(The article below is copyrighted © 2012 by Steve Becker, LCSW. My use of male gender pronouns is for convenience’s sake and not meant to imply that females aren’t capable of exhibiting the attitudes and behaviors discussed.)
What does it mean to say that someone has sociopathic tendencies, versus full-blown sociopathy, and does the difference even matter?
The simple answer is that someone with sociopathic tendencies will exhibit sociopathic behaviors and attitudes sometimes, while elsewhere he may seem to possess (and, in fact, may possess) a somewhat genuine (if limited and unreliable) capacity and desire to respect others.
In contrast, the full-blown sociopath’s respect for others, when apparently evident, is never really deeply genuine, but rather driven more by expediency or, more specifically, by the lack of any immediate opportunity to benefit from disrespecting or exploiting others.
Another way to say it is that the full-blown sociopath will almost always capitalize on perceived opportunities to exploit others for his own gain, whereas an individual with “sociopath tendencies” is likely to be somewhat less predictably exploitive in his interpersonal relationships.
In my experience, to identify that you are involved with a partial versus full-blown sociopath is not grounds for optimism. So long as sociopathic tendencies are present, their “quantity” seems to me to matter little. In the end, the individual’s prognosis is the same—hopeless. He is no less treatable or curable for the comparatively inconstant expression of his sociopathy.
In some respects it may be more disconcerting to be involved with a partial sociopath than a full-blown one. This is because the partial sociopath’s seeming capacity to be a “real,” sometimes (if selectively) attached human being can serve as a sort of tease—one finds the seemingly less exploitive aspect of his nature even more confusingly impossible to reconcile with the more exploitive one. One seizes on his capacity for “selective humanity,” misjudging it for his potential for ongoing, reliable empathy and respect for others.
Of course this is a pipe-dream, because the partial sociopath’s capacity for “sensitivity,” perhaps even for certain forms of loyalty, is ever-presently compromised by the underlying tug, and ultimate grip, of his underlying sociopathic orientation. He will inevitably, with utter certainty, drift back into his more exploitive mode and exhibit again, at some point in time, the shocking markers of his sociopathy—his defects of empathy in the context of his audaciously violating behaviors.
I want to stress this very carefully: to the extent that someone has sociopathic tendencies, implying that his sociopathy doesn’t necessarily encompass his “whole character” (as in the case of the full-blown sociopath), this is something like comparing two very dangerous, ultimately untreatable cancerous malignancies—the first hasn’t perhaps “metastasized” fully, but is definitely malignant with absolutely no cure and no chance of meaningful remission; whereas the latter shows perhaps evidence of a global invasion, i.e. “sociopathy run uncontrollably wild.”
I’ve worked for several years with a client I regard as having clear-cut sociopathic tendencies and find her to be among the more baffling clients I’ve worked with. There is the strangest, most jarring mix of humanity in her personality, a capacity for generosity, yet alternating with a historical pattern of cunning, lying behaviors and a chilling capacity to comfortably disown remarkable abdications of responsibility.
She has exhibited these dizzying, confusing qualities in her relationship with me. She has lied to my face countless times and produced fantastic, absurd, and obviously specious explanations for behaviors that someone fully unsociopathic would feel anxious and embarrassed to assert. When confronted with her dissimulation, she conveys (and seems to feel) little to no shame, just the knee-jerk inclination to perpetuate and elaborate the deceptions.
She is opportunistic and someone who has “worked the system” in a variety of unethical ways. Ultimately she lacks either the willingness, or capacity, to truly own the varieties of ethically dubious, sometimes alarmingly irresponsible behaviors that continue to sabotage her otherwise seemingly considerable potential.
She is a complex person, a very attractive and seductive individual, and I believe she possesses a dimension within her characterized by seemingly real generosity. At the same time, she can be shamelessly manipulative and deceptive, and can be “counted on” ultimately to be only “unreliable.” She seems destined to leave those in her life periodically stunned by the betrayal of their faith and trust in her.
She will never change. There is a sociopathic element in her character that I believes explains these patterns and that leaves her, in my view, permanently untrustworthy.
I’m interested in readers’ feedback on this subject.
Kim Frederick, thank you for the link. It’s an interesting article and I’m still curious about “how much” narcissistic and Borderlines can be “cured.” I don’t think it’s possible unless the individual is of such intent as to be willing to undergo some very, very painful processes.
KatyDid, your response makes sense. I’ve got a lot of work to do. LOL
Stargazer, at the moment, I am pretty much “stuck” in the past. I’m paying quite literally for the past in the form of a dwelling that has a roof and walls. Instead of spending time and effort in maintaining this joint-owned piece of shit, he spent his time and money (AND, my money) on going to a nearby city to engage in some of the most depraved and violent sexual activities imaginable. So, as a result, I have a furnace that needs to be replaced – it does not function and any attempt to use this source of heat could result in catastrophe. I have a hot water heater that died two weeks ago that should have been replaced 6 years ago. I do not have a functional cookstove. So, I am heating water on a wood-burning stove that was also neglected and is rusted in many, many places. I do not earn enough to pay for gasoline to drive to the job that I have.
And, because the idiot exspath just wants to see me a drooling, grovelling, and hollow shell of a human being, he is pressing for a divorce TRIAL instead of a hearing, and is drawing this out for as long as he can. The only reason that I haven’t given up and rolled over to die is because I don’t want to. I know that there will be an end to this bullshit, but getting there is a nightmarish journey that I didn’t deserve to have to take.
And, I think it would be a better approach for me to stop wondering when (or, if) I’ll ever feel “joy” again. This afternoon, I don’t much care. I don’t care if I ever pick up another paintbrush or throw another pot. I really don’t. I only care about heating the interior of these walls and hitting the food bank in another 10 days. 😀
To clarify: Pity Party is over.
Truthspeak,
Do you know that parable about the person who is paddling their boat down the river and another boat runs into theirs? They get all pissed off, cursing up and down at the inconsiderate, incompetent driver who ran into them. Then they look over and realize the boat is empty, and suddenly they stop being angry. Same boat, same situation. What’s the difference?
In Costa Rica, most people don’t have bathtubs, A/C, or even running water for part of the day. They have hurricanes, earthquakes, and floods regularly. They work for $2 an hour for 60 hours a week just to survive. And yet they are ridiculously happy. When they smile, their smiles light up their faces. Why? Because they do not feel resentment that someone made their lives that way. You could still be happy with a broken furnace, without any investments, and without much in the way of material things. But you will not be happy if you keep falling into resentment about it. It’s a HUGE challenge but this is your choice. If you continue to feel resentment, you will add to your health problems, and you will age more quickly. You will watch the joy and happiness draining out of your life. However, if you let go of the resentment and realize that you have everything you need in the present moment, joy will return to your life. It’s a catch 22, and you can’t have it both ways.
I want to say to you, sure go ahead and take the luxury of feeling anger and resentment for a day or so. Go ahead and have a pity party every once in a while. We all do. But I have to be honest – I don’t do it too much any more because I realize how destructive it is to think like that. Thoughts are things and you will create the things you worry about and the things you think about. If you worry about poverty, you will perpetuate poverty. Thoughts are things, and they are very powerful. We all have immense ability to create. So what are we creating with our thoughts?
My neighbor recently told me he worries a lot about living alone and what would happen if he was sick and couldn’t get to the phone, or if he was choking and couldn’t call anyone for help. I asked him, “Why do you spend so much time thinking about that?” I also live alone, but I spend no time thinking of such things. This leaves me free to think about happier things, like all my parties that people think I act like Cinderella LOL (which I don’t think is a bad thing). I figure when it’s my time to go, I’ll go. Why worry about it? Interestingly, my neighbor who is much younger than me, has a host of health issues. My health is much better than most people half my age. I firmly believe that time spent worrying about health issues perpetuates health issues. Period. I know I will piss a lot of people off by saying that, but I believe this with all my heart.
Stargazer, I read you loud, and clear.
Brightest blessings
Stargazer,
I believe our health is affected by our minds a lot. I also believe there are many factors which play into the body as a whole. The environment we live in along with genetics and mishaps of life which are unfortunate. Diet can also play a big part in health issues.
Worrying perpetuates all issues I believe and it is such a useless emotion as it changes nothing for the good. I have to be conscious of this all the time.
Star,
I get it, what you’re saying is, that a spath is like an empty boat.
LOL! good analogy!
Kim, thanks for that great link. It was long but really informative.
The part about the borderline being bored once their hunger for love is met, makes sense. They only feel “alive” when they are in predatory mode, when there is a game afoot, when they are competing for something. So this might answer Louise’s question about why they push us away. It’s a game and once they win your affections, they need you to get angry at them, so they can start over. Like Lucy holding the football for Charlie brown.
They like to win, but what makes them feel alive is the game.
It also connects to them being story driven characters. The story has to have a MacGuffin, a prize, which drives the adventure and the plot. At the end, the hero lives happily ever after. But those are empty words to the spath, he needs more adventure. Living happily ever after is boring.
There were many other great points in that link but that one is one that really struck me.
Also, I think that the difference between the spath and the borderline, is that the borderline may not necessarily be aware that his or her machinations are being fueled by this need for drama/games. But a spath is fully aware of it. He/She simply likes to see other people moving according to his whims, chasing his plot devices, exerting his/her power over the kingdom. They can never get enough of that. Though the spath also likes rivalry so that they can compete, WIN and watch you lose, the spath always intended to cheat.
Spaths set us up to play one game while they are actually playing another. The spath was never looking for love or trying to win your love. They only were looking to manipulate and win your acquiescence. Then once they win that, they turn up the heat to see you resist his next boundary violation. If you resist, the game is on again. Until you acquiesce again.
It’s like the dictator who keeps threatening war with a neighboring country. Once you appease the bully, he only comes back for more. That’s why we must never appease them.
skylar:
You know, I saw so clearly in my spath’s face what you described above. The “alive” look on his face when he was in predatory mode, the game, the competition. WOW. That is sooooo him. You can literally see it. So here’s another question…ooooh, I think I am onto something. So it’s a game to them, right? So as long as it’s just a game and they are getting what they want, they continue. But if it’s not a “game” to them, if they are “serious,” I think they stop. In other words, the OW showed her affections to him big time. He KNEW that she was crazy about him yet he continued on with her for almost a year. But with me, it was very short lived. I guess my cog/diss wants to tell me that’s because he started feeling something for me so he pushed me away and he went back to messing with her again. Why? I think because she was a plaything and that’s ALL he wanted, but in me, he saw something more. There has to be something to that…there just has to be.
You also said, “They need you to get angry at them.” I agree with that 100%. When he was blatantly ignoring my texts, I texted him, “Maybe you WANT me to hate you.” Of course, he never replied.
Louise,
read Dupey’s link to that song.
It’s dead on. As is Kim’s link. Yes they want you to hate them.
I don’t agree that they stop if you are serious. What you experienced was a triangulation with a spath and a borderline woman. She needed the rivalry because she is also pathological. She provided much more emotional craziness than you did. She was on a rollercoaster of emotion, but you held your ground. You gave no quarter – so to speak — you did not give him your pearl. You gave him sex but you didn’t give your pearl. Louise, that’s why you won. You played on instinct because you didn’t know about pathalogicals, but you still won. You listened to your intuition.
I see what you want to believe: that he saw you as being too serious. No Louise, he saw you as not being in the game. They need game.
When you think of him as an emotional being, you are projecting. He has no emotion, he’s just an infant playing a game. As shallow as a puddle. A cardboard cutout. Louise you fell in love with a mirage. Don’t feel bad, you aren’t the only one.
skylar:
You are right. He is an spath and she is borderline or extremely narcissistic. She IS pathological…she is a sick woman and he is a sick man. Yep, I didn’t play his game and he got bored. You know, he even asked me, “Why don’t you call me?” I will NEVER forget that. I wasn’t calling him, I wasn’t texting him, but you can bet the OW was ringing his cell day and night and the texts…oh, hundreds of them. Haha, I love it…he got with me and wondered why isn’t she calling me like that other one? Then he told me I was mysterious. Well, yeah…I was mysterious compared to the pathological spaz case. He was feeding off of her big time.
I am projecting and I need to STOP. That is the one area I really need to work on. Thank you for that.
Thank you for your responses, Skylar and Kim.
The link you posted, Kim, was very interesting. But I have to disagree with the tone the author took in regards to Narcissists. It’s almost as if the author was stating the Borderline is worse than the Narcissist. And as far as a narcissist being a “perpetual giver”, well that is a bit absurd to read. My ex-narc was not a giver at all unless it was to make him appear wonderful.
I’m not sure if I was a borderline and now I’m recovered. I don’t believe I ever pushed my ex away when he showed love to me. It was in those moments where I really fell for him. I have always strived for spiritual and mental growth, so I’m really not sure what my state of being was at the time I was seeing my ex.
I can admit that I wasn’t healthy emotionally because of my sad childhood and abandonment issues. I honestly think I was experiencing CPTSD during that time. I was clingy and needy at times in my relationship with my ex, but I attribute that to his constant devaluing and discarding me. I couldn’t understand it so I clung very tight to the hopes of getting him to love me again.
Looking back, I can honestly say that I loved him. I don’t think it was the pain of his rejection that I took for love. I honestly felt I had a deep and hopeful connection with him. I thought he really loved me. I thought I was safe and could let my guard down and really give all of myself to him. I was exposed completely and he knew it.
He almost immediately rejected me when I let my love feelings be known to him. So after reading the article from the link, I am beginning to wonder if he is a borderline. I am so confused to what he is.
I do know that he was cruel emotionally, sadistic at times, haughty, conceited, and always wanted attention from his friends. He always wanted to seem like a good guy or like he was the victim. He used me so badly and I was left in shock at how untrue his feelings for me were.
So, I guess the question is, can someone be a narcissist and a borderline at the same time? I think I am more confused now …