Do sociopaths know what they are? Many, many Lovefraud readers ask me this question. The short answer is that some of them do and some of them don’t.
The man who sent me the following email certainly has insight into his own personality:
I would like to thank you for making your videos they have given me an insight into how you people recognize us. WE are not to blame for your short comings because you are weak minded and foolish enough to be taken advantage of. We are evolutions next step we don’t allow silly emotions to cloud our judgments. In fact we use our advantage for survival because we are natures next course. I know I sound very narcissistic and apologize for that but if you are so proud and concerned and attached to your emotions why not allow someone to make you feel like a queen for something as worldly as money? We give you what you are missing just as all of the world ecosystem has since the beginning of time. It’s funny how we have been so easily classified and even now as I attempt to alter myself in order to become unparallel to descriptions of us, I find it very difficult to even perceive. I would like to boast of my strategic victories over hearts but I would fear you making another video and making this game more difficult, of course it would make it much more challenging and pleasurable when enjoying the hunt.
This email is a great example of the sociopathic perspective, whether or not individual sociopaths are aware of it. Lest we forget, here is how sociopaths view themselves, the rest of us, and the world:
1. Sociopaths are superior beings, and everyone else is a mark.
2. If marks are dumb enough to be conned, they get what they deserve.
3. Marks deserve to be targeted because of their stupid emotions and consciences.
4. Emotions and consciences are useful in marks, because they can be exploited.
5. Exploitation is a perfectly reasonable way for sociopaths to get what they want.
This is why there is no rehabilitation for sociopaths. They do not feel that they have a disorder; rather, sociopaths believe they have an evolutionary competitive advantage.
Or, for those sociopaths who don’t have the intelligence or education to analyze their place in the world, they’re simply content the way they are and see no need for change.
I just re-read this very informative article above: “The Sociopath’s Perspective.”
This person’s words are so creepy. When he thanks Donna for letting him know what “your videos they have given me an insight into how you people recognize us” it gives me chills! “you people!”
He goes on to state that sociopaths “are evolutions [sic] next step we don’t allow silly emotions to cloud our judgments.” This statement strikes me as fascinating and bothersome.
Many years ago, when I was in a different type of relationship with the spath, I used to call him “The Neanderthal” when discussing his obnoxious behaviors with others. I instinctively KNEW he was lower on the Evolutionary Scale to solid human beings.
Unfortunately, I didn’t know he was a sociopath. I felt I was joking because he was so devolved, or “regressed” as notsuperior stated.
Now, I believe that sociopaths truly are below us in an evolutionary way. Because of the research I have been reading about (nature and/or nurture differences in sociopaths vs. non-sociopaths), I can see that they are sub-human. What I also refer to as feral humans.
They are missing that EQ (Emotional Quotient) that full fledged humans have. I believe and some research shows that their brain is just missing that ability to use their EQ in life. They have a personal agenda and whatever makes THEM feel good is the only thing that matters to them.
When I noticed that he refers to the victims here as “you people,” it makes it even more clear that he doesn’t even see himself as a “person” like we are. He believes he is evolved because it makes him feel better about his abuses. But, he is clearly devolved/regressive and I am glad he unwittingly shared that with Donna. I am also grateful to Donna for continuing to share “The Sociopath’s Perspective” with us “people.”
Donna is a great administrator here and I am so grateful for those asking her to share the guidelines here. I have posted them above for another member having difficulties.
FFWR, I do not want to communicate with people who behave as you have on this thread. This is my final post to you and on the matter. Leave me alone please.
Blossom did you see the speed of light editing that happened here after my post to FFWR? Good God.
Please everyone calm down. We all walking wounded, or at least typing wounded.
No one here knows what will trigger anything for another poster. I try to make my posts personal, about me and the latespath’s destruction; because a fellow poster pointed out to me that I should not make generalizations about spaths. As a new member, I appreciated that.
My personal trigger, it’s the simply name of the stock brokerage house. All I see is a broker who violated his company’s rules and gave the latespath ‘permission’ to wreak the damage he did, because he believed he ‘knew’; rather than being a broker, this man decided pretend he was some sort of family specialist. I spent 3 years involved in litigation and 6 1/2 very expensive days, in a federal proceeding listening to how he and the brokerage ‘were right’, even though all the evidence proved them 100 % wrong. Listening to how no one would ever commit fraud and forgery. No ruling could ever right the damage the latespath did because the broker let him. When I hear the name of the firm, I shut the TV off. When I see their name in the paper, I toss the paper. My entire day or longer, is ruined by a mention of a common corporate name.
One of the reasons I am here is to get/regain enough courage/self confidence to write this broker a letter. That would be a big step in MY healing process.
Thank you, Lost. I removed the person’s name as they requested. Kind of crazy making response to my doing as she asked.
Have you been on this site long? I feel like we got here about the same time. I am beginning to wonder if I have been here long enough. I have read a lot of the Patricia Evans books about emotional abuse and I am feeling it happening. Not safe.
lost everything,
I am impressed by the strength you already show! I have been following your story,and find the life your late spath led a truly deceptive and dangerous one.But YOU ARE A SURVIVOR,and that is what matters the most! Healing times vary;each of us travel these healing journeys at our own pace.
I also suffer with PTSD,and it took a long time for me to be able to cry,because I had held it all in too long,trying to be strong and “carry on”.I finally found that watching movies with sad endings helped me cry.And I’ve learned that I don’t always have to be strong.Everyone has their weak moments/days.Finally,I try to replace the negative with the positive.Take care and look forward to more of your posts!
Hi FF and Blossom,
Although I had been getting email updates from Donna for a few months, my first post was April 23, in response to her ‘open letter to lawyers’. When I got the email on that I had to respond. I never denied being a luddite, I do not even have a mobile phone.
I really am not that strong, but I am getting stronger.
It is 4 years and 8 months today since the latespath died; Saturday, November 1, 2008. I was thrown head first into this nightmare, the following day. The EMT’s left the things they found in his pockets on a table, I didn’t look until Sunday. Other than keys and a few dollars, they found one of my mother’s checkbooks. I didn’t understand why it was there and in going through the carbons, everything was normal until I came to the last one, it was a check to a girl whose name I didn’t know. Naive me, thinks, I’ll just call the broker tomorrow and put a stop on the check. This brokerage, acts as a quasi-bank; they offer a service in which they deposit all stock dividends in an account on which the account holder can write checks and get a debit card against; these accounts also pay interest on monies in them. That Monday call was the call from hell. I hope to be able to write about it with out sweating and shaking.
Free bit of advice; don’t assume that even long established, global businesses, do what they promise, built their reputation on.
As I said I am healing. Even when the devastation hit the fan, I had my mother to take care of, that was my first priority; there was also the house, the pets and my son. I couldn’t find a law firm, even with all the proof, willing to take this on. The paralegals in my ‘good law firm’,a local one, kept telling me they had no idea how I kept going. I was in a trance, reacting on auto pilot, rather than acting. My mom died 7 months later and without her, I completely hid. The mess and loss the latespath created was all I could focus on. I went to Walmarts and bought lined drapes for the dining and living room picture windows. I disconnected the doorbell and unplugged the telephone. I went to the supermarket late at night and only ventured out during the day to walk the dogs or for appointments.
After many months, I was able to replug the phone, rehang the proper curtains. Okay, I busted the doorbell; one of these days. Since being here, I finally feel secure enough to shop in daylight hours. I no longer feel the need to obsess over the escorting sites, even though many of the ‘ladies’ that were the recipients of my family’s money are still very active.
Maybe someday I’ll be able to write to them as well.
Fight, as for your comment, that you wished someone dead. If you think dealing with a live spath is hard, you have no idea what having to confront a dead one and their damage is like.
Thank you my friends
Tea,
Did you know people were being bullied on this site or being told to be converted?! I didn’t.That’s news to me! I’ve been posting on here as from the beginning when I first came on,in support and friendship of the members here.
Hi Lost everything. That’s good advice. I am very calm and relaxed here now as I usually find this site very peaceful. Hopefully everyone can try to refocus on our mission here. I dont know you obviously, but I have read many of your posts. I have developed a certain respect for you based on what you have chosen to share. Beyond respect, concern for you as a person who has already gone through enough would cause me to step up if I surmised you were being mistreated or continually targeted. I have no desire to initiate or perpetuate conflicts. I like you hope this settles . Peace and healing to you.
I cannot be sure what your spath will do.But I know in my own situation,with my spath,what occured.He made empty threats to intimidate me.He thought if I was scared enough,I’d jump to “do his will”.But like you,I learned to look him in the eye,tell him I wasn’t going to do whatever, whenever he wanted it done.If he felt like he needed to do…(threat)”go ahead,I wasn’t holding him back!” He would stare in disbelief,like “where did this woman come from?!” “Who kidnapped my wife?!”
blossom4th,
Much the same thing happened to me. One night when spath grabbed me with one hand and was ready to wallop me with the other, I stood my ground and stared him down. He stared back for a while then gave it up and walked away. Some time after that, drunk again, he stared at me as if in wonder at the moon and said “what ARE you??” He seemed amazed that I could stand up to him. Strange, if I were in his shoes I’d be surprised if people DIDN’T stand up to me! It shows how much he really knew me, and that he is a coward at heart. But I have never let people push me around.
I can remember that even as a child there were certain kids that made me feel intimidated and ashamed. I had a few of the semi-bad ones as friends, and while they didn’t bully me directly, out of the instinct for self-protection I hid my tender feelings from them in order to spare myself their mockery. (“Identification with the aggressor”, I guess.) I even dumbed myself down during my teen years after they called me “brown nose” for being a good student! Now I realize that I was never the misfit; they were. And to this day I suspect the presence of a sociopath when I feel that hint of shame for simply being an imperfect, vulnerable human being. The last incident of that happened about ten years ago, with a waiter in a restaurant. Something about him didn’t seem right, and he chilled and repelled me, as polite as he was. It was very subtle, but it made me want to hide from what seemed to be a cold, cynical scrutiny. His gestures of courtesy seemed false and overdone, with an edge of irony, as he were secretly and smugly mocking all of us–I was with my elderly parents at the time.
Yes…smug, that is the word I was trying to find. My ex-husband had that same quality, and I’ve noticed that very expression on the faces of criminal psychopaths in news photos.
liferaft2: I think you may be rather intuitive. I am about some things, but I have been sucked in and abused in some situations. I was very bullied in Jr. High and some in a new High School I attended when I was moved from my real home.
I lucked out (I guess!) recently when the spath whom is affecting me at this time was at a hospital and his nurse’s wife knew him as a student. my posts are being removed here because of not wanting to be bullied by religious zealots for anyone reading through this – unsafe site – beware. This nurse was so helpful to me and I will never forget how kind he and his wife were. She was an instructor who knew the spath. I did not know this, but I told the nurse, “You know, he is able to charm people and he seems to fool all of the doctors and nurses, but I think he is a sociopath.” This nurse said, “I kNOW he is!” Wow. He told me what his wife had witnessed. I believe your word smug is a very good description. This man referred to the spath we both know as “smarmy” which I thought was a perfect word for him.
There are a lot of really great articles here if you are new to the site. If you go up to the About link, there is a full archives and a search engine to search the articles.
I would like to say that I have been on this site around three months. I want to say something you may already know. Spaths are everywhere and they will “lovebomb” you as is discussed here and some will “carebomb” you. I highly recommend observing a website before trusting anyone or purchasing anything. Posting too much has been very harmful to many people on websites with trolls and/or sociopaths.
The articles here are the most helpful information I have found other than a few books that have helped me with my specific situations.
fightforwhatsright,blossom4th,
Hi! thanks for the welcome.
I think I’m rather more aged and experienced than intuitive, but thanks anyway! But I guess that can sharpen intuition.
I’ve acutually been “lurking” on this site for years, since 2006, and I agree, it’s a great site, very iformative and with many comrades in arms, fighting the good fight for personal survival in the face of the spaths. Yes! We need one another.
I posted one comment in the past, I think it was about a year ago. I have a very busy life now, and I’m ten years out of my relationship with the spath. I also travel a lot these days, and so my life has become very complicated. Plus, I got hit with another whammy that hijacked my life for a while, but that is behind me now..thank God and my…yes, my intuition! But that is another story…which, by the way, demonstrated to me that there are actually worse things in this world than spaths, if you can believe that (unless spath is into homicide)!
liferaft2: Thank you for popping in to post that post about those subjects when I needed them very much. I appreciate it.
liferaft2,
Your stories and experience will really help here!Come when you can;keep us updated!Ten years out away from the spath-wow!I’ve only been away from spath this time,for 9 monthes.
Welcome liferaft2,
I don’t recall seeing you here before.This is a wonderful,supportive community that helps one in healing from interaction with a sociopath whether it be partner,family member,secular or otherwise.There are many fine articles in the archives to read as well as other educational materials.
Hi losteverything:
The reply button was missing after your last post. I am sorry to have hurt your feelings. You are right. I don’t know what it is like to deal with the aftermath of a sociopath dying and then finding out. What I said was abrupt and I am sorry. I think maybe I am preparing myself because the spath I deal with is on his way downhill and I know I will find out even more than I already have when he leaves behind his computer.
I have been abused by people the last couple of days. lost, my posts are being removed. He has been raging because he is being weaned from pain pills after his surgery. It was so bad last night with his raging because I wasn’t getting his cigarettes fast enough, that I told him I really do need for him to contact the VA and leave. He threatened to humiliate me in a very upsetting way similar to what you have discussed was done to you in the past. He raged at me as I was trying to walk into my front door while in the front yard and it was late and quiet outside so humiliated me so the neighbors could hear. I know I do not deserve abuse. I do try to stay away from him. But, he ran out of money, cigarettes and coffee. That is who he is. And he was being given the last of an addictive drug. He is one of the most addictive people I have ever known. After that, I did leave him a message that I can’t take any more and that he must call the VA and go into their housing program. I think he will ignore me and things will continue as they are until he does die. Abuse is abuse is abuse. How much can one take? I guess we don’t know until abusive people drive us crazy.
I am sorry about your mother. I know how much that haunts you. It was him. He was a bad person. I am glad that you have been able to get out and enjoy your life. I felt that way when I first found this website. But, it doesn’t make me feel that way any more. People like you and Stargazer and Still-Reeling and Imhope and liferaft2 and several others have kept me here because of your kindness. But, I don’t know if this site if for me. We will see.
Hi there Fight,
Calm down girl, you didn’t hurt my feelings at all. Deep breath. You are hurting and feel the need to be over alert.
I can relate to feelings like that. I was at the supermarket in January 09 and was just about finished shopping and walked into the produce department. 2 shoppers were talking about the stock market, I freaked, left my cart and went home. Not my best moment.
I remember your writing , I guess Sunday, about wishing the spath was dead. I could not find your post, as Lovefraud does not have a search feature. My point was ‘dead’ does not always make the problem go away. So many people told me, he got the ultimate punishment. Not from my point of view, I wish he was still alive.
Then I read, on an escort site, a post by one of the latespath’s ‘buddies’ after he died, ‘horrid to get caught cheating by your spouse, so much better to get caught after you are dead’. That was a slap in the face.
I was left to try to get my family’s own stuff back. That was a hell created by a sociopath and there would never be any answers.
At least if your spath is alive, you can confront him.
Hugs
Thank you, Lost. I will do my best to stay calm if I am still here. I know what people do to try to make another look or act crazy and I appreciate the many people here whom have stepped in and spoken to me kindly to let me know that I need to stay centered as they are witnessing abuse and it is not me. Some have stopped posting “for some reason” and have posted just to let me know it is not me.
I can confront my spath, but I work hard not to. Those rages are humiliating and there is no reasoning with a raging spath. I have left him a message and asked him to contact the VA and get on the list to move out as I can’t deal with him. He is addicted to everything except gambling. my posts are being removed while bullies stay. He ran out of coffee, cigarettes, and his post surgical pain pills two days ago and was demanding that I spend my money to go get coffee and cigarettes. I had been warning him for days that he was out of money and needed to portion out all of his nicotine and caffeine. The pills are just being weaned from post surgery.
However, addicts respond differently to that than the rest of us. If I buy him two cans of coffee, he still runs out. I got his money yesterday and bought three cans of coffee this month and I will not be surprised if he has used all three cans two days before pay day again! I can buy one carton of cigarettes or two. It will be gone within two weeks. He is also a food addict, so always runs out of food as well. He expects me to be his mommy and give, give, give.
He ignored me and told me “not to worry about it” and then demanded that I go pay for coffee and cigarettes before he got paid. I am proud of myself for standing my ground and keeping the consequences in place. However, his raging fit was upsetting. Emotionally, I just want him gone as I know it would be better for me in the long run. He holds some of the cards, though, as he is not above emotional blackmail as you and I have discussed. And I am scared of losing that money and having to find another room mate. But, he is not going to ever be consistently normal and raging and verbal and emotional abuse needs to be gone.
He was nice for a couple of months while waiting for his surgery. As soon as he knew his leg was repaired, he became his evil self again. I know it is wrong, but I wish he would never be able to be off the walker. He is much nicer when he can’t do anything for himself that requires walking and it is worth it for me to do it and have him weaker. When he is fairly physically helpless, he is much easier to deal with….even if I have to do more work.
Thanks for listening, lost. As always, I appreciate it. I’m tired.
I know the ‘pseudo mommy’ thing well. I knew that the latespath resented his mother, for working all the time, for turning him into a latchkey kid from 3rd grade on; in a time when stay at home moms were the norm. His mother is all business all the time, which is why I don’t really know her. Actually I have spoken to her more since he died than in the 47 years years before. If you watch the show ‘Mad Men’, she is very similar to the character ‘Joan’. The fact that he didn’t have 2 parents didn’t bother me, as my high school sweetie’s mom passed away before I knew him. I figured I was experienced with a single parent guy. MISTAKE. He came to expect that ‘care’: food; clean, ironed clothes; maid service. While he was in the midst of his stealing spree, he would think nothing of asking me to pick up a pack of cigarettes for him.
You, like me, opened the door for this type of behavior, I am sure quite innocently; trying to be helpful. I stopped doing his laundry way back and you know, those 500, 700, a grand an hour, girls didn’t care that his clothes were obscenely wrinkled or his shoes had holes in them. How he traveled on public transport in them and not felt embarrassed, I’ll never know.
If your spath is a veteran and you need help, you can contact the ‘service officer’, at your local American Legion or VFW, even if he is not a member.
In any relationship, both people ‘hold cards’. If he’s not afraid of yours, don’i let him know you are afraid of his.
Cigarettes and coffee, he lived on them since college.
fightforwhatsright,
Can I ever relate to that! These spaths are indeed all alike. Mine was alcoholic (among other worse things), and the most dangerous times with him were when he’d just gone off the wagon and was feeling arrogant and “invincible”, as he described it. But after a few weeks of that he’d get sick, and then he’d act pathetic and remorseful. But when he was healthy he was dangerous. I remember how sincere and needy he became when he feared he had cancer; but then it was back to the old demon once he learned he was in the clear. He was like two different people, with each of them sometimes even looking radically different from the other. I remember how that unsettled me early in our relationship. I should have disappeared fast at that point, instead of staying with him for fifteen years, needless to say.
Thank you, liferaft2:
Mine does the cancer scare thing, too. He has had it twice now…the most recent bone cancer removed and a rod in the leg….surgery two weeks ago. How scared can he be? He is smoking even more and tried to demand that I buy them with my money. Not going to happen again. Oh, the rage that brought on. All is quiet today, though. I’m glad you got back in touch with me.
lost everything,
You’ve been through such a nightmare;it’s totally understandable why you would need to isolate yourself for awhile and just get your thoughts together.But,we’re all here to support you and care about you.Take care of yourself;you deserve to release yourself from that nightmare~~atleast once in awhile!