Lovefraud recently received the following email from a man whom we’ll call “Andrew.”
I recently met a lady out of the blue after I had sat at home alone for 2 years. She is the victim of a sociopath—reads & posts on the Lovefraud site trying to heal. She says she can’t tell me all the damage done & I don’t need to know—it’s her business unless she feels she needs to share.
She had cabin fever—had to get out for a night—hence our meeting. Well I had basically given up on finding someone until I met her. We instantly clicked. It was so good for 3 weeks—making plans of fun things to do. I thought it would help her heal—to go have fun again.
I think she started liking me too much in that short period of time—got scared & slammed on the brakes. She says she needs time, but truly values my friendship & adores me. I’m trying to give her “time.” It’s so hard when she lit up my life for a while.
She wants to see me again, but doesn’t know when.
I have no motives other than to get to know her & help her get over the past. She might just be the one if we spend the time to know one another.
I have read the Lovefraud blog trying to understand—some really sad stories.
What should I do?
In the thousands of emails that I’ve received, this is the first time someone has asked this question (which I’ve paraphrased) how do you approach a potential romantic partner when that person has been burned by a sociopath? I appreciate that fact that Andrew cared enough to ask the question.
I will answer the question assuming that everything is exactly as presented—a woman, whom we’ll call Caroline, had a terrible experience with a sociopath and is skittish about opening herself to another man. Andrew honestly likes Caroline, and wants to get to know her better. I will assume that neither Andrew nor Caroline is actually a predator who is looking for a new source of supply.
This, of course, is something that Caroline, and everyone else who has been betrayed and damaged by a sociopath, needs to understand and believe: There are good people in the world. Yes, as many as 12 percent of the population are social predators—sociopaths, psychopaths, narcissists, borderlines. But that still means that 88 percent of the world’s people are not disordered, and are capable of having a loving relationship.
Understand where she’s been
So, Andrew, the first thing for you to understand is that Caroline has been through the meat grinder. She’s experienced betrayal that has rocked her to her core. She’s certainly suffered emotional and psychological abuse, and may have also suffered verbal, physical, sexual and financial abuse. In fact, it may be a miracle that she is still standing.
If you’ve never experienced this level of betrayal—most people haven’t—it may be hard for you to believe what she’s gone through. Should she tell you anything about what happened, it may sound like a bad movie, and you may be inclined to think she is exaggerating. I assure you, when someone is involved with a sociopath, anything is possible. I’ve collected more than 3,200 cases, and many of the stories should be made into movies. You can’t make this stuff up.
Caroline, however, is accustomed to not being believed. She may have gone to court and to the police, and they didn’t believe her story. It’s possible her friends or her own family do not believe her. So one of the best things you can do is believe her. It will help her feel validated.
Go slow
Andrew, you will need take things very slowly. It’s likely that the sociopath swept into Carolin’es life in a whirlwind romance—if you call all the time, if you are overly exuberant about wanting to see her, it may set off alarm bells, because that’s how the sociopath acted. Let her set the pace. Keep things light.
Understand that trust needs to be earned. This may be why Caroline got into trouble in the first place—she trusted too readily. Now, she may have gone too far in the other direction, and resolved to never trust anyone again. This is an unhealthy position, because we do need to be able to trust in order to live a good life. But you may not know how much progress Caroline has made in regaining her ability to trust.
So if you want to move forward, you need to be trustworthy. Tell her the truth about everything. Keep your promises. Call when you say you’re going to call, and show up when you promise that you’ll show up. In fact, I hope that’s how you live your life anyway.
It may not work
Finally, it is possible that Caroline simply is not recovered enough to think about another involvement. If she tells you that she really can’t be in a relationship, don’t argue with her, and don’t take it personally. You may just need to accept it and move on.
But if Caroline indicates that does want to get to know you, albeit slowly, getting closer will probably be worth the wait. Before hooking up with the sociopath, Caroline was probably loving, giving, caring, responsible, dynamic and empathetic—because that’s the type of person that sociopaths target. So if she’s able to find herself, and open herself—well, it could be rewarding for both of you.
Lovefraud readers: If you have any more suggestions for Andrew, please post them.
I will speak of Andrew in the third person because he does not belong here. This is a site for us, not for potential love interests, the curious or possible spaths. I am 40 years out of my spath relationship; remarried for 30 years. I have studied these creeps for years because I have children with one. I felt extreme red flags and creepiness in both Andrew’s words and the audacity to come here for his petty curiosity at best or to get more psycho bait to use against other women at worst. Either way he has no business here. I do not believe his Caroline exists and if she does he is way out of bounds to show up here. Sorry Donna, to assume he is legitimate is more than I can do.
Now in first person; Andrew, please go back under the rock from which you came!
THANK YOU ALL! *tears* I have to say I still find it very very difficult to ‘speak my mind’ due to an exaggerated fear of being rejected.
To those who agree with me that Andrew does not belong here I thank you from the bottom of my heart for also ‘speaking up.’
I belonged to a survivor’s group of spaths and was BOOTED OUT for speaking out. This women (she said) named Matilda, stalked me in every post and did damage to my words. She was one of several ADMINISTRATORS of the website and had the power to oust me.
After that 6 months of writing, wanting to believe in the site, I was booted for talking about the subject of suicidal tendencies of victims of spaths.
I was told to NEVER say the word suicide (I might send someone off) and then was unceremoniously kicked out permanently. No chance to change my wayward ways.
Donna has been nothing but accommodating to me and has printed an article about my story. She is the real deal and I will forever be appreciative of this website.
We do, however, have to be wary of people coming in and reading our posts.
I would hope that Donna has done one of two things:
1. Made up the story of Andrew and Caroline to engage us in converation about being too hypervigelant with regular folk.
or
2. Contacted Caroline and asked her permission to post Andrews story.
Either way, it has been a very informative conversation and I feel blessed to belong with this very strong group of woman. I feel blessed to be here.
(((hugs)))
oh my
Just an observation: most obsessive lovers can’t take no for an answer. They also mind read, and rationalize. They tend to believe their object of desire “adores” them, even though the “object” has never given him any reason to believe that. Now, here is where the object needs to take responsibility. We can NOT BE wishey-washey…we can not try to placate to save him from having hurt feelings, we need to make ouselves perfectly clear! Anything short of that will serve his fantasy that we can be swayed and that we really adore him. This is undeniably a lesson in boundry setting!!!
And, also, I think a lesson in not being emotional care-takers to others feelings.
I felt I was being shamed for recognizing my boundries and speaking out about them. I am not voiceless anymore. I don’t feel I attacked anyone, but assertively stated my opinion about what I felt in my gut.
I wonder what Caroline felt in her gut that made her pull back.
Also, we are taught not to talk to much about our vulnerabilities, early on, with someone just entering our lives….we all know spaths and narcs use these vulnerabilities…but we are supposed to “Help” an unknown person to understand how to “help” a woman who has clearly stated she does NOT WANT his help.
Just sayin”
I agree so much with betsybug, Comille54 and kim frederick. And I always, always listen to my instinct and gut feeling. If something feels wrong, it IS wrong. I have spent almost my whole life trying to supress that feeling and silence my inner voice because I wanted to give everyone the benefit of the doubt. It only got me into trouble with no less than four psychopath-boyfriends/one ex husband. No more!
I don’t care if I get kicked out of this forum; there is something very wrong with Mr. A! And yes, I too say pissed off etc, but I do not write it on forums/internet if I want to be taken seriously.
It also is a strange phrase to use in the context of the rest of his oh so balanced comment.
However, It was not just the ‘pissed off’ that made me suspicious. It was just about everything he wrote.
I sometimes wonder if I will ever be able to trust again.
I used to be one of those ‘nice’ people who always gave
everyone the ‘benefit of the doubt’ until I saw different.
Only thing was, with ppath, it was blatantly there in front
of me and I was choosing to ignore it – amazing.
I don’t think, after almost 12 years of stalking by a psychopath,
that all people are rude, ugly, cold and calculating. But, then, on the other hand, after everything I have just come through, it definitely is difficult learning to ‘trust’ anything any more, much less a romantic involvement of any kind. Just maintaining ‘friendships’ has become difficult for me.
My world, for the past six years, has been completely overflowing with spath crap and drama.
I gave up living MY LIFE in exchange for helping him live his. He almost snuffed me out pretty well.
However, the one thing he never bet on was the fact that I AM STRONGER.
I WILL go on.
I will.
And I will stand on my values and integrity and character.
What will “THAT” excuse for a human being stand upon?
Yes, there ARE ‘boogy men’ behind every bush.
Yes, there ARE psychopaths, just like in the movies.
I escaped one. (Hopefully).
Do we allow ourselves to be PREY or do we stand up for
ourselves and get the poison away from us?
No matter what our emotions are telling us, sometimes in
this life we MUST forsake our emotions and use our heads.
We are entitled to make good choices for ourselves sometimes,
even when our hearts may be lying to us and telling us something else.
Adult choices and decisions come very hard sometimes in this life and we have to accept the good along with the bad.
It’s tough it has to be like that but it is.
In MY case, if I hadn’t set aside my emotions in all this and
started using my HEAD, I would have probably ended up DEAD.
To me, this is a lot more than just a ‘blog topic’, it has been my life for quite a long time now. I have stepped through that ring of fire, though.
I have acquired my freedom and it is slowly but surely shuffling itself back into some semblance of order.
I wonder and wait for that ‘surprise visit’ out of the blue.
As sure as I am sitting here, I can feel it coming.
Big mistake on “IT’s” part.
I will become “IT’s” 3rd strike.
WITH NO QUALMS.
(Caps used for emphasis).
Andrew, at mid life, you should know better. no means no. space is space. your lengthy comment above is so spot on with what i have seen and experienced. bizarre is the only way i can describe it. i will not elaborate. i just SEE. back off. and permanently if that is what she wants. and if your sincere and genuine, my apology. but i for one recognize a few things and i will not divulge their nature in the interest of avoiding teaching someone how to get around what is being accomplished here. period.
This thread reminds me of what happened when a self-proclaimed sociopath’s article was posted a while back. It generated outrage and shock to readers that Donna would post such a boatload of arrogance. But, to Donna’s credit, there was one grain of sand in that article that was based upon truth: our spath entanglements go from a curse to a blessed learning experience. We learn about ourselves, our boundaries, and emerge as stronger and emotionally healthier individuals, once the dust settles. All other pontifications of the self-proclaimed sociopath were blather.
This discussion has sparked some serious insight and recognition of our own boundaries and triggers. For whatever it’s worth, I’m glad that Donna posted this and I am very much hopeful that Caroline will continue to read, post, heal, and empower herself with what she’s learning. It is a HUGE encouragement to me that she recognized a possible threat, and took proactive steps to protect herself, EVEN IF Andrew was sincere and genuine.
I’ve typed this, before, and I mean it: nobody on this planet of billions of human beings is “The One,” and if Caroline’s choice is to pass up on an opportunity to turn another person into “The One” in lieu of protecting herself and her boundaries, I have three syllables for her: TOWANDA!!!!!
Brightest blessings
Dupey, you’ll “trust,” again when it’s been earned by someone. That’s how it goes, I believe. Where we once used to hand out our trust to anyone and everyone like M&M’s, we now know that trust isn’t a right but a privilege. Trust is something that should be hard-earned and given only after actions have spoken louder than one’s words.
By their own actions will you know them…..
Brightest blessings
Thruthspeak wrote: ” nobody on this planet of billions of human beings is “The One,” and if Caroline’s choice is to pass up on an opportunity to turn another person into “The One” in lieu of protecting herself and her boundaries, I have three syllables for her: TOWANDA!!!!!”
Add a TOWANDA from me too!
One of the first things I loved about the book “He’s not that into you” was how the author did away with myths. He made clear how people tend to tell stories which are no better than “urban myths” of some woman who waited and did stuff so that the guy she believed to be “The One” eventually did propose or committed himself and how they lived happily ever after. It’s always someone who knows someone who told them. He urges women to stop waiting for such a myth to happen to them and instead value themselves and not put up with crap or boundary breaking behaviour.
I know I don’t believe in “The One” anymore, but it doesn’t make me a cynic. I do believe there are actual good men out there I can fall in love with and who are capable of loving me in return, that some of these good men are available and that I can form a healthy relationship with them, because both I and them have grown enough to have a healthy relationship. I even believe there are SEVERAL of these men in existence, and most likely within proximity. I have very much faith that I have a chance of having a healthy, inspiring and fulfilling relationship.
I also know and believe that while nobody is perfect that these men will respect my boundaries, not just by professing so, but in action as well (thus actually going slow and actually leaving me alone when I want time and space). For me this faith and belief is the absolute opposite of cynicism and hypervigilance and distruting people.
This belief in myself and faith in the men in existence, enables me to not feel guilty of missing out when a man would not respect my boundaries and to allow myself to take all the time I need to establish a foundation for trust and find out for myself alone what I want or do not want.
I do not believe that everyone who is deaf or blind to my boundaries is disordered. A lot of people who are deaf and blind to it ime are so for other reasons. But even then the behaviour implies to me that these sincere well meaning people are not people I want closely in my life, let alone intimately. Because I can be sure of only one thing with them: they will not understand a boundary, not even when they bang right into one.
This is my general take on love and friendship and trust and who I interact closely with.