Lovefraud recently received the letter below from a reader; we’ll call her Andrea.
I was married to a sociopath for 12 years (didn’t know it until we divorced). He had 3 affairs and was a minister for a majority of that time. He messed up a lot of lives. Anyway, I am at my wits end right now because I cannot get him out of my life because we had 2 children. I am so tired of dealing with him. My kids are 12 and 10 now and my ex is doing everything in his power to try and convince my son to go live with him when he’s 14. I see it happening and there’s nothing I can do to stop it. I keep notes about everything that happens, but my lawyer tells me that it would be a very hard case if my son wants to go.
I’m also struggling right now because I have something my ex wants. I have some documents from when we were married and owned a business. He needs some proof that another couple we were in business with is not responsible for a loan we had. My ex got the loan in the divorce. I believe he’s trying to bankrupt his business. Anyway, I’m refusing to give him the documents because I am so tired of being bullied by him and lied to. I know this was a stupid thing to do because now he’s furious and is attacking me through emails and bashing me to the kids. But, it seems so unfair that I have to give in to him ALL THE TIME to keep the peace. I am tired of it. He has something I want and I’m holding the documents as a bargaining tool. Do you think this will work with a sociopath? Or am I just asking for it?
A relationship or any type of involvement with a sociopath leaves us with a big ball of turmoil. We discover that everything he or she has ever said to us was a lie, and we are outraged. We learn that we were played like a fool, and we are humiliated. We realize that our love and trust were abused, and we fear that we’ll never love and trust again.
While trying to deal with the emotional shock of the betrayal, we also have to deal with the practical issues of disengaging—divorce, finances, children. As we do this, especially if there are legal proceedings involved, we want to tell the world, or at least the judge, about the sociopath’s wrongdoing. We want to prove that we were honorable, and the sociopath was not. We want to be vindicated.
The sociopath does not experience this emotional turmoil. The sociopath’s only objective is to win. The definition of “winning,” of course, depends on what the sociopath wants. Maybe it’s keeping his or her possessions, such as children. Maybe it’s keeping his or her money by not having to pay child support. Maybe it’s destroying us.
Think strategically
Usually Lovefraud advises our readers to have no contact with sociopaths. Of course, this is not possible when someone, like Andrea, has to co-parent with a sociopath.
My advice to Andrea was to think strategically. There is no point withholding the documents just because she is tired of being bullied. What does she really want? What leverage does she have to get what she wants?
The documents she talks about are leverage. Therefore, Andrea should play this exactly as the sociopath would—using the documents to extract some kind of concession out of him. She needs to evaluate what that might be, and then use her leverage to get it.
However, whatever she demands needs to be something that the sociopath can deliver immediately, not at some time in the future. Sociopaths do not honor agreements, so there is no point in asking for something that will be delivered later, or over a long period of time. It will never happen.
What works?
For sociopaths, it’s all a game, a game that they want to win.
In my case, however, my sociopathic ex-husband, James Montgomery, just quit playing. In our divorce, he fired his attorney, signed papers to represent himself pro se, and then defaulted. He was on to his next scam, and had no use for me. I never interacted with him again.
So I actually don’t have experience in ongoing dealings with a sociopath. Therefore, I ask Lovefraud readers for your input. If you must continue to deal with a sociopath, what works?
ps to even get it reduced I think he wold have to hire an attorney, and without a job how is he going to hire an attorney? Hope that is the case anyway, and in the meantime the support “piles up” unpaid.
Hi all. I’m reading the posts and taking notes! Thank you all.
My problem is is that my mother is a sociopath. I hope that I can use the insights on this wonderful resource to separate from her. My father passed and left me in charge of her money. I get caught up in the inheritance thing. Writing this makes me sound so foolish. Associating with her just to get an inheritance one day and then I might not as the way the economy is right now.
I have to understand my sanity and sanctity is more important than her money. I want to be a good daughter but I can’t. She is an S.
The no slack, no compassion sounds like a good start.
I am new at this and my life has been going down the toilet the more I am around her or talk to her.
endthe pain,
Regarding child support- he may not be paying now, but the debt never goes away. He would have to contact an attorney to get a motion filed in attempt to lower it.
My sons father moved out of state and didn’t pay support for years. Finally, I caught back up with him while employed. Judge set up payments with back child support with interest. With my son being 20 yrs old now, I still randomly receive payments as the interest incurs monthly.
THe dad hasn’t seen my son in years now. Makes no difference, His obligation is ALways there to pay whether he exercises visitation or not.
thank you..my life has been so complicated with this man…he has now gone back to his ex wife…he stopped their divorce as he thought he would be ablw to get something thru the sale of their home and as it turns out they are losing it. I saw first hand what he was capable of when he was going thru this divorce as he had no concern for his daughters support…I tried to get him to do the right thing and was sickened with what I saw…needless to say she is refusing to pay his child support..but will support him in every other sense of the word…he has gone back and forth between the two of us..for so long..lying to each of us..I am the smarter one as I wil not stand for this any longer and have told him…I just dont kn ow what to expect next from him
also..he hasnt filed a motion as it was stipulation we entered when i lowered it once..he contacted child support services for a review stating he spent time with his son so it should be modfied and also that he isnt working
aroundthebend…Diana…I just read your post/story…thanks, and welcome. I can’t think of anything to add to that account…just thanks.
endthepain:
Since S isn’t paying child support, go into court and ask for an order garnishing his tax returns. Going into family court pro se (without an attorney) isn’t hard — here in NYC I would say the majority of the people going in aren’t represented.
The bigger question you have to ask yourself is this — would I be willing to forego child support to get him to terminate his parental rights? That may be where you ultimately want to go, since you will be chasing this creature for money until the end of time and have to put up with his interference too.
sabrina, on a posting yesterday brought up the importance of getting a visitation agreement in place and forcing S to stick to every word of it. No changing visitation. No late support payments. All requests for holidays must be in writing and certified mail. All pick-ups and drop-offs must be in a public place. If you give this non-human creature an inch, he will take the proverbial mile.
Bottom line? You’ve got to get really, really clear on what you want vis-a-vis S, and then do it.
ANGELAJOHNSON-
“First of all, they feed off of fear. Once you stop fearing them and stand up to them emotionally and legally, they will begin to act differently. They are used to you being afraid of them and they are used to you not adhering to the boundaries you say you are going to set. When you say you are going to do something, stick to it. Plan everything you are going to do strategically and intelligently. Try to use logic instead of emotions when you plan your course of action.
After you have done all this, use all the advantages you have, witnesses, documents, emails, their former criminal records, etc, against them. Keep everything organized and know exactly what you are going to say when you deal with them.
Usually, if you disengage from the fear and “dance of anger” with them and begin to handle them strategically instead of emotionally, THEY WILL SELF-DESTRUCT in front of everybody. When I say in front of everybody, I mean everybody (Judges, Police officers, family, friends, new spouses, girlfriends, etc). They are not good at keeping their cool when You keep yours. And they don’t fare well when they aren’t pushing anyone’s buttons”
This is advice is priceless! It is spot on. It is what should be done especially when involved with divorcing one of these people or sharing custody of children. Have to be in that detached state of mind, finally at a place where your emotions are only shared only with yourself and your true family friends loved ones and LF :)- not with the X!!
Diana (Aroundthebend)
WOW. Wow. What a story. What a journey. What a miracle! I experienced so many feelings just in your post..cant imagine all you have endured.
But you believed in yourself. You knew what was right for you, or rather what your daughter had to do – in order to find her way back home. There is SO MUCH TO LEARN FROM YOUR POST AND ALL THAT YOU SHARED..You certainly have touched someones life today.
Thank you for sharing and showing us the power of SELF- SURVIVAL and knowing when to put your faith in the hands of the power to be..God bless you…
Dear Pesel,
Welcome… sorry you are going through this in your life. There are alot of articles and post here for you to read and connect with and hopefully find the tools required to go through life with a sociopathic mother. You will find great support here. Sharing your story, your journey also helps in many ways…
More important than wanting to be a good daughter..is the the importance and necessity of wanting to be good to yourself first and putting boundaries in place and knowing your own limitations with your mother.
Remember she is not healthy… so conversations with her are not necessarily to be received by you as healthy and correct. Hope you find comfort and support here and anywhere you seek it!! Good luck. Glad you are here!!