOARDERS this is a mental illness!! This is NOT NORMAL….and along with his abuse and secret live and him calling his buses “communist bastards” these are all RED FLAGS THAT HE IS NOT NORMAL!!

You have to make the decision of when you are not going to settle anymore…that you are not going to let his horrible behavior just be.

You do not owe this grown man anything more…he will suck you emotional & mentally dry! You can give him doctors & therapist names all day long but he is never going to change ever. Sociopaths have a different brain then normal people this is a medical fact. Their brains are wired completely opposite to ours and their brains do not work in the emotional region of the brain this is why they will not change ever.

Diane, Can you see yourself living with this mentally ill man for the rest of your life?

Hi Diane111, Donna just posted info on this book yesterday here at Lovefraud. I think you might be interested in this book as it will help guide you out of your abusive relationship with a sociopath.

Amber Ault, Ph.D., MSW, is a member of the Lovefraud Professional Resources Guide and author of “The Five Step Exit—The skills you need to leave a narcissist, psychopath or other toxic partner and recover your happiness now.”

Just do a search on Amber Ault at the top right of Lovefraud & you can read what donna wrote about this book. This will help lift the bird cage your husband has put over your mind.

Hi Jan7, To quote Dr. Phil, “He who has nothing to hide, hides nothing”. So very true. I’m sure he changed his passwords on his accounts and went to a fingerprint access on his iPhone because he knew I was checking his accounts and his phone. So, really, it was me who couldn’t be trusted; HOWEVER, I would never had done those things had he not given me reason to not trust him first. He was and is the one who is keeping/hiding things from me ” there’s no doubt in my mind. There are things that I am keeping from him but those things I’m keeping from him are for my safety and well-being, i.e. being on LF, etc.
My h and his ex were married for twenty years. I believe she left him for the same behaviors that he is exhibiting with me. Again, we are from a very small town. We all went to the same school (weren’t in the same grade but were in the same school) so we do know each other. She and I do not communicate except if we run into each other somewhere and even then it’s just “hi” in passing. My h never talks about her ” doesn’t mention her name ” even though I know he talks and texts her. It’s like he has two lives ” the one with me and then the one with her. They’ve been divorced now for about 15 years, I think. They have two children together. A son who is 27 and a daughter who is 22. And as I commented in other posts, I am not involved/don’t know anything that is going on in their lives ”“ just the basics. Details about their lives ”“ the going-ons ”“ are discussed with the ex.
I’m still working on the question ” it’s crazy how much has happened over the past six years. Makes me shake my head. Each thing that I write down, hardens my heart a little more. I think I’m heading in the right direction!

Hi Diane…YES!!! Dr. Phil, “He who has nothing to hide, hides nothing”.

This is exactly true! Most on this planet leave a simple honest life. Not to mean simple on terms of not exploring the world & learning new things but simple in just being true to themselves and to others.

My ex h hide things from day one…and when asked he would change the subject or turn it around to blame me for something i.e. cheating etc.

It’s very odd that he does not share his details of his children or ex wife. This is a RED flag into his mind. I remember our marriage counselor (yes I was stupid enough to go to marriage counseling with him = WASTE of time!!!) saying to my husband while discussing his cheating that he “compartmentalizes things in his mind”…this stood out to me at that moment and even know as to how they think. Nothing is combined always separate always that Double or triple secret life they lead.

I think with regards to the phone that you just leave it as he is hiding things from you which is not only bad for a marriage but also is emotional withholding.

Do not ever apologize for looking at your husbands phone! I too did not want to cross that line because I am just not that type of person to invade someone else space but when there are RED FLAGS and HIDDEN LIVES they lead then you MUST protect yourself. If they are cheating you have a right to know not only because you are in a monogamous relationship but also their cheating can lead to STD’s which can be deadly.

The only time I lied in my marriage was at the end when I knew I was leaving but it was just matter of when I was leaving. And I only lied about things that were protecting me like you are doing now. THIS IS VERY SMART OF YOU DIANE so give yourself a good pat on the back because you are listening to your gut instincts!!

You state: “My h and his ex were married for twenty years. I believe she left him for the same behaviors that he is exhibiting with me.” …know that a wife does not leave a marriage especially after 20 years unless its really bad!! I have no doubt that you & her would have very similar stories about him. Once you leave you may (or may not) want to have a conversation about his behavior it may give you some needed closure on your marriage/relationships.

You state: “I’m still working on the question ” it’s crazy how much has happened over the past six years. Makes me shake my head. Each thing that I write down, hardens my heart a little more. I think I’m heading in the right direction!”

Diane your statement is very powerful! YES it takes time to write ALL of their craziness down..it’s each and every day all day long that they do crazy & abusive things to their spouses!

It is good that you are writing down everything this all is opening your mind up.

The cycle of abuse teaches (or trains us is a better word) to accept their bad behavior…when they switch to the honeymoon stage our mind triggers a positive reinforcement and so we forget about the abuse.

SO writing down everything now on paper you actually see the truth in your relationship = it is BAD = it is ABUSIVE!!

It’s jaw dropping when you see everything on paper or written out!!

You are going in the right direction!! Be proud of yourself it is not easy to look back at all the times you were emotionally, mentally, verbally & finically abused by your husband. BUT IT IS THE TRUTH ABOUT YOUR RELATIONSHIPS. It is what you have been praying for = answers to why your marriage is not working and why your husband is the way he is.

I am proud of you! You are taking the right steps to better your life! 🌺

Hi Jan7,

I just typed up a HUGE reply and I lost it – totally disappeared! UGH!

Okay, let’s try this again LOL

You are truly a Godsend!

The more I’m hearing about what you have gone through, the more I’m learning how much alike, not only our experiences/stories are, but also we are.

Why do I stay with my h? Why haven’t I left? For the exact reasons you listed, word-for-word. Marriage vows; raised and practicing Catholic; no marriage is perfect; all husbands and wives fight; marriage is hard work; strong people don’t give up; you can’t run away from your problems; and then add the manipulation of the mind, the gaslighting, the lovebombing, and you end up being “stuck and lost” … your thoughts are all mixed up … you don’t know which way is up or which way is down … or like you said, where the door is to get out.

Bermuda has not been mentioned since I posted it on LF. He has never brought it up again, and neither have I. I believe he wasn’t serious about going … it was a ploy – a game – to lead me on, to keep me hanging on … and plus it would make him look good to others and could use it to make me feel bad/guilty.

As you know, I no longer have access to his iPhone, but he also has an iPad, which I do have access to (I got his code). The iPhone and the iPad are synced together, so whenever someone who has an iPhone send him a text or he sends them one, the text message shows on the iPad. Well, on Wednesday night, I had a quick opportunity to check the iPad. There were messages back and forth between him and his ex. The first couple were about their daughter, but then the texts turned to MY puppy, which I just got last Saturday. The past November, I put dibs on the pup because I planned on being in my own place by January. He was/is going to be my companion … my protector. As you know, I’m not there yet. Well, my h sent his ex a pic of the pup. She texted back how jealous she is, she’s always one of those breeds, how much the pup looks like their Bingo (apparently a dog they had when they were married??), said she’d dogsit if he needed her to. He never mentioned this conversation to me, but then, he never has mentioned any of their conversations. So tonight, I check the iPad to really read the texts since I read them so quick the other night, and the messages are gone. He deleted them. Either, he deleted them because he’s hiding something OR he deleted them just because he didn’t want to keep them, no reason to keep them. I’m going with that he’s hiding something OR that he enjoys deceiving/pulling something over on me. Whatever.

I’ve been doing a LOT of research and have tapped into the resources you have told me about. I never thought about creating a fake FB account so I could “like” the pages you mentioned. I wondered how I could do that without giving myself away. Other than my two sisters and my daughter, no one knows. Like you, I don’t talk to anyone for the same reasons you didn’t. God, they are good, aren’t they!!

((Hugs))

Hi Diane, I have done the same a few times…typed out my thoughts then it was gone 🙁

What I have found is all sociopaths pick similar type victims and all sociopaths are very similar in their abuse to a point it’s like they are reading from the same abuse playbook.

The type of victims they go after are hardworking, responsible, law & society followers, how have a kind heart, empathy, and get along with others.

According to Steven Hassan author of Freedom Of mind…when a person has a life change such as a job change, going off to school, a relationship breakup, divorce, death in the family, empty nest, a move etc this is the most likely time for a vicim to be sucked into a cult or a domestic abusive relationship. This change is a vulnerable time for a person because the persons guard is down dealing with the change. Sociopaths move in quickly and love bomb the victim into a relationship with them. For me I moved out of state to start a new job. I did not know anyone and it was a mutual out of town friend that invited me along to meet a group of people…he was in that group. Can you look back and pin point what life change you might have had that lead to you dating your h?

What I can tell you from my personal experience is DONT MAKE ANY EXCUSES for staying…NONE…the only regret I have is that I stayed far to long in my marriage. I have zero regret leaving my ex h. We are raised by myths…the Catholic church also in a way controls our minds with all of the religious marriage myths (like any religion regarding marriage) what are the religious myths?

That you took a vow in sickness & heath, better for worse etc etc. These myths keep us stuck in a abusive marriage. This is not what the bible teaches. I remember about a year after I left my cousin saying that I can get annulment…I told him why I was marriage & I am divorcing and I am ok with both of those facts. I did not leave a blissful marriage I left a abusive marriage.

You are correct that when you are in the marriage with a sociopath your thoughts are all messed up…your gut is telling to RUN the heck away while the sociopath is manipulating you back into the marriage. I say FOLLOW YOUR GUT ALWAYS!! Never weaver ever from your gut. Google “Oprah Gavin Debecker you tube” and what their interview. Gavin Debecker is the author of Gift of Fear. he reminds us to follow our gut instinct this is why we have a build in ALARM SYSTEM.

I dont even know what to say about his conversation with his ex w. Its good for their kids sake that they are on talking terms but it is disrespectful to you that he does not share the fact that he is communicating with her about your personal life with you. I am sorry that you found this out. PLEASE PLEASE be careful looking at his iPhone I dont what you to put yourself in harms way for any reason.

Since he is sharing info about your puppy I would highly recommend that you keep a very good record of all that you spend on your puppy. From vet bills to buy treats/food and toys. Because in a divorce sociopaths become evil and he may just try to take your puppy from you as sociaoths do this with their children.

BTW Congrats on your new puppy. So happy for you & your little puppy as he won the lotto when he got you has his mommy! 🙂

I think you made a wonderful decision to get a puppy so that you were not alone. Again Diane you are making unbelievable good decisions while you are in the sociopaths tornado. Pat yourself on the back. So happy that you made this step. It’s hard at first leaving…even prior thinking you are going to be alone..I felt this way to and it scared me because I was with my ex for over 14 years..but I can tell you that you will get to the point that you actually love your alone time. I was so independent before I met my ex and then slowly he took that way from me mentally but you will find that you move back towards your old self over time away from your h.

Glad that you are researching things. This is one of the most powerful steps you can take. It really is shocking how it opens up your mind. At first you might not realize that you are opening up your mind but then one day you are just done with the sociopath emotional & mentally because of all the reading and relating it to your relationship. You have a lot of AHH HAA moments…and you have a lot of moments were you realize how truly manipulative they really are and how you (me & every victim) is just a puppet to them.

I am glad that you have shared this with all of your sisters & daughter. This is another excellent step. As victims we feel shame & embarrassment but once you leave have some counseling you will see that you have nothing to be ashamed of or embarrassed of…you did nothing wrong! You wanted to love someone nothing to be ashamed of for that.

Wishing you a great day today 😎

Hi Jan7,
My weekend was good. Spent time with my daughter and granddaughter , and then with the rest of my family for my Mom’s birthday.

I’m being as careful as I can be when checking his devices, and truthfully, I don’t think I will be doing that much anymore. It gets to be too stressful, and I really don’t think I need any more so called evidence ” enough has been said and done over the past six years. I was going through two life events at the same time when I got together with my h. A job change and a divorce. The divorce was from a man who was into teenage pornography, which I was totally oblivious to. Found out when our computer crashed and I took it to have it repaired. Divorcing him was easy … black and white.

And I didn’t mean to go on about the text messages between my h and his ex. I have absolutely no problem with them communicating about whatever, especially about their children. My problem is that the conversations, the contact between the two of them, is being kept a secret and then deleted as if it never happened. The compartmentalizing of things in his mind makes perfect sense.

Love what you said about “myths” ” that is a great way to look at things, too! I’m putting too much emphasis on those things instead of the reality of the situation.

Still making progress though. My brother and sister-in-law bought a new refrigerator, so they gave me their old one (which is still in excellent shape) for my house. My brother and son delivered it yesterday :-)

How great for you to hear from Amille22! Although the experiences you had with your ex were horrible and devastating in numerous ways, you have made such a positive difference in Amille22’s life, and now in mine, and probably countless others. You have shown us/taught us, it is not us, we are not alone, and we are strong! We CAN and WILL overcome!!

Hi Diane, so glad you had a wonderful weekend with your family. Another great step that you are doing!! connecting with our family helps to bring us back to who we were before the sociopaths plus the emotional support is so therapeutic.

I think it is a wise decision not to look at it like you state “enough has been said and done over the past six years.”. I got to that exact point too..my ex h cheated through out the marriage and I too just got to the point that I did not care what he was doing I just wanted to escape him. You are thinking so clearly & rationally Diane. I know you dont feel emotionally strong but you are and like I have stated you are making so many great decisions to get away from him.

I want to clarify something when I stated I didn’t know what to make of his texting his ex w because I was trying to think what he was actually doing manipulation wise. Sociopaths are always conning someone even his ex w will be conned again.

With the regards to him texting his ex w I want you to know that it was very complexing to me so I was just talking to you out loud but I did not want to diminish his behavior at all.

I want you to also know that my first thought reading your post of him texting her nice texts about your puppy was that he was love bombing her too??? I did not want to say this to you because honestly I dont know him or his motivation and did not want to steer you to something that he might not be doing but could it be that he is love bombing her back into a relationship with niceness incase you do leave him for good? You have a house that when you are ready you can escape to and he will be left alone. Sociopaths hate to be alone. Just a thought…what do you think?

Please if this is true dont blame his ex w focus solely on escaping him so that you can finally be free of him.

When I left my ex h (then h) he had 3 women on the side once I escaped I and learned who he was realized they all were victims also like myself. I held zero anger towards any of them because my ex h focused his attention on them gave me my path to escape him.

Yes family or religious Myths really to hold us in a abusive marriage along with our abusers manipulative words. Steven Hassan’s writes about these myths in his book that I mentioned before. This aspect of things are quite interesting on how our brains hold these myths and block out natural gut instincts.

So many helped lift me up on my darkest days & nights here at love fraud and other support sites for sociopathic abuse. I asked so many questions and so many took the time to help me. One day you if you want will do the same. You can pass your knowledge along to someone in need too. Amille22 is a good person who is incredibly smart which you can see in her post. I hope that she will share some of her experience both in her relationship and also her healing journey. She has come such a long way in a short amount of time because she throughly educated herself on her ex’s behavior & manipulation which opened her mind up to keep the no contact rule informed.

Glad that you had a wonderful weekend. Take care

Hi Amille22,

Thank you for your words of encouragement and your praise of Jan7. There’s been a lot of support on this site, but Jan7 has been my constant rock!

How great for you that you have been 9 months of NC!!! I truly cannot wait until I reach that point – heck, I’ll be happy once I get the emotional strength to move out to begin the NC! That will be the hardest for me – the NC – but that’s the only way I’ll survive him. If there’s contact, I know I will get sucked back in. I’m my worst enemy when it comes to that.

Take care, and thanks again for posting 🙂

Hi Jan,

So far, today has been a better day 🙂

Thanks once again for the encouraging words. You actually made me smile when I read your words about thinking about my new life and what I want to do with the house and planting flowers, etc. I do picture those things in mind, and it is refreshing and peaceful.

I’ve been in this “exit plan” for almost two years! I just shake my head in disbelief of myself! UGH! This is so difficult, and you can’t explain it to anyone except to those like you who have, unfortunately, lived it or are living it. I’ve mentioned this before, and so have you, of just wanting someone to come in and physically remove me and take me away because I don’t seem to be doing a very good job of saving myself. I do know I have a done a lot so far … and honestly, I can feel I’m right there on the verge … on the edge … I just can’t seem to take that much needed next step to freedom. Holy man, this is crazy awful!

Anyway, like I said at the beginning, I am better than yesterday. Yesterday, I was totally feeling sorry for myself and giving up … no mental energy to keep doing this day-after-day. Today, my mental gumption is back! Need to stay angry at what he has done over the years to me and my kids … the lies, the deceit, the playing games with my mind, the manipulation, etc. … not this loving, doting man that he’s been for the past two months.

I know my health is suffering from all of this, as you had mentioned it would. I did go to the doctor last week, just feeling extremely tired and anxious. Had lab work done which all came back normal, which is a good thing, but I was hoping for some cure-all medication to make this all go away LOL Anyway, I do have to start eating better and getting exercise – I’m not overweight at all, just need to be healthier. I’m sure once I’m on my own, I’ll be more relaxed, less-stressed and happier, which will have a huge impact on my health. I’m not giving up!

I’m seriously looking into the phone counseling, more than likely with Donna. I know she “gets it” and already have the trust established. I need someone to get into my head and get me straightened out … unbrainwash me … and get me back to the strong person I know I am.

I don’t think I will need the restraining order when I leave. He has a quick, violent temper but he’s not physical.

I wish this was as simple as the last one … just tell him I can’t be with him, pack my things, move out, and divorce. No issues at all. Nope, not this time. I can’t tell him. Will need to leave when he’s at work. He won’t let me go quietly. His concern isn’t with me … it’s with the fact that he doesn’t want to be alone and he doesn’t like people talking about him. Who he is … his image … and his name is important to him.

Thanks, Jan …. ((hugs)) back to you!! Be back in touch tomorrow 🙂

Hi Diane, it’s normal to be fearful of leaving. The sociopaths create this fear in their victims mind intentionally to keep the vicim in the abusive relationship. Exactly like a cult follower is stuck in a cult so is a domestic abuse victim like yourself and like me before I escaped.

As you know sociopaths use manipulation, pathological lying, instead fear & phobias into the victims mind, use brain washing, mind control, gas lighting abuse, reward & punishment etc.

Your h used reward & punishment on you by saying he was taking you to Bermuda (reward). My ex used to do these things too throw words out but never follow through this excites our reward brain region. So even though we did not actually get the reward it manipulated our minds as if we did. NOT THAT YOU SHOULD GO TO BERMUDA with him but since you stated he has not brought it up again it made me think about my ex h manipulation.

Sadly no one can pick you up and carry you out. But the good news is someone like Donna or even Steven Hassan of Freedom of mind resource center phone counseling can help open your mind up from the brain washing and then you will RUN out of your marriage.

This is from the national domestic violence hotline …I have posted about an Exit Plan for you…the national domestic Violence hotline USA uses the term “Safety Plan”:

“What Is Safety Planning?
A safety plan is a personalized, practical plan that includes ways to remain safe while in a relationship, planning to leave, or after you leave. Safety planning involves how to cope with emotions, tell friends and family about the abuse, take legal action and more.

At the hotline we safety plan with victims, friends and family members anyone who is concerned about their own safety or the safety of someone else.

A good safety plan will have all of the vital information you need and be tailored to your unique situation, and will help walk you through different scenarios.

Although some of the things that you outline in your safety plan may seem obvious, it’s important to remember that in moments of crisis your brain doesn’t function the same way as when you are calm. When adrenaline is pumping through your veins it can be hard to think clearly or make logical decisions about your safety. Having a safety plan laid out in advance can help you to protect yourself in those stressful moments.”

When I was in my marriage I felt like I could not talk to anyone…my mind was frozen somehow by the brain washing so I did not speak about the abuse but when I left I slowly opened up about it. What helped with this I reached out for help. I put all my feelings of shame and embarrassment aside and reached out for help. It was scary at first after being in a marriage for 12 years but now it is easy. The abuse center helped me especially the women group meetings I know that you live to far from these to go weekly but even going to one will help you.

I also reached out to outside counseling. I went to two counselors the first one told me who my ex was but I was not really connecting with that counselor so I went to another.

Plus on line support like LF.

I know that it is difficult for you because of your location but I can promise you reaching out to a counselor or life coach like Donna Anderson and at the same time the Domestic violence hotline will help you leave sooner.

Love that you have been thinking about flowers in your yard & decoration your home = GREAT THINKING!! 🙂

I’ll type more tomorrow. Have a good day!! 🌴😎

Hi Diane, here is a question for you to open up your mind. No wrong answers so take your time.

What are the reason you feel stuck in your marriage right now which is preventing you from leaving your abuser?

Hi Jan7,

The reasons today why I feel stuck in my marriage … what is keeping me from leaving today:

1. He’s been extremely nice and wonderful since Thanksgiving.
2. With him being so nice and wonderful has me second-guessing myself in that maybe I’ve been wrong about him … I may have misjudged him.
3. I feel guilty, and I feel bad for him. I know now it’s from the early-on brainwashing, i.e. no one’s ever treated me this good, I never had anyone who helped me around the house, I hate being alone, I’d keep my vehicle in the garage and stay downstairs so people wouldn’t know I was home alone, etc., but even though I know I’m feeling this because of the thoughts he instilled in me, it’s still very difficult.
4. I need to leave when he’s not home/at work. When I pick out the date based on his work schedule and my mindset, when that day comes, because he’s been nice, etc., I don’t leave (reference 1 and 2 and 3 above) … it’s a vicious circle for me.

I’ve said in earlier posts … I’m my own worst enemy, and I need help.

Thank you so much, Donna, for taking the time to respond, and also for creating this website/blog for us for support. It’s extremely sad that the website/blog is needed by so many but it truly is life-saving. God bless …

Once I realized my ex was a sociopath, there was only one outcome for me. Freedom.

I came to realize that at his core, my ex had only two states of being towards me, setting me up OR letting hell rain down on me.

I am someone who barely escaped the murder. Believe me. Not all sociopath will murder but…. ALLLLLLLL Sociopaths are capable of it with the same detachment demonstrated by your husband’s sweetness after the Sept blowup. He wasn’t sweet. He was in his pleasure mode b/c he attacked your soul and your agony felt pleasurable to him.

I predict that you are on a time bomb. Whether or not you stay and get murdered will all depend on you. Yep, they do it to us, but WE are the ones who have to rescue ourselves.

As Donna says, you are being prepped, being distracted while he is making plans to end you. Chose to survive. Recovery will come when you escape the bombing.

Oh my gosh, NotWhatHeSaidofMe! How horrible and scary for you!! I can’t even imagine. There’s been no physical abuse, as of yet, in this relationship but his angry outburst are pretty unnerving. Is he capable of murder? I don’t know … I don’t think so, but I don’t know. The timebomb reference you made is right on. He doesn’t want me to leave … he’s afraid of being alone … of people talking (we are from a very small, close town … everybody knows everybody, etc) … he’s very private and his image/ego is important to him. One time I had forgotten to pay my personal taxes and we received the normal late notice that goes out. His main concern was our last name being in the paper for unpaid taxes, and he was quite angry about that possibility. Anyway, the past three months, it’s like he’s in “desperation” mode. He’s sensing my withdrawing and he doesn’t like it. When the actual day does come when I do leave, he, the bomb, will explode. God bless …

Diane111
I knew things didn’t make sense with my husband. He NEVER laid a hand on me, he NEVER raised his voice to me although I witnessed him losing it big time when his demands were not complied with. He took great pride in being in control of his emotions and the assault followed that, he was very controlled and calm, it was a task to be done.

I escaped by LUCK from being murdered. I left and have been over 2000 miles away ever since. I did not know about sociopaths then. I found this website later and realized he was a sociopath. Once I KNEW what he was, ALL the confusing behaviors made sense. We lived in a small town, his IMAGE was PARAMOUNT, not b/c he cared but b/c it was his best tool, he used it to con, scam, manipulate, and dupe people and he’d crow about how easy it was for him and how stupid the community people were.

But what I want all people here who realize that if their monster fits the profile of a sociopath, ALL need to know that INCLUDES the capacity to MURDER. They are SO two faced that being nice is the red flag to tell you that you are being set up.

Because he’d never touched me, I truly didn’t believe he would harm me but then again, I absolutely would have bet my life that he wouldn’t have cheated on me nor scammed me (all was being done behind my back, including smearing me to EVERYONE so I had no support and everyone thought I deserved his abuse. They KNEW he abused me, they just thought I deserved it b/c of what he told them.) I totally bought into his image… until the lies broke that reality into pieces… until nothing made sense b/c it was NONSENSE. I promised, I TRIED to believe in his fairy tales. Then when I was getting ready to leave him, and all had turned good with him again, BOOM, out of the blue I was nearly murdered.

There is the possibility that I am all wrong. But, more likely you are playing with fire to not save yourself NOW. Once I saved myself, then I had the space to heal. You can’t EVER get better while being with him. Reclaim your being. It sounds harsh but until we take COMPLETE responsibility for ourselves, we will remain their victim. You have to be willing to grow up. Yes that is so harsh but it’s the trap they’ve used on us. That we give our power to them. That’s not a grown up thing to do. I was SO weak myself, but escaping him was the only path. Stay for what? Abuse ALWAYS escalates, it NEVER desolves. I got away and yes, I was traumatized and hid for a long while (b/c I was ALONE and didn’t have this site to guide me and assure me that my fear was realistic.) Once I wasn’t being emotionally, mentally, physically, financially assaulted, then the truths starting flowing in my life.

When you live in NONSENSE, EVERYTHING is crazymaking! Choose to reclaim your sanity. Choose to sever his access to control and dominate you. Choose life. It doesn’t FEEL like that’s the choice but after getting free, it becomes obvious that is what I was chosing. TO LIVE. Like Kaya48 wrote, at first there’s a huge hole, but both Kaya48 and myself (and others!) filled that hole pretty quickly…with HAPPINESS.

NotWhatHeSaidofMe,
Your comment about being two-faced hit me like a ton of bricks! That’s exactly him … never thought of him that way … but he is! If people, including his family members, knew what he said and what he thought about them, they’d be flabbergasted. Well, maybe not … I don’t think they’d believe that he would say and think those things. They truly are amazing.

And just because he hasn’t physically abused me doesn’t mean he doesn’t have it in him to do just that. I definitely do need to reclaim my sanity and my life!

Diane111
Also, let’s use the words correctly b/c he is controlling what words mean to you.

He’s NOT PRIVATE. He’s secretive. for a reason. He’s scamming.

Make sure when you leave you disappear completely off the radar as much as you possibly can. It’s not that difficult for these types to cause an “accident” so your departure will need to be a total blindside. NotWhatHeSaidofMe knows from hard experience.

NoMoreWool

You used the term “blindside”. This past summer he had gone to visit his son for a week, and while he was gone, I packed up some more of my things … little things. When he returned, he had noticed and confronted me about it. He was not angry … he was very sad. He said to me, “I had no clue. I thought we were getting along fine. I’m totally blindsided by this”, with tears in his eyes. And then I got an emergency phone call from my daughter and had to leave. We never talked anymore about it. I felt extremely guilty for going behind his back while he was gone and blindsiding him. Even though I feel bad and guilty (it’s just who I am as a person … I don’t like to see anyone hurting, let alone be the cause of the hurting), I know there is no other way to leave other than leaving with them not having a clue. If I would let him know ahead of time, I’d never be able to leave. He’d prevent it, in some way, shape or form, he’d prevent it. I can’t take that chance.

Diane –
The sad act was because he knows exactly which button to push to cause you the most distress. My SP noticed absolutely everything too. When I left, the packing was done in a matter of minutes- just enough clothing to get by and I let the kids each take a grocery bag of toys. Our safety was more important than things. But – my SP was also having some serious mental problems at the time. Still – life is more important than things.

Diane111
Good god, it sounds precisely like my ex. Anything he said or any abuse towards me and my daughters, he would conveniently ‘forget’ or ‘I misunderstood’ or ‘that never happened’. He literally tried to tell me I was dreaming once. They think we are dumb. I am reading your posts and I am so grateful you have a few resources to escape! I will be following everyone’s story here. I agree Diana111, this site helps you realize you are not the one to blame and gets you closer to the truth of the matter: IT’S NOT YOUR FAULT HE / SHE IS A SOCIOPATH!
The only truth I can offer is to continue to leave the escape hatch open and deal with him the way you see fit. It’s your life and you are in control. The scary thing is, once a sociopath loses his control, there’s no end to the torcher / the lengths they will go to in order to ruin you emotionally, financially. They will take until you have nothing left. They want you at their mercy and they hate not having control. We are all in the danger zone.

My goodness, its very scary reading the above link, maybe the sound of the ticking time bomb has been going in the background of the relationship for so long its almost hard to realize what the ticking is. The hard thing at times can be the way our frame of reference is altered to suit them. That daily training in what emotional expression is allowed in the relationship (always theirs with yours undermined or ignored) and the way a person can be taught that anything they try to do to improve the relationship or simply be a person in their own right-gets so badly smashed or undermined to such a degree that maybe its harder and harder to see the difference between a heavy mind game and a actual threat to our physical safety. its taken me a while to accept, that nothing to did could make him happy or unhappy, he chose his behavior because it suits him just fine. And if its not me being treated that way, its someone else. Now I would not chose ANYONE to be treated that way, NOR would I treat any one that way. So logic tells me not to be around someone like that. But we all know they ARE scary people and its scary even to think about it being over because of all the crazy stuff that could happen. But hasn’t all the crazy stuff already been happening?. I have a sense that I am always looking over my shoulder and will for a long while to come. But my ex is moving onto new targets as I type, so I feel happy, sad and bad. Happy for me, sad and bad for whomever is next. I Really, Really, want everyone and their children on this site to be safe. Please do what you can to be safe and none of this is your fault – its the nature of the beast in a very literal sense. no one prods a beast with a stick just to check they are still a beast, smart people move around it until they have a plan and support.
take care everyone my thoughts are with you because even though you are strangers I feel that you have a far better understanding of my situation than my friends did.

Wow Stunnedmullet, I could of written that whole thing, almost word for word. It still stuns me that they ALL use, say & do the same thing!!

I swear my ex had a MASTERS DEGREE in undermining or ignoring & gas lighting. We never argued, he never raised his voice, he just ignored or pretended it wasn’t happening. He would sit there with a stupid blank look on his face Ugh! god I hated that blank face. Every time I ask him to have a chat about our relationship, his response was always the same for 3 years. I would ask ” how would you say our relationship is going?” his response “I’m still here aren’t I” that’s it, end of discussion Ugh! lol all communication was dead-ending like that or on some crazy ass tangent. On the site here I think they call it ‘word salad’

Another thing he use to do was this opposite thing, like- Our first Xmas together, we had been dating about 5mnths. I was hosting at my house with my mum, son sister & brother in law coming, my mum doesn’t like to be around pot smoking, (he smoked a shit load)so I asked him to not smoke while my mum was around, he said no worries I will behave. Lmao haha yeah right! he went onto the patio, opposite where my mum was seated & lit up his pipe…It was a glass door with sheer curtains!! he would do shit like that all the time, like a 4yr old, what you asked him not to do, he would do more of that, if you asked him to do something-nope the request wouldn’t exist in his world…..Just brain scrambling shit.

Stay strong, you can do this! be kind & gentle with yourself.

Blessings Dragon xx

Thank you, heatherdee. When you think you’re the only one who is going through this, you automatically think there’s something wrong with you and you feel alone … no one would understand. It was so good to read your comment.

Dear All,

I fear I’ve already been boiled beyond repair. I haven’t posted in a few days. All the information I’ve gathered on these types sometimes is beyond overwhelming sometimes. I’m in counseling, continuing to reach out to friends, exercising a bit. I’ve been so isolated for so many years I don’t know how to be in the moment. There are days/weeks lost in anxiety, depression (I’m not by nature a depressed person), conditioned to only think and do for the sociopath/husband. I am determined to get my divorce. I spend hours and hours coming up with legal strategies, undoing the mess he creates as he throws obstacles in the way, trying to understand the children who live with him and why I don’t hear from them. Some days I feel worse than the worst day with him. I understand that only a complete dismantling of my entire life is going to get him out of my life. I’ve put the future of my family in the hands of a judge since no compromise can ever be made with this guy. This divorce, the destruction of my family, and the uncertainty of my future is all I can think about most days. I think I’ve been slow cooked for too long.

Hi becomingstrong,

Yes, that’s just it isn’t it? We TRY to understand what CANNOT be understood by we mere mortals.

I too, go back and forth like that, as well. Why does my SP son do this? Why does he do that? How can he possibly think that there is nothing wrong with him ? Why is he even a SP??

I think that we have to keep talking to ourselves. Telling ourselves that we are wonderful loving worthy people. That has been lost to us because we lived in the f’ed up world with a SP for so long.

It is not our fault. We cannot help or change them.

We may also need to let certain people just ‘go’. People who refuse to see or are in denial about the SP.

It is possible to go on and like a full and happy life. I talk to myself every day and make it happen. Day by day. Easy to say, I know, but for our own survival, it is a MUST. We only have this one life and we are in control of making it what we want it to be.

You may have been slow cooked, but girl, you are DONE! Done with the SP!!

Love your line, “you may have been slow cooked,but girl,you are done! Done with the SP!!” I’m done but like most SP’s your done when they say your done. Yes we spend our time trying to read tealeaves. Their word salad, lies, and false impressions they create. My SP is on the verge of having no career, yes no career. A career he “professed” to be all important to him. A career I know realize was just a rouse to further abandon and neglect and torture me over. A career, if he continues on the path he his taking, will not be an option. I do scratch my head. Okay I more than scratch my head over that one. I am in awe that he his willingly self destructing rather than give me my divorce. Is it stupidity? Is it just being obstinate? Or a combination of the two? The question goes round and round in my mind, “Why is he willingly throwing away his career (btw I believe he has crossed the line already) to keep this divorce from happening? Does he not see what the consequence could be, no career, or does he just not care?” The answer to this question does haunt me as I think the answer holds some kind of answer to my future life and whether I will be free of him. Thanks Bev

I hear that!

Same thing with my son…career wise. I think is is all imploding on him, now. He is losing interest because it no longer serves the purpose of isolating himself from the family that he supposedly wanted and created. So that he could look like everyone else. He always professed to love his photography business…but it is going downhill now since his ex threw him out. I never really believed that he loved it, though. It was merely a way to be away (escape) from his wife and children, that he said he wanted, but it all got too real and I dare say, boring, for him. Instead, escape into other peoples’ weddings, and families, and good times. Perhaps gauge their emotions in the photos so as to mirror them? Who knows.

Yes, you are DONE, but the SP perhaps NEVER is done with you. You cannot take that sickness on, though. YOU ARE DONE. You have the control over you, that asshole does not.

I guess that is what I meant 🙂

What was his career, if you don’t mind me asking?

I sometimes wonder if these SPs choose certain careers based on not only how they want to appear, but on the boredom factor, and it’s ability to let them be the freaks that they are in whatever way that presents itself.

Bev,
Interesting insight that the career is just an excuse to neglect and abandon the family. My husband is a doctor. He worked insane hours (almost twice as many hours than the average for his colleagues). He would take up others shifts repeatedly. I used to tell him he was leaving the impression we were in debt or I was out spending him blind (“poor him, he had to work himself to death for that wife of his”). Now he is at risk of losing it all. He could very well lose his license. Then what? He has no family to rely on, or even friends for that matter. I know they think they are omnipotent but this really takes the cake to be in that amount of denial. He thinks I’m going to save him all the while publicly stating he wants to be divorced it’s me.
How is your son going to support himself? What does he think will happen to his new victim of he’s broke?

Yes, I absolutely think that they choose careers based on how isolating they will be from their personal interpersonal relationships WHILE at the same time, at their career, having many superficial interpersonal relationships with OTHER people who have no chance of REALLY getting to know the SP. Boy, that was a long sentence! Sorry 🙂

Only family who live with them REALLY know and observe firsthand the traits that they can’t help but exhibit. The mask slips long term. If they spend too long with anyone, their oddness is revealed, I think.

My son’s photography is a sideline career. He also has a ‘real’ job working for a custom log home builder. Not sure what he does there, but it is hard to believe he has remained there for so long (about 8 years I believe) because of all of the time he has missed, according to his ex. He works full time there, and then weekends doing photography.

When he was young, and still lived with us, he isolated himself ALL of the time, and I am not embellishing. He seemed to detest being around my husband and / or myself, preferring instead, to stay in his own room almost 100% of the time. He came out for meals and bathroom time.

How strange is that? I do not remember one good time with him. No Christmases no Halloweens…he would just get in trouble so that he could be sent to his room…wow. Writing it down makes it all the weirder…

Bev,

It helps writing down these events. We become so used to the abnormal that we lose sight of reality sometimes. It’s also interesting that you point out there were no good times. My SP, there were no good times either. When we went on vacation (it was my planning, my grunt work) he would pick it apart. The only “good times” were when he gave me a reprieve for being a complete slave to him (Christmas was a good example of that). He never participated in any planning that way his hands were clean to criticize and pick apart.

His career doesn’t seem important, or as important as getting me. So if I want my divorce, divorce+SP=no career-no torturing me; no divorce+SP=career+torturing me.

Like your son, he has been at his job for years. Mine would never take a day off, not for anything or anybody. Now that all important job is on the line.

Different than my son, but there is likely a reason (only known to him) why he never misses work.

My son’s ex thought he WAS at work Monday to Friday, and then found out on a few occasions that it was not the case.

He was NEVER home, though. Perhaps that is why your ex SP worked as much as he could and never missed a day?

My son NEVER misses a day of work through the week (that his wife knew about anyway, as I said above) and he NEVER misses his photography sessions on weekends. (That is probably far more exciting that the log home job). He also branched into ‘boudoir’ photos…that seemed to coincide with the marriage going downhill and breaking up as well. Wonder what came first? Taking nearly naked photos of different women, or his failing marriage…OR, the photography is just an outlet to meet sexier (than his ex wife and mother of his kids) women and perhaps cheat with them.

Like I said, who only knows? We probably aren’t even aware of the depth of his secretiveness and deceitfulness.

Yes Bev they go to work to leave the wife with a lot of pressure on her. Being in the hook with kids 24/7 is frazzling and makes her either leave him or she can’t see straight. Isn’t torturing people their thing? As far as the budoire pictures what a scam. Good cover for meeting women.

Exactly. That is what I think too.

Isolate the poor wife at home with two kids. She can’t check up on you, then, can she?

Only, she finally managed to do just that, and caught him not where he was supposed to be…which was at work! Who knew where he was on those weekdays. Maybe with one of those ‘boudoir’ girls.

I don’t have kids at home but my ex used a similar method. When not together, our contact was 95% FB chat lol we lived in the same town, always got the will talk with you later (which meant FB) that way I would have to be at home cause I only have a laptop so would need to be home, meanwhile he had an IPad & was getting up to all sorts of things(sleeping with clients)Only realized this near the end though.

ON Ward, excellent article.
Paths have radar when it comes to making good predatory choices. They also have the maturity level of an 3 yr old, which I think is very key and can’t stress enough. It explains many things about the way they think. It also makes their “come-on” very dangerous, as their lack of filters and impulse control is so refreshing and can be fun and liberating….at such an enormous price to their chosen playmates. Like a child, when they finally get caught with their pants down (sometimes/often literally), only then, because it affects them, do they show authentic emotion. You will notice, it is often very child-like. I just can’t stress how important this is in spotting a path.

I can’t help but think of the movie “Big” and “Being There” when I regard the path in my life. A fake persona, not real in any sense.

“A single gesture of kindness or expression of love in a flowing stream of affection goes all but unnoticed. The value of that same gesture in a love-deprived environment, however, is immeasurable.”

This is SO very true. And paths know and target this. They test you without your knowledge of it. As I look back, it’s so obvious to me. Since I might the path in my life at work, I often wondered why he’d say or do things that could get this high level mgr fired!! You have to watch out for these red flags. I did not. I just thought it was bizarre and funny. I had just left a company where I was treated so poorly by management, I felt I’d traded a rotten oyster for one filled with pearls. He must have told me 20x how valuable I was…again, that made no sense because I had done nothing as an employee yet but try to get some training! But as he well knew, I was eating up his support and felt he saw something special in me. I was toast. I knew it wasn’t a good thing, some of the things he said to me were outrageous, asking me to go away with him for one. Really?

At any rate, yes, I, as per your superb article, got sucked in because I wasn’t getting anything even close to his flirtatious and down home plain ole earthy admiration. He liked me, he thought I was beautiful, “there was something about me” (head in hands).
And there I sat, lapping it up like a needy stray dog.

You know, I felt at one time that I embarrassed myself, but when I picture that loser as he really is, a savant enfant terrible, I realize there was not even one soupcon of reality to his complimentary, adoring behavior. And he can go suck a passy.

Perfect still reeling…so perfect.

The fact that SPs play on our very weaknesses tells a lot. Who would do that other than a SP?

And, always to get what THEY want. Not to lift us up.

Very good post.

Thx for the kind comment, Bev. *And* for suffering my grammar errors! There used to be an edit button, I thought. That would me mighty useful.

I just wanted to add that I had read here on LF somewhere that it’s common behavior for paths to say and do things that outrageously personal or revelatory to prey they hardly know. “You’ll never understand how much I enjoy our convos.” What? I’ll “never” understand…you’ve only known me 3 months. “You can do no wrong in my eyes, you know that, don’t you, don’t you?” I said “No, how could I know that??? I’ve only known you a few months!” That made him angry. He huffed and puffed. Did I think these and other things he said and did were weird? Sure. But I loved the positive attention and the candor. He made me feel like I could say *anything* to him, which to me is the most important thing in a friendship or relationship of any kind. Just being accepted and cherished for who I am. I got that rare and wonderful feeling that I could be the fun and goofy person I am and he seemed to enjoy it immensely. Would ask me to sing to him, do impersonations, etc. The cog diss was excruciating because right on the heels of the warmest, closest times, he’d disappear, physically and/or emotionally. I just thought it was a “get away closer” kind of deal as well as his having to deal with a failing marriage and career. He out and out told me he couldn’t do his job and all kinds of negative things about his marriage.

What a mess.

No worries about grammar! I know what you were saying.

They DO indeed get angry (their only TRUE emotion) when you question anything that they do or say, so, yes, par for the course.

Their lives ARE just a MESS. The convoluted cluttered minds that they have…then we have to also try and deal with all of that when they are in OUR lives…ugh.

I don’t know if this is allowed on here, but I was the victim of a sociopath a few years back and now am facing losing my apartment. My ex stole most of my savings so I am have trouble coming up with the money to move. I have a GoFundMe at gofundme.com/fhjffztg setup to help defray the costs of moving. I deeply apologize if this is not allowed on here. I’m really down on my luck and desperate and feel too ashamed to ask friends and family for help. If anyone has any question or need verification of anything, please contact me. Thanks so much.

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