By | August 25, 2012 24 Comments

Sociopaths victimize using human institutions like the courts

This summer I read a fabulous book, Coercive Control: How Men Entrap Women in Personal Life by Evan Stark. It is a well written academic discussion of the topic of coercive control that also provides a history of domestic violence awareness in America. Although I highly recommend the book to anyone who advocates for victims, I do not agree with the premise that coercive control is about female victimization. I have known too may male victims to believe that this is a male —female issue.

The challenge then is to come up with a theory about intimate partner victimization that accounts for, rather than rejects the very cogent arguments put forward by clinician-researchers like Dr. Stark. Although there isn’t space here to detail all the theory I am considering, the cornerstone of it is that psychopathic individuals (sociopaths) male and female will take advantage of every societal institution that exists as they work to gain control of the people in their lives. The end result of this theory aligns me with Dr. Stark and other dv advocates, in that I also see the need to change society in order to help victims of coercive control.

A read of the stories posted on this site by victims reveals that psychopathic sons and daughters exploit their parents using parental obligations and threats of reports to child protective services. Psychopathic female partners use child support (the male role of husband as provider), and threats of loss of access to children to control their male partners. Psychopathic male partners use notions of male dominance and feminine submission as well as the family courts to control their women. Also, psychopathic mothers and fathers use their “parental rights” to abuse and control rather than to parent their children.

If we are going to set about to help victims then we have a whole list of societal institutions to take on. The first one is the family court system because that is the most used and blatantly dysfunctional institution we have. One shocking example of the dysfunction appeared in the news this week in the wake of political arguments about rape and abortion. It seems that in 31 states a rapist can assert parental rights. There are countless studies revealing that rapists possess psychopathic personality traits and that aberrant motivation to control a victim underlies the crime. Such individuals are likely unfit or marginally fit to parent a child legitimately conceived forget the child of a victim; so much for the “best interests of the child” doctrine that the family court purports to pay homage to.

Thankfully, there is one victim who is speaking out and fighting to change the system and I think we should support her in any way we can. “Shauna R. Prewitt is a lawyer in Chicago. She is the author of “Giving Birth to a ‘Rapist’s Child’: A Discussion and Analysis of the Limited Legal Protections Afforded to Women Who Become Mothers Through Rape,” written for the Georgetown Law Journal.” To read her story visit CNN. There you can also download her paper if you want to read an academic discussion. Also help spread the word, rapists and others who perpetrate coercive control should not have the same parental rights as healthy loving parents. Children deserve the best upbringing the healthy parent can give them.

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Liane, what a fantastic article and very timely, as always.

For whatever it’s worth, I’m in. I don’t have a network of contacts or any political experience to offer, but I’m in – in whatever capacity I can be of use to “do something.”

The idiot that you were referring to about abortion v. rape caused me to nearly drive off of the road (yes, I finally have transportation) when I heard it on NPR the other day. “Legitimate rape?” REALLY?!?! What kind of jackass would even entertain using such a term? Then, he had further audacity to suggest that a female’s body has the ability to “deal with” spontaneously preventing a pregnancy as a result of rape!

It is a statistical fact that children who are raised in abusive environments either develop into abusers or into victims, and there is no exception on this. Children who are dragged through endless custody battles and battles for “parental rights” are thoroughly damaged, often beyond repair. Children born of rape suffer the stigma for the rest of their lives. How difficult is it for anyone to “get this?”

Coercive control. An ominous term, to be sure.

Thank you, again, Liane. Superb.



Are you talking about Todd Akin? He made international news with his remarks about rapes to result unlikely in pregnancies because the female’s body has the ability to deal with it spontaneously.

That guy seriously needs to retake HS biology curriculum.

In any case it’s another faux argument to blame women once again: well you must have wanted it, because you got pregnant. If you didn’t want this man, then you wouldn’t have become pregnant. Reminds me of the witch trial arguments: if she floats and survives, she’s a witch; if she drowns she wasn’t a witch… in any case her property is ours now anyway. Hooray!

Liane, the second link of the CNN story doesn’t work.


Darwinsmom, yes, that’s the moron. He just needs to be prevented from reproducing more like himself, that’s all. What a dope – I mean, an absolute dope! And, now he’s running damage control in advertisements asking for “forgiveness” for his poorly chosen words. LMAO!

Oh, dear lordy, I really did yell at the radio when I heard the report and the words that were recorded coming out of his mouth. Right. Every time the first exspath committed sousal rape, my body immediately performed a spontaneous abortion to prevent an unwanted pregnancy. Yes. This happened, I’m certain. Thank you, Dr. Akin.

Every woman’s group on this planet is probably on a testicular hunt, at this point. What an absolute dope!


Apparently he sit on the House Committee for Science, Space and Technology! So this folklore politician makes decisions about science: school science curriculum, research, etc…


Someone needs to figure a way to weed out these morons and there should be an immediate removal of his seat on that committee.

It’s frightening knowing this ignorance is still alive and well but I am happy when their own arrogance outs them.


nothing is that simple. THERE ARE MANY SPATHS IN CONGRESS AND IN POWER. Why would they want to weed out one of their own? True, he did screw up with his “legitimate rape” quote. (spaths can be SO stupid), but they count on us to go into cognitive dissonance, and throw that comment into a WTF? bucket.

That means, that we will be mad for a while and then forget about it because it doesn’t mean that much. When people don’t know about spaths and EXACTLY WHAT SPATHS ARE: EVIL, LUCIFER, ETC…, then they just sort of “get over it”, and continue with their banal lives.



Yes, and you know it is getting harder and harder for me (with the deeper and deeper I go into the spath “research”) to converse with most people about this topic.

(“this topic”: bad things that people do; stupid things that our politicians say; what we can and ought to do about it!; coercive control in general, as it permeates EVERYTHING about our lives, like the air we breathe; does evil exist?; the oxymoron of “legitimate” rape)

I would say “oh, don’t even get me started” except I don’t even know where or how to start anymore. It seems to depend so much on the level of understanding and experience of the person I’m contemplating talking to.

I know that sounds obnoxious. I really do not mean it that way. I guess this is just another phase or stage I’m in. I certainly do not claim to know everything, but this must be the stage of exasperation or impatience that comes from wanting to help wake people up, though KNOWING that I can’t and it’s not my job.

And at the same time, realizing that quite probably I have a lot of waking up to do, still, myself.

I am surrounded by family members who do not get it, some of whom are elderly and just are not interested in questioning their lifelong-held beliefs about the inherent goodness of people. To them, our politicians are misguided, ignorant, but not willfully corrupt or sociopathic. They do not believe in corrupt systems; only a few “bad apples” who are just misguided fools.

I have to keep my mouth shut so I don’t appear to be a nutcase around most of the people I know.

So thank goodness for all of you. 🙂

Articles like this scare me. Like many of you, I used to be naive to the level of dangerous pathology amongst those who take such a big part in our justice system.

Lately, after what I have been through, I don’t feel protected and I don’t feel safe.

When I first heard that stupid politician (whose name I won’t even repeat here) make those comments about “legitimate rape” I didn’t know whether to scream or cry or both. I hate how our country has turned into a place where it is so common to blame the victim and uphold the “rights” of a monster terrorist.

Yes, I do believe that many people who seeks these sorts of positions of power are sociopaths themselves. I remember my ex telling me once that he believed everyone wanted to be a celebrity. I tried to explain to him that not everyone needed that sort of attention. He couldn’t understand this because, to him, power and attention were the two most important things. Given this…it should not be surprising to us that police, judges, lawyers, politicians, etc are full of sociopaths.


at the risk of being horribly misunderstood….

we have allowed ourselves to be placed under coercive control. I don’t mean “blame” when I use the word “allow.” Instead, I mean something like this:

It is indeed COERCIVE control, and by this (great word choice BTW though I have not read this book) I mean, it is a DUPING method of FORCING us under their control. We are told it is something that it isn’t. Or that it isn’t something that it is. It is a lie told, little by little, mixed in with truth, to deliberately deceive and confuse us.

We are deceived and confused: we are blameless.

However, if we can start to wake up, then we can take RESPONSIBILITY for the place we find ourselves in, and take steps to get ourselves out of it, and to prevent its happening again. We are more aware. We get our power back.

There is another type of coercion that has to do with brute force (more in your face, not hiding the fact you are being forced, as in that “legitimate rape,” I suppose). (I was being snarky, there)

OK. Insofar as birth control, fertility, conception, abortion, etc. goes, we have allowed ourselves to be placed under this coercive control by not realizing that from the beginning of human civilization, there have been methods of birth control and fertility enhancement. Women have had this knowledge and used it. And now, we have allowed ourselves to place all of this power in the hands of people who are licensed and elected to decide for us. We have to go to doctors to get prescriptions, it is expensive, sometimes it fails or we are raped or whatever, and we find ourselves helplessly pregnant.

It really does NOT have to be this way.

There is also some truth (here I may be very unpopular if I am misunderstood) to the idea that our minds and intentions are very powerful things, and actually can influence our fertility. This is not the same thing as saying a woman can be blamed for becoming pregnant if her rape is not legitimate enough. It is only to say that there is a lot more to our fertility than we are allowed to know these days… but the truth IS out there. Discover it for yourself, and regain your power.


I am going to have to respectfully disagree. I was a victim of rape and I don’t think that there is anything I could have been thinking in that situation besides sheer fear. While the stress of the situation could certainly impact a woman’s changes of losing the baby…..this doesn’t always happen.

I was under a tremendous amount of stress when I was pregnant with my son (due to the chaos Luc was constantly inflicting) and this didn’t change the fact that I was able to have a beautiful and healthy little baby boy.

Rape is rape. Not all rape happens when men jump out of bushes with a mask on. The sooner we all realize that there are several forms of rape…the sooner we will put an end to it by locking these men up.

Luc should be in jail and the man who raped me should be as well. They are not, however, because all too often people like this are protected and the victim is blamed.


cappuccinoqueen, I do not disagree with you! I realize that my meaning could be mistaken because I mentioned rape and women’s power over their own fertility in the same post. The two can be confused. I am sorry I had trouble expressing my idea better.

I do not think that the majority of women understand that they have this power — and you cannot develop it if you do not realize you have it.

That is not the same thing as suggesting that any woman who is raped should have any blame over it or any of the results from it. A rape is a violation — period. (I have been raped, too).

However…. my post was more about the reality of the potential of our feminine power which has been hidden from us (which relates to fertility).

What made me think of it as a topic was the topic of this post on coercive control, and that made me think about how MUCH we are controlled by society, all that we are taught (or not taught) about how our bodies work, the spiritual aspects of it, etc. How we are expected to place our health in the hands of our doctors as opposed to ourselves, and how we are not taught (my daughters who just took sex ed in HS were not taught, either!) truly how our bodies work!

It is also related to the topic of the lies that spaths tell — some of them by omission. some of them by misleading us and confusing us, through mixing the truth and lies.

It is not so simple as “in a legitimate rape the woman’s body shuts down and she can’t get pregnant” because that is NOT true, and it is a twisting of the truth into something completely damaging and the opposite, and blaming of women. But the result is that we react by saying, “that stupid idiot man! How dare he!” without realizing that… there is more to this thing of our fertility/bodies than we are allowed to know these days.

I did not know this reality for the first four decades of my life. Then, I started learning about it. It is subtle and hard to explain. It is a very intuitive thing but we cannot use it if we are not TAUGHT it, and if the reality of its existence is suppressed.

I was very angry when I first learned what had been kept from me. And then I started to learn about it and how to use it, and it really is very empowering and exciting.

kim frederick

20 years, very interesting. Do you have any links?


kim frederick,

about 10 years ago, I found this book “Taking Charge of Your Fertility” by Toni Weschler, which is the book that totally opened my eyes to info which I feel has been kept from many girls/women (and the boys/men in their lives).

That was just a starting point. I already had an interest in herbal medicine and natural healing AND an interest in something which has various names but has to do with our energy fields and the power of thought.

The book gave me the nuts and bolts of how my body actually works. The study of herbal medicine brought a new understanding to what I was learning (including the history of folk medicine/healers and the rise of modern, pharmaceutical meds and suppression of the old methods). This has been a self study, so I don’t really have links but you can find the info as you go, if you want.

The final piece is the intuitive part which has grown in me over time, to the point where I am now much more aware of my own power of choice (free will) in matters concerning my health, including my fertility. Again, this has been a personal practice, and it takes time and dedication. When studying something like this, it is murky at first, and becomes clearer with time and practice.

The starting point, though, is discovering that a possibility exists. And learning to listen to and trust your intuition.

Back to earth: Toni Weschler’s book opened my eyes to the effects of birth control pills on my intuitive ability (totally suppresses it). I have not used chemical birth control for 15 years, and it has made a very big difference in my mental and intuitive wellbeing.



Well said. It’s unfortunate but I agree with you. It sometimes makes me nuts as the WTF bucket (love that) is full already. lol

I agree with the rest of you about the careful selection of words and knowing around those who’s heads are in the sand or those who have lived a long life believing it’s a bad apple lest we all sound like conspiracy paranoia cases.

The courts have had the same affect on my life. I haven’t felt safe…many different times in my life as far back as childhood. Now there is just one more piece to that puzzle which hit to my very core. The law.

I have found after the extreme feeling, from new knowledge and some time and healing occurs, I tend to find a middle ground that brings some peace and balance. Upon the first knowledge though it hits me so extremely and like 20years states, I have to be careful not to sound like a nutcase needing to awaken the world!

The fertility comments and rape are just that to me.

I have known and heard several times of women failing to get pregnant until they adopt a child and by some strange fact of life become pregnant soon there after. So there may be something to that but rape is rape and we must be careful to keep as much power away from anyone speaks of “legitimacy” with that subject and ability to conceive. Think of those poor 11 and 12 year old pregnant by forcible sex or “coerced” sex or the daughter of the father who becomes pregnant…… too many different examples to paint with the broad brush of law and politics.

My story here at Lovefraud begins with “holes in the condom”. Rape? Nope, but definitely life changing deception.

Good mind stimulating conversation though as usual on this board.

Cappaccinoqueen, I believe after some time (didn’t think this until probably 3 years into the court case and feeling completely broken never to heal) you will balance out and get some perspective and feel some safety again. If you are anything like me, it will come in babysteps and with a great deal of trepidation as you move forward with your new knowledge. Really you will be much safer than before living with blinders and lack of knowledge. You no longer will expect justice or fairness from man. It’s a rude awakening but this is why so many fight to avoid it. You may make a huge difference in lives to come living mindfully.

((((hugs to all of us who are waking up)))))

Thank you lovefraud for giving us a place to express ourselves while traveling through these experiences and being able to share our struggles on all different levels.


20 years,
you and I must be in a very similar space with regard to learning and healing from spaths. Your words are exactly how I think: just WHERE do we start letting people know? How deeply will they “get it”?

The fact that that moron used the words “legitimate rape” means he believes it isn’t rape unless the woman is being held at gunpoint while screaming and fighting the whole time. I wonder how many times he has raped women himself. I know people don’t like to make assumptions without evidence, but I’ve learned to discern a “tell”. To come up with the words “legitimate rape”, he must have given it some thought. So why would he do that? Well perhaps he was justifying a sexual encounter with an unwilling victim and considered that it wasn’t a “legitimate rape” because she didn’t fight hard enough.

I’m not saying, arrest the man, just sayin’ “don’t date him.”


Moron is right. Very Bad word choice.

Definition of “legitimate”: lawful, being in compliance with the law (as though rape itself is sanctioned by the state!)

He could have used a word like “bona fide” instead, which is probably what he meant, because it means “genuine.” (as opposed to — date rape? spousal rape? coercion as opposed to force? the girl changing her mind after?)

Or better yet, just call it RAPE. (date rape, stranger rape, spousal rape, without consent — it is all a violation)



I know there are others in a similar space to you and me, with regard to learning and healing from spaths. I also know that I have learned from others who are a step or two ahead of me.

However, I CANNOT learn from others who are several steps ahead of me. I continually misunderstand what they are saying, and in fact some of what they say sounds offensive or insulting or hurtful to me. I’m not ready for it. Not in a place where I can hear it.

Doesn’t mean there is anything wrong with me for my inability to see and hear. Doesn’t mean there is anything wrong with them for saying what they are saying, from the place they sit.

They are probably helping someone just one or two steps behind them on the path.

I know this, because I’ve walked far enough that I have eventually caught up to some of these places, and it hits me, “Ohhhhh… NOW I get what they were saying, that I didn’t get before…”

So, I guess I’m thinking, maybe I can say what I’m thinking, from the place where I am, and maybe some people will be offended (which I hope to avoid but probably unavoidable to some degree), and maybe some people will learn something, and of course *I* will keep my eyes and ears open to listen and learn.

I know I’m a slow learner. So I really can’t expect others to be any faster at this than I have been. 🙂


I felt like that moron was implying if you got pregnant, it wasn’t a “legitimate” rape. So would he find the guy innocent if you went to court pregnant during his criminal trial? Yikes!!


20years ~

I never quite thought of what you just said about not belng able to learn from people who are several steps ahead of you. But, you are absolutely right. I think about how many times someone has said something or written something that no matter how hard I tried, I just could not relate or believe. Then, down the road I would come to understand. Great explanation and I think right on.

Sky, I feel I have learned so much from you and your keen insight. Above all else, I believe the concept of the “tell” is perhaps the most important. We all know that understanding is such an important weapon against a spath. When we learn to recognize or discern a “tell” it is almost like having a crystal ball, or finding the hidden pictures in a “Highlight” magazine. Thanks for all the lessons.



What a great observation you made of learning! There have been so many times I met with a wisdom from others that sounded wrong, or like blaming… I would wonder how they honestly could think like that. And I would think myself better for not thinking like that. Only to find out later in the journey in life as if I was in a mirror situation and suddenly felt and thought and understood what that other person had meant, about to say the exact same thing to someone in the mirror situation.

I used to debate for several years fiercely on a forum meant for debate, which gave me the conviction that everyone is opinionated about something always. As opinions goes, there are plenty going around, on every issue of life. And when I look back over the past 20 years and some more, I must say that I’ve been pretty opinionated and sure that my way of viewing things was the right way… The younger I was the more opinionated I was too. But life itself teaches us that our way of thinking alters with each experience (good and bad) and how we grow and heal from it; and where I felt t have an opposing view especially on life and emotional matters before I would experience something that made me feel as if I was looking through their eyes suddenly. It always made me feel as if life’s veils were being lifted, as if I being shown a secret through a rip.

So yes, some people are way ahead of us in their perspective steps, but at some point we’ll stand at the same spot. I could not learn from these people the moment they shared their wisdom, but the conflicted opposition I felt to it burned in my mind like a smoking gun for me to remember the moment I was finally there at that understanding.


MiLo and darwinsmom, thanks for your comments back at me. You’ve given me more food for thought! 🙂

I think I need to develop more patience. Right now I’m dealing with a (personal) situation of a dear relative of mine who is now old enough (she is just a few years younger than I am) to suddenly be very opinionated and right about so many things having to do with the way the world ought to be… and I’m finding myself unable to totally keep my lips zipped.

I find it so frustrating. I was that opinionated person several years ago. Now I see it mirrored back at me. How politically correctly obnoxious of me!

I am hoping/assuming that in another several years, I will see my own self NOW, and be aware that I have moved on from this stage and onto another. Who knows. One can hope.

Maybe part of my impatience (for my dear relative) is the loneliness I feel at being unable to connect well with her at this time…. we used to be so close and in sync. And not anymore, or at least not right now. She thinks she knows everything!!! I remember feeling that way…

She is so hell-bent on fixing everything in society, and I just see things differently now. It’s just not possible to run around, dictating how everyone else must be, think and behave in order to make things all as we think they should be (usually these are public policy types of things).

So I’ll try for a little more patience, myself. I’ll try to be less frustrated with not being in sync with people I care about.

I know I’m offending the heck out of her, because I cannot pretend to agree with her opinions. But she can’t understand where I’m coming from, either. It’s hard.

so funny that I’ve been so helpful to you. It is becoming my opinion that I have aspergers. just a bit. I’ve been reading and learning more about it. I know my bf has it, but it never occurred to me that I might be affected.

The reason I think it, is because I can’t really understand why the truth is offensive to people. Like Oxy says, if someone asks her, “does my butt look big in these pants?” She would say “no, you look fine.” Well, I wouldn’t. I’d say, yes, let’s find some better pants for you.” I don’t mean to be rude, I just don’t see the point in letting other people look like fools. I know that I’m a minority in that opinion, that’s why I think I might have some aspergers.

It’s weird huh? Your grandson has aspergers. Maybe he will be a teacher too. Someone who can just tell the truth. I’m not saying all aspergers people are good, I know that it can also be attached to evil people. Honestly, I don’t know what causes the different choices.

Today, I looked at the “letter to God” that my spath wrote. I turned it over. I had noticed some math problems on it before but I hadn’t actually studied what it was. OMG.

There was a short division problem on the back (you know like they teach in 4th grade. It was 668.10 divided by 10.

Think about it.

It was written like, how you learn in 4th grade. First you write the 10, then a vertical bar attached to a horizontal bar and under the horizontal bar, you write 668.10. Then you start to do the division….
by 10.

He doesn’t even know enough to just move the decimal point.
I showed it to my bf. we both just sat and considered it.

The spath taught himself to weld, play guitar, use autocad, build and design experimental helicopters, fly helicopters but he doesn’t get the decimal system. WTF?

An autistic savant? who can beguile any human being? WTF?

As much as I get spaths, it’s my own ex-spath that I don’t get.

Further down the page, he began to subtract 66.81 from 668.10. He managed it once, the next time he got mixed up and just stopped.

I feel so sorry for him. I just don’t know what to think.


Skylar, I think it is funny that you mention Asperger’s as a possibility. I don’t disbelieve in the autism spectrum, but I don’t like to pathologize or label personality traits I think fall into the range of normal.

It is kind of like saying that we all have a few sociopathic “traits” so we fall on the sociopathic spectrum. And I don’t think it’s as simple as that (as a neat continuum).

Or maybe I have it too, haha! 🙂

I think the truth can hurt or be offensive, if a person is not in a place to hear it. But that doesn’t mean that the person who delivered the message is a jerk or has Asperger’s (not equating the two).

This thing called Truth has been giving me lots of problems lately. Like I mentioned above, with my relative I was close to for about 40 years, and lately we are having quite different takes on things, and I feel it as a very deep loss. But who possesses “The Truth?” It seems very important to her to enlighten me. And I have this awful, sinking feeling that I just cannot go along with what she believes, because it is so similar to what I believed myself, about 5 years ago. So it’s not like I’m superior, but in a way I have been there and moved on from it, and I can’t go back, but it is Very Obnoxious for me to put it to her like that (or any way I can think of).

And I can’t help myself occasionally rising to the bait of a debate with her, which I know will go nowhere, and generally has to do with her wanting me to sign a petition to save some aspect of the world, and my knowing that that is not really where you need to take the battle. For instance, a particular agency of government is supposed to “save us” if only we can present them with “the facts, the truth” about something, if we can clamor loudly enough, or with the best facts, or the most voices, the most poignant examples, then somebody at that agency will hear us and make everything all right.

And I just don’t see that happening. It’s not the same as cynicism. It’s more like yes, this is a problem worth solving, but how do we actually change society? I don’t think that’s the way.

EDIT: Because I no longer believe that institutions “care.” I see the sociopathy now that I didn’t see before. I see my dear relative assuming that if you just explain well enough, they will hear you, they will care, and they will fix things. All they need is having it pointed out to them. That is HER belief. It is no longer my belief.

And the deeper I delve into seeking Truth above all else (that is my main goal), then the weirder it gets or more mysterious it gets, or more intangible it gets, and the less able I am to articulate it — which is immensely frustrating.

But I have faith this, too, is just a stage along the way.


Oh Dear Sky ~

Sometimes I think that it is the people with Asperger’s who are the “normal” ones. In your example, if the person asking the question about how they looked in the pants, didn’t want a truthful answer, then why did they ask. They had an ulterior motive with the question, they wanted positive attention. Why do we feel the need to feed that? I really don’t think it has anything to do with lack of empathy, I think it is our misguided need to be liked. Maybe people with Asperger’s don’t feel that need. Who knows?

Ah, Grand’s ability to tell it like it is does cause Grandma a great deal of embarassment at times. But then again, why? The kid is just telling it like he sees it. lol I got a call from his special ed. teacher this morning (early) asking me to stop in after school. I would bet the farm it has something to do with this very subject.

Your spath’s math. Did you ever consider that he KNOWS the decimal system, just doesn’t trust it. He has to put it down on paper, check it and recheck it, because nothing in his world is to be trusted. my take

You don’t get your own personal spath because you are standing too close. Hubby used to work for a couple that owned the largest collection of privately owned Salvidore Dali (sp – sorry) paintings in the US. I loved to visit and was so awestruck with his work. If you stood close to the painting you saw a very clear picture of one thing, take a few steps back and there you saw a completely different image. Maybe if you took a few steps back, looked at him as someone’s else’s spath you will see a different image.


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