Lovefraud received the following e-mail from a woman whose daughter is caught in the web of a sociopath. The woman and her husband are not enabling the relationship—the sociopath, of course, wants money. They are hoping and praying that their daughter will escape.
Here is her question to other Lovefaud readers:
What was the “turning point,” “awakening moment,” “realization point,” that woke them up OUT of the fog, the gaslighting, etc., and what made them realize they needed to RUN, to get away from their sociopaths? Â What finally “did it,” what finally “broke the camel’s back?” Â Where they realized what was happening to them, had been done to them, when they finally realized things were NEVER going to “get better?”
There must be a “trigger” here somewhere. I’m just trying to grasp what it’s going to take. Â What is going to have to happen to jar her awake from this brainwashing/fog?
My experience
I remember the moment for me.
I knew my husband, James Montgomery, was lying to me, although I didn’t realize the extreme extent of the lies. I knew all my money was gone; my husband had spent about $227,000, much of it carelessly. I suspected he was cheating on me, and when I discovered proof, I left him.
Still, even after I left him, I thought my husband was just one of those guys who can’t stay faithful. I did not realize that my entire marriage was a scam right from the beginning.
The real moment of truth came when I called one of the women my husband appeared to be involved with. According to bank records I’d found, she had given him $6,000. The conversation went like this:
“I’m Donna Andersen. I’m James Montgomery’s wife, and I’d like to suggest that you don’t give him any more money.”
“It’s too late. I already gave him $92,000.”
I almost dropped the phone. And with that conversation, I realized that my husband had married me for the specific purpose of taking my money. That was all.
Your moment of truth
This reader has asked a really important question, one that may glean some possible approaches from helping people escape the sociopathic trap. So please post your experience.
What did it for you? When did you finally realize that you had to get out?
Dear Gem,
Sounds like you and I are about in the same place with our kiddos—just don’t “give a chit” much any more…don’t fall for the lies, don’t believe a word any of them say, know they ain’t’a’gonna change, and I don’t respect them—what’s to respect? I don’t like them–what’s to like? If I neither respect nor like someone, what’s to love? If “love” means I would sacrifice myself to save them, save them if they were sleeping on the street or hungry, or save them if they were drowning…then no, there’s no “love” there. If feeling like I don’t even KNOW THEM, that they are STRANGERS to me is indifference, then I guess I feel mostly indifference to them.
I don’t have any expectations that are positive out of them. I don’t want to associate with them, and with the P son, I actually FEAR him rather much, with son C, I don’t fear him, he isn’t going to decide to deliberately do something to hurt me, although I have no illusions that he would go out of his way to protect me either, and I don’t trust him to tell me the truth if it is the least bit inconvenient for him.
The same with the egg donor I guess….For my whole life I THOUGHT I knew her, but realize now it wasn’t “her” I knew, it was the ILLUSION I HAD KNIT TOGETHER of a mother who loved me and that if I tried hard enough I could please… so eventually I realized I don’t give a rat’s behind if she’s pleased or not….I’m out to please myself now, Snooky! Gosh what a CONCEPT!@.......!!!! Wish I’d thought of it decades ago!
Oh, well…..live and learn, and live and learn some more….Glad you are making it Gem. YOu deserve to make it P-FREE!!!! (((HUGS)))))
Dear Ox Drover, I cant remember where I first posted my comment – I just want to make a confession and ask what you think of it.
In the last months before I left my husband, I decided that I would try to play him at his own game, and so I gathered all his clothes ( that I had bought him ) together, all the personal things of his, some tools he had left at the “prison” he was keeping me in, and I either gave them away or sold them.
Then when he came looking for them, I told him he had taken them with him to the mine he worked on. He accepted this, as I found not one personal document of his anywhere, nothing at all, he always said “they were in his car” – if I queried this, then the aggression would start “Are you STARTING again?!”
8 months on, he still calls me twice a day ( only for 1 min to complain how hard he is working) – he does not know where I live – I have moved to another part of the country. He is “waiting” for his “money” to become available so he can “repay” the money he borrowed from my family, as he thinks that then, I will be coming back to him.
The other reason I allow him to call me and tell me he loves me, is because by allowing him to do this, he pays me a small amount of money every month and this covers my chronic medication, so that I am able to save most of my wages. I told him I was earning very little and that I was forced to pay most of it over to my family to repay his debt.
After he has spoken to me, I end the call and call him an asshole, and smile because I am working him the way he worked me.
Sometimes I think I am a spath as well. But you know, even though I now know what he is, when I hear his voice, I can pretend sometimes that I must be mistaken about him ( I really do know I am not) – and I am sure that until I start the no contact rule, I will not really get over this man.
I bloody well keep on HOPING that I can get my old life back, and yet, I know I never will. Yes, I KNOW I am a fool, but at the moment I just cant help myself. I know I must sound like a real idiot, but I am still so confused.
I just cant keep from coming back to read this forum every chance I get, and I am so glad its here for people like us.
Dear Stilll grieving,
NO!!! You are NOT like him, you are just, as ErinBrock would say “BACK-SPATHING” him—playing him along to try to get some justice for what he has done, get some of your money back. Personally, giving them DIS-information is NOT “lying” to them, it is just like “all’s fair in love and war”——and DEALING WITH A PSYCHOPATH.
Do what you have to do to get the money back, except sleep with him! LOL
You are DOING A GREAT JOB it sounds to me like KEEP IT UP. We all know he is not going to give you any large lump- of repayment, but get what you can get with a phone call and a little DIS-INFORMATION. ((((HUGS)))) I’m proud of you GIRL!!!! REAL PROUD!!!!! TOWANDA!!!!!
m
The turning point… I left him physically before I left him in my mind. My turning point was reading about personality disorders and seeing that all of his behavior matched up.
Love is intoxicating. We are conditioned our whole lives to look for an over the top love experience… when we feel that.. we think we have found THE ONE. At that point, we will do anything, put up with anything, try to BE anything… to keep it.
It is painful to accept that this sweeping away in love moment in our life is fake… because we are not fake… and our love is not fake.
A turning point is when you learn to pay attention more to what people DO than what they SAY? And also, we learn, the hard way… to question people’s motives. What does the other person have to gain?
Good luck. My sister has a co-worker that is hooked up with a Sociopath right now. She is 25ish. And he is 22. The “meaning of life” for her is to be married and be loved… and he has tapped into that.. and he has moved himself into her house and free-loaded off of her. No one supports the upcoming “marriage.” And the Bride to be, doesn’t look happy, either. She has stopped talking to people about him and sanitizes what she does share… because she is in love with love.
:O)
I used to be that girl too. The road to recovery is rough but I made it.
Hey, hey!!! Aloha babe!!!!~ Good to see you! How is school going? Are you on spring break? Spring is springing here–but has actually chilled out a bit! back into the 50s and 60s instead of the high 70s, but I’ll be griping before long about the heat and humidity! LOL
Yep, in love with LUUUUVVVVV!!!! Ain’t it grand! LOL
I just came across a link to a song that’s a pretty good description of loving someone with a personality disorder.
here you go:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBWrLhgiX74
Hi I’m all new to commenting, but not new to the life you all talk about. You all have saved my sanity for the last year I have endured losing what I thought was my best friend to my was I thought was my live in boyfriend. My relationship with the gal was for 18 years. We had been thru alot of life together. I moved my guy in and she always hated the idea. Constantly telling me I was very sick and he was not the person to fall for. After six months of emotional abuse from him and her, I had him move out. Something inside of me said save yourself. You are not afraid to be alone, get rid of him. He is an ex-con, been locked up many times. But all I wanted to see was this kind giving guy that was there for me while I was going thru the roughest time of my adult life. I had worked in the same job for 27 years, single Mom, and been divorced now for 30 years. I am 50 years old, and being on my own is what I know. After he left I snapped and wanted him back so bad. I did not realize that I had betrayal bonds with this man in such a short time. I was dying inside and begged to have him come back and he refused to see me talk or anything. My what I thought was a best friend, ran off with him. They both turned on me and flaunted their relationship in my face. It has been a nightmare. I keep think I’m in love with him and that he is this great guy that took care of a disabled me. In my attempts to mend the relationships they filed a restraining order on me and took me to court. By now I had lost 40 lbs, sick and not taking care of myself. In court they lied and said I had been in mental words off and on my whole life. That I helped my Mom kill my dad when I was 15. No one knew me in this beach town, for I had gone where she was to heal and recovery from my medical condition. She was the only character witness I had and she was the enemy. Right befor my eyes, the judge believed all the testimony of the people in court and I was the bad guy. Now a whole town knew me as a stalker. Stupid me, I stayed to prove them all wrong. Stayed in the small town and tried to make friends in a 12 step recovery program. Futile it all was. All the lies and betrayal just kill me. I after one whole long year have moved back to my old home and am trying to heal. I have so much anger sometimes it kills me. Then I read your blogs and I find hope. I know somewhere in me I will get better like never before. I am alone and feeling all the emotions I can. Lonely? Sometimes, but all I have to think about was how they turned on me. When I was a little girl, number 7 of 9 kids, my dad was a P. and my mother never protected us, then one day in 1975, I was 15, my dad came to the house to kill us all and my mom after 25 years stood up to him and shot and killed him. I have always picked sick abusive men and end up alone, hurt and betrayed. Now I’m after all these years, seeing how attracted to these sick men and women. looking for approval and love, and so willing to accomidate all their needs, financially and physically, and emotionally. Now I’m healing myself with the man upsatairs. And sharing my HOPE with my sis who is going thru lifes same battles. Thank you all of you. You have saved my sanity. I looked ups sociapath and found you all a year ago this week.
Dear Anne,
Welcome to Lovefraud, and thank you for posting. I hope you will stick around and keep on reading here. There is so much wonderful information here and it will help you to heal.
What a terrible thing to happen to you in childhood…but there is NOTHING that cannot be overcome if we work hard enough at it.
The book by Patrick Carnes, “The Betrayal Bond” might be a very good book for you to read as you go along on your healing journey. It talks about the trauma bonds that make us want to attach to the same kind of mean people we dealt with as children.
Again, welcome to LoveFraud. God bless.
Thank you for commenting. I have been very private and afraid to reach out. This has helped a lot. Sometimes I just want to lock myself up in my house and not experience any human contact at all. Writing is helping me reach out. I did read that book Betral Bonds, and what a turning point for me. I couldn’t understand how I could miss and think I still loved the people that betrayed me. it makes much more sense now. thank you so much for being there. Bless you
Dear Anne,
Wanting to retreat inside your house like a turtle inside his shell is a normal response when we have been traumatized and hurt. I think to one extent or another we have almost all been there in that same feeling of being afraid to reach out to others.
I lost my own trust in myself to keep me safe from harm, my own ability to decide who was safe to interact with and who wasn’t. Now I am learning again to trust myself to keep me safe. It isn’t my trust in others that I lost that I was so missing, but my trust in myself.
I have put up some pretty stiff boundaries around myself now, and I no longer allow others to cross those boundaries of dishonesty and unkindness. If I observe that someone is dishonest or unkind, I don’t let them approach me any closer.
In order to feel safe in interacting with others, I have to set the limits of what I think is safe. People who are dishonest I don’t think are safe to be around so I avoid them. It’s a process. Learning is life long, and when we quit learning we quit growing.
I’m glad you are here and glad that you reached out to post! (((hugs)))