Many women have written to Lovefraud about husbands who they’ve come to believe are sociopaths. They were astounded to discover that, not only was the husband cheating, but he was having sex with men.
Lovefraud reader eyeswideshut writes about this in a recent comment to the post, After he’s gone: looking at the sociopath through open eyes. She asks:
Now that I know he is also gay, is sociopathic tendency in married gay men not common as well? When I read the stories of the women in the book (“Straight Wives”), many of the men sound like sociopaths as well. Have you studied this phenomenon? Is it possible that gay men who choose to live the lie of married life are likely also socios?
To this, another Lovefraud reader, Leslie, commented:
On the third extended date I had with the SP, I turned to him one night, after we’d been together, and said, “Have you been with men?” Something in the way he’d made love made me think he had. He stared at the window and said in a monotone, “I have never made love to a man.” It was the same monotone he used to deny that he was living with a woman when I asked him that a year later. He was. I don’t have hard proof, but I know the guy had had sex with men.
Then alohatraveler commented:
I have heard from another victim of my sociopath that he was starting to get more “experimental” when she knew him. She knew him after me. He was expressing an interest in having sex with a man, but of course, with a woman present, because he was “not gay.” We both also saw an ad that he posted looking for sex with a transsexual. Then he placed an ad where he wanted a traditional type of woman.
“Not a gay bone in my body”
Shortly after I met my sociopathic ex-husband, James Montgomery, he proclaimed to me, “There’s not a gay bone in my body.” I had no reason to doubt him. But when I left him after two-and-a-half years, I learned a lot about his sexual activities:
- He had sex with at least six other women during our relationship.
- He was heavily into Internet porn.
- He solicited gay male prostitutes.
- He tried to arrange threesomes and looked for swinging couples.
In short, he wanted sexual thrills. The more different kinds of thrills, the better. I’m lucky I didn’t get a serious disease.
Screw anyone
Sociopaths are hard-wired for sex. They have an excessive need for stimulation, excitement and sensation. They also have no fear and no inhibitions. From a sexual perspective, that means a voracious appetite and anything goes.
Dr. Liane Leedom writes that sociopaths only want two things. One of them is power. The other is sex.
So when it comes to sexual orientation, I believe sociopaths are neither straight nor gay. In short, they’ll screw anyone.
Lovefraud has heard from gay individuals—men and women—who were involved in gay relationships with sociopaths. I asked several of them if they thought the sociopath was actually gay. They all agreed with my theory and said the sociopath was not gay.
Sex with an agenda
This does not mean, however, that sociopaths are out of control. On the contrary, to them, sex, and sexual orientation, is just something to be used in order to achieve their objective, whatever that is.
Perhaps the most egregious example of this is the case of James McGreevey, the former governor of New Jersey. McGreevey, you may recall, resigned from office after proclaiming in a news conference that he was a “gay American.”
The truth was that his political career was imploding under a series of scandals. As I wrote in a review of the book written by McGreevey’s wife, I believe the former governor played the gay card because it was the best way to spin his political collapse.
Sociopaths use people for sex, and use sex to get what they want. Anybody who suits their agenda will do.
If it suits their agenda to be married with children, then that’s what they’ll do. But if sociopaths indulge in same-sex relationships, in my opinion, it’s because they’re sociopaths, not gay.
notavictim;
I don’t have a lot of time but we do hav much in common. I too am an East Coast gay man who was envolved in a short-term relationship with a European sociopath.
However, there are differences, including my was upfront about his sexuality and one of the things I do believe he truthfully said ws that he was never with a woman.
My was hot and cold but not overt. No verbal abuse per say, but emotional coldness like I never seen in a person.
I am also fully convinced mine is HIV+, something he never told me. I posted (alot) about this guy as there were many interesting aspects, not the least being that could be my little brother looks wise.
I will post more when I have time but you mention that you will not allow yourself to get nostalgice about him. That is a very good approach.
PS, in context with this post. Sociopaths may be after sex, but that was not the case with me in my encounter. However, others believe that permiscuous sociopaths do in fact withold sex, but I am not sure why.
Notavictim,
Some of them will F a snake if someone will hold it for them. Some of them like to see the snake squirm as they cut pieces off it’s tail. They do not care about the “objects,” living or inorganic, that they use to get their jollies.
People are just objects for them to manipulate in whatever sordid and sick way that gives them pleasure.
great article Donna….one I needed to refresh myself with again. It’s atonishing how we all have the same eye opening horror down the road…that even though they professed to be
in my case the P said he wanted a monogamous, loyal, exclusive relationship that there was “nothing” to be gained sleeping around…he had been there done that in his youth and really wanted to settle with someone he could enjoy a deep loving relationship with…..
excuse me while I fall on the ground laughing…because I believed him…why wouldn’t I? what reason would anyone make up a lie about this stuff for? Well he did lie about it…and Gay??? NO WAY…and now I have discovered ads on sites soliciting transvestites..so I guess I didn’t think of that one!! I’d never even thought of asking him about that!!!He was talking about swinging to me and I was just staring at him with my heart falling out…..swinging??? after selling me the promise of exclusive deepening love??? I was so angry…I couldn’t undertsand the change around…the swing….they swing like crazy into anything for kicks if sex is their interest….no doubt…yes Oxy… so true
Some psychopaths are into sexual thrills or a combination with robbery, killing, inheritances, scams…..the list of interests is varied but there is one thing that remains steady…whatever their kick is you will be sacrifced on the slab for it…
I do need to chime and offer my experience in addressing the original article. Depending on who you speak to, human sexuality falls along a spectrum (we can have Kinsey to thank for that). I am pretty much on the far extreme side of the homosexual scale – I’ve never had a sexual or romantic encounter with a woman, and I am completely out of the closet in my personal and professional life.
I live in a city where there is a large concentration of MSM (men who have sex with men). These individuals can fall anywhere on the Kinsey scale, may identify as “straight” and have sexual encounters with other men while single or in relationships with women. I’ve met several men in this category, and I’d even further argue that based on my research 60 -70% of MSM fall into this category. A lot of what drives these men is curiosity and fantasy. Sexuality can ebb an flow during a lifetime and it is rare that bisexual men are malicious. Bisexual men are no more malicious or deceitful than gay and straight men. However, they can be stereotyped as oversexual, looking for sex with anything that moves, but most bisexuals are not sociopaths.
If an MSM engaged in a relationship with a woman and started having sex with men, they are cheaters, liars, and at the very least bisexual. Our society has a tendency to overuse splitting – no one is 100% straight or gay, and even bisexuals have a tendency to identify primarily as heterosexual or homosexual. To these men, sex is sex – and many don’t equate sexual acts cognitively as making them gay or bisexual. It’s confusing I know…
I’d argue that although not all MSM or bisexual men are sociopaths or narcissists, most sociopaths are probably bisexual (asexual is a better term). A full-blown sociopath, narcissist, or psychopath devalues human beings and treats them as objects – any gender will do.
The ambiguous sexuality of the P/S/N can be used as a means to psychologically confuse. My charming P would deny, deny, deny he flirted and targeted gay men to seduce them into bizarre faux friendships or relationships for attention, free dinners, and trips around the world. He doesn’t care, and you’re easily replaceable. What’s even more bizarre is that I wasn’t dealing with someone lying about being gay, I was probably dealing with someone lying about being straight. To me this is the best example of his full blown sociopathy – he enjoys the act of deceiving other people. He is a gay man pretending to be straight. It’s quite a fun game for him. So when you are suddenly trapped in his web, believe you’re being courted, asked about having children, moving in together, traveling together – you are unsettled and begin to feel you’re losing you’re mind. “This guy is so wonderful, yet I must be crazy because he’s a straight guy. Maybe he’s just confused and will come around if I help him”. Insane thinking, I know.
This was the game he played with me. He had the chameleon-like ability to present himself as a smoke/mirrors boyfriend, based on my desire to be in a relationship and be intimate with him. One minute he’d be asking about our next date, the next he’d deny being gay and remind me that we’d already discussed his sexuality, then after denying being gay and expressing my feelings to him he’d ramp up the flirtation and seductive behavior to confuse me even more, the next he’d sabotage and lure me out of an early stage relationship I was having with another guy promising me the world and everything my new boyfriend wasn’t offering me, then he’d tease me sexually to control me or joke about showering together, then he’d get angry at my sexual advances and guilt me because he didn’t want to “experiment”.
He used his sexuality and my desire for a relationship to play mental mind games. One minute he’d act gay, the next he’d imply I was dumb for taking him seriously because he was “straight”. I don’t know what his actual sexual history is (who or what he engaged with), but with me his favorite poison was teasing me, and withholding sex to cause me pain. He had a talent for denying and withholding from me everything I wanted from him. If I asked him to go to the symphony a certain night, he’d claim he was too busy and then go with someone else sending me an email with a picture of the ticket to boot.
There is nothing worse when someone intentionally gaslights you about who you think they are. This was not denial. It was psychological manipulation. I suspect due to my insight and loving nature all my best qualities repulsed P which intensified and sped up the relationship and cycle of abuse. When I look at his current or past targets, I wonder why he chose me and inflicted his abuse so rapidly while he slowly unleashed his bulls&it in past relationships. And the unresolved questions linger – why did he mistreat me? why did he treat certain people in his life with respect and dignity but discard me like trash/garbage? is he abusing his latest target?
It was my best qualities, my love for this creature, this sociopath, and my ability to see behind his mask that repulsed him, led to his abuse, and his hatred for me. I think I am one of very few people (if any) who can see him for who he is. And then you look at his photos, alone or with new targets and the person you see is a monster. And you see their fake smile, their empty soul, you finally see his piercing, empty eyes and remember his sustained eye contact as predatory, and it all repulses you. Or you see him with a new target, and while you’re picking up the pieces he’s carousing with the next brand new thing. What winners these spaths are. I imagine he reacted to the end of our friendship with the same depth of thought we have when killing a mosquito. I felt mentally raped.
Grief and recovery from these creatures is lonely process that is intensified by the stronghold of the psychopathic bond. As much as I desire revenge (from afar) and want to believe in karma, I see this charming monster strolling through life like a parasite while his former targets are left shattered, bitter, jaded, and left to grieve a false self and relationship that never existed. Our best qualities were turned against us. Being empathetic we use our experience to move on, grow, learn and get healthier mentally. I am not a malicious person. But my experience made me understand evil at a personal level. I cannot wish good things for this person.
notavictim – you are not confusing in the least. but i would venture that they are not ‘at least bisexual’ – but rather are only opportunistic and predatory. I do not believe that spath sexuality has the same motivators as empathic’s; and, that gender ‘preference’ isn’t really part of their sexuality. I am in a bit of a rush tonight, so can’t go in to detail, but wanted to at least respond to your thoughtful post (with my two cents worth. ;))
Wow…I would have never thought I was dating a sociopath. But when the smoke cleared how everything seemed to make sense.
How I thought I was gullible in believing we were going to share this wild adventure of sex. When it was is just part of their characteristic?
My S wined and dined me. Traveled all over the world money was no object. I had the best of everything. BUT….There was a payback. The payback as I see NOW was I would be his pawn in his sexual mind. You see, my S has power BUT he really isn’t all that good looking. So he convinced me about this new sex adventure called “Swinging” . I said I would try it. We set up a profile AND that’s when things changed.
He turned into another person. He was glued to the computer as soon as he woke up he would check emails, scroll through it out the day. AND REMND me I have yet to answer the emails.
I wasn’t comfortable yet so I told him I would take it slow. I did have one encounter and I enjoyed it to be honest. He watched it was such a sense of freedom.
But he was making these outrageous requests, even told me to stay home and just have sex with others. He would go on line with my picture and pretend to be me.
It never bothered, but it was so excessive. Too excessive. He promised the world.
He decided to move in with me. In a week made up some silly excuse and moved all his things out and left my house empty and said he couldn’t help me. Two days later he gave me money to buy furniture.
My spirit was broken, I felt stripped of everything I felt powerless. I trusted him with everything and he took it and chewed it up and spit it out.
He told me he couldn’t live with me but we can still be together. Together meant spending weekends with him. Sexually pleasing him.
I would say he did everything for me cook, clean, wash my clothes all I had to do was be amazingly sexual. But I didn’t have that high tolerance he had. He couldn’t understand it. He would call me boring, inexperience it was such a head game.
He would gawk at women like a horny little sixteen year old. I couldn’t understand who I was with. When he was sexually pleased he would alienate me. When I didn’t want to play fantasy he slept in bed with me with his back turned and wouldn’t talk to me for two days.
I was sexually hooked. He was amazing and I wanted more of his sex and more.
I went away on vacation came back, called him, and he tells me he is dating someone and he would like me to respect his space. OMG the feeling which came over me was almost an out of body experience. It felt the world had ended.
I had things at his place he said I can pick them up but I had to wait downstairs because she was upstairs. OMG again, if that wasn’t kicking someone when they are down.
But as a consolation prize he told me to give him time he just needs a little space.How I felt like a homeless woman with no place to go. How the pain numbed my body. It made me severely depressed. How I thought how could he do this? What did I do wrong? Two years and this is what i get ?He said he was going to settle down and find his soul mate. Yup, LOL that’s when I realized waitttt a minute. This man is a sex addict and he wants a one on one relationship? That’s when I knew he has issues.
So I went on twitter created an account dedicated to him. Befriended all his friends. Then uploaded our conversations about him wanting men.
He was mortified. He wouldn’t return my calls but I knew he was reading my text messages. So I told him he needs to apologize to me for the poor treatment and I would take the account down.
It was as if I was asking for his first born! He could see how his friends were commenting on my uploads. Towards the end of the nite I received a text “The Apology” I am sorry you felt I treated you poorly. That was not my intention. I apologize. HUH? He is sorry that I THOUGHT! Well, he struck a nerve then I uploaded his craigs list ad when he was looking for a man for a quickie!
He never apologized but I couldn’t walk away without venting. It would have almost felt as if he won. I had no problem walking away from him NOW. BUT : ) I just had to give him a little taste of his medicine.
So I texted him too bad she wasn’t my type you could have brought her into bed with us. Now if I knew him like I thought I did and he has no emotion. But loves sex! I knew my phone would ring. Well, low and behold my phone was ringing.
I never picked it up and he continues to call, I never pick it up. That was my release and it was such a good release. My instant sadness went away. I couldn’t let him walk away as if his mission was completed and on to the next one.
The S person deserves humiliation. The one thing they despise is to have the light on them in a negative way. Especially his manhood. Because they are the big men in town.
I do not condone what I did but in all honesty how it made everything so easy. It almost felt like everything him robbed me of I robbed it back from him.
I wish every woman who has encountered such a man to find and pull from inner and find the strength to move on and not look back.
Whether its humiliation or taking the high road. There is light to get your soul back.
…. so did my ex …. totally careless behaviour in EVERY area of life!!! Thanks Donna for unmasking the ASPD’s.
BTW: ASPD is the only so-called disease where the person who has it is NOT suffering. But everyone around him / her.
“OxDrover says:
Notavictim,
Some of them will F a snake if someone will hold it for them. Some of them like to see the snake squirm as they cut pieces off it’s tail. They do not care about the “objects,” living or inorganic, that they use to get their jollies.”
While my x-spath is singuarly attracted to younger gay men, the type of pornography he views is violent, unsafe and filthy. Some of the stuff is so vile, I would not even post the names of the videos here.
To think that this charming, polite, unassuming and shy guy could be into such stuff blows my mind.
Knowing where his hands might have been and the fact that he serves food to people on flights actually makes me sick.
Just think of where his mouth has been – kiss kiss…