REGISTER | LOGIN
By | December 15, 2014 174 Comments

Why you feel so shattered by the sociopath’s betrayal

Human skeleton“How can someone who claims to love me be so cruel?”

“Do you mean he (she) never loved me? It was all a lie?”

“I never knew people like this existed!”

When you first begin to realize that you’ve been involved with a sociopath, you may feel unhinged, like you’ve lost your bearings in the world and you’re drifting.

You’ve had your heart broken before, but no previous relationship compared to this. Even if you’ve managed to get away from this toxic person, you feel lost. Your well-meaning friends and family are urging you to get over it, to put it behind you, but you can’t.

Why? Why is it so difficult to overcome the sociopathic experience?

I believe it’s because nobody talks about the fact that sociopaths live among us. It’s a giant, malevolent skeleton in humanity’s closet.

Society’s myths

All our lives, society bombards us with messages such as “everybody is basically the same,” “all men are created equal,” “we all just want to be loved,” and “there’s good in everyone.”

We strive to follow the Golden Rule — “Treat others the way you want to be treated” — believing that if we’re good to people, they’ll be good to us in return.

As much as we would like these ideas to be universal, they are not. But no cultural institutions, such as schools, churches, or even women’s magazines, tells us that there are exceptions to all these truisms.

No one tells us that criminals and terrorists aren’t the only bad people in the world. No one tells us that our neighbors, co-workers, or fellow church members, who look just like us, may, in fact, be human predators.

So when we run into these human predators, we are totally unprepared.

The big contradiction

We don’t know about sociopaths — people who live their lives by exploiting others. Professionally, they may be diagnosed as antisocial, narcissistic, borderline, histrionic or psychopathic. The official estimates for the number of people who have these personality disorders average about 12% of the population.

For this segment of the population, all those feel-good messages we get from society simply don’t apply. These people are not the same as us. They do not just want to be loved. Deep down, there is no good inside.

World view

We all have a certain Weltanschauung, a word borrowed from German that means “world view.” We have ideas and beliefs about how the world works, the nature of things, and the nature of people.

After a lifetime of absorbing cultural messages such as “everyone deserves a chance” and “love can change everything,” these are the lenses through which we view the world. They are also the lenses through which we approach our relationships.

Then we experience betrayal by the sociopath.

Here’s why this betrayal is so devastating: It shatters our world view. It contradicts everything we thought we knew and understood about the world and the people in it.

We learn, much to our horror, that our world view is not accurate. There is a certain percentage of the population the sociopaths for whom everything we thought we knew about humanity simply does not apply.

This is why we feel unhinged. Not only our heart is broken — our understanding of life is broken.

Wisdom

Along with emotional healing, therefore, recovery requires that we change our most fundamental beliefs.

Yes, for 88% of the population, everything we always thought remains true. But for the remaining 12%, we need to accept a new reality.

Sociopaths are totally different from the rest of us. They have no ability to love. They are motivated only by power and control.

But now we know. We’ve know that although the majority of people are good and loving, some are not.

Having learned this lesson the hard way we can now approach the rest of our lives with the wisdom of a survivor.

 


174
Comment on this article

Please Login to comment
  Subscribe  
Notify of
pau

That is exactly how I feel. I am devastated. My understanding of life is completely broken. I don’t know what is true, what false, whether God exhist, whether He is a product of my imagination only.I keep asking myself why God created such monters? And where is free will, if they have no consciense. I feel like I am watching a horror movie and I am main character in it. I am no even sure if those horrible things really happened to me. My ex “killed me emotionally” and I am not even sure if he is a psychopath.
We were together few years, we met when I was 23 and he 22. He was my prince charming and the best person, friend, sould mate I have ever met. We shared same ethical system, hobbies, our families loved me and him. We were so happy together and so much in love. During this whole time I haven’t seen his real face – the one behind mask of sanity, he never did any mistake, he passed all the tests, and was always for me when I needed him. Supported my career, adoring me, loving, spoiling etc. everything was great until I accepted his proposal and few months before wedding had a chance to break into his computer. He went abroad for few days and left me alone in his apartment. That was when I found videos of him and different woman, he was having sex with. He recorder all of that without their permission, they didn’t know about that. English is not my native language so it is nor easy for me to express what I felt when I saw it.The way he treated those woman, it just wasn’t the person I loved. Still I am not sure if some of them weren’t just prostitutes. The worst thing was that we never had sexual relation, I am religious and wanted to stay virgin till the wedding day and he claimed to be the same. We often talked how much we loved God, and how much we want to have pure love and marriage based on real commitment, friendship and unification. He often criticized his friends who lived with woman or changed their girlfriends like a socks. He underlined how blessed he was to have me and that I was his perfect angel and treasure. When I found his horrible secret my life was ruined I begged God to die. Still I praying for this. My heart and soul was innocent and I had to watch a love of my life in many porn movies made by him! After few days of not eating and throwing up. I decided to forgive him, I blamed myself of not sleeping with him. When he came back from abroad, and I told him about his revealed secret he started to cry and apologize. I felt so sorry for him and my love was even bigger, I could do anything to help him. He said that it was his weak side and that he was just depressed. Next day however , when I started to cry and couldn’t stop , he showed me the coldest face ever, he close the door to the room I was staying in, not to hear my cry and said “cry you will feel much better”. That was big red flag! He had no empathy for my pain! Then he came to me and offered to watch movie together, I was so much in shock that felt asleep in his arms, and when I woke up he said to me” I should kill you as you know all my secrets now”.I thought he was joking. 2 weeks after that , everybody started preparations for our wedding and I just couldn’t calm down, every night I had nightmares, he was betraying me in and then cutting my face with knife, his face looked different – was very ugly, he looked like a psychopath. (I didn’t understand that as he is very handsome – type of man model). When I told him that I started to have doubts if he really loved me, he got mad.I asked him to give me 2 weeks so I could make final decision regarding our wedding. I loved him so much that after 1 weeks I called him and told him I wanted to be with him. He told me that as he sees my fears he thinks we should slow down a bit, he was lately pushing me to marriage, his last words to me were: “Honey don’t say anybody about your doubts. We will solve our problems together.I will wait for you as long as you need. Let’s talk tommorow. I love you”. And guess what….he dissapeard from my life the next day, it was just before Easter!he blocked me, my friends, family on facebook. And few days later posted a photo with new woman, few weeks later photos from their engagement ceremony. He was kneeling in front of her as he kneeled in front of me, and he even gave her exactly the same engagement ring. He never broke up with me! I still had the ring he gave me! He married her on our day of wedding, the date I chose, in the place I chose. She even had the wedding dress similar to one I chose. They went on honeymoon to the place I chose. And he made sure that I see all of that as he posted all the photos on facebook. His family trurned his back on him and supported me , even though I didn’t ask them for that, for the first time he didn’t care that his father disagreed with him. All of that is so strange, I am not sure whether he is psychopath whether not, he was so good to me, he loved animals, he was helping so many people, always saying right things, from good family, well educated, modest, I could count like that for hours. And than he married a woman he knew few days, why ?To make me suffer more? Is it normal? I am not sure what is normal anymore. I keep blaming myself for what I found in his computer, his family say that he is unhappy with new woman and that he loves me, but can he really love. Could he really pretend the love for me which I saw in his eyes? Will God ever give me the answer to all my questions? How can I trust again?

Viewpoint

I can think of one answer to hang your hat on: Your beau is/was heebie-jeebie weird. Whatever else he was/might be, he definitely is a weird one. And here’s the thing: Weirdos can look normal… up to a point. When you wind up doing 24/7 with them, you catch the smell…And they do create the most curious of lives. You hang around long enough and you’d be wondering not just what folks think of you with him but whether some of his goofy hasn’t rubbed off on you!

You know, sometimes, despite ourselves and our tunnel visions, God takes care to see us to safety. It was a good fortune to you that the creep went his way; despite his parting words (Maybe even despite himself) because when you didn’t take heed yourself, it was the only way to save you.

You might think of this for the future: That the kick in the teeth you first got, you were meant to get to get you gone. You don’t have to worry about trusting another; you just have to be trustworthy to yourself: That you won’t ever entertain a second chance for that which is just yucky/weirdo (Not even for the choirboy), that you’ll lead with your head not heart as difficult as that may seem, that you won’t put any of your stabilities in jeopardy (financial, personal gratifications, career aims, important relationships, etc.)and that you’ll have a tongue and cheek attitude about romance… That it’s fun, it’s heady and desirable but it is only a shooting star. The prognostic indicators for happiness rest in other things… including the kind of things that left you sleepless and broke your heart.

Your pain from this way weird business will not last. The day is coming sooner than you imagine that you will shudder about this as a “close call”. You don’t have to do anything particularly special to have that day come; you’re already geared for that moment. Just because you encountered a weirdo doesn’t mean anything but that…ie, says nothing about you.

On the other hand, what would have been like to have been the one in the wedding dress? OMG! I can’t hazard to guess because you got only the tip of the iceberg on this wacko.

eurohorse

Pau,

I have been reading snippets from this site for several years now, but have never commented because I made the mistake of using my actual “handle” of Eurohorse when I originally signed up, and I did not want my ex (a flaming sociopath) to use it against me. However, when I read your story, I was compelled to finally contribute.

Your story is tragic. It is 9:06 in the morning, while I am typing this, and I am near tears, on your behalf.

But Pau, here is what I find the most tragic…..and that is that you are doubting yourself. You are so young – you have such a fine life ahead of you – I was 45 when I went down the path of loving someone who was not who he said he was.

I want you to learn from me, right here, right now, please.

I have a child who just turned 16 from my involvement. My four other children are much older. I bought a book just two days ago on Audible (it’s a service where you can purchase a book, and listen to someone read it). I implore you to buy this book. To put aside all of your worries, all of your grief, all of your horror – and just sit and listen to this book. It will change your life. Here is the name of the book….The Object of my Affection is my Reflection. I am reading it because I fear that many traits of the sociopath are tempting for my 16 year old. His father, after completely annihilating me financially, moved on to another woman whom he financially ruined as well….we were both stepping stones to his marriage to the daughter of a billionaire. Yes, with a “B”. She is what is called a “trust funder”. He now has an American Express card in his wallet that gets paid every month by his father-in-law. My son has one too. It is hard to compete. That is why I am listening to this book, because even though my ex is basically out of my life, my son will never be. Please get the book immediately, whether in a hard copy, or through Audible, but you must read it. I believe that once you have, you will become the most determined, the most audacious, the sassiest and most compelling victim of a sociopath the world has ever seen! Thank your lucky stars that this happened to you when you were still just a babe….as in a babe in arms. Your willingness to tell your story was the beginning of your bravery. You have NAILED this, Pau!!!!!!! You are on a mission!!!!!! I am so proud of you!!!!!! And by the way, God has already given you all the answers you will ever need. You have them, right now. Be at peace. That is all God wants for you, and that is huge.

teepee1124

I have just escaped a 30 year marriage to a sociopath. I knew after the first few years that something wasn’t right. I thought it was his difficult childhood. I thought I just needed to love him more, do more, be more. It took me longer to realize that everything out of his mouth was a lie.
I read a lot of books about difficult men and how, as a wife, I could help him, us. Not one mentioned anything about a sociopath and how nothing can be changed.
After leaving him, he spread some pretty vicious rumors about me to our friends, customers, people I work with and potential employers. I wondered why everyone was being weird, then he finally let me in on the big ‘secret’. He has pulled some pretty devastating things on me in the past, but his one took the cake. I was so humiliated over the things he accused me of. The worst part is that so many people who were supposed to be ‘my’ friends, supposed to ‘know’ me, actually believed him! Of course, I know how he told them. With his head bowed, shaking his head, stuttering because he was so emotionally devastated to have to talk about it, then looking them in the eye, lip quivering, as a tear rolled down his cheek. Of course they believed him! Look how many years I believed him.
So, now I’m at the point that I just don’t think I can trust anyone. Seems we had a few customers that backed him up and have been spreading the lies. I get calls everyday from friends from all over the country, asking if it’s true.
The whole kicker is that he’s convinced himself that his lies are the truth! I know from reading here that that is part of it. He has always believe that saying something enough times makes it the truth. Once I asked him why he lied to me. He said it was really my fault because I’d ask him about things that he didn’t want me to know about. Yes, if I hadn’t asked the wrong question, he would not have had to lie.
I’ve dropped all our friends, cut myself off from all of them. I’ve moved four hours away and have no contact other than regarding our divorce settlement. I only speak to him in a voice void of all emotion. He cannot understand why I’m being ‘this way’. Once the divorce is final, I will have no further contact with him, even though we have two adult children.
I just wish I had found the information on this site so many years ago. Had I known it was hopeless, I would not have worked so hard to make everything work. Once the divorce is final, I am planning on starting a FB page that offers information and testimonials on sociopaths because I know so many other women in the same boat.
As to ‘why’ he lied to me, manipulated me, and used me…because he could.

daughterofone

Teepee1124, I am so sorry for what you’ve been through. It’s sad to say, but your story is a common one. Spaths know how to work people and they are quite narcissistic and sensitive to having their reputations questioned. He sounds like an older man who has had years of practice, years of watching, researching and mimicking how to turn on his fake emotions to convince the unknowing of his great “pain” and “hurt” caused by you. For the uneducated out there, all they see is this poor, hurting man who misses his wife and can’t understand what has gone wrong in her mind. And all the while, it was and is him who is at fault.

If you can afford it, I highly recommend you seek out a counselor/therapist who is knowledgeable in the field of victims of sociopaths and get some help for yourself. It will take years to heal from this. And it will be hard for you to ever trust another man again. But please take time to take care of yourself. You need it, you deserve it. Build new friendships and new social circles. Of your old friends, maybe a few might be willing to listen and learn, but if they refuse to believe you, move on. You have to forge a new life for yourself.

I watched my mother come out of a 15 year marriage to my sociopathic father and she did not do any of the above and ended up jumping from one relationship to the next and finally married a man who turned out to be a severe Narcissist who cheated a lot and gave her much grief and unhappiness, and emotional needs that went unmet. I think all people coming out of a marriage like you had needs to take time to heal and recover. Your idea to start a FB page for others like you is a great idea. And you will learn more about yourself and not feel so alone.

Blessings to you. I hope you will find your new self and be happy again.

teepee1124

Thank you. Through reading here I was dumbstruck over reading about PTSD. It ‘fit’, and I couldn’t believe I finally had an answer. I was having terrible physical symptoms, all listed here. I also had five shingle outbreaks in 6 months. If that doesn’t tell you something, nothing will.
So, yes, I will be finding a therapist after the first of the year. My commitment to myself it to get healthy- emotionally, physically and spiritually. It’s my number one priority.
Thanks for the great site. It has been a tremendous help to me, and unfortunately, I know several other women who are in the same boat I’ve been in. I’m passing on the info, knowing it will help them out as well.

Jan7

I wonder what Camille Cosby’s nightmare is like behind closed door since we now know what Bill Cosby’s evil double life looks like in public.

daughterofone

I’ve wondered the same thing. Has she traded a comfortable life for this? Women of wealthy and powerful men often do. She is not a dumb woman from what I’ve seen. She must have known.

teepee1124

I doubt she knew. Who could imagine such a monster, really? Sure, she may have thought he was fooling around, but really, drugging and raping women? And she probably learned early on not to ask questions. His willingness to victimize women certainly makes him a candidate for being very nasty and vindictive to anyone that questioned him.
After so many years, there is a shame that overtakes you when you realize what a liar the person is. Life is less difficult if you just roll along with the punches. It does become more about surviving each day and less about working for the future. She will be left holding the bag and he won’t care one whit.

LostnFraud

It’s amazing the denial she’s lived in for so long. To forsake herself for a lifestyle? I’m sure she must have known but as Jan7 said we don’t know what her nightmare was like behind closed doors. I know how bad mine was and how I still live with it today. My marriage was under 10 years but it was 10 years that will probably take a lifetime to purge. I was just recently divorced and have gone into hiding from almost everyone including family. I am in therapy but the nightmares still haunt me and I still have no adrenal or thyroid function despite medication. Am also on activated B complex. My experience with this monster nearly killed me and I’m now certain this was his plan all along.

Jan7

Daughterofone & LostnFraud, I think the real reason is Cosby is just masterful at manipulating people including his wife…his victims talk about how much power he had/has in Hollywood and how “powerful” he is…when they use the word “powerful” I now (since being educated) equate that to master manipulator & sociopathic behavior.

There is no doubt he is gas lighting his wife behind closed door because he is now attempting to gas light the media & viewers…he is attempting to change the perspective of peoples options. Throw in the fact he is also blame shifting in high gear and having his lawyers & now his wife do the same ….he is predictable in his sociopathic behavior.

Camille has her Phd she is a smart woman & well respected but she is being brain washed/mind controlled by her husband just like a cult leader does to his followers like all victims of sociopathic abuse. I imagine after 50years of being married to a evil man it would be very hard to leave because you have been so conditioned with mind games that you would not know what to do once you escaped much like a cult follower leaving after 50 years. The word “denial” is often used to describe a victim but really it’s the fact they are brain washed/mind controlled that keeps them in the denial state.

The money aspect is not a problem they live in California and she would get have of his estimate 300 million dollars.

I feel sorry for her because there is no doubt she has been/being mentally, emotionally, verbally (maybe physically) abused by him. A man that is abusive in public is also abusive behind closed doors with his loved ones. He has no respect for woman and only cares about his needs being met it’s all about him this is evident by him drugging the woman.

LostnFraud I dont think it is a bad thing to shut the world out when you first leave you abuser the reason why is a victim needs time to heal their brain & body from all the trauma. All the noise in the daily world is chaotic and a victim needs calmness to sort out the mind and to relax the mind. You will get to a good place again you are being very proactive with your healing (coming to lovefraud, in therapy, taking vitamins etc) God’s speed in your recovery!

Jan7

Jenna23, My heart broke reading your post, I am so sorry that you are in so much emotional pain.

It sounds like you have PTSD. A high percentage of victims of abuses have PTSD. One of the biggest issues with PTSD according to adrenal gland expert is Adrenal fatigue. Some symptoms of adrenal fatigue (PTSD) is racing thoughts, continual loop of the same thoughts, anxiety,sleep issues depression, panic attacks, mood swings, ocd issues, etc etc it’s a long list. See sites like adrenalfatigue. org take the questionnaire on the site to see how your adrenal glands are functioning/see symptoms list/read, Drlam. com see symptoms list/read, Mialundin. com see her you tube videos/read her book (must read!!).

Find a good hormonal specialist by googling “compounding pharmacy” with your city name then call them for a list of doctors and/or ask friends and/or see adrenalfatigue. org for a list of doctors. Get tested for cortisol levels, vitamin/mineral deficiency and hormonal imbalance all issues with PTSD (adrenal fatigue). Within days & weeks you will have a calm mind, body and will move back towards your old self. This is the missing link to healing form a toxic abusive relationship.

Jan7

Adrenal fatigue Symptoms list from DrLam. com:

“…Not everyone has all of the symptoms or conditions listed below. The number varies from person to person, but if you take a step back and look from afar, they collectively paint a picture of a body under threat. The higher the prevalence or intensity of the items listed below, the higher the chances that you may have Adrenal Fatigue Syndrome.”

Unable to fall asleep despite being tired
Wake up in the middle of the night for no reason
Heart palpitations at night or when stressed
Low Blood pressure consistently
Low libido and lack of sex drive
Low thyroid function, often despite thyroid medications
Feeling of hypoglycemia though laboratory values are normal
Depression, often unresolved after anti-depressant
Endometriosis
Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome
Uterine fibroids
Fibrocystic breast disease
Hair falling off for no reason
Irritable under stress
Anxiety
Panic attacks
Feeling “wired” and unable to relax
Feeling of adrenaline rushes in the body
Fogging thinking
Inability to handle stress
Waking up feeling tired in the morning after night’s sleep
Feeling tired in the afternoon between 3:00 and 5:00 pm
Inability to take in simple carbohydrate
Coffee needed to get going in the morning and throughout the day
Coffee, tea or energy drinks triggering adrenaline rush and adrenal crashes
Feeling tired between 9:00 and 10:00 PM, but resists going to bed
Craving for fatty food and food high in protein
Craving for salty food such as potato chips
Dry skin more than usual
Unexplained hair loss that is diffuse
Exercise helps first, but then makes fatigue worse
Chemical sensitivities to paint, fingernail polish, plastics
Electromagnetic force sensitivity, including cell phone and computer monitors
Delay food sensitivity, especially to diary and gluten
Unable to get pregnant, requiring IVF
Post partum fatigue and depression
Recurrent miscarriages during first trimester
Abdominal fat accumulation for no apparent reason
Temperature intolerance, especially to heat or sunlight
Dysmenorrhea advancing to amenorrhea
Premature Menopause
Constipation for no apparent reason
Joint pain of unknown origin
Muscle mass loss
Muscle pain of unknown reason
Cold hands and feet
Premature aging skin
Inability to concentrate or focus
Psoriasis of no known reason
Gastritis despite normal gastroscopy
Low back pain with no history of trauma and normal examination
Dizziness for no known cause
Fructose mal-absorption
Tinnitus (ringing in the ear) chronically
Numbness and tingling in extremities bilaterally
Mouth sores recurrent
Short of breath even though breathing is fine
Ovarian cyst
Breast cancer associated with estrogen dominance
Grave’s disease
Hashimoto’s thyroiditis
Legs that feel heavy at times
Dark Circle under eyes that does not go away with rest
Loss of healthy facial skin tone color
Body feel tense all over and unable to relax
Postural orthostatic tachycardia
Irritable Bowl Syndrome, with more constipation then diarrhea
Chronic Fatigue Syndrome unimproved with medicine
Fibromyalgia unresolved after conventional help
Systemic Candida that gets worse when under stress
Electrolyte imbalance despite normal laboratory values
Irregular Menstrual Cycle that “stops and go”
Lyme Disease but unable to fully recover after medication or intolerance to drugs
H Pylori Infection in the past and was told resolved but never feel the same since
Heavy metal and mineral toxicity may mimic AFS

biggestdummyofall

My view of everything has changed. I view the world in shades of grey instead of color now that the world has been forever altered for me. I do not know if I will ever be the same or if my heart will ever mend to beat again instead of the dull thud I feel inside my empty shell of a chest. After 3 failed relationships with men in 30 yrs who were definately s-paths (what are the odds on that happening) I am basically done with relationships. I even managed to find a couple of female s-paths as “friends” for good measure (I still had just a pinch of self-esteem left for someone to smash -by golly) Hell will probably be a relief for me , actually.

daughterofone

You are certainly not a dummy. You wouldn’t believe how common it is to go from one spath to another. This happens because this feels normal to you. You know this personality type and it feels comfortable. You are used to being treated badly, you are used to being used, you are used to doing everything to keep the relationship going, you are used to being guilted and manipulated. These sickos cause you to question yourself and give you “crazy head” and keep blaming yourself over and over again for disappointing them.

You are on the right path. Just being here on this site is a good sign of self awareness. I have a friend who draws in spaths like moths to a flame. She is too nice to them and has a hard time saying no. Then I realized why – she’s married to one. So, this feels normal to her. I’ve tried and tried to get her to see it, but there are blinders in place because she has been groomed since her teens to be their doormat. I know too. Been there. You feel like a total jerk for standing your ground. And they will make you feel guilty for no longer coming around and being their play thing. More crazy head.

Some victims heal faster than others. But don’t beat yourself up for having had so many spaths in your life. It happens a lot and you are at an advantage because you recognize it. Sites like this are so valuable. Counseling, if you can afford it, would also be helpful. Give yourself time and be strong and don’t rush into any friendships or romantic relationships. Those spaths count on you jumping in with both feet.

Blessings to you!

elizabethbrooks

Pau, YES, he really did fake it when he looked into your eyes with such love, and told you he loved you. Been there! My sociopath was my husband of 26 years. He looked at me with “genuine” love and warmth, and depth of feeling, every time he saw me, the whole time. His eyes “lit up” every time he saw me. This was part of how I “knew” what a deep, intimate bond we had. Yet he was cheating and paying hookers the entire time, and committing other criminal acts. While building a life and business, and raising two kids with me. Like Teepee, I knew nothing about sociopaths, and had no clue I was devoting my life to one. Teepee, I applaud you for your incredible good sense and strength in how you are handling this!!! You will recover and you WILL be fine!

I learned mine was a sociopath the day after I ended the marriage; our counselor explained it to me…..I had known I needed to talk to him alone… knew he was seeing something in ex that I didn’t see…and then a clarity came into my life, and I healed quickly, because I realized how truly heartless ex was. I think of him as a robot. As I cut off all his control of me, he spiralled totally out of control quickly, and tried to have me killed. Because he’s so dysfunctional, he admitted it in court.

Biggestdummyofall, I do know how you feel, I know how empty you feel. I also had a best friend who was a sociopath, and I only figured it out 7 years into the friendship, as she and her children began stealing from me, and I caught her in lies. I’m not good at discerning these people, no question…. but I’m good at other things, and you WILL feel better!! I have grown deeply in faith, in my relationship with God. I trust HIM to heal me and walk me forward with healthy relationships. I have seen Him bring me clarity with 2 guys now, and a few girl friends. God promises to provide, and to help you, and so many other things. His promises are true…..cling to those. I have to daily realize my value in God’s eyes. If someone can’t treat me with love, respect, and honor, then they don’t deserve me. And I am not wasting my time with those who don’t.

stillinshock

Biggestdummyofall….I feel the same. My entire worldview has changed. The world is not anything at all like I thought it was. Evil truly does exist. And I had 2 s-paths in a row. When I was fighting for my life and trying to get away from s-path #1, s-path #2 smelled the vulnerability and honed in on me like a shark. When you deal with so many so closely, it makes you wonder about EVERYONE! I look at everyone now that gets close to me and I look for signs they might be s-paths. It really sucks.

carriesguns

pau
if in your dreams you see a different face, i think- based on my own experience- you should pay attention to that face you see.
take that memory out of the dream and look at it. hard. straight up, look at the real face of the real person you loved.
because THAT is the face of him.
you can’t see it because of the lovebomb…because you don’t want to. because he’s careful to turn his face away til he has just the right expression to show you.
but somewhere, you’ve looked back when he didn’t expect it, and you’ve seen his unguarded face.
and although consciously you didn’t want to believe it, your subconscious is trying to break through all this surfeit of overwhelming adoration and show you what you are burying.
God is real, pau. and God and his rules are saving you. by not having sex with him you have managed to retain just enough objectivity on the “back office software threat detection” to escape.
it takes time– time to slowly “depressurize” and slowly wake up…because that state is “cognitive dissonance” and it goes hand in hand with “lovebombing”.
and they progress along with that whole relationship deal, too. so if he said he should kill you, at some point he very probably would have.
thank the God who just saved you.
i was a “closet christian” and looked back after 14 years of marriage to see that face…and the subsequent one, the one that “rescued” me from being killed by my own husband…

Andi62404

The hardest thing for me is to remember that it is only 12% of the population. I can’t seem to believe in anyone without having to talk myself into believing them. Even the man I’m involved with now; who I knew before my ex husband shattered my world view. He has never lied to me in the 14 years I have known him. He is one of 2 people who know exactly what my ex did to me in graphic detail because he wanted to understand what had happened to the girl he used to know. I STILL can’t just trust him if all people. I feel so broken sometimes. I just want to enjoy loving him. I don’t know how.

still reeling

Andi, I hear you. As well, I am not able to fully trust anyone anymore. Not my husband (I have a lot of nerve not trusting him, eh? Even though I did not have a physical affair w/the path, I feel guilty for the total emotional immersion and infatuation), even my onw daughter, friends, especially co-workers. I just left a job after a year and 1/2 because the lead boss seemed inconsistent, moody and I just felt sick every day having to face him. I did not trust him at all.
The worst part of this, Andi, is I don’t trust or respect myself.

Whatever it takes to forgive yourself, try. You have every reason to do so. The personality traits that made us attractive to the paths are responsible for this lack of trust some of us wrestle with.

I wish you self-love and forgiveness. Let trust happen.

Jordan

Burnt!
My sociopath displayed most of the qualities listed in the excellent articles on this site. UNFORTUNATELY, they weren’t displayed until after our marriage and the control began. I absolutely would not be controlled, told when I could get out of bed, talk, sit, where to stand, who I could talk to, where I could go (to name a few). She did, however, destroy me emotionally. When the charm and the romance is there, ya can’t help falling in love with em! But, that’s the plan, to hook us, catch us off guard, prey upon our emotions. My experience with this manipulative predator has made me look at everyone with a different eye. Though I have not experienced the trauma and hurt that most sociopath victims have, the depression is here. It’s difficult to comprehend how someone can use you, with no remorse or conscience. Educating ourselves is key. Thanks Donna for the wonderful articles and your great letter of encouragement.

victim3

Jordan, I know exactly how you feel..now the tables have turned in my relationship. she has divorced her 5th husband and is baiting her hook for me…no thanks !!!!. and yes I look at every woman differently now..prob will never get married again

victim3

spaths look for needy people, like you and me. they don’t love you, they say they do but they don’t. my ex told me she never did love me and that she only married me to get out of the apartments she was in…then the cheating started, with the neighbors and anyone online she could catch.. I am so happy I don’t have to look at her phony smiles anymore.. truly happy !!!!!!!

Barb

Can a formerly good person become a sociopath, or do you have to be born one? Sounds like a strange question, I know, but I feel that I don’t want to be bothered with people much of the time but would not deliberately ‘use’ them…

I have a ‘friend’ who routinely has used me, taking advantage of my passivity and feelings of ‘lost’…but she has also been there at really bad times in my life to buoy me up.

So an admixture of good and bad does not relate to sociopathy?

AnnettePK

Interesting question. I think there is a fundamental difference between normal people and spaths that has to do with the deepest motivation. Circumstances can bring out bad behavior in normal people; however when they learn that they are doing wrong, that they have hurt others, that there is a better way of interacting, normal people change. Psychopaths do not change no matter what new information they get, because they know they are harming others – it is deliberate and they don’t care.

Consider whether your friend has been there for you in bad times as a tactic to keep you engaged in the friendship, rather than out of genuine concern for your welfare. Consider how she reacts if you tell her that you feel used and taken advantage of.

Spaths do ‘nice’ things for others when it will get them what they want, and they will just as easily treat others harmfully if they think it will get them what they want. For a spath, being ‘nice’ is a tactic, not a genuine concern for the well being of others.

heart1

That article was a piece of wisdom, indeed. I slowly learned that spaths are nice in public, like a spider doing a dance on its web to attract. Once it gets its clutches on you, they drain you slowly. I was left thinking for years that there is something wrong with my spath but could not put my finger on it. Whatever strange behaviuor it was, I would rationalize it with my own emotional center. Because the concept that someone doesn’t have an emotional center, doesn’t compute. So where does the flowers and gift showers come from. To us that’s love. When we are only married once, wheres the base of comparison to what a marriage is.
I had to follow a rationale that was learned on this site
they are con artists-experts. My spath can talk to someone for hours on..and..on. I get like 5 words a day. I don’t get informed of things until too late. Then he says, I told you about it. I was always to blame for everything, to the point of absurdity. When I say,I honestly don’t find him too self centered, I would have to stand back and interpret the whole picture under a magnifying glass, then I would find something. They do for some part go around dorment, with this generic personality till the needs surface…
I’m still learning…but good article.

victim3

they will always turn things around in their favor never forget that.. saw my ex wife do this to her own family..pretty sad eh

slimone

Hi Donna and all,

When I was in the phase of the initial betrayal, I confused my total devastation for how much I loved him. I remember thinking that I could only be this heartbroken and despairing BECAUSE he was so amazing, and because I loved him so so much. This guy’s con was pretty fast, so I didn’t get many facts to back up my gut feeling that I was being royally screwed over. In that way I really had to trust myself, and, like this articles says, lots of folks were just telling me to move on, that he was a ‘player’.

I had a very hard time managing my feelings of despair and longing. I didn’t think of him as a player. More as someone who was trying to create a life that was just ‘beyond’ me, that I wasn’t deep enough to understand. Even though my insides were on total high alert: sleeplessness, no appetite, stomach aches, back pain, exhaustion, mood swings, etc…My mind was CONFUSED. I still believed if I was given another chance to show him how much I loved him, how much I was willing to be his ‘anchor’ (in his otherwise stormy life), that he would be changed. I believed that ‘loves cures all’, and that everyone was looking for healing.

It wasn’t until some months had gone by (and my hormones began to return to normal, and not the ‘love bomb’ hormone levels), and I had done enough reading about personality disorders, and had hung out here at LF, that I understood that the devastation truly did come from the complete destruction of most everything I thought was true, and used everyday to problem solve, communicate, and help.

I had to consciously rewrite my belief system. It was not easy. Some of this stuff goes so deep, and is so much EVERYONE else’s belief system, that it felt pretty isolating to have a different set of understandings about human kind than most people around me. Since that time however, I have found other people who do have an awareness of sociopathy, and have an understanding that is more in line with my own. Some of the friends I have learned about the subject from me, and have re-framed some of their beliefs too.

Recognizing the red flags, my gut feelings, defining my values/morals, and making myself clear on what I believe about other’s has definitely saved my rear since my last entanglement with a spath. I have avoided several run-ins with spathy co-workers and such. It has also helped some friends who were having problems, when they have specifically come to me for validation of their own experience.

My friend, who was entangled with the same spath as me, ran into him yesterday. She said it was like he was NOTHING to her. She had no fear, no bad feelings, no CONFUSION. She was CLEAR about him. He tried to engage her like they were merely long lost buddies, and she said she just breezed right by him and out the door. She said she giggled when she got in the car and drove away. This woman was in therapy for 2 years because she couldn’t figure out her relationship with this person. Now, she says, he doesn’t even exist for her any longer. So, it can happen. With time and clarity.

victim3

Jenna, poor girl..i am sorry for that..relax..you want to get over it . be happy..that took me 3 long years..i know it hurts to see other people holding hands with their kids and being happy but ya know, your going to be fine. everyday gets better I promise!!..hopefully you can find YOURSELF and not another freak like that.. its hard for me to be in a relationship other than fwb I just cant put myself out there any more I cant take the chance. my relationship was 8 years. constant lies, cheating , manipulating etc etc…. thank god for this site. it brings fourth all of the truth about these freaks of nature. one day you will be helping someone else in the same boat. keep your stick on the ice.. I worry about you….Michael

AnnettePK

I am so sorry you experienced this nightmare. How long has it been since you made the wise decision to leave him?

You believed he loved you because he lied to you and deceived you to make you believe it, because he wanted to exploit you (and every other woman he could exploit). Congratulations on doing a good job taking care of yourself by getting away from him when you came to understand he was harming you.

You probably got hooked by this psychopath gradually; and you will probably recover gradually. When it is difficult to even get out of bed, try to get up and do one thing even if it’s a challenge. Try to do a little more every day. You will get back to a full life.

NoContact

I am a lifelong astrologer and from that perspective would comment that the psychopath is in a stage of soul development in which his/her/its function is to more plainly describe our own paths.

The path of the psychopath is essentially Negative but its FUNCTION is in order to illustrate the Positive, in other words.

None of this makes them any easier to take, however. They are still the ultimate pain in the you-know-where.

NoContact

Dear Jenna,

Yes they do get what’s coming to them, it’s called karma.

Secondly, don’t push yourself.

Third, love yourself. We’re all there stuck in bed with you on many days and nights, don’t hate us all, lol. 🙂

Love you, hang in there, N/C

NoContact

Oh absolutely NOT, Jenna.

Just the opposite: I think spaths are botn spaths and we can often see this in the chart itself. It’s not really susceptible to being “fixed” — just “moderated” by really good parenting or therapy or something…..in other words, being a spath is sort of different “perspective on life” that is not the same as the result of ours…..including yours and mine.

NoContact

That said Jenna, YES! I do think that all experiences EVENTUALLY teach us something.

That does not mean it was “intended” we would get spath’ed. Rather that we would learn how to NOT get so treated in our future, and much better, relationships.

dorothy2

Bravo!

NoContact

Jenna, I’d say that my own spath has turned off MANY people at this point — although it took a few years to do it.

Now it is not just me who thinks he is a spath, instead his former co-workers, semi-friends and other victims that he’s run over, have turned into quite a Force against him!

So YEAH, it may take awhile but being a spath means ending up as a spath, and more of us become aware of them out there, they have less and less Safety in Society cuz we are finally speaking up.

However, I don’t think they are “freaks of nature” but rather, they point out for us what men (and women) are not supposed to act like, and eventually gross us out until we say YUCK, I KNOW I don’t want to be like THAT. And as I said, not just lovers but everyone around them….we ll end up going YUCK until finally we’re not alone anymore….they are.

NoContact

Sweetheart, the simple answer is that he does those things because he is a psychopath.

And NOT because of anything at all to do with you.

That is HARD right? because we like to feel like WE are in the relationship TOO!!!!! That’s what makes them evil, and that is the only word that really fits.

I am so SORRY!!! this happened to you, it was NOT YOUR FAULT, all your can do is promise yourself to never act like that as a human being or EVER let a kid in your control do it either. And remember, his being ugly doesn’t make you less beautiful.

SociopathsSuck

Hi jenna,

Yes, I think they do eventually get what’s coming to them most of the time…they eventually do themselves in. I’ve been where you are. I was having trouble functioning day to day. Dealing with the ex-spath was too stressful…but I went to my doctor and got help with coping. I believe I also have PTSD. I quit a stressful job to help me heal. I ended all contact with the ex (we have a child together) and used a middle man for all communication. He made my life hell for years but once I cut him out completely, things slowly got better…I got better. I still have 4 court cases against him representing myself. I go to court almost every month but I can handle it now, with help. I hope that if you need help, you ask for it. It really does make a difference (I mean from a doctor)

My ex always seemed to be able to fool people…friends, lawyers, judges, social workers. I had the ability with my last court order to invoke supervision if I thought my son was unsafe with him. I did so in October 2013 and he refused to pay for a supervisor so he hasn’t seen him since then (my son is 5 now). he basically disappeared except for court, in which he had 5 bench warrants issued for not showing up. I found out in June that he was caught shoplifting in April. I found out today that he was charged with theft over $5000, theft under $5000, theft of 2 motor vehicles, resisting a peace officer and running from a police officer and more,all in the last 3 months. he is also facing jail time for not paying child support and soon I will be able to enforce my other 3 judgements against him. It took 4 years, but he was finally caught and has plead guilty! He never stopped, he just got smarter at hiding what he was doing. On january 14 he is going to court to get the results of a psych exam…and I will be there!!! I am going to try to get his access removed completely due to his mental issues.

I know it’s hard to recover. it shatters your trust in all people. but there are still a lot of good people out there. surround yourself with them. rid your life of toxic people. take care of yourself. get better. don’t let that monster win.

NoContact

I’d add also Jenna, that my spath was also adopted by very worthy people, and ended up really “taking a dump” on their lives and especially his Army officer adopted father, who would totally FREAK OUT if he knew what happened after he died. omg. all that money, all those honorable years……WASTED and thrown away to the OW while the gentleman’s own family members SUFFERED.

So yeah, I feel your pain. 🙂

They really are disordered.

NoContact

TOTALLY I have been there!!! I remember holidays alone and whatnot but TRUST ME, these people do not continue to pull bags over peoples’ heads forever. As they go along these relationships DO fall apart, they do!!! I have watched my spath go from Mr. Popular to Mr. About-To-Be Arrested, in about 2.5 years.

NoContact

And Jenna let me be frank if you missed me on other threads: MY personal Mr. Popular is being accused of HOMICIDE by OW family members, OMG!!!!!!!!!!!

No, it doesn’t last for them. As they get older, the Mask starts to slip and they forget who they told Lie A to, as opposed to Lies B, C or D, and eventually people get together and say HEY WE HAVE BEEN LIED TO!! and at some point, I believe there was a “confrontation” between his latest conquest and himself that ended up even WORSE than you and I feel tonite.

NoContact

In fact Jenna, you’ve already predicted that horrible person’s future, when you wrote:

“Now she is bitterly fighting to get her money back again…”

I’ll bet I am lots older than you. In my generation of hippies, we called that BUSTED. 🙂

NoContact

Oh they sure will! and you don’t want to be around, when they do. Cuz they will be just as angry as you are, and it’s hoped you will be MILES away by then, after all who wants a cheating man? NOT YOU.

And not anybody else that is sane either, cuz all that sort of man does is make EVERYBODY feel ugly. It doesn’t matter how lovely they looked five minutes before, now they feel homely, unwanted and like cold leftovers, just because he treated them like you-know-what.

There is a lot of stuff you can google up about spaths with a sexual orientation to their sickness, by the way. It IS a different twist and my spath also had some weird sexual stuff going on …. not with me, but (I later learned) “others” if you get my drift (I’m sure you do).

NoContact

Jenna, I even found an old pencil cartoon that he’d drawn of his adopted father — in the nude — “excited” if you know what I mean.

I think the word is Perverse.

The decades I stayed just drove me more insane, ha. Every MINUTE around him made me more and more nuts. Recently I ran across that old cartoon he’d drawn out of his poor father, who was not just in a sex act in these pictures but DECEASED!!! and I though OMG how could I possibly have missed how deranged this person was??!!!

In truth Jenna I would be ashamed and embarrassed to show you the cartoon I found in my old boxes the other day, because I am 100% sure you would think I had a screw loose to stay with him. I don’t even have an excuse to give myself, much less someone else, I really MUST have been insane.

Just as you said about yours, my spath’s adopted parents were wonderful middle-aged people (if maybe a little old? to have adopted him and his older sister at 40 or so) and that was the SICKEST drawing I think I’ve ever seen!! Of ANYBODY!! not just their adopted Army officer dad.

Viewpoint

Do you understand the reasons that your counselor wants you to refrain from getting further involved? It can help to understand those reasons.

First, is the issue of your safety in this day of age where the unimaginables happen with more frequency than we appreciate. You don’t know this ex-lover; you didn’t when hooked up with him and how could you? Have a healthy respect for this clown’s deceptions and bad guy’s ways… Healthy for you: To stay away from peril to you.

Second, as tempting as it is to rehash (It is more like being driven), research says that it’s likely to leave you stuck in that purgatory longer. Here’s a method to help you move out of that: Take the incredulous that you’re feeling not to do reality checks by a rehash but to seek help for shouldering the incredulous. What I mean is respect that you are shouldering this incredulous thing, were never prepared to shoulder it (and shouldn’t have had to be prepared) and so now, need help to do that. Describe to your counselor, as much as you can, the states you go through shoulder this. Then he/she can be more help to those. The story of what put you there doesn’t matter to a counselor: What matters to them what is happening to you for what you shoulder.

Viewpoint

Do you understand the reasons that your counselor wants you to refrain from getting further involved? It can help to understand those reasons.

First, is the issue of your safety in this day of age where the unimaginables happen with more frequency than we appreciate. You don’t know this ex-lover; you didn’t when hooked up with him and how could you? Have a healthy respect for this clown’s deceptions and bad guy’s ways… Healthy for you: To stay away from peril to you.

Second, as tempting as it is to rehash (It is more like being driven), research says that it’s likely to leave you stuck in that purgatory longer. Here’s a method to help you move out of that: Take the incredulous that you’re feeling not to do reality checks by a rehash but to seek help for shouldering the incredulous. What I mean is respect that you are shouldering this incredulous thing and could never been prepared to shoulder it… and so now, need help to do that. Describe to your counselor, as much as you can, the states you go through shouldering this for that’s where he/she can be of help. This is their business to bring support and guidance to the hard stuff that happens to us.

The story of what put you there doesn’t matter to a counselor: What matters to them what is happening to you for what you shoulder, for you to give voice to that and get help to make it tolerable.

AnnettePK

Thank you for answering. 2 months is still not very long out, and for most survivors it is a very tough time to go through. The awful reality of the nightmare is sinking in for you; and you are going through very painful and traumatic grief work. You are doing good for yourself by seeing a counselor.

Your ex SAID he loved you, but he did not love you. The way he treated you is NOT loving, it is harmful. You probably loved the person he said he was in order to deceive you, not who he really is.
The person he presented is fake, it never existed and never will exist. However, there are nice people in the world who are honest and goofd.

It happened to you because he decided he wanted to exploit you for something and he decided to lie to you and abuse you, because that is how he treats anyone. Many of us victims/survivors are particularly kind, generous, loving, honest, and trusting. Your ex abuser chose to exploit these excellent traits you have developed. After a spath experience, we learn to be very careful to only give ourselves to someone who appreciates our goodness, who cares about our well being, and who has good character traits of honesty and commitment.
It happened to all of us because we didn’t know the truth, because we were deceived by an evil person who set out to deceive us. It happened because the lying abuser is a bad person. He doesn’t want whats best for others, he doesn’t care about the well being of others, he is a liar and he likes being the way he is. Beyond that, there is no logical reason. In the 19th century they called psychopathic behavior moral insanity. We can’t really understand; and I eventually decided I would not want to really understand. It’s too awful.

Something very bad happened to you. It is not your fault, you didn’t do anything to cause your ex psychopath to abuse and betray you. He treats everyone this way, when he can get away with it. You are likely experiencing confusion and cognitive dissonance because most people do not recognize what has happened to you and how bad a person he is. If you are widowed or in a bad accident, people have a lot of understanding and sympathy; but survivors of psychopathic abuse and abandonment are not well understood.

Your ex psychopath is now conducting a smear campaign against you. He’s a skilled liar and people believe him in the same way that you were deceived enough by him to get in a relationship with him.

The PTSD, the bewilderment, the pain, and the questions you have, are normal responses to being abused and abandoned by a very bad person. There are evil people in the world, for whatever reason. My personal belief is that it is on some level a choice they make and they do know right from wrong, along with a genetic propensity. They deaden their consciences by repeatedly choosing to do wrong and thus developing evil character. I believe in right and wrong and in good and evil, and that people choose to develop good or bad character, which was the prevalent world view until the last couple of generations when moral relativism became a more popular view with many people. You will come to understand your experience at the hands of the spath according to your personal philosophy. I also have a strong religious faith and doctrine, which I drew on to understand my ex P experience.

My ex P got away with a lot of evil stuff he did, and he got caught in a few things. I have an understanding of when and how he will ultimately be held accountable (that does NOT involve burning in hell for eternity!) that is in harmony with my spiritual understanding of life. You will come to understand your experience according to your world view. Your counselor’s advice to try to focus on yourself is sound. Spath’s tend to escape immediate justice of any kind and it is very difficult to come to terms with. But it is something that is for most survivors out of our control. The best ‘revenge’ is truly recovering and living a good life and not giving the spath a thought. They want to control us, to keep us miserable at their hands, and keep us thinking about them forever. Try to balance the time you spend grieving with spending time focusing on things that take your mind off him. It is very very difficult, because your ex has probably done a lot of things to keep you hooked on him. He probably used hypnosis and other mind control tactics to get you under his control. Because it works for him.

You are a good person; he is evil. Good is stronger than evil and you will recover and get free of him and move on to having a great life with good people. You did a good thing for yourself to get away from him.

How long were you with this evil person?

AnnettePK

With respect to his accusations, that is what spaths do. They accuse their victims of everything and anything. It doesn’t matter what we do, they lie and accuse in order to keep us on the defensive and keep us spinning. There is NOTHING you could do or be that would make him stop accusing you of whatever he thinks will hurt you the most and make you take the blame for the evil unscrupulous things he decides to do. It’s confusing and frustrating. They often accuse people of doing things that they are doing. My ex P was clever and cunning, but uncreative and boring. My ex P eventually falsely accused me of pretty much the same outlandish stuff that he accused his first ex wife of doing. Sadly for me, some people believe him. I don’t blame them, as I was deceived by him at one time.

AnnettePK

Why so many women? Simply because he likes humiliating and harming as many people as he can, so he can feel power and control. It’s simple, but normal people like you and me can’t understand how they can be this way. You can be glad that being evil is an unfathomable mystery to you.

In today’s world, the paradigm of morality and good and evil are not taught as they were in past generations. We are taught that no one is really bad, that everyone really has good intentions deep down, that there are external reasons why people do bad things, that everything happens for a good reason. My personal view is that my spath experience fits in with a Biblical paradigm of good and evil, a spirit world of good and evil beings, and a good and loving God who has plans to rid the world of evil when the time is right. You will come to understand your experience in the context of your beliefs.

dorothy2

AnnettePK, you hit the ball out of the park in your replies above to Jenna23. I posted on another site that every victim/ survivor needs to copy, past and print your reply posts on this page, hang a copy in every room, etc. I just wanted to express my appreciation. Thank you

AnnettePK

Dorothy,

I’m glad you found something of value in it. I learned so much from survivors farther along in their recovery. It took me a long time for me to believe it and for the reality of it all to sink in.

Thank you lots,
Annette

NoContact

Actually Annette, I’ve already collected your various writings in SEVERAL different threads, and am planning to publish them shortly under my own name.

Thank you very much!!!

Tongue-in-cheek with laughter and love from N/C

AnnettePK

NoContact,

LOL…But seriously you’ve made an interesting point, everything I contribute I learned from other survivors who shared here and elsewhere, and I’m just republishing under my name. Nothing original and nothing copyrighted. I hope you will pass the wisdom on. Wouldn’t it be great if there were no more victims, though.

Love ya too.

catnoch

Yesterday my sociopathic psychopathic man in my life called and begged for forgiveness. He said I am the only person in his life he needs and wants. He broke it off with his girlfriend for good this time and he is so sorry he hurt me by saying all the mean things to me. He said he said them so I would get angry and hate him to make it easier because his ex was constantly calling and would not let him break away from her. He had check out along time ago with her but she always makes him feel bad and he always goes back but swears he will never go back to her again.

We talked for six hours yesterday on and off while he worked to convince me that he wants me and only me, that he cannot live without me . He listed all the reasons why he knows we should be together and they all sound like valid reasons. One problem is his track record and I lost count if this is two or three strikes. I am drawn into his charm, his foreign accent and when I am with him I want to be with no one else.

I am a widow and my husband who I was with for over 30 years began the same way as this man. When I compare the stories they are almost the same. With one exception! My husband was a money maker and super intelligent. This man is not stupid, however because he comes from another country and his English is not the best, he does not command jobs that pay well. So here I am in this dilemma. Is this man who I am so attracted to any different than my husband?

AnnettePK

Was your husband a good man? The sociopath is likely to make you think he is similar in history, experience, or other traits to your late husband, if he thinks that it will manipulate you into desiring to be with him.

They are usually very charming.

Consider that he is playing a game and wasting your time saying things that he does not mean and does not necessarily intend to follow through with, because he wants to manipulate you into doing something he wants from you.

Old fashioned wisdom: One ‘strike’ could be a mistake, the second could be a misunderstanding, the third is a pattern of behavior that indicates who this person is and what his character really is.

Consider that the person you are attracted to is fake, it’s a false persona, and he does not really exist. The sociopath is someone entirely different, who does not have values, and does not care about your (or anyone else’s) well being. You probably are not attracted to who he really is.

daughterofone

Catnoch, please notice how all of his reasons and pleadings are all about him and what he wants. What about what you want and what is good for you? I bet your welfare is either excluded from his words, or certainly masked in such a way as to make you think he has your best interest at heart. He doesn’t. He is now alone, or so he says. And they cannot be alone. They must have a source (vulnerable people) or else they become bored. You are nothing more than his play toy. You are his current challenge. Once he draws you back into his life, he has won and the old behavior will quickly surface.

I say RUN and do not engage him anymore in conversations. If you can, I advise that you tell him you will not be taking his calls or communicating with him anymore. Then block his number, change your email, Facebook, or however else he communicates with you. If he mails you letters, throw them away, unread. This is how you go No Contact and it’s the only way to keep them out of your life. If you respond, even in anger or self defense, they win again because they have engaged you. This only encourages them to keep coming after you and wearing you down. It won’t feel natural to you to do these things. You are a nice person and you will feel you are being rude or hurting his feelings. He has no feelings for anyone other than himself, so you can’t hurt his feelings. He may put on like he’s hurt, but in reality he’s playing you and preying on your sympathies. It can take a long time to get over the guilt of going No Contact, but coming back to sites like this one can enable you and make you strong. Anyway, my two cents…..

NoContact

Dear cat, this comes with Love from the Universal All.

You do not have a dilemma.

He has a dilemma.

You are now short an additional six hours of your own precious time. Cut your losses on that as well as all else you have had to sacrifice to this person. Then, promise yourself right now that NO MORE OF IT will occur, EVER!

You are intended to meet someone NEW and not marry a corpse. Please forgive me for putting it this way which I know is offensive!!! however although I am not a legal “window” my ex died while we were married. It’s just that their was no funeral and the kids continue to visit him, however the man I loved is DEAD ans so is yours, my dear.

Please see my outstretched hand, as it is one of Comfort and Safety ….. however, in the Sign Language of the hearing impaired, my hand also spells out: don’t fool yourself.

AnnettePK

It isn’t fair. Life is not fair for anyone on the planet. It’s likely that, given his character, he got the material things he has by exploiting others, lying, cheating, stealing, too. He’s a very bad man.

It’s good you see clearly what an evil person he is and you understand that he harmed you very deeply. I am so sorry this happened to you. I hope that your counselor understands about psychopaths (not all counselors get it); and that she can offer you some practical help. Have you considered your legal options about his act of rape against you? It may be better for you to do nothing, or maybe it could be helpful to press charges. It depends on many factors in your specific situation.

You will recover from the PTSD and live a full life, and have positive interactions with many good people. You will feel better.

Given the suffering and injustice in the world, where is God who is good and all powerful? is a question asked by many. I can only offer my paradigm, which is from the Bible. Satan is the god of this world (2 Corinthians 4:4); and Satan is a murderer and a liar (John 8:44). God is allowing Satan to influence people and cause suffering, until a future time when Satan will be restrained (Revelation 20).
God promises that He will not allow you to be tested beyond what you can survive (1 Cor 10:13). He wants you to have a good life (John 3:1-2). When I was in the midst of the worst of my ex Psychopath’s abuse, a wise minister suggested reading the Psalms. Turned out it helped me feel better. If you’re interested, check out Psalms 37 and 55.

donewiththat

Jenna, you did love a selfish lying monster who only values his own jollies. You lost a year and will need longer to recover. But you will. You said no, which is not in his vocabulary, instead of going along with something you did not want. Stay strong, our friend. You will get to a better place soon.

jeannie812

Dear Jenna, he took advantage of your niceness and kindness. His cheating is NOT a reflection on you. It doesn’t mean you aren’t pretty enough, or not interesting enough– his cheating is his problem. He is trying to fill some sick hole in his heart, and this has nothing to do with you. The hole in his heart happened before he ever met you. What does he get from playing many women at one time? (cause it’s playing them, not loving them) He gets instant gratification. It’s so common with men who cheat because they are trying to fill that sick hole in their heart. Your recovery will happen. After I broke up with my boyfriend, It took me months and months to get rid of that constant heart ache. Eventually the hurt began to subside. During that time I had to sit on my hands to stop myself from calling him. I made it through. I survived. You will survive this too. Just keep telling yourself to breathe slow and tell yourself that you will be ok.

jeannie812

I broke up with a boyfriend 4 1/2 years ago, broke up with him because he was abusive. He wrote me a letter and this letter came in the mail today. I have many rebuttals to his letter. I omitted the part where he described our best date(s) because the letter is five pages LONG!!! Anyway, I can’t believe he consider that a date? He came over on a Friday and we played on computer, and he left at 7:00 on a Friday night, and disappointed me again by ending the night early, AGAIN. And, now to hear that he looks back at that as our best date? If he thought that was a date, I suppose he also thinks our trips to grocery store with my car and gas were also a date. Anyway, I have many other rebuttals to his letter but it’s exhausting…

here it is:

Dear Jeannie,

The reasons for this letter is NOT to piss you off or to upset you or to start shit up again, so please read the whole letter. First I think it is best to say “WHY” for writing this letter: for the last few years I have done a lot of “Soul Searching” and have wrote or called Several People to tell them off (I AM NOT doing that Now) and get them out of my life. You might be surprised at Who I told to fuck off for the things that they did — Then it dawned on me that on the same hand “I” need to say Sorry to Some People and that I need to Say Sorry TO You! because I was an Asshole for making you sit at home wondering if or when I would Show Up, and, to say it was because I was stressed or depressed is a bullshit excuse because at the very least I should of called and told you I would be late or not coming at all, and for that I am Truely Very Sorry. I have NO Excuse except to Say

Page 2

that I was acting like an ASS.
You told me a few times that I would never find Someone Who Would love me as much as you had loved me, I think you was right. even though we had our ups and downs and at times you may of Pissed & Moaned about it, you was ALWAYS there for me even though I wasn’t for you and for that I am VERY Sorry.

AWhile back Someone had asked me “What was the most fun that I had on a date” He decribed to this person a couple of times he came over to my house.

(Patrice I’m cutting out some of the letter cause it’s just sooo long. He goes on to describe a time he came over and we played on computer, and he left early as usual left early on a Friday night, and he still thinks that was considered a “date”? so much for him being sorry..)

Page 3

Several times over the years I had thought about calling you but, I had figured you would just hang up and call the police so I never did. It would be nice to have you back in my life Some way Shape, or form, even if it is to just say “Hi” and to Shoot the Shit. I have thought about writing this letter for a long time, just was not sure how to word it. I was told that at the Brown bar’s Party, you left right away because you saw me. I want you to know that you need not worry, that I will NEVER try to Cut You down or humiliate you if we were to run into each other,

Page 4

even if you were to try to do that to me, I will not do it back, I do not Want to “Stir Shit Up” For the Shit I had done to you if you feel the need or want to tell me off, feel free to do so, as I will NOT do it back, I will listen to what you have to say and NOT retaliate in any Way, Shape or form. I will NEVER cut you down in PUblic again. Last year at D’s Party I was Surprised at the feelings & emotions it stirred up in me when I saw you, to tell you the truth, I wished We were able to at least Shoot the Shit that night. I do miss the long chats that we would have. I don’t think I have ever been with someone whom I could freely talk with and have a intellegent conversation with as we were able to, nor laugh as much as we did at times.

Would you like to go to a quiet place for lunch, coffee, or a few drinks–not a date, but just get together to Shoot the Shit?

Page 5

It would be my treat, we could meet or I could Pick you Up or even just talk on the phone, if you do not I can understand. in case you forgot my number is xxx-xxxx–if you want me to never talk to you, just call and tell me to Fuck Off and I will never contact you again except to Say Hi if we were to run into each other–

I Wish nothing But
The Best for you, Have
A Merry Christmas.

J

jeannie812

This is the same guy who ran to my neighbors across the street from me after I broke up with him in July 4, 2010. He took over my neighbor friends. I couldn’t go across the street to visit my neighbors, because he was always over there. I was hiding in my house, because I knew there would be trouble if he spotted me out in my yard, so I hid in my house for months. One day in December 2010, he was across the street AGAIN, I couldn’t out-wait him that day, because I had to take my son to doctor in afternoon. I needed firewood and had to step outside into my yard. I couldn’t wait until later to get firewood, because it’s dark by 4:00pm-ish in winter. The moment I stepped outside he spotted me. He started screaming at me from across the street. He wouldn’t stop. I finally yelled back and told him that if he doesn’t stop I will call police. He yelled back, Go ahead and call police and I’ll tell cops that you drink. and on and on he kept on screaming. I called the police. Cop came and said he can’t do anything unless I get a restraining order. I asked cop to go across the street to talk to my ex-boyfriend and tell him to leave me alone. I had to ask the cop to take his squad car with him because the squad car was parked behind my car blocking me in. I never should have told the cop I would file restraining order, because the cop went across the street and told my ex-boyfriend that I was on my way to court house to get a restraining order. So boyfriend raced up the highway and passed me on highway to beat me to the court house to file a restraining order on me. And, he ripped me apart at court, and he conned the judge. The judge was yelling at me, glaring me, and staring me down.

Now fast forward to today. My ex-boyfriend really seems to think that a half ass apology will erase all of this, and lets have coffee. He is psycho!!!!!!!

NoContact

Jeannie, my heart is throbbing with PRIDE for you and hoping also that you feel it for yourself.

MAY EVERYONE WHO THINKS IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO GET PAST THIS EXPERIENCE ANALYZE JEANNIE812’s POSTS!!! THIS GUY HAS BEEN BUSTED FOR A LONG TIME AND IS BACK AGAIN……SHE IS NOT “FEELING THE SAME” AS BEFORE, LOL.

Congratulations and Kudos to you, Jeannie812!! N/C

I have a confession to make. Im still in the process of MESSING with the mind of my Spath. JUST to give him a taste of his own medicine!! … (Does this make ME a Sociopath, now)? LOL!! I know he just tries to manipulate me for sex and daily phone companionship, but I know his game, now. When I realized WHAT he was, my entire body cringed & all I wanted, was the nearest STD Clinic. SO DISGUSTING!!

Im repaying him,for how he treated me!! I lie to him when he calls, make excuses why Im too busy to see him, tell him hes stupid and ugly, & that Im dating another guy…. NOW hes meeting me for dinner, & spending $400 to take me shopping!!…All in very busy public places, for safety. He treats me like he should have been, all along…HA!!! Im enjoying the revenge, as I see him BEG to have me back. I know this is SO WRONG on so many levels… but it sure does make me feel like Ive retrieved some of my dignity and self worth!! I know…Im BAD for doing this…but he DESERVES IT!!!

Hes attractive and owns an investment company, so Im sure he has women all over. He wont think anything of my payback, but I feel justified to have this sort of closure. He says he wants sex with me so bad, now…he cant stand it. TOO BAD!! ID USE HIM, but I dont wanna contine this. For me, itll make no contact so much easier…as will imagining HOW MANY women hes been doing this to. NO THANKS!! Im finished with him.

AnnettePK

You’re probably not a spath, but spaths want us to lower ourselves to their level. It’s satisfying to you now, and he deserves the worst of everything, but consider if you will regret wasting more time on him rather than with good people. Consider that even if he’s treating you well, is it because he cares about your well being. In the long run, what makes No Contact easier for most survivors is focusing on things other than the spath. They are so negative, they poison everything they interact with. In the end, no good is likely to come from more of him, even when the tables are turned.
What is really best for you and your life in the big picture? Best way for you to really win is not to play the game. Spaths thrive on interacting no matter how negative – they win when we think about them, interact with them, no matter how negative.

mothercline

I get it. I am struggling with trying to get the rest of my personal property from my predator ‘ s house or just let it go and stay forever in the no – contact zone. I have an expensive painting. The rest is just crap I don’t want his next victim to be preyed upon in the presence of thus adding to his museum collection of victim personal belongings. I would have to consider aa civil standby. Am I just trying to hold on? For a strong, independent woman I am a train wreck! This site has been so helpful. I wish there was some way to warn future victims.

mothercline

There are some interesting buzz words in your post. Where revenge fades but justice can be served to aid in the healing process. Justice may possibly only accessible through letting go. If we communicate the truth it is not slander, liable or harrassment. I do not want to limit my need to process out of an irrational fear of punishment for speaking the truth and warning others. I dismissed many red flags too.

NoContact

Now Jenna, imagine that I have asked them of YOU instead.

Now imagine that my name is Nancy. I call you on the phone crying, right? and finally you can make out in between my sobs, what I’m saying.

I manage to garble out to your understanding: Jenna why in the world is this person treating me this way?!

What do you say to me?

Jenna, you are going to say the following:

Nancy this is not your fault. Dry your eyes and get yourself together, I will pick you up in an hour and we will go out and have fun. The guy is doing this to you BECAUSE HE CAN and he is a JERK.

Call him a psycho, call him an a**h****, call him whatever you want, Nancy! And give him whatever “reasons” that you need to give to “explain” why he is such a nasty person and especially so to women. The answer will stay be the same: IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT so DO ALL YOU CAN TO GET OVER HIM. The REST of your life does not deserve to HURT like this.

And Jenna, if I have read you wrong and you would say something ELSE to me, like Nancy you have bad breath, you are fat and ugly, you need a nose and boob job to keep up with those other women AND you need to fake it better in bed…..? …. then please feel free to correct me on this post. Otherwise, I think that EVERYBODY knows why the guy is a jerk: because he is a JERK PERIOD. And that has absolutely NOTHING to do with you! and will not HURT you anymore, either!! UNLESS YOU LET IT which you shouldn’t because YOU are not a jerk personally, you are a nice person who would give your good friend Nancy the same advice, and so it’s hoped you will recognize it in yourself, and GIVE YOURSELF A BREAK.

Cuz Nancy says so, ha ha. 🙂

LOVE to you Jenna, from Nancy! and THANK YOU for being such a wise and loving good friend to everybody out there reading these words and NEEDING to know he’s a Jerk and that they did not CAUSE this to occur, rather they are on the RECEIVING END of a BAD GUY and that is all our grandmothers would have called these men: BAD GUYS. Grandma didn’t call them Narcissists or Psychos in other words…..just GOOD GUYS and BAD GUYS and hope we knew the difference or that we would SURVIVE learning it the hard way…..like Jenna and Nancy, for instance. 🙂

AnnettePK

We understand because we were abused and betrayed in the same way you were. It’s that awful and than unbelievable.

You did not love the monster he is. You loved the fictional character he pretended to be. He knows right from wrong and he knows what a real and loving man is, so he faked it to exploit you.

Do you think you might be grieving a loss from your past, along with the loss and betrayal of the ex Psychopath? Is there a loss that you experienced that you never had a chance to grieve for and work through? Maybe you were too young to understand that you were experiencing a loss? This happens sometimes, and it’s that much more painful to feel the pain of another loss that’s been buried for a long time.

AnnettePK

That’s a lot of sadness and grief. I am so sorry. When you were a child you were abused? Children are so vulnerable and innocent. So sad when a child suffers. It’s likely you didn’t understand you were being harmed, and why you felt the way you did. Your father should be the protector and the provider, not the perpetrator of harm. That is extreme betrayal of his family and children.

You are at a low point in your life; but perhaps it is a turning point, and things will turn around and get better from here. Doesn’t make your present suffering all that much easier, though, does it?

Keep taking care of yourself. You will feel better. There are good folks in the world who deserve and appreciate what you have to offer.

AnnettePK

He probably wouldn’t care if someone lied to him or cheated on him the way normal people care. It’s all about power and control and games and winning to him.

NoContact

Annette, your posts are always right on and this last one of yours was no exception. In fact it INSPIRES them to be competed against, they ADORE that feeling of Participation at something they can understand: hostility and aggression. If they can get you to in some manner engage with them, you are Toast. The reason for this is the same as when any attacker comes at you: he knows he is going to attack you while you know you need to go to the bathroom to pee and that’s all. Duh. The notion you will never pee without a gun on your lap is even MORE inspiring to someone who’s trying to get you to warp your whole life around him. You are better off trying to “manipulate your way through” until you can ESCAPE, I am sorry to say, by pretending you haven’t yet noticed he’s totally Bizarre and Emotionally Disordered, until you have an escape plan in place and some allies for support. If you look, they will be everywhere! and the exact same people you THOUGHT didn’t “understand” him, from former supervisors to landlords to ex partners and parents, they’ll be there and not surprised to hear from you, either, is my guess.

Annette, please let me take this moment to reply in regard to something you said earlier about my ex’s having told me about how cold and nasty his adopted parents were. I personally observed this family dynamic and it is true that his father attempted to control him via access to his wallet and particularly when the issue of Higher Education came up at the expected age. However, doesn’t every parent get to control where the kid goes to college if the parent is footing the bill? OF COURSE, and if Dear Daughter wants to go to Beauty School as opposed to the expensive college that Dad has in mind at his own expense, I SUPPORT THE DECISION to make Daughter pay for that cut-rate “schooling” as opposed to the one offered by Dad. In this and IN MANY OTHER WAYS I feel manipulated into being CRUEL to my now-deceased father-in-law in particular, and may this post bear Witness to my shame and disgust at myself for believing ANYTHING that came out of my ex’s mouth beyond Hello. So here is a virtual message to my deceased father-in-law of 30 years.

Dad, I am so sorry and I THANK YOU for your many gifts. Here at Christmas and every day since you passed away…..I would do ANYTHING to speak with you, just once more. Please know that in 30 years I did love you and that you were not only my father in LAW but my father all that time. BLESS YOU for your protection and the many things you shared with me, and PLEASE FORGIVE ME for my STUBBORN RESPONSES to what you tried to WARN ME ABOUT!! Which you MUST have known was AHEAD FOR ME AND THE GIRLS but could not prevent. To the extent I could save your Fortune and your Granddaughters, I swear I have done my best at this FOR YOU. Annette is RIGHT, you undoubtedly gave this person the very same things that I did…which is to say, he sucked you dry and left you so empty it was hard to breathe. Bless also your last partner Barbara, who loved you while your “family” disparaged your memory even before you died. It’s hard to imagine on some days that I can even hold my head upright at all! in my SHAME for the way I allowed him to treat you, and also treated you MYSELF. For that I have no excuse nor is this post intended to inspire one on my behalf. IT WAS MY FAULT AND I WILL BE SORRY FOREVER!! I should have dumped him and come to take care of you, that is what the kids wanted to do (all except the dumping of him, which would have been required). In every home we had, I made mental “room” for you but you knew, he’d never let you live with us — you were his Target until you passed away — and then it was just Me and Them left, for him to predate. xoxox in Understanding that Came Too Late for Us..please wait for me so I can pay you BACK, KA you know what I mean.

Let no readers find themselves in this position, please! if you have been manipulated and had your OWN reputation smeared…….what have you BELIEVED?!! It’s as rotten as the smear on your own name and history, as Fake as the person Itself. Please don’t be TOO LATE in your own lives, instead let this be my collective Holiday Gift to All: HONESTY ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED TO ME.

AnnettePK

No Contact,

Thank you for sharing your experience, and your sadness and sense of loss at how your ex spath kept you separated from your father in law and created animosity that wasn’t really there. What you wrote really emphasized to me how many family, friends, and acquaintances my ex P turned me against and kept me apart from. I believed all the negative things he told me about so many others. I am aware that many others believe all the rotten things he told them about me. I am still waking up to the fact that things he told me about others are not true. He tried to keep us all apart, and to make me believe that others are against me in one way or another, and make others believe I am against them, dislike them, whatever he could think of. He basically smeared everyone to everyone else. It makes me feel a little free from the black cloud of the smear campaign; and feel there’s hope that we’ll all be ‘friends’ again.

AnnettePK

I am seeing more clearly now how my ex P discredited to me everyone who would have warned me about him, just as he discredits me now to his new targets.

AnnettePK

Jenna23,

He should be in jail for assault. He is dangerous physically as well as emotionally. You might consider getting some specific advice from a women’s shelter, or other good source, on how to keep yourself physically safe. You might get something out of this free risk assessment if you haven’t already done it. https://www.mosaicmethod.com/

AnnettePK

Sexual perversions are very normal for spaths. My ex Psychopath cross dressed for sex with himself, was addicted to horrible porn including child porn, and probably more than I never found out about. I suspect he was into gay porn too.

AnnettePK

He would have discarded you eventually no matter what you did or didn’t do, because that’s what he does to everyone. Good for you for saying no; you saved yourself from even more harm.

Good riddance. That’s one less problem you have to deal with. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tx8x3LCnYZw

I would rather be you with PTSD than be him driving around in his Porsche. Who cares what he drives? He is scum and the Porsche doesn’t mitigate that. If he doesn’t appreciate you, he’s an idiot anyway.

He has not taken away your ability to be a nurse, nor has he taken away your beauty, nor your ability to love. You have those things with you whether you’re using them at the moment or not. You will work again, your beauty will come back out of hiding, and your capacity to love and bond and care for someone remains. He doesn’t have that and he never will.

AnnettePK

Lying is bad, it’s against just about every religious doctrine, and some lies like slander are against the law.

There is nothing wrong with believing someone. It is likely the ex spath put a lot of effort into deceiving you. He probably made a study of you and what tactics would work on you. He probably used hypnosis on you and other tactics to control you. You’re so not stupid that his evil didn’t work and you had enough presence of mind to tell him no about the threesome. I did so many things I regret, allowed my ex P to harm my son and manipulate me into neglecting my son. I wish I’d been as strong and clear headed as you and told my ex P no about a lot of things.

NoContact

Jenna, I am a lifelong professional woman who has supported herself since the age of 21.

At one point during my marriage, I offered to share my husband with his other woman.

She was not willing, in fact he wanted to leave me for YEARS but she refused to go. Guess who he hated on for that?! Right: Me and our daughters. We were not her and HER daughters, and she teased him until he went insane….at OUR home. She got Mr. Wonderful trying to tempt her while we got — well, the same guy you did, ha ha….I’m sure you would recognize him even though my own had a different name and PROBABLY not as good-looking a body either — as I would come right out and confess to y’all that mine was bald and it DID bother me all those years, SO THERE!!!!!! 🙂 Ha ha, also he was five years younger and that bugged me too.
The fact he turned out to be a TURD??!!! omg I coulda had a guy with hair and put up with the same stuff only from a GOOD looking man, lol.

AnnettePK

Keep in mind that when the spaths triangulate, it is not because they have a preference for a particular woman; it is because they enjoy torturing both women by playing the situation and each of them against the other. My ex P triangulated with other people including his adult daughters instead of other lovers. They are using the fact that love relationships are generally meant to be monogamous and committed, so they bring others in to the situation in various ways, and they keep letting us know they are not committed. It is crazy making.
If your ex wanted to leave for years, he would have. He would have just once said he was sorry but…(whatever his reasons are)…… and left once and stayed gone, leaving you to get over him and get on with your life with someone else. Not a good choice to leave a marriage, but well accepted in today’s culture.
He did exactly what he wanted to do which was stay with you and torture you emotionally for years. That was his first choice – to enjoy the power and control he felt when he hurts your feelings.

AnnettePK

It seems that it is common for spaths to be with and marry women who are 5-10 years older. I’m not entirely sure why, but it seems to be a pattern.
My ex P’s first ex wife was about 5 years older than him. I happen to be younger, but I have never been interested in men my age or younger, always older by a few years. I perceived that men mature slower than women, so I found men my age too immature as a rule. Maybe an inaccurate perception but it figured into my dating life, in my younger days…

NoContact

Jenna, it IS hard to tell ourselves the right stuff and easier to tell your friends instead.

I have really focused on that as a big part of our problem in dealing with these people: as a collective, we don’t seem to take very good care of OURSELVES.

So YES!! if you would comfort ME, then just ask yourself why you don’t deserve the same break. Trust me, I DO have bad breath and COULD use a boob job…..but no that is not why he acted like a turd. Instead he took advantage of my THINKING I had bad breath and flat bosom, and used my own insecurities to let himself into my life. From then on, he was the Turd From Beyond, and from the sounds of it he has a lot of brothers out there just like him! and at the end of 30 YEARS with him I was total mush.

I sincerely hope that at 62 you are not Mush, Jenna 🙂 and those who love you most would deeply agree. At least I know who put me there … and I am totally SURE that if I called you crying you WOULDN’T MAKE ME FEEL WORSE! right? as he does! but encourage me instead to use mouth wash and call a plastic surgeon if those things really bother me THAT MUCH, that I’d let someone treat me like You-Know-What. 🙂

Love and support from N/c, Jenna!! and fellow sisters and brothers, all of us trying to hit the right Balance and KNOWING FOR SURE this last relationship of ours was not it.

NoContact

You put it exactly: they take our whole being away.

Jenna I feel weird looking at the photo albums that I put together myself.

How many photos of him are there, in which he was thinking something different than I thought? Having said he’d never bonded to me or our kids (!) does that mean he wasn’t BONDED to me when the daughters were born?!

It’s been enough to drive me insane and like you, the fundamental element was trauma in my birth family that made it seem OK for me to have an emotionally distanced husband…which I always knew about him…I just didn’t expect or imagine that he could turn against me. Instead I kept trying (and encouraging the children to also try) to LOVE him into being a better person.

At the end of it, I ended up in the emotional AND FINANCIAL gutter, after having out-earned him x3 when we married 30 years before. One day he suggested I could get a job cleaning houses. ?? Is this ME?!

No, it is a Projection of his hated mother who “left him and never came back,” whereupon he was adopted out, and never forgave that birth mother of his. I am only five years older but ended up with grey hair and wrinkles as though I’d been a Cougar with a partner 30 or even 40 years younger than me. ??!!

But you are right: I am in here someplace! and by the blessing of the angels, SO ARE YOU. Just imagine what this would do to people who were NOT nurses or other professionals, and had NOTHING to hang onto at all?! My heart bleeds for you, and me, but also for them.

NoContact

Jenna, mine was not an infant an adoption but a somewhat older child (maybe 2?) and the longer I thought about it, the more it seemed he’d been in foster care or possibly in the care of a grandma who got too old to finish the job and didn’t have a daughter who was “in a position” to mother him.

The adopted parents were maybe a little old? at 40, and his adopted mother sadly was dec’d by 55 or so, there was no family funeral! I think I was more upset by that than anyone on his own side of the family. In truth they were a little expectant of what he should act like, so I think he got more subversive until he was just Acting the whole darned thing.

Years later, I married a Pretend who pronounced himself an artificial husband (!) 30 years later once he’d met somebody else who was really More His Type. NOT a professional woman at all, in fact a person that I don’t think would be in our circle of friends. Someone easier to dominate, in other words, less independent and self-sufficient…a real house keeper.

NoContact

In fact Jenna, a telling Clue is that my ex’s new woman did not even drive a car, and that was NOT because she’d had too many DUI’s or something….she simply did not drive a car and therefore had to be taken everyplace.

Without revealing my location for public info, please let me merely comment that this is NOT A PLACE where you can live without driving a car. There are some places you can get around on public transport or via cab. This is not that place, ha ha.

So she was TOTALLY dependent on him AND HE LOVED IT! that is a clue for us all about “why it happened.” “Women who can’t get away are easier to abuse” is what it means. We professional women have a status they just have to drag DOWN….this other lady was already there.

AnnettePK

They don’t bond with anyone. My ex P told me once, a ‘tell,’ that he didn’t think he ever bonded with his mother. This was before I understood the whole Psychopath paradigm and I thought that was a weird thing to say. I told a good male friend, who said, well if someone doesn’t bond with their mother, they don’t bond with anyone.’ Made sense.

I wasn’t married to my ex P as long, but I did have trouble processing that the whole experience meant nothing to him. I have had by now some success in accepting that the experience I had was real because I bond and love and commit and care for another, even though he was doing something else. I rewrote the memories by replacing who I thought he was with who he really was. Recognizing what was going on in his viscous, evil, and deceptive mind, made the memories make sense and relieved me of a lot of my guilt. Then I replaced him in my mind with a cardboard cutout – that is the way I think of him now, as a dangerous but not really human personage. I also would imagine chopping up the life size cardboard cutout of him into tiny tiny pieces and throwing them up in the air and the wind starting to blow them away and they sort of turned into glittery sparkles of nothingness.
Totally different than how I dealt with the death of my first and wonderfully good husband. Grieving for him was painful but meaningful and integrating my memories of our life together into my present life gave to me, despite the extreme trauma and sadness. He passed away unexpectedly and I experienced PTSD for about a month, but it was totally different than the PTSD from the spath trauma.

AnnettePK

No Contact, Maybe this doesn’t apply to your ex P, but mine made up stuff about his past in order to justify/explain his abusive and hostile character. Is it possible that your ex really wasn’t so traumatized by being adopted, or that it didn’t even happen like he says it did? Did he ever seek counseling to mitigate his resentment? It’s possible he’s telling the truth, but I found that with mine everything he did and said was for power and control and to justify his choices. But he never chose to change as he likes what he does and he likes his motivations.

AnnettePK

You are seeing pretty clearly, sad and disgusting as it is. He wanted you to think you were his only girlfriend and he wanted it to look that way to some people. Even though you were being his girlfriend, he was not being a boyfriend in a committed relationship, and you were not his only intimate relationship. You are so right that you were his main target. You didn’t know at the time, and you did the best you could. Now that you know, you are doing your best for yourself and others who care about you.

Incredible as it is, he is not repentant. He doesn’t feel bad about what he did or how he hurt others. He is probably feeling inconvenienced because he got caught; or maybe he doesn’t mind or even enjoys the added drama and suffering of getting caught from time to time, and then he moves on to new victims.

If he ever does apologize to anyone, he doesn’t mean it. He says he is sorry in order to get something he wants. In your situation, he decided it would be most enjoyable to him and most convenient to him, if he just ignored you once you found out the truth about him and his choices of words and actions.

AnnettePK

Very typical of a spath to turn cause and effect around. You were rightly suspicious because he was cheating. He turns it around and says he’s cheating because you’re suspicious. It is crazy making.

He may not have really thought you were cheating on him; he may have just accused you to make you feel like it was your fault he was abusing you.

AnnettePK

You didn’t know how he was abusing you and manipulating you and gaslighting you. When you understood what he was doing and how awful he is and how you were being harmed, you left. That is something to be thankful for, and you can depend on yourself to take care of you and to protect you. You have a lot going for you in your own choices, and you have a lot to offer to people who are worthy to be your friends – those who appreciate you and care about your well being.

NoContact

Jenna please do not miss Annette’s earlier point: people who act bizarre can do worse.

This has been my point too. I look back and see how Disordered it seemed “back then” and shouldn’t really be surprised at how Deranged it seems “right now.” It’s a calculation like a graph you would set in your job so just imagine I have hit 105 in 20 minutes and your heart will race AS IT SHOULD!! with the Danger Ahead that your brain has instantly calculated, right?!

Please Jenna, listen to yourself and see the Hazard in this person, this is a temp rising so fast that people can practically hear the pulse across the street. Really..I am probably 3 states away and if I turn off the tv I can hear his racing heartbeat myself. IT IS NOT YOUR IMAGINATION instead!!!! nope, that racing heartbeat is NOT JUST IN YOUR EARS, you are fine….it’s the guy you are standing next to, with a bomb in his soul.

NoContact

Jenna, I’m electronically unable to respond to your post so I’m responding here instead.

Here is why I think you are at risk and I have not read very many of your posts — for which I’m sorry but of course you understand as I’ve been dealing with the same sort of person a very long while.

1. You are SMART.
2. You speak your mind. You are so articulate that your words virtually jump off the page.
STOP HERE.
You are a lot more threatening to any sort of disordered person, than a bimbo.
Now, let’s go on, ok?
3. You are professionally connected to people who could theoretically get him into trouble. If you made the right calls to the right people, you could make his life something other than it is right now, if only by TELLING THEM that this person pulled your hair. PERIOD.
STOP HERE.
THIS PERSON PULLED YOUR HAIR TO HURT YOU WHILE YOUR NECK WAS ALREADY HURT. Is that something you are supposed to get over?
Come back to Nancy. Here I am, my neck in hurting, my boyfriend grabs my hair and holds on until I am squealing and begging him to let go and it takes MONTHS for me to physically heal. Meanwhile my SOUL will not, because my NECK IS A SPECIAL PLACE TO ATTACK ME. I can be killed there as every mountain lion knows. IT IS NOT THE SAME AS KICKING ME IN THE SHINS.
4. You know things about him that are fairly outrageous and seem to feel pretty raped by having committed sexual and other acts that you wouldn’t have if you had UNDERSTOOD THE LEVEL OF HIS COMMITMENT. I know that this is a “special” feeling and it’s the same as the bride who comes down the aisle and…..???……wtf?….where is he?
Again, stop there. In criminal law, if that is a Repeat, they call it Fraud.
5. You are terribly emotionally and possibly physically damaged by this experience. Those who feel my lengthy exposure is worse because it was so extended, should remember that I got two WONDERFUL DAUGHTERS out of it, and that is why I STAYED. If you had gotten pregnant, wouldn’t YOU have stayed?!! of course. Does that mean that either one of us SHOULD HAVE??!!!! Trust me, the answer is NO just as soon as the first Weird Thing showed up — and it was not a whole lot further out than the year you spent with your spath. It’s just that I had already made “other plans” by then….that I’m not really sorry for because of those kids, right? so it puts Moms in a difficult space, being grateful for being attacked is sort of putting it oddly but essentially how we feel at the end of it all. And Confused, like you, and Damaged and wondering who to trust.
6. Studies show that the best predictor of a woman’s risk is the level of her own fear. The fact that you are not enjoying the holiday but rather focused on how unfair it is that he’s hurt you, suggests he will return to do it again. I’m so SORRY to tell you this, but the more that you MISS him, the HUNGRIER he becomes for that feeling.
And THAT is why I have been afraid for you, WITH LOVE.

NoContact

Jenna, in response to this comment about his karma — he won’t want to take it alone so make sure you do not get in the WAY of what that karma will bring to him. SCOOT! you don’t deserve HIS KARMA, dear! in fact if you stand there then how are the angels going to DELIVER it?! move so they can Do Their Thing.

That’s my advice from the Outsider’s Perspective out here in the Loving Gallery of Life. Guess what?! the Universe has GOOD surprises too. Here is Some Love, drink up: (_______)

xox N/C

NoContact

Jenna, the big problem is that you are thinking like a rational professional person, while your attacker is none of those three elements.

He can be trusted to hurt you.

Period.

Again, I AM SO SORRY but he can be TRUSTED TO HURT YOU and that is what you have learned and why your soul is In Rebellion as soon as you wake for the day. Am I right? Of course I am, Jenna. People do not ATTACK US INTENTIONALLY unless they are disordered, and as a nurse you know we are hard-wired to pull our hands away from a hot stove. It is AUTOMATIC, it is INSTANTANEOUS! so what you are experiencing is the inner RECOIL!!!!!!! at finally recognizing your hand is burning hot with pain raging down your arm, through your heart and out the other side.

The problem is three-fold.

1. Your burns need to heal.

2. You need to re-learn what a stove looks like.

3. You need Justice psychologically which may not be obtainable, so counseling will be required to help you Live with that until he meets his Karma. WHICH HE WILL! however, your life CANNOT rest on that result in the interim, rather a continued focus on what happened will KEEP YOU IN THIS DAMAGING EMOTIONAL AND PSYCHOLOGICAL TRAP and he will just as predictably notice you are in there. And WHY did he put you in there, lock the exits and let you think you were Inferior and Damaged and Leftover Goods, dear? so that he could attack you some more.

The Facts of Life are NOT what Mama told us. So please take here from Nancy with the SCARS ON HER HEART. These men and women are DANGEROUS!!! His ability to attack you is based on two simple elements, so please go back to Nursing School #1:

1. You are a Human Being equipped with a conscience.

2. Your untreatable male patient IS NOT. He is DEAD and sucking out your human blood.

THAT is why you wake screaming!! he is not “ALL THERE” and should be locked into a facility where he cannot hurt anyone — and maybe at some point Society will wake the heck up and SEE THAT IS TRUE. Meanwhile, it’s a matter of Dancing Away and understanding you are lovely and strong enough to do so….and SO AM I AT 62, believe it!!! Even now I make him look like crap and I have been pretty used up by now, still my skin is glowing (and secretly I am finally glad about those flat boobs since at least they’re still “up there) because I AM NOT CORRUPT INSIDE AND NEITHER ARE YOU.

NOTHING done to your body is as important as what has been done to your TRUST in your HEART. That was put there by Nature, you are intended to BOND and not be worried about protecting yourself, so in this process you have been MADE ILL. Many victims say they’d rather have just been hit with a fist, and Jenna I am definitely among them. What I recall is not the fear of bodily injury but rather, the things he SAID to me and about me behind my back, like a 14yo girl in junior high.

All this is why your skin crawls, so just name it and make sure your windows are locked and that you do NOT ANSWER THE PHONE. REMEMBER my sign-on poster name when, not if, he comes back to upset you again. HE WILL! but let your heart beat in a wish that he had NOT called, as opposed to being glad to have temporarily “won his interest” because his INTEREST in you IS INSANE just like the “man” himself.

NoContact

As for “leaving be” his other friends….

OMG LEAVE THEM BE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You do NOT want to be responsible for his LOSS of anyone or heaven forbid, his reputation or status at this perilous point in time FOR YOURSELF.

My ex’s new friend never wanted him, he nearly killed ME for that AND NOW SHE IS DEAD HERSELF.

MY poster name should be NO KIDDING!!!! instead of JUST No Contact, Jenna.

NoContact

Jenna, please let me add this top-off cherry to the whipped cream of this guy’s risk to SOCIETY, it is a quote from your post (that may or may not be above, ha ha):

“Other than his best friend he really doesn’t have any close friends.”

HMMMM….. AND WHO DOES THAT LEAVE WHEN THE LAST WOMAN WALKS OUT, JENNA? MAKE SURE THAT WHEN THE MUSIC STOPS IN THE GAME OF ‘MUSICAL CHAIRS’ YOU DO NOT GET LEFT OUT OF A SEAT. CLAIM IT NOW!! AND DO NOT LET HIM GET PUSHED OUT BECAUSE HE HAS RUN OUT OF OTHER RESOURCES AND YOU HAVE NOT RECOVERED ENOUGH TO PUSH YOURSELF!! that is actually the best benefit of this website.

HERE IS THE PUSH YOU NEED. FIND A SEAT IN LIFE! CLAIM IT NOW!!!! At some point in the very near future, the new person will figure him out, and he will be RIGHT BACK. You have not had nearly enough time to recover from this and CANNOT BE EXPECTED TO FEEL BETTER THAN YOU DO, so instead of beating yourself up about it, LET ME MOTHER YOU TODAY TO THIS LIMITED EXTENT: DO WHAT YOU ARE TOLD RIGHT NOW, AND FIND A SEAT!!!! OR HE WILL PUSH YOU OUT OF YOUR SEAT, SINCE THAT IS WHAT HE DOES TO PEOPLE. AND SHE WILL FIGURE THIS OUT. BE SAFE!! AND COUNT ON HER SEEING THE SAME THINGS YOU DID instead of imagining that she will be an easier Sale than you, because the collective VOICES out here are saying NOPE!!! we would NEVER go for that guy unless we had a broken wing, so please hear N/C and SCOOT AWAY BEFORE HE COMES BACK TO GET MORE NURSING!!!!

He will never pay you back, and at this CURRENT point his stinky character won’t last with a new person more than just a few months, tops. As I said, this is a Graph you can draw and so can your virtual audience out here….you are a GOOD PERSON and he is NOT so duh…once his new friend sees how rotten he is, he’ll be OUTTA PLACES TO GO!!!! Doesn’t your place look so sweet and pretty, just like the nurse that you are??!! sure and where’s the passenger in that Porsche??!!! golly she looks more and more like Jenna to me out here, TEMPORARILY smiling while he cruises along at the wheel, renting her beauty and her presence while he SHOPS FOR OTHER VICTIMS not because she’s unsatisfying but because he wants a Cow in that seat.

Hey, at least my ex was honest about it, he wanted a dumb cow. AND THAT STRATEGY WORKED FOR HIM, let me point out, ha ha. He made no pretense about it at all, mooooooooooooooo. 🙂

NoContact

Jenna dear, I THINK YOU HAVE DONE GREAT WITH THIS.

IF ONLY!!!! I had lost less time.

Naturally I don’t regret the years in which the kids were born, but those thereafter…..I couldn’t get out.

So YES! I totally support your plan and WISH IT HAD BEEN MY OWN and congratulate you on taking better care of yourself than SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE here, who have lost decades and fortunes and the trust of their children and employers….all for a single relationship that SHOULD HAVE only lasted as long as your own.

GOOD JOB JENNA! and may everybody else get Free as fast as you. Unfortunately, “we should be so lucky,” ha ha ha.

xox from N/C with Love and Thanks!! for mutual healing, in your experience I have seen a clearer vision of my own, and not identified any better way out than the one that you set forth too. It hurts, but better now than later — after we have grown a big wart on our foreheads.

AnnettePK

Jenna,

You are doing a good thing for yourself in not letting him know how much he has harmed you. It is best if he doesn’t know anything about you at all ever.
The less you think about him, the better. There is really no figuring a psychopath out, and who wants to understand them anyway.

NoContact

Jenna, you matter so much to us all, that I have checked in today on Christmas Eve just to say HAPPY CHRISTMAS TO YOU!!!!**** and may the New Year ahead be ever so much brighter, and SO much more like what you really deserve.

xox from N/C

AnnettePK

He has no reason to apologize because he does not regret what he did, and he does not care about anyone else. He lied when he said he cared. That is extreme betrayal, and it is the most painful thing in the world, I think.

His ‘best friend’ is probably not really a friend. If they are both disordered, they are probably using each other. He doesn’t be a friend to anyone. If he were a real friend he would be a real boyfriend.

He might or he might not come back, and it could be years from now. It depends on what he wants and what he thinks he can get. Even though you’ve exposed him to other victims, once it’s done, he really doesn’t care that you did it in a personal way. The degree to which he wants to exploit you and the degree to which he wants to hurt you are the same regardless of what you did. Spaths are completely impersonal and although they use punishment to control the victim when they are in a series of interactions that make up a fake ‘relationship’ they usually don’t care enough about anyone in a personal way to desire revenge. They are just as happy to torture anyone. Other people don’t really exist as real individual people in their paradigm; and I am not sure they experience consciousness as a person like we do.
It is chilling, but understanding how they ‘think’ and what their motivations are make it easier to predict their behavior on some level, although their behavior is always somewhat random because no one is an individual person to them.
When they are looking for people to exploit, they do tend to come back to people whom they interacted with in the past, maybe because the familiarity gives them an advantage and it’s less of an effort with them.

NoContact

uhhhh…..No Jenna….this is NOT ALL THEY CAN DO.

…..the WORST was being called the wrong name at “the critical moment” and after the words “I love you” and being SLAPPED UPON as though calling me a Cow “during the act.”

And then — being called a Dumb Cow.

Just in case I hadn’t Noticed — RIGHT?

Now, please go back to my earlier suggestion and pretend that I’m Nancy and have CALLED You about this dude. WHAT ARE YOU GONNA SAY TO ME JENNA?!! lock your doors sister Nanc! that guy is INSANE and TOTALLY reminds me of somebody that I used to date once, and boy did he nearly put me under six feet. Pick ya up in an hour and this time let’s have suitcases packed and a note for the landlord, or at least make an affirmative new Plan to DO SOMETHING ELSE BESIDES THAT.

NoContact

You’re kidding, right?!!

Not only are you nicer to me than the spath that faked me out of my life in 1983 — but you are also WAY WAY WAY WAY NICER that our elder daughter.

Between the TWO of them (she was Daddy’s Girl) I have been Pinched nearly to death and that girl has not let go in ALL THESE FOUR YEARS since I separated! so that this will be my 5th Christmas with a snotty daughter who is now 30 years old herself.

So ha ha! please let me THANK You!!!! for your kindness to me at the holidays. THIS IS GOING TO BE TOUGH TONITE AND TOMORROW!!! so please wish me luck, and if I totally can’t stand it anymore, then expect to see me posting and not spelling very well.. however all the words will be spelling THESE PEOPLE ARE DRIVING ME OUT OF MY MIND!!

LOL, enjoy the Day, dear! N/C

LeaGurl

Hi Jenna,
I’m going through it too. The worst thing in the world ever. I just need to meet people and keep reading these blogs. I’ve tried the no contact and its not working. I dont know why I even want to contact him. My head is so f**ked up right now. I’ve never been this way. I’ve always been strong and now im so weak. After the fall I was left like WTF just happend? So. I started reading up on his behavior and i found sociopath and it nailed it to a tee. He’s also a sex addict. Ripped my heart out and stomped on it.
Girl just try to have a Merry Xmas. If I can you can. I’ll also give you my # if you want we can text or just talk. IDK. All I know is I have to pull my head outta my ass and do it. Trust me I have thoughts of destroying him on a daily basis. But then im just going to look like the jealous psychotic ex gf. However, once i started noticing his odd behavior i started making copies, screen shots, texts you name it. I have them all saved. I could hang him right now If I wanted to. The more I think about him the more control he has over me. I need to put an end to the madness. Hang in there girl.

NoContact

Me too Jenna, and I’m sorry I can’t be of more help.

Yesterday my daughter did what has turned out to be “the usual,” specifically she wants to shun me from my family because she VASTLY PREFERS her spath father.

I am so ruined by this that there are no words for this. Every time I have started to heal, the daughters he taught to batter me, make it impossible. I had to bail out of the family home in 2010 and went into what I thought was “my family’s” duplex where our daughter was living.

Instead of welcoming me, knowing her father had been cheating on me, she made me feel SO TERRIBLE and believe it or not, CONTINUES TO HARP ON ME FOR HAVING DISRUPTED HER LIFE when I showed up battered and destroyed by a spath who threatened to kill me, wanted another woman AND HER KIDS and to dump our kids and me. The kids are either spaths too (it’s only the waste of MY WHOLE LIFE since I’ve been on my own since the age of 19 when my mom died) or just horrible people and either way, I don’t have a family anymore because I didn’t want to share my husband with another woman.

AnnettePK

Good question you ask as to why he didn’t dump other women for refusing to go along with his perversions. It proves that the reason he discarded you is not that you refused to participate in a threesome. He gave that as a reason in order to blame you, but his real reason is something else. Whatever the specific reason he discarded you, it is based on his motivation for exploitation, power, control, sadism.

Given that you are certain that he lies to you, does not care about your well being, nor does he appreciate you, nor does he bond to you personally, and he does not choose to change; the specific reasons don’t matter all that much. The reason he discards people is because he is a bad person; it has nothing to do with you.

Righteous anger can be a motivation for change. You’re angry at injustice done to you, so you remove yourself from the situation, you determine not to allow yourself to be abused anymore, and you do what you can to bring about justice if possible and if it doesn’t stress you. When you get to the point where there is nothing more you can do, feeling angry uses up one’s energy and doesn’t accomplish anything. It’s difficult to just turn it off like flipping a switch. You don’t want to be burdened with the intrusive thoughts and the anger; you want peace. I found it very difficult to unburden myself, it’s not possible to go back in time and undo the damage done. I allowed myself to feel anger and to think about things, and I tried to balance that with focusing on other things. It takes time and it takes work. I listened to a relaxation audio made for survivors of psychopathic abuse in a love relationship.

It is possible that you may feel better when you work through and heal from the other psychopathic abusive relationships you experienced, especially the damage when you were still a child. That can be so deeply entrenched.

The book, Getting Past Your Breakup by Susan Elliott, was helpful to me.

Lovefraud is being upgraded. Comments and forum posts are temporarily disabled. Dismiss

Send this to a friend